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wonderwhy
Stranger
Registered: 07/09/09
Posts: 23
Last seen: 15 years, 2 months
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Why aren't my shrooms growing?
#10778149 - 08/01/09 12:35 AM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
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UPDATE (9/3/09): Here are pics of the full-grown (i think) pins right after I picked them. They look like different parts of mutated mushrooms mashed together lol. I have no idea how this happened. However...the trip was amazing. It was mostly a weird euphoria that lasted a few hours. I spent those few hours rolling around in my bed, out of my mind, gnawing at the sheets, thinking of all these things I was suddenly inspired to do. I kept saying yes, yes, like I was having an orgasm lol. I also said thank you God a lot. Sometimes I also got tears in my eyes and cried a little for no real reason. Besides all that, the rug looked like it was moving kind of like water and other things seemed to be moving (you all know what I'm talking about). I get that sometimes when I'm sober, though. I did even when i was a kid, long before I tried any psychedelics. Also, when I got up from my bed to go to the bathroom, I felt really tall and light, and the knob on my sink faucet looked extra glossy. The only bad thing about the trip was that I felt a mild disphoria after the intense euphoria ended.
I opened the bag early to eat the "mushroom" in the pic in my previous update. It matured before all the others. I didn't trip very much on it. As a result, by the time all the others were ready, some of them had a little bit of white fuzz on them. I just avoided eating those parts. One of the "mushrooms" had a weird green blob on it. I don't know if it's an infection or what. There's a pic of it below.
Here are the matured pins. I ate most of them for my trip.


 This is the one with the weird green blob. You can't see it in this pic, but it had a bunch of little lines through it that made it look like intestines.
UPDATE (8/26/09): I got pinning about 4-5 days ago but they're growing kind of slow and they don't look right, they look like they're mutated or something lol. Here are pics, tell me if they're ok.



UPDATE: The mycelium stopped colonizing at least a week ago but I still don't see any pinning. There seems to be a lot of condensation on the side of the bag. Is there too much moisture in there? Here's a pic:

----------------------------------------------------------
2 months ago, I injected Penis Envy (Psilocybe Cubensis) spores into one of the grow bags sold here:
http://www.themadseason.com/growbags.asp
I followed all the directions on the site. The substrate was supposed to be 90-100% covered with mycelium within a month, but it almost stopped spreading after 2 weeks when it was only about 30% covered. By 5 weeks, it was still only about 40% covered, so I skipped to the next step which was to expose the substrate to indirect sunlight. Pinning was supposed to start about a week later. A few weeks went by and nothing happened. So i put them in direct sunlight which wasn't in the directions, but I was desperate. A week went by, and here I am. The mycelium kept growing slowly in the light and by now covers about 80% of the substrate, but still no mushroom growth. What should I try next? Or will the shrooms never grow?
Update: Now that I've mixed it around, should I take the substrate out of the bag when pinning starts so the shrooms have more room to grow? Or will that get it contaminated? And when should I pick the shrooms?
8/4/09: Mycelium has been reforming over the substrate for a few days now. When I shook it up, little crumbs got stuck all over the walls of the bag, and mycelium is crawling up the walls. Is this ok, or will it think it has to colonize the entire inside of the bag before it pins? Here are some pictures:



Edited by wonderwhy (09/03/09 08:05 PM)
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Citric


Registered: 03/19/04
Posts: 4,490
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Re: Why aren't my shrooms growing? [Re: wonderwhy]
#10778164 - 08/01/09 12:39 AM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
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It's still in the bag?
Did you ever crumble the bag and spread the myc around? I'm assuming not, and that's why it took forever and is still not colonized.
Crumble it up, spread the myc around, and set it someplace for a few days. If it is still healthy, and with correct moisture content(After 2 months I dont know), it should recover and finish itself off.
-------------------- Self Healing lid tek ** Update 10.17.17 **
Mini casing pictures: Pins to harvest
Cup O' Shrooms
Magash: I noticed my contams were in the shape of fingers
Hyphae: Yes "Loss of moisture from the substrate" is not a casing trigger.
My final Grow!
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Mo0se
Stranger

Registered: 07/22/09
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Re: Why aren't my shrooms growing? [Re: Citric]
#10778178 - 08/01/09 12:43 AM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
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If it's still colonizing, you don't want to expose it to light. And you actually don't want to ever expose it to direct sunlight...
What is the approximate temperature you are storing the bag at?
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wonderwhy
Stranger
Registered: 07/09/09
Posts: 23
Last seen: 15 years, 2 months
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Re: Why aren't my shrooms growing? [Re: Citric]
#10778192 - 08/01/09 12:47 AM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
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The website directions don't say to crumble it up, are you sure I'm supposed to do this?
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wonderwhy
Stranger
Registered: 07/09/09
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Re: Why aren't my shrooms growing? [Re: Mo0se]
#10778204 - 08/01/09 12:50 AM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
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The bag is being kept at 72-78 degrees. It fluctuates so much because I have an air conditioner that doesn't work right.
Edited by wonderwhy (08/01/09 12:51 AM)
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Mo0se
Stranger

Registered: 07/22/09
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Re: Why aren't my shrooms growing? [Re: wonderwhy]
#10778223 - 08/01/09 12:54 AM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
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He has that "Trusted Cultivator" tag, so he probably knows what he's talking about .
Anyways, crumbling it up will mix around the mycellium, which allows it to grow in more places at a time... which basically speeds along the colonization. You shouldn't be putting it in any light right now. If you can, keep it at around 80-85 degrees. Although upper 70s will be fine. I'm going to assume its moisture content is fine since it is a grow bag, and should come set up properly (although you never know with those things). Like Citric said, it should start to colonize fully. Don't start giving it light until you are ready to fruit it.
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ArcanePerception
The only rule isthe golden rule



Registered: 04/30/05
Posts: 435
Last seen: 14 years, 10 months
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Re: Why aren't my shrooms growing? [Re: wonderwhy]
#10778224 - 08/01/09 12:54 AM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Mo0se said: If it's still colonizing, you don't want to expose it to light. And you actually don't want to ever expose it to direct sunlight...
Not true at all light exposure is no big deal and might even be a good thing.
Quote:
wonderwhy said: The website directions don't say to crumble it up, are you sure I'm supposed to do this?
Yes you should have crumbled at 30% or so it spreads the mycelium around and inoculates the rest of the bag. Its more important with bags of grain like that because you have alot to colonize.
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nastos
secret secretions




Registered: 06/15/09
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Re: Why aren't my shrooms growing? [Re: wonderwhy]
#10778226 - 08/01/09 12:55 AM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
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shake the shit out of it
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wonderwhy
Stranger
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Re: Why aren't my shrooms growing? [Re: wonderwhy]
#10778318 - 08/01/09 01:21 AM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
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Ok, I just crumbled up the entire thing and mixed well so you can't see any mycelium anymore. Is that right or was I supposed to only crumble the outer layer?
PS: I'm kind of pissed that the website left out that important step.
Edited by wonderwhy (08/01/09 01:22 AM)
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veda_sticks
Cultivator




Registered: 07/29/07
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Re: Why aren't my shrooms growing? [Re: wonderwhy]
#10778470 - 08/01/09 02:18 AM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
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breaking up the grain will make it look like the mycelium disapears, its normal. after it recovers it will continue colinising.
I have my substrates in light from day 1 and they dont pin until they are fully colinised.
Full colinisation is the number 1 pinning trigger. Simply adding light wont really do anything untill you have full colinisation.
--------------------
PF TEK - writeup by EvilMushroom666
Lets Grow Mushrooms - RogerRabbit & RoadKills website with sample videos plus the full PF TEK video series. Alot of great information - BUY THE DVD
Cakes can and will pin! - So you think cakes suck for pins. Your wrong
Franks Simple Coir/Verm Tek
Franks Proper Pasturisation Tek
Franks Spawning To Bulk - Monotub
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BeefWatson
Beefmaster

Registered: 01/28/09
Posts: 190
Last seen: 14 years, 5 months
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direct sunlight may just dry it out, depending how much i suppose.
i actually have fully colonized madseason bags of PE, im waiting for them to pin
good luck with your grow.
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MADHACK3RZ
Stranger



Registered: 07/30/09
Posts: 3,873
Loc: Canada
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Re: Why aren't my shrooms growing? [Re: BeefWatson]
#10778741 - 08/01/09 05:43 AM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
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Yea the light isn't going to do shit, just direct sun will fuck your bag up. Have some more patience and you should have some 'shrooms to enjoy. I hate waiting too. I can't believe that the company selling the bags didn't say anything about shaking that will increase the speed of the grow.
-------------------- There is no food in my fridge only body parts
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Brennus
Student of Life



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Re: Why aren't my shrooms growing? [Re: MADHACK3RZ]
#10778945 - 08/01/09 08:22 AM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
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If it's taken 2 months to reach 80% colonization, then you have bacterial problems.
I'll bet if you cut that bag open, you'd get a big whiff of rotting apples or gym socks. Next time, colonize at room temperature. I've had this problem before and lost a tub because spawn I had colonizing was sitting in a room without AC and got up to 80-90F during the day.
Light is, for the most part, irrelevant during colonization.
You might have luck spawning that to an outdoor bed.
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prismism



Registered: 05/11/09
Posts: 5,570
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Re: Why aren't my shrooms growing? [Re: Mo0se]
#10779008 - 08/01/09 08:44 AM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Mo0se said: He has that "Trusted Cultivator" tag, so he probably knows what he's talking about .
Anyways, crumbling it up will mix around the mycellium, which allows it to grow in more places at a time... which basically speeds along the colonization. You shouldn't be putting it in any light right now. If you can, keep it at around 80-85 degrees. Although upper 70s will be fine. I'm going to assume its moisture content is fine since it is a grow bag, and should come set up properly (although you never know with those things). Like Citric said, it should start to colonize fully. Don't start giving it light until you are ready to fruit it.
outdated information. those temps are too high. please stop spreading this misinformation.
-------------------- ephemeral anomalous
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Citric


Registered: 03/19/04
Posts: 4,490
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Re: Why aren't my shrooms growing? [Re: Brennus]
#10779017 - 08/01/09 08:47 AM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Brennus said: If it's taken 2 months to reach 80% colonization, then you have bacterial problems.
I'll bet if you cut that bag open, you'd get a big whiff of rotting apples or gym socks. Next time, colonize at room temperature. I've had this problem before and lost a tub because spawn I had colonizing was sitting in a room without AC and got up to 80-90F during the day.
Light is, for the most part, irrelevant during colonization.
You might have luck spawning that to an outdoor bed.
It's been two months, and it is still colonizing. It hasn't stalled, just growth has slowed. If it was bacterial it would of stopped colonizing ages ago. The issue here is the myc was not spread around so it is going to take longer.
-------------------- Self Healing lid tek ** Update 10.17.17 **
Mini casing pictures: Pins to harvest
Cup O' Shrooms
Magash: I noticed my contams were in the shape of fingers
Hyphae: Yes "Loss of moisture from the substrate" is not a casing trigger.
My final Grow!
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prismism



Registered: 05/11/09
Posts: 5,570
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Re: Why aren't my shrooms growing? [Re: Citric]
#10779039 - 08/01/09 08:56 AM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
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^this is so true. if you have ever lost a jar to bacteria you see that growth comes to an abrupt halt and goes no further.
-------------------- ephemeral anomalous
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Mo0se
Stranger

Registered: 07/22/09
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Re: Why aren't my shrooms growing? [Re: prismism]
#10779308 - 08/01/09 10:25 AM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
prismism said:
Quote:
Mo0se said: He has that "Trusted Cultivator" tag, so he probably knows what he's talking about .
Anyways, crumbling it up will mix around the mycellium, which allows it to grow in more places at a time... which basically speeds along the colonization. You shouldn't be putting it in any light right now. If you can, keep it at around 80-85 degrees. Although upper 70s will be fine. I'm going to assume its moisture content is fine since it is a grow bag, and should come set up properly (although you never know with those things). Like Citric said, it should start to colonize fully. Don't start giving it light until you are ready to fruit it.
outdated information. those temps are too high. please stop spreading this misinformation.
Can you please tell me where it says that those temperatures are too high. I'm not really trying to challenge you... its just that everything I have ever read said to keep it at those temps while colonizing and then reduce temperature by ten degrees when fruiting. It'd be nice to see the newest information.
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pickboy87
Shroom n00b




Registered: 06/26/07
Posts: 159
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Re: Why aren't my shrooms growing? [Re: Mo0se]
#10779389 - 08/01/09 10:45 AM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
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^^^ RR has said (let me look in a sec) that those temps are too high. I believe he even says it in the video. Anything over 81 degrees can lead to bacteria being grown. It's more of an ideal temp for them. The 85 degrees temp has been passed around for years, but it's outdated and needs to be kept at 81 or lower if you want to avoid a bacterial contamination.
Edit:
*Do you know of one place in nature where cubes fruit naturally that does not have a difference between daytime and nighttime temperatures? I've read ever since 1985 that 86F is best, usually because of somebody simply repeating what they've read somewhere, then somebody repeats that, and so on and so on. Now, over 20 years later, they're still repeating it, and it's still wrong. In my grow room, the day and night temperatures fluctuate as much as 20F. When I say normal room temperature that means 72F to 78F. There is zero increase in rate of growth of cubensis above 80F, and mushroom mycelium often stalls out and bacteria is encouraged in warm anaerobic environments, such as is found in the bottom of non-vented tubs commonly used as 'incubators'. COLONIZATION
-------------------- My first harvest:
 
Edited by pickboy87 (08/01/09 10:47 AM)
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newtogrowing
Mr. Green smiles



Registered: 07/29/09
Posts: 577
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Re: Why aren't my shrooms growing? [Re: wonderwhy]
#10779398 - 08/01/09 10:47 AM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
wonderwhy said: 2 months ago, I injected Penis Envy (Psilocybe Cubensis) spores into one of the grow bags sold here:
http://www.themadseason.com/growbags.asp
Is that a good site, are there pre loaded bags any good or is it better to make your own?
-------------------- [gradient:#FF0A0A,#03FF18]
Got to try to get results, got to improve that to have success, have to be successful to work on perfection
Pf Tek is the way to go, it's what I plan on sticking to, I fully support and suggest Pf Tek for everyone new or not, it's awesome it has results and is easy to follow.
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veda_sticks
Cultivator




Registered: 07/29/07
Posts: 14,191
Loc: UK
Last seen: 5 years, 13 days
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Re: Why aren't my shrooms growing? [Re: Mo0se]
#10779403 - 08/01/09 10:49 AM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Mo0se said:
Quote:
prismism said:
Quote:
Mo0se said: He has that "Trusted Cultivator" tag, so he probably knows what he's talking about .
Anyways, crumbling it up will mix around the mycellium, which allows it to grow in more places at a time... which basically speeds along the colonization. You shouldn't be putting it in any light right now. If you can, keep it at around 80-85 degrees. Although upper 70s will be fine. I'm going to assume its moisture content is fine since it is a grow bag, and should come set up properly (although you never know with those things). Like Citric said, it should start to colonize fully. Don't start giving it light until you are ready to fruit it.
outdated information. those temps are too high. please stop spreading this misinformation.
Can you please tell me where it says that those temperatures are too high. I'm not really trying to challenge you... its just that everything I have ever read said to keep it at those temps while colonizing and then reduce temperature by ten degrees when fruiting. It'd be nice to see the newest information.
bring your temps down to 75F. 80f is the upper limit for pf jars. Much larger substrates once you get enough mycelium can produce more heat than a small pf jar. if your incubating at 85F your substrate temp could well hit 90F.
Theres alot of misinformation in the forums and it can be sometimes hard to filter it out. It was discovered a several years ago that the 86F published in paul stamets book were bogus, even he dismisses it.
RR has tried to duplicate the results and found it to be wrong, instead above 83F growth slows down. whats interesting is that growth speed doesnt change much between 75F-80F.
Ive colinised jars in a warm cupboard that was around the 80F mark with no noticable increase in speed compared with my jars now that just sit at room temp.
Colinising at such high temps can often slow growth down and give the uperhand to thermophilic moulds and bacteria.
--------------------
PF TEK - writeup by EvilMushroom666
Lets Grow Mushrooms - RogerRabbit & RoadKills website with sample videos plus the full PF TEK video series. Alot of great information - BUY THE DVD
Cakes can and will pin! - So you think cakes suck for pins. Your wrong
Franks Simple Coir/Verm Tek
Franks Proper Pasturisation Tek
Franks Spawning To Bulk - Monotub
Professor Pinheads RTV Injection Port Tek
Foo Mans No Soak WBS Prep Tek
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Mo0se
Stranger

Registered: 07/22/09
Posts: 129
Last seen: 3 years, 1 month
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Re: Why aren't my shrooms growing? [Re: pickboy87]
#10779414 - 08/01/09 10:52 AM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
pickboy87 said: *Do you know of one place in nature where cubes fruit naturally that does not have a difference between daytime and nighttime temperatures? I've read ever since 1985 that 86F is best, usually because of somebody simply repeating what they've read somewhere, then somebody repeats that, and so on and so on. Now, over 20 years later, they're still repeating it, and it's still wrong. In my grow room, the day and night temperatures fluctuate as much as 20F. When I say normal room temperature that means 72F to 78F. There is zero increase in rate of growth of cubensis above 80F, and mushroom mycelium often stalls out and bacteria is encouraged in warm anaerobic environments, such as is found in the bottom of non-vented tubs commonly used as 'incubators'. COLONIZATION
Thanks dude ... good to know for the future. Generally my temperatures have been around 80 degrees, but like the paragraph explains I've always read around 85-86 was ok.
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wonderwhy
Stranger
Registered: 07/09/09
Posts: 23
Last seen: 15 years, 2 months
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Re: Why aren't my shrooms growing? [Re: newtogrowing]
#10784784 - 08/02/09 10:08 AM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
newtogrowing said:
Quote:
wonderwhy said: 2 months ago, I injected Penis Envy (Psilocybe Cubensis) spores into one of the grow bags sold here:
http://www.themadseason.com/growbags.asp
Is that a good site, are there pre loaded bags any good or is it better to make your own?
It was really easy to set up. All I had to do was wipe the needle and injection site with alcohol and then inoculate. But as I found out in this thread, the directions on their website are incomplete. So it's a good site as long as you don't follow their directions, lol.
Thank you everyone for your help. I should've come here sooner. Hopefully now that I crumbled up the substrate this will work. I'll keep it at room temperature since that's what the consensus seems to be. I will have a camera soon so I'll take pictures and post them if the shrooms grow.
Edited by wonderwhy (08/02/09 11:49 AM)
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Citric


Registered: 03/19/04
Posts: 4,490
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Re: Why aren't my shrooms growing? [Re: veda_sticks]
#10785594 - 08/02/09 12:40 PM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
outdated information. those temps are too high. please stop spreading this misinformation.
You know, I have seen this posted over and over that the 86 degree mark was proven false. However, I have never once seen a link or actual text written to prove it was.
I have always incubated my jars and have never had any issue. My jars colonize in a weeks time from multispore inoculation.
AFAIK, the only dismissal of the 86 degree temp by stamets did not even cover cubensis.
-------------------- Self Healing lid tek ** Update 10.17.17 **
Mini casing pictures: Pins to harvest
Cup O' Shrooms
Magash: I noticed my contams were in the shape of fingers
Hyphae: Yes "Loss of moisture from the substrate" is not a casing trigger.
My final Grow!
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feelingfunny
Queen Bitch




Registered: 05/08/09
Posts: 1,865
Loc: South
Last seen: 10 years, 10 months
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Re: Why aren't my shrooms growing? [Re: Citric]
#10785610 - 08/02/09 12:42 PM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
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Me too. We always incubate and have had many successful grows.
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me if you need an answer and not 'Why don't you use the search function?'
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nastos
secret secretions




Registered: 06/15/09
Posts: 7,371
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Re: Why aren't my shrooms growing? [Re: feelingfunny]
#10785719 - 08/02/09 01:07 PM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
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yeah its almost impossible for me to keep my jars below 83 degrees and i havent had a contam yet.. maybe 75-80 is "ideal" for colinizing but just not possible for some places in the summer... my jars have been colonizing in 81-86 and the myc is vigarous as ever..
if your jars are getting bacterial contams i would first be worried about how clean the enviroment is before blaming it on the temp. contams shouldnt be allowed to enter your jars in the first place....
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Edited by nastos (08/02/09 01:09 PM)
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feelingfunny
Queen Bitch




Registered: 05/08/09
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Re: Why aren't my shrooms growing? [Re: nastos]
#10785730 - 08/02/09 01:10 PM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
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Agreed. I live in the South and it is FUCKING HOT. I can't get my temp below 75 no matter what I do. But like I said, been growing just fine.
-------------------- Green isn't just a color, it's a way of life!
Don't fear the OTD!
me if you need an answer and not 'Why don't you use the search function?'
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nastos
secret secretions




Registered: 06/15/09
Posts: 7,371
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Re: Why aren't my shrooms growing? [Re: feelingfunny]
#10785750 - 08/02/09 01:15 PM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
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even if i run the ac all day i cant get my grow room below 81...
not to mention if you go to the horse back riding place down the road the cubes continue to pop up in weather upwards of 90 degrees here so that should tell you something cubes are tropical so i dont see why 85-86 wouldnt work as long as your not allowing contams to enter the situation...
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ArcanePerception
The only rule isthe golden rule



Registered: 04/30/05
Posts: 435
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Re: Why aren't my shrooms growing? [Re: Citric]
#10785776 - 08/02/09 01:21 PM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Citric said:
Quote:
outdated information. those temps are too high. please stop spreading this misinformation.
You know, I have seen this posted over and over that the 86 degree mark was proven false. However, I have never once seen a link or actual text written to prove it was.
I have always incubated my jars and have never had any issue. My jars colonize in a weeks time from multispore inoculation.
AFAIK, the only dismissal of the 86 degree temp by stamets did not even cover cubensis.
Its not really that the number is wrong it is just that in doesnt take into account the heat the myc produces naturally I think.
-------------------- Oh, welcome to this world of fools
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nastos
secret secretions




Registered: 06/15/09
Posts: 7,371
Last seen: 6 years, 7 months
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Quote:
ArcanePerception said:
Quote:
Citric said:
Quote:
outdated information. those temps are too high. please stop spreading this misinformation.
You know, I have seen this posted over and over that the 86 degree mark was proven false. However, I have never once seen a link or actual text written to prove it was.
I have always incubated my jars and have never had any issue. My jars colonize in a weeks time from multispore inoculation.
AFAIK, the only dismissal of the 86 degree temp by stamets did not even cover cubensis.
Its not really that the number is wrong it is just that in doesnt take into account the heat the myc produces naturally I think.
this is true the internal temp of your jars is probably 2-3 degrees hotter than your ambient temp but still
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wygram
Myconaut

Registered: 01/28/07
Posts: 573
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Re: Why aren't my shrooms growing? [Re: nastos]
#10785854 - 08/02/09 01:37 PM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Citric said: I have never once seen a link or actual text written to prove it was.
Really? Nothing, never?
Quote:
RogerRabbit said: 85F makes the mycelium weaker and more prone to infection with bacteria which is favored at high temps. Black pin mold is also a common contaminant when excessive heat is used during 'incubation'.
I've tried to duplicate that test on agar stamets refers to in his book at various temperatures, and by no means is 86F optimal, even for petri dishes. There is zero increase in growth beyond 78F, and growth slows down at 84F and above, falling off rapidly around 90F.
PF jars can colonize well in two to three weeks at 75F. Mine are done in two weeks. How many posts per week do we see where people have had jars in the incubator for a month at 86F and they're still not colonized? Something else is wrong. Just use room temperature and you'll have far less problems with bacteria and other contaminants, not to mention your jars won't dry out. If you're comfortable in the room with a t-shirt on, your jars will be comfortable as well. RR
Quote:
RogerRabbit said: 72F is fine. Commercial spawn labs incubate at 68F, and their living depends on getting the best success rate possible. It's always warmer inside the jars than outside, and mycelium growth slows down at 83F and above. Note that I'm referring to mycelium temperature, not air temperature. RR
and
Quote:
nastos said: not to mention if you go to the horse back riding place down the road the cubes continue to pop up in weather upwards of 90 degrees here so that should tell you something cubes are tropical so i dont see why 85-86 wouldnt work as long as your not allowing contams to enter the situation...
You can not compare outdoor to sterile indoor cultivation. Outdoors bacteria that thrive in hot temperatures are kept in check by other bacteria and organisms. Indoors where we sterilize the substrate a bacterial contamination has no natural competition and can run rampant.
-------------------- Changing your mind is one of the best ways of finding out whether or not you still have one.
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Stealthgrower
n00b Pwner



Registered: 04/19/09
Posts: 622
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Re: Why aren't my shrooms growing? [Re: wygram]
#10785886 - 08/02/09 01:42 PM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
wygram said:
You can not compare outdoor to sterile indoor cultivation. Outdoors bacteria that thrive in hot temperatures are kept in check by other bacteria and organisms. Indoors where we sterilize the substrate a bacterial contamination has no natural competition and can run rampant.
-------------------- Infea said:
You ever seen that movie Constantine. Well they pass into hell several times. In hell there are melting human bodies, in your tub are melting mushroom bodies. Your tub had passed into mushroom hell.
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nastos
secret secretions




Registered: 06/15/09
Posts: 7,371
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well ok then when i throw a cake out and it starts to fruit ill remember that... we are talking temperature here not the diff between indoor and outdoor
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newtogrowing
Mr. Green smiles



Registered: 07/29/09
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Re: Why aren't my shrooms growing? [Re: nastos]
#10785962 - 08/02/09 01:54 PM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
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Jeeze all the hostility, it's just voice of opinion lol
-------------------- [gradient:#FF0A0A,#03FF18]
Got to try to get results, got to improve that to have success, have to be successful to work on perfection
Pf Tek is the way to go, it's what I plan on sticking to, I fully support and suggest Pf Tek for everyone new or not, it's awesome it has results and is easy to follow.
[gradient:#FF0A0A,#05FF05]FREAK OF THA FAMILY[/gradient]
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nastos
secret secretions




Registered: 06/15/09
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Re: Why aren't my shrooms growing? [Re: newtogrowing]
#10785986 - 08/02/09 01:57 PM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
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yeah all im saying is it gets hot as fuck here and i have not had a single contam... not saying that any of the information provided is wrong just throwing in my 2 cents on my experience incubating between 80-86 and having jars fully colonize in less than 2 weeks
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wygram
Myconaut

Registered: 01/28/07
Posts: 573
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Re: Why aren't my shrooms growing? [Re: nastos]
#10786025 - 08/02/09 02:04 PM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
nastos said: well ok then when i throw a cake out and it starts to fruit ill remember that... we are talking temperature here not the diff between indoor and outdoor
You were using outdoor cultivation as an example of why those principles could work indoors and I understand what you were saying, just forgot to reference that in my answer. Just because mycelium can grow in hot temperatures this my no means it's optimal. Kids all over the world live in starving conditions, yet they continue to grow, but remain stunted and underdeveloped for the rest of their lives. Why do you AC or heat your home? Because too hot or too cold isn't the best environment? Living things find ways to survive in environments that are in no way optimal, but if you're going to be cultivating mushrooms why wouldn't you give them the best so they can thrive and not just what they can survive in.
Quote:
nastos said: yeah all im saying is it gets hot as fuck here and i have not had a single contam... not saying that any of the information provided is wrong just throwing in my 2 cents on my experience incubating between 80-86 and having jars fully colonize in less than 2 weeks
That's awesome and means you probably have pretty good sterile technique. However, for people having problems especially with bacterial contamination, keeping a lower temperature (or not raising it through incubation) could be the solution.
-------------------- Changing your mind is one of the best ways of finding out whether or not you still have one.
Edited by wygram (08/02/09 02:10 PM)
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Stealthgrower
n00b Pwner



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Re: Why aren't my shrooms growing? [Re: nastos]
#10786132 - 08/02/09 02:26 PM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
nastos said: yeah all im saying is it gets hot as fuck here and i have not had a single contam... not saying that any of the information provided is wrong just throwing in my 2 cents on my experience incubating between 80-86 and having jars fully colonize in less than 2 weeks
I live in GA. I just harvested an 80g cube with a cap the diameter of a CD from a casing I tossed last week and it hasn't dipped below 80 here at night and been about 90-95 during the day. There's more to it than temps. That's all I'm saying. Never got an 80g cube inside. ever. My guess it's the combination of constant FAE, plus the good rain we've been having, plus the balance of bacteria and mold keeping each other in check outside. I have noticed competitor molds in my outdoor patches, but them and the myc don't seem to mind or bother each other. Nature is pretty cool.
-------------------- Infea said:
You ever seen that movie Constantine. Well they pass into hell several times. In hell there are melting human bodies, in your tub are melting mushroom bodies. Your tub had passed into mushroom hell.
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ArcanePerception
The only rule isthe golden rule



Registered: 04/30/05
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thats for the info wygram
-------------------- Oh, welcome to this world of fools
Of pink champagne and swimming pools
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Citric


Registered: 03/19/04
Posts: 4,490
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Re: Why aren't my shrooms growing? [Re: wygram]
#10787409 - 08/02/09 06:05 PM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
wygram said:
Quote:
Citric said: I have never once seen a link or actual text written to prove it was.
Really? Nothing, never?
Quote:
RogerRabbit said: 85F makes the mycelium weaker and more prone to infection with bacteria which is favored at high temps. Black pin mold is also a common contaminant when excessive heat is used during 'incubation'.
I've tried to duplicate that test on agar stamets refers to in his book at various temperatures, and by no means is 86F optimal, even for petri dishes. There is zero increase in growth beyond 78F, and growth slows down at 84F and above, falling off rapidly around 90F.
PF jars can colonize well in two to three weeks at 75F. Mine are done in two weeks. How many posts per week do we see where people have had jars in the incubator for a month at 86F and they're still not colonized? Something else is wrong. Just use room temperature and you'll have far less problems with bacteria and other contaminants, not to mention your jars won't dry out. If you're comfortable in the room with a t-shirt on, your jars will be comfortable as well. RR
Quote:
RogerRabbit said: 72F is fine. Commercial spawn labs incubate at 68F, and their living depends on getting the best success rate possible. It's always warmer inside the jars than outside, and mycelium growth slows down at 83F and above. Note that I'm referring to mycelium temperature, not air temperature. RR
and
Quote:
nastos said: not to mention if you go to the horse back riding place down the road the cubes continue to pop up in weather upwards of 90 degrees here so that should tell you something cubes are tropical so i dont see why 85-86 wouldnt work as long as your not allowing contams to enter the situation...
You can not compare outdoor to sterile indoor cultivation. Outdoors bacteria that thrive in hot temperatures are kept in check by other bacteria and organisms. Indoors where we sterilize the substrate a bacterial contamination has no natural competition and can run rampant.
Yes, I know RR has said the text written years ago was retracted or whatever. However, I have never seen that statement is what I mean.
Secondly, the link referring to commercial spawn labs, as I said in my first post regarding this subject, the dismiss of 86F was never on Cubes, but on Gourmet / Medicinal mushrooms. Please show me where it states this for Cubes other then RR saying through his test.
Because through my test, and many others of the mycology world, I have seen vast speed increase above 80.
Not only that, since I have been back to these boards I notice a lot more people colonizing in light. I also notice there are more and more cases of people having invitro pinning as well.
Edit: I am not saying RR does not know his shit, or is wrong. I am also not saying he is right. RR can out grow most people on this board without attempt, and does provide a lot of help. I however think some of his methods are very extreme and things are made out to be more complicated then they actually are.
Paul Stamets himself said when it comes to the world of Mycology, David Aurora is boss(Not in those words).
I'd like to see where this was stated that 86F was proven wrong is all.
-------------------- Self Healing lid tek ** Update 10.17.17 **
Mini casing pictures: Pins to harvest
Cup O' Shrooms
Magash: I noticed my contams were in the shape of fingers
Hyphae: Yes "Loss of moisture from the substrate" is not a casing trigger.
My final Grow!
Edited by Citric (08/02/09 06:18 PM)
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Rose
Devil's Advocate



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Re: Why aren't my shrooms growing? [Re: wonderwhy]
#10787515 - 08/02/09 06:20 PM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
wonderwhy said: 2 months ago, I injected Penis Envy (Psilocybe Cubensis) spores into one of the grow bags sold here:
http://www.themadseason.com/growbags.asp
I followed all the directions on the site. The substrate was supposed to be 90-100% covered with mycelium within a month, but it almost stopped spreading after 2 weeks when it was only about 30% covered. By 5 weeks, it was still only about 40% covered, so I skipped to the next step which was to expose the substrate to indirect sunlight. Pinning was supposed to start about a week later. A few weeks went by and nothing happened. So i put them in direct sunlight which wasn't in the directions, but I was desperate. A week went by, and here I am. The mycelium kept growing slowly in the light and by now covers about 80% of the substrate, but still no mushroom growth. What should I try next? Or will the shrooms never grow?
You should see pins a week or two after full colonization. Your bag could probably use a dunk and/or roll after your first flush.
The info you've been given in this thread is sound.
The cakes needed to be crumbled and no need to keep 'em in the sun.
Incubators are fine, they just are not needed, they cost $$$ you don't need to spend, and 1 in 3 n00bs fucks their incubator up.
-------------------- Fiddlesticks.
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Citric


Registered: 03/19/04
Posts: 4,490
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Re: Why aren't my shrooms growing? [Re: Rose]
#10787544 - 08/02/09 06:24 PM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Cervantes said:
Quote:
wonderwhy said: 2 months ago, I injected Penis Envy (Psilocybe Cubensis) spores into one of the grow bags sold here:
http://www.themadseason.com/growbags.asp
I followed all the directions on the site. The substrate was supposed to be 90-100% covered with mycelium within a month, but it almost stopped spreading after 2 weeks when it was only about 30% covered. By 5 weeks, it was still only about 40% covered, so I skipped to the next step which was to expose the substrate to indirect sunlight. Pinning was supposed to start about a week later. A few weeks went by and nothing happened. So i put them in direct sunlight which wasn't in the directions, but I was desperate. A week went by, and here I am. The mycelium kept growing slowly in the light and by now covers about 80% of the substrate, but still no mushroom growth. What should I try next? Or will the shrooms never grow?
You should see pins a week or two after full colonization. Your bag could probably use a dunk and/or roll after your first flush.
The info you've been given in this thread is sound.
The cakes needed to be crumbled and no need to keep 'em in the sun.
Incubators are fine, they just are not needed, they cost $$$ you don't need to spend, and 1 in 3 n00bs fucks their incubator up.
You're one of three. Get your ass on IRC.
-------------------- Self Healing lid tek ** Update 10.17.17 **
Mini casing pictures: Pins to harvest
Cup O' Shrooms
Magash: I noticed my contams were in the shape of fingers
Hyphae: Yes "Loss of moisture from the substrate" is not a casing trigger.
My final Grow!
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wonderwhy
Stranger
Registered: 07/09/09
Posts: 23
Last seen: 15 years, 2 months
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Re: Why aren't my shrooms growing? [Re: Citric]
#10787898 - 08/02/09 07:31 PM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
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Should I take the substrate out of the bag when pinning starts so the shrooms have more room to grow? Or will that get it contaminated? And when should I pick the shrooms?
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Rose
Devil's Advocate



Registered: 09/24/03
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Re: Why aren't my shrooms growing? [Re: wonderwhy]
#10787915 - 08/02/09 07:34 PM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
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There's a good thread around here about when to pick PE. They are not as easy to tell as other cubes.
They'll be fine in the bag, at least the first flush. No need to open your first bag grow before you see pins, unless it stalls.
PE's can be a bit slower to pin than your average cube... don't panic, they'll pin when ready.
-------------------- Fiddlesticks.
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wonderwhy
Stranger
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Re: Why aren't my shrooms growing? [Re: veda_sticks]
#10801822 - 08/04/09 09:45 PM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
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I just took a few pictures. I put them on the first post along with some questions.
Edited by wonderwhy (08/04/09 09:46 PM)
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ArcanePerception
The only rule isthe golden rule



Registered: 04/30/05
Posts: 435
Last seen: 14 years, 10 months
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Re: Why aren't my shrooms growing? [Re: wonderwhy]
#10801864 - 08/04/09 09:52 PM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
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its fine if it climes the walls no biggie
-------------------- Oh, welcome to this world of fools
Of pink champagne and swimming pools
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Rose
Devil's Advocate



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Climbing the walls is a sign of strong myc.
-------------------- Fiddlesticks.
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wonderwhy
Stranger
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Re: Why aren't my shrooms growing? [Re: Rose]
#10802149 - 08/04/09 10:36 PM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
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awesome
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wonderwhy
Stranger
Registered: 07/09/09
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Re: Why aren't my shrooms growing? [Re: veda_sticks]
#10875138 - 08/17/09 10:37 AM (15 years, 5 months ago) |
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I updated the first post with a pic and a question. There is still no pinning.
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wonderwhy
Stranger
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Re: Why aren't my shrooms growing? [Re: veda_sticks]
#10944006 - 08/26/09 07:34 PM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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I got pinning a few days ago but they look strange. I put pics in the first post.
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wonderwhy
Stranger
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Re: Why aren't my shrooms growing? [Re: wonderwhy]
#10951691 - 08/27/09 10:15 PM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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I guess no one cares about my thread anymore
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Rose
Devil's Advocate



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Re: Why aren't my shrooms growing? [Re: wonderwhy]
#10952392 - 08/28/09 12:03 AM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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I care but the pics are hard to see, but you have PE Pins! PE LOOKS WEIRD.
Congrats.
What else do you want us to say?
-------------------- Fiddlesticks.
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wonderwhy
Stranger
Registered: 07/09/09
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Last seen: 15 years, 2 months
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Re: Why aren't my shrooms growing? [Re: Rose]
#10954384 - 08/28/09 10:55 AM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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I'm happy about it but they don't look like mushrooms at all...just hoping the strain was really penis envy.
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Rose
Devil's Advocate



Registered: 09/24/03
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Re: Why aren't my shrooms growing? [Re: wonderwhy]
#10958633 - 08/28/09 10:46 PM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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You'll know soon enough. And the pics will be better once those pins get bigger.
Keep us posted. I like tis thread. Don't worry if nobody replies, just keep posting. The FINAL thread will be worth it.
-------------------- Fiddlesticks.
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wonderwhy
Stranger
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Re: Why aren't my shrooms growing? [Re: veda_sticks]
#10994758 - 09/03/09 08:04 PM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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I updated the first post with a description of my trip and pics of the pins right after I picked them.
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wonderwhy
Stranger
Registered: 07/09/09
Posts: 23
Last seen: 15 years, 2 months
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Re: Why aren't my shrooms growing? [Re: wonderwhy]
#11011079 - 09/06/09 06:47 PM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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bump
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