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OfflineEchoVortex
(hard) member
Registered: 02/06/02
Posts: 859
Last seen: 13 years, 1 hour
Re: Pentagon to moniter every purchase made by citizen [Re: Ellis Dee]
    #1077611 - 11/22/02 08:17 PM (18 years, 9 months ago)

RailGun writes:

"We still have the right to bear arms... If these things get too out of hand we can still vote from the roof tops... "

Instead of getting into an unwinnable firefight with the feds (who have SWAT teams and tanks and Apache attack helicopters, don't forget) I'm planning to do the smart thing. I'm making plans to leave the country. If Bush gets re-elected in 2004 I'll be ready to go in a flash. The smart people didn't wait until 1939 to get out of Germany.

Things are just going to get worse. I was just reading an article about how the US aviation industry has NO PROTECTION WHATSOEVER from hand-held, surface-to-air infrared missiles (of the Stinger variety). It's only a matter of time before a terrorist group gets their hands on some (hell, thousands are already missing from military stockpiles) and start shooting the airliners out of the sky like clay pigeons. I AM NOT MAKING THIS UP. Here's an excerpt from the article:

"The air industry's worst nightmare
Just days ago, national security executives met secretly with airline CEOs to warn them that al-Qaida may be planning to fire shoulder-launched missiles at commercial jets in the U.S. There's virtually no defense.

- - - - - - - - - - - -
By Paul J. Caffera



Nov. 22, 2002 | The war on terror took an unsettling turn last week with the resurfacing of Osama bin Laden and the FBI's announcement that al-Qaida is planning "spectacular attacks ... [with] high symbolic value, mass casualties, severe damage to the U.S. economy, and maximum psychological trauma." The FBI identified the U.S. aviation industry as a prime target for al-Qaida, and although critics have complained the bulletin was vague, Salon has learned that in the days before it was issued, national security executives met secretly with top airline officials to discuss the risk that high-tech portable missiles might be used against commercial jets.

According to sources who attended it, the meeting was convened by the year-old Transportation Security Administration on the afternoon of Election Day, Nov. 5. It included Adm. James Loy, chief of the agency; President Bush's secretary of transportation, Norman Mineta; representatives of the Office of Homeland Security; and a group of 25 airline CEOs. Gathered in a secure conference room in the Department of Transportation Building in Washington, they heard evidence of the growing and intractable threat that shoulder-fired infrared-homing missiles pose to crowded commercial jets taking off and landing at U.S. airports.

Sources within the White House Office of Homeland Security and the Transportation Security Administration, speaking on the condition of anonymity, told Salon the conference was prompted in part by a recent Senior Executive Intelligence Brief prepared by the CIA, which alerted top Bush administration officials and selected military leaders that terrorists have likely smuggled shoulder-launched missiles into the United States in recent months.

The news was ominous for the millions of people who fly on American jets each year: Every commercial flight is susceptible to an attack from terrorists armed with launchers that are small, relatively easy to obtain and surgically accurate. And even after a decade of research at the federal Aviation Research Laboratory in New Jersey, neither the government nor the aviation industry can do much to mitigate the danger.

Gary Stubblefield, who heads the security firm Vantage Systems in Scottsdale, Ariz., describes the shoulder-fired missiles as "aviation's dirty little secret." Todd Curtis, the creator of AirSafe.com and a former Air Force officer and Boeing safety analyst, adds this caution: If a "dedicated person wanted to shoot down a plane, there's nothing to stop them."

The weapons "are a serious threat, [and] not enough is being done to deal with it," retired Adm. Thomas Moorer, who served as chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff for President Reagan, told Salon in an interview. "It's a simple thing to do. Airplanes have a schedule. They are at the same spot every day, [and] it's simple to fire [a shoulder-launched missile] from a boat or big truck."

Intelligence and security officials have long known of the danger posed by these missiles, but alarms began to sound after the recent discovery of al-Qaida training videos instructing terrorists how to fire the portable antiaircraft missiles and the capture of thousands of such missiles in al-Qaida camps in Afghanistan. "

The government will surely use such attacks as a further pretext to strip us completely of our civil liberaties (even though doing so won't do anything to stop the terrorists)



I would also suggest that Shroomery users (those living in the US, that is) discontinue visiting the site from your home computers as soon as you can. Go to a library or internet cafe or something


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InvisibleBuddha5254
addict
Registered: 04/23/00
Posts: 532
Re: Pentagon to moniter every purchase made by citizen [Re: EchoVortex]
    #1078118 - 11/22/02 11:36 PM (18 years, 9 months ago)

Echo, that totally freaks me out, didnt all that shit pass the house and senate? I guess prez is just going to save it and sign it right before teh State of the Union.


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OfflineEllis Dee
Archangel
Male User Gallery

Registered: 06/30/01
Posts: 13,104
Loc: Fire in the sky
Last seen: 2 years, 6 months
Re: Pentagon to moniter every purchase made by citizen [Re: Xlea321]
    #1078124 - 11/22/02 11:40 PM (18 years, 9 months ago)

In reply to:

Wierd. Last week you were thanking the lord that the republicans now had total control of congress. With republican control there'll be no problem whatsoever passing the legislation to bring this into effect.

I knew it would all end in tears.



Most scholars I've read believe that the infringements would be far worse under liberal control. Especially if they would have had control directloy after 9-11.

In reply to:

All this will only become worse under Republican control. This is the doing of the conservatives, who Rail Gun and Invertigo seem to be a big fan of. Well what do you think now?

It's all gone a little quiet. Seems like you hit a raw nerve...



Some of us have jobs instead of living off the public dole. This is the first I've checked back to the shroomery since I got home from work at 11:30 EST. Get a life or a job, bumb.


--------------------
"If the foundations be destroyed, what can the righteous do."-King Solomon

And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,


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InvisibleBuddha5254
addict
Registered: 04/23/00
Posts: 532
Re: Pentagon to moniter every purchase made by citizen [Re: Ellis Dee]
    #1078492 - 11/23/02 02:55 AM (18 years, 9 months ago)

Ummm, I have a job, and I go to school. That was a really bad assumption to make. So what "scholars" have you been reading? Jerry Fallwell? Billy Graham?


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InvisibleXlea321
Stranger
Registered: 02/26/01
Posts: 9,134
Re: Pentagon to moniter every purchase made by citizen [Re: Ellis Dee]
    #1078566 - 11/23/02 03:34 AM (18 years, 9 months ago)

Most scholars I've read believe that the infringements would be far worse under liberal control.

They wouldn't be right-wing "scholars" would they rail? Think about it.

Some of us have jobs instead of living off the public dole

I do ok rail. Don't worry about what i earn. It'll only make you feel bad that a "liberal" is out-earning you by at least 5 or 6 times.


--------------------
Don't worry, B. Caapi


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Anonymous

Re: Pentagon to moniter every purchase made by citizen [Re: EchoVortex]
    #1080902 - 11/24/02 03:38 AM (18 years, 9 months ago)

Thanks for alerting us of the upcoming disaster.

This police state has been a long time in the making and it started, lately, with the Republican President Abraham Lincoln creating the United States out of the Union.

At the moment we are caught between the Socialist/Communist/Democrats and the Facist/Totalitarian/Republicans.  Not a pretty picture, is it?

And where will you go?

Better still, where will you go when the world turns into the police state as the globalists want?

The likelihood is that mankind is about to enter a very dark time.

God help us all.  :frown: 


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OfflineJiminiCricket
member
Registered: 06/26/02
Posts: 116
Loc: Ohio
Last seen: 18 years, 7 months
Re: Pentagon to moniter every purchase made by citizen [Re: ]
    #1080974 - 11/24/02 03:56 AM (18 years, 9 months ago)

In reply to:

Better still, where will you go when the world turns into the police state as the globalists want?



Heaven. I suspect the rapture will occur closely around that point where the one world gov and anti-christ takes over.
In reply to:

The likelihood is that mankind is about to enter a very dark time.

God help us all.



He will help you if you ask Him.


--------------------
Molon Labe!


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Anonymous

Re: Pentagon to moniter every purchase made by citizen [Re: JiminiCricket]
    #1080985 - 11/24/02 04:00 AM (18 years, 9 months ago)

Um, what's a rapture?


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Invisiblevkk_
DNA Timebomb

Registered: 02/03/02
Posts: 1,289
Loc: Planet Erf, Yo.
Re: Pentagon to moniter every purchase made by citizen [Re: ]
    #1081008 - 11/24/02 04:07 AM (18 years, 9 months ago)



--------------------
I remember, the first time, I... smoked DMT.


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OfflinePoetFirst
The Risen

Registered: 11/18/00
Posts: 69
Last seen: 13 years, 8 months
Re: Pentagon to moniter every purchase made by citizen [Re: EchoVortex]
    #1081026 - 11/24/02 04:16 AM (18 years, 9 months ago)

Your job will now be to serve the computer with your brother troubleshooters. Beware though, traitors are everywhere. Everyone around you is guilty. Be alert. Know your enemies and your friends. Report any treasonous information to the computer. Failure to do so is treason.

Some of your companions may serve the computer. Some will assist the communists by being members of secret societies or possessing unregistered mutant powers. Communists are everywhere. The enemy is everywhere.Trust no one.

You will be assigned a standard Red clearance laser pistol, a multicorder, and new experimental equipment from research and development. Give thanks for the computers bountiful generosity. Preserve this equipment, and take care of it. Only communists would be careless with the computers resources.

Your missions might take you to unfamiliar sections of the Alpha complex. Your mission might take you to strange new worlds. It might even take you to the outside. Be prepared! Know the enemy! Guard against treason. Serve only the computer. The computer is your friend.

Stay alert. Trust no one. Keep a laser handy.


--------------------
Stay alert. Trust no one. Keep a laser handy.

Life is suffering. The origin of suffering is egoistic craving and attachment. There is a way to the cessation of suffering. This Way is the Eightfold Path:.


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OfflineJiminiCricket
member
Registered: 06/26/02
Posts: 116
Loc: Ohio
Last seen: 18 years, 7 months
Re: Pentagon to moniter every purchase made by citizen [Re: ]
    #1081072 - 11/24/02 04:44 AM (18 years, 9 months ago)

It's when God snatches up His people. Basically I get to go straight to heaven while the world sufferers and goes to hell on earth.


--------------------
Molon Labe!


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OfflineJammer
Computers areMORE Addictive!

Registered: 11/05/00
Posts: 3,998
Loc: (God's Country) - USA
Last seen: 16 years, 3 days
Re: Pentagon to moniter every purchase made by citizen [Re: Thor]
    #1081144 - 11/24/02 05:54 AM (18 years, 9 months ago)

RE: "Get rid of this, fight the damn Patriot act..... Then you can feel better."

LOL:

(Most agree)


--------------------
>>Jammer>>


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OfflineJammer
Computers areMORE Addictive!

Registered: 11/05/00
Posts: 3,998
Loc: (God's Country) - USA
Last seen: 16 years, 3 days
Re: Pentagon to moniter every purchase made by citizen [Re: Ellis Dee]
    #1081179 - 11/24/02 06:38 AM (18 years, 9 months ago)

RE: "The Pentagon is constructing a computer system that could create a vast electronic dragnet, searching for personal information as part of the hunt for terrorists around the globe... including the United States."

ONE QUESTION:

DUU?


--------------------
>>Jammer>>


Edited by Jammer (11/24/02 06:42 AM)


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OfflineEchoVortex
(hard) member
Registered: 02/06/02
Posts: 859
Last seen: 13 years, 1 hour
Re: Pentagon to moniter every purchase made by cit [Re: ]
    #1084540 - 11/25/02 03:56 PM (18 years, 9 months ago)

"And where will you go?

Better still, where will you go when the world turns into the police state as the globalists want?

The likelihood is that mankind is about to enter a very dark time."

You're quite right to suggest that the world is entering a dark time and that there will probably be nowhere to run and nowhere to hide.

In the meantime, however, there are a number of countries where:

A) One can enjoy greater civil liberties than in the US (unless you consider owning a firearm to be the central and most important 'civil liberty')
B) One's tax dollars are not being spent to fund the single largest (though by no means the only) engine of global disruption: the United States government--US foreign policy and the US military.

Here are a few of the countries that fit the bill:

Norway, Denmark, Sweden, the Netherlands, Canada, France, Germany, Australia, New Zealand, Japan.

I'm sure I've left out quite a few. Of course, I will be taxed more heavily in any of these places than I currently am in the US, but I personally consider it a small price to pay not to have to live in the midst of bloodthirsty "patriots" who engineer wars for political gain and who are basically planting the seeds of this country's eventual collapse. It is a question of WHEN, not IF, a terrorist organization is going to get its hands on a nuclear device and detonate it in a major US city (probably NYC, where I live, because it has the greatest population density). It may happen in twenty years, it may happen in two, but it will happen eventually. The political and economic turmoil such an event will cause will break the country's back. Even if it doesn't, the US will overnight be turned into one of the world's shittiest places in which to live: martial law, death, disorder, etc.

In any event, I'll take social democracy over fascist totalitarianism any day. Of course the turmoil that follows on the heels of the US's collapse will engulf the entire world. But at least the rest of the world will draw the correct lessons from the US's experience: hubris breeds nemesis. No matter what happens the US will never learn this lesson: it will simply answer nemesis with more hubris. People like George W. can't even spell or define 'hubris', much less understand this eternal law of the human condition.


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Anonymous

Re: Pentagon to moniter every purchase made by cit [Re: EchoVortex]
    #1084578 - 11/25/02 04:07 PM (18 years, 9 months ago)

Thank you Echo for that thoughtful reply. Many people agree with you, myself included.

The way things are going we are in for a rough go. However, I think that might turn into a global situation. In which case we will have no place to run or hide. I sincerely hope that is not the case.

Cheers,


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OfflineGrav
 User Gallery

Registered: 02/06/02
Posts: 4,454
Last seen: 8 years, 8 months
Re: Pentagon to moniter every purchase made by cit [Re: ]
    #1085247 - 11/25/02 08:34 PM (18 years, 9 months ago)

This is fucked up. I've never felt so actually violated.

Everyone should go read a history book, eat some mushrooms, and fucking REALIZE.


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Anonymous

Re: Pentagon to moniter every purchase made by cit [Re: Grav]
    #1085265 - 11/25/02 08:39 PM (18 years, 9 months ago)

Dear Grav,

Most people are not good at realizing.  They actually like playing follow the leader.

Look where it has got us. :frown:

I feel ya Bro


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Anonymous

Re: Pentagon to moniter every purchase made by citizen [Re: Ellis Dee]
    #1085916 - 11/26/02 12:07 AM (18 years, 9 months ago)

EVERYONES INFO WILL BE GATHERED. This includes all politicians and police!!!!!

If they use it against you, you will be able to use it against them.

When they come take me away for doing things NOT RELATED to Terrorism, I will be worried. Until then, it is only FEAR OF THE UNKNOWN.


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Anonymous

Re: Pentagon to moniter every purchase made by citizen [Re: GoBlue!]
    #1085933 - 11/26/02 12:10 AM (18 years, 9 months ago)

The constitution protects you from them MISUSING the info, not from gathering it. REMEMBER their info will be gathered as well.


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InvisibleEvolving
Resident Cynic

Registered: 10/01/02
Posts: 5,385
Loc: Apt #6, The Village
Re: Pentagon to moniter every purchase made by citizen [Re: ]
    #1086008 - 11/26/02 12:27 AM (18 years, 9 months ago)

The constitution is void where prohibited by law. Politicians pay lip service to it, but use it as a door mat to wipe their feet on upon entering office.


--------------------
To call humans 'rational beings' does injustice to the term, 'rational.'  Humans are capable of rational thought, but it is not their essence.  Humans are animals, beasts with complex brains.  Humans, more often than not, utilize their cerebrum to rationalize what their primal instincts, their preconceived notions, and their emotional desires have presented as goals - humans are rationalizing beings.


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