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InvisibleJMath
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How do these look? (first grow)
    #10605687 - 07/01/09 07:52 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)











Strange thing is, this is the only jar out of 10 that has any substantial growth, but it's only been a week.

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Offlinekaneabel
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Re: How do these look? (first grow) [Re: JMath]
    #10605696 - 07/01/09 07:53 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

what kind of tape is that?

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OfflineROGER5676
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Re: How do these look? (first grow) [Re: JMath]
    #10605709 - 07/01/09 07:56 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

that one looks like its starting fine. thats brf pf cakes right? is the holes on top covered? also, sometimes those shoulderless jars make life miserable when trying to get a colonized cake out of them.

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InvisibleJMath
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Re: How do these look? (first grow) [Re: kaneabel]
    #10605736 - 07/01/09 08:00 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

masking. some kind of heavy duty painters tape from lowe's. I took it off yesterday though and raised the temp to about 80 to see if I could get faster growth

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OfflineLostkeys
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Re: How do these look? (first grow) [Re: kaneabel]
    #10605741 - 07/01/09 08:01 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Looks like masking tape to me, in which case your jars aren't getting any gas exchange, which would cause them to colonize slowly, or not at all.  As your attorney, I advise you to remove the tape from those jars to let some oxygen in.  Your dry verm layer should keep any contams at bay.


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So heavy I fell through the earth...


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Offlinekaneabel
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Re: How do these look? (first grow) [Re: JMath]
    #10605744 - 07/01/09 08:02 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Now that you've taken it off, expect growth but be patient. I f-ed up and done that once and it was a contributor to the grow failing. It is good tape to use when PC'ing though, so don't throw it away.

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Offlinechitown
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Re: How do these look? (first grow) [Re: kaneabel]
    #10605912 - 07/01/09 08:29 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

i left masking tape on my first set of jars and it colonized just fine, havent done it since but just letting u know my experience.


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OfflineStealthgrower
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Re: How do these look? (first grow) [Re: JMath]
    #10605939 - 07/01/09 08:32 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

JMath said:
raised the temp to about 80 to see if I could get faster growth



While you're at it, go ahead and put up a sign near the jars that says, "come on in bacteria, I got just the place for you to flourish, right here, in these jars"


--------------------
Infea said:
You ever seen that movie Constantine.  Well they pass into hell several times.  In hell there are melting human bodies, in your tub are melting mushroom bodies.  Your tub had passed into mushroom hell.

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Offlineylibniquah
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Re: How do these look? (first grow) [Re: Stealthgrower]
    #10606204 - 07/01/09 09:17 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Stealthgrower said:
Quote:

JMath said:
raised the temp to about 80 to see if I could get faster growth



While you're at it, go ahead and put up a sign near the jars that says, "come on in bacteria, I got just the place for you to flourish, right here, in these jars"



ha, yeha, 80 is too high. 70-75

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Offlinenexus1946
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Re: How do these look? (first grow) [Re: ylibniquah]
    #10606777 - 07/01/09 10:53 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Isn’t 85-86 is ideal for incubation or is it lower because of heat generated within the jars? Would temps in the 80's be more ideal for cultures?


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Gypsum/Drywall Tek
The Story Of Russell The Texas (Cube) Bear



The human race's prospects of survival were considerably better when we were defenceless against tigers than they are today when we have become defenceless against ourselves.
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Invisiblem00nshine
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Re: How do these look? (first grow) [Re: chitown]
    #10606810 - 07/01/09 10:57 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

chitown said:
i left masking tape on my first set of jars and it colonized just fine, havent done it since but just letting u know my experience.





I always keep the tape on my jars unless I notice that colonization is taking too long. I've never had a problem.


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OfflineStealthgrower
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Re: How do these look? (first grow) [Re: nexus1946]
    #10606819 - 07/01/09 10:59 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

nexus1946 said:
Isn�t 85-86 is ideal for incubation or is it lower because of heat generated within the jars? Would temps in the 80's be more ideal for cultures?



The worst a cooler temp can really do is slow growth a bit.  The worst a warmer temp. can do is provide a very hospitable environment for several common contaminates.  You pick.  For best results, keep jars in a room OUTSIDE OF A HEATED INCUBATOR, that is unless you live in a garage in Canada.  Room temperature is ideal for colonizing jars.  That is the rule of thumb.  Yes they produce their own heat.


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Infea said:
You ever seen that movie Constantine.  Well they pass into hell several times.  In hell there are melting human bodies, in your tub are melting mushroom bodies.  Your tub had passed into mushroom hell.

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InvisibleJMath
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Re: How do these look? (first grow) [Re: JMath]
    #10607300 - 07/02/09 12:44 AM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Well i'm not using an incubator but I could move the jars back to my 76° closet. It seems like more people are concerned with the tape than the temperature.

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OfflineLostkeys
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Re: How do these look? (first grow) [Re: JMath]
    #10607438 - 07/02/09 01:14 AM (15 years, 6 months ago)

The closet i keep mine in sits at 72 F and my cakes are almost at 100  percent after 2.5 weeks.  80 is very warm and very close to the temps contams thrive in.


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So heavy I fell through the earth...


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Offlineiluvfungi
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Re: How do these look? (first grow) [Re: Lostkeys]
    #10607468 - 07/02/09 01:19 AM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Flowhoods are your friend, built one...

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Offlinegreg86jgl
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Re: How do these look? (first grow) [Re: JMath]
    #10607492 - 07/02/09 01:25 AM (15 years, 6 months ago)

alcohol wipe a tote and put jars in it.spray around n in it every few days with lysol if ur worried about contams. been colonizing rye in a 85-90 degree atic 4 the past 5 months like this with no contams. 78-83 is safe n fast. ur choice the lower u go the slower it goes the higher u get the more flyers ur putting up for unwanted bacteria.

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Offlineylibniquah
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Re: How do these look? (first grow) [Re: nexus1946]
    #10607761 - 07/02/09 02:25 AM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

nexus1946 said:
Isn�t 85-86 is ideal for incubation or is it lower because of heat generated within the jars? Would temps in the 80's be more ideal for cultures?



according to RR, the ideal temp for all stages of the cubensis life cycle is 70-75. doesnt matter if your doing cultures, grainspawn, colinizing or fruiting a substrate, or whatever.
i would be more concerned with your temps, high temps can make contams more likely, not to mention making growth slower. I put a window unit AC in my room for temp control, and keeping it steady between 70-75 has increased my growth very noticbly from the speeds i got in another part of my house that was cool, but not really properly air conditioned.

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OfflineStealthgrower
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Re: How do these look? (first grow) [Re: JMath]
    #10607798 - 07/02/09 02:33 AM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

JMath said:
Well i'm not using an incubator but I could move the jars back to my 76? closet. It seems like more people are concerned with the tape than the temperature.



To be honest, the tape is fine for now.  The only thing a lack of air flow causes is stalled jars.  They should start doing their thing just fine with the air that's in there, and continue on until at least 70% colonization or so.  After that, you will need some gas exchange as the existing air will be mostly used up.


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Infea said:
You ever seen that movie Constantine.  Well they pass into hell several times.  In hell there are melting human bodies, in your tub are melting mushroom bodies.  Your tub had passed into mushroom hell.

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Invisiblebumpn
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Re: How do these look? (first grow) [Re: Stealthgrower]
    #10608162 - 07/02/09 06:22 AM (15 years, 6 months ago)

my closets kept at 78 i got em in a shoe box for 11 days now mist a alcohol/oust mix once a day there doing fine the Mycelium nock up spots are starting to touch each other i do live in  a clean house tho so dunno no contains yet tape is off maybe some spore tape instead


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[if u have PB print PM ME]
{-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------}

Edited by bumpn (07/02/09 06:24 AM)

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InvisibleJMath
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Re: How do these look? (first grow) [Re: bumpn]
    #10610435 - 07/02/09 03:21 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

I have them back to 76 degrees and tape is off. But does anyone have any idea why I would see really good growth in only one jar and absolutely nothing in the other nine jars except for a tiny spot in one? They have all been kept in the same conditions and tape was removed at the same time. I do know for a fact that the jar that is doing well was the first one I knocked up with the syringe (all were done in the same sitting, it was just the first one).

Could the alcohol flame kill the spores if the body of the syringe got too close? I can't think of anything else.

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OfflineLostkeys
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Re: How do these look? (first grow) [Re: JMath]
    #10610464 - 07/02/09 03:27 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Did you shake up your syringe?  Most of the ones I've seen have a giant clump of spores in there that you gotta shake up to mix evenly throughout to the syringe.  If you didn't do this, you could have shot your whole load into the first inoculation point... That's just the frist thing that came to mind.


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So heavy I fell through the earth...


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InvisibleJMath
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Re: How do these look? (first grow) [Re: Lostkeys]
    #10610507 - 07/02/09 03:35 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Nope definitely shook it up, didn't seem to be a ton of spores in there but enough to get some in at least more than one jar. I actually shook it between every jar.

Edited by JMath (07/02/09 03:38 PM)

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InvisibleJMath
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Re: How do these look? (first grow) [Re: JMath]
    #10611709 - 07/02/09 07:33 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

I also feel like it might be that I didn't let the jars cool long enough. The first five sterilized were cooled for about five hours, but the second batch only cooled for a little over three hours. Now I know you're supposed to wait 12 hours, but they were cool to the touch, and when you inoculate you squirt the solution down the sides of the glass so if the glass is cool to the touch then wouldn't the substrate on the outside where you inject be cool also? Even though the core may still be hot, the outside would be cool, does that make sense?

And even if it were the heat, how does that explain the fact that one jar is colonizing great? I don't know, I guess I'll just be happy that I got one jar and go ahead and start a new batch (after I wait another week of course).

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Offlinehyphae
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Re: How do these look? (first grow) [Re: ylibniquah]
    #10612119 - 07/02/09 09:05 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

ylibniquah said:
Quote:

Stealthgrower said:
Quote:

JMath said:
raised the temp to about 80 to see if I could get faster growth



While you're at it, go ahead and put up a sign near the jars that says, "come on in bacteria, I got just the place for you to flourish, right here, in these jars"



ha, yeha, 80 is too high. 70-75



80 is not too high! Where you coming up with this? 80-81 is optimal! Not necessary but optimal! If properly done there will be no bacterial infection even at 90F and if not done right bacteria will flourish regardless if it's 75 or 80! Think about it!!!


--------------------
Getting the most out of your casings!, A pinning strategy.
Oyster Shell "Flour" $2 for 1lb. a hell of a deal :wink:
Not what is overlay but rather what overlay is
Gas Exchange vs. FAE

"We all have priorities. I used a closet once setup a nice little lab trouble was all the shit that was in there ended up in the bedroom that pissed off the GF then I ended up dumping her as she was getting in the way of my sterile culture technique! Ya I got priorities too!!!"

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Offlineylibniquah
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Re: How do these look? (first grow) [Re: hyphae]
    #10617845 - 07/03/09 08:33 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

70-75 is optimal, as stated by RR. I have worked very hard to keep my temps under 75, and I can say that it does produce great results. Take up your differences in opinion with him. I've seen him say it a million times, and I'm sure he has a good reason to say it. At any rate, 70-75 not only is optimal, but it's the comfortable temp range for ppl in their homes.... 80 would require an incubator for your jars, unless you keep your home on the hot side. there's a lot of misinformation on this board, but after watching RR's vids, I would take his advice on anything mycology related.

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OfflinePsuper
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Re: How do these look? (first grow) [Re: ylibniquah]
    #10617880 - 07/03/09 08:42 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

ylibniquah said:
70-75 is optimal, as stated by RR. I have worked very hard to keep my temps under 75, and I can say that it does produce great results. Take up your differences in opinion with him. I've seen him say it a million times, and I'm sure he has a good reason to say it. At any rate, 70-75 not only is optimal, but it's the comfortable temp range for ppl in their homes.... 80 would require an incubator for your jars, unless you keep your home on the hot side. there's a lot of misinformation on this board, but after watching RR's vids, I would take his advice on anything mycology related.






Your missing a few points in your argument.  Hyphae is right, the information your quoting is meant to reduce the risk of contams growing in the jars.  Chill. ~Pixie~


--------------------
Clinical Management of High Dose Psilocybin Sessions:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FbHOTIqjZLk

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InvisibleCH HELL
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Re: How do these look? (first grow) [Re: Psuper]
    #10618041 - 07/03/09 09:24 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Psuper said:
Quote:

ylibniquah said:
70-75 is optimal, as stated by RR. I have worked very hard to keep my temps under 75, and I can say that it does produce great results. Take up your differences in opinion with him. I've seen him say it a million times, and I'm sure he has a good reason to say it. At any rate, 70-75 not only is optimal, but it's the comfortable temp range for ppl in their homes.... 80 would require an incubator for your jars, unless you keep your home on the hot side. there's a lot of misinformation on this board, but after watching RR's vids, I would take his advice on anything mycology related.






Your missing a few points in your argument.  Hyphae is right, the information your quoting is meant to reduce the risk of contams growing in the jars.  Chill. ~Pixie~





Hyphea is correct,  I would go as far as to say between 79-83 is optimal.  The reason for lower temps is to keep bactirea away, they thrive at higher temps.  For spores I would recommend a lower temp  79f or below but if you have a good Iso higher temps are great.
CH

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InvisibleJMath
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Re: How do these look? (first grow) [Re: Psuper]
    #10618050 - 07/03/09 09:25 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

So basically the consensus is that 70-75 is fine. While moving towards 80 will give you slightly faster growth, it isn't worth the risk of contams. Correct me if I'm wrong. Either way, I have spotted growth in two more jars!

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Offlinehyphae
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Re: How do these look? (first grow) [Re: Psuper]
    #10618158 - 07/03/09 09:55 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

We did a comparison many years ago disproving Mr. Stamets findings. We found 81F to be the fastest growth with cubensis. I believe Roadkill was the one that was spot on. We must all remember these are core temps not incubator temps understand mycelium generates heat through metabolic activity this can range from a couple degrees in half pint jars to 10F or more in bulk subs such as dung. This means with optimal core temps of 81F mean ambient air temps in the range of 71F to 79F depending on the substrate/tek used. RR is and has been correct but has not apparently explained enough to his following the reasoning behind it. I've personally have been growing since Oss and Oeric days I bought the book when it first came out in "75" I believe. I grew more exotic molds during those first two years in search of the elusive cubie! My first success was when I gave up on a beautiful case run it wouldn't fruit for nothing I mean I waited a whole 5 days maybe 7 so I tossed it in the corner of my basement two weeks later I when to throw it out and I had shooms growing I was tripping moments later!!! I finally set up a very nice lab with an airlock chamber entrance and all the bells and whistles I could buy ($4000 worth) which was considerable overkill but I perfected my sterile culture technique and have been growing ever since not just mushrooms but spiritually as well.

Just one last thing that's been misunderstood when ever you place a casing layer on a substrate you are casing it that's why we call it a casing technically it's a cased substrate but calling it a casing is quicker to type and we all know we are then talking about a cased substrate correct no but it's myco lingo in my book. You'll see me always refer to it as a cased substrate because I respect RR and everything he does for us although we don't always agree he always has my utmost respect and I'm right there reading his replies to try to pick up on new info.
Now when I say 80F is not too high it isn't too high it is on the high side but will work almost perfect I know Ive done it more times than I can remember! What we need here is more open minds not sheep we need our members to really understand the whys before the hows because the whys will answer so many of the hows before even being asked. Understanding is the key to success.


--------------------
Getting the most out of your casings!, A pinning strategy.
Oyster Shell "Flour" $2 for 1lb. a hell of a deal :wink:
Not what is overlay but rather what overlay is
Gas Exchange vs. FAE

"We all have priorities. I used a closet once setup a nice little lab trouble was all the shit that was in there ended up in the bedroom that pissed off the GF then I ended up dumping her as she was getting in the way of my sterile culture technique! Ya I got priorities too!!!"

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Offlinehyphae
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Re: How do these look? (first grow) [Re: JMath]
    #10618197 - 07/03/09 10:05 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

JMath said:
So basically the consensus is that 70-75 is fine. While moving towards 80 will give you slightly faster growth, it isn't worth the risk of contams. Correct me if I'm wrong. Either way, I have spotted growth in two more jars!



If you've sterilized your jars correctly there is little to no risk of contamination. The point being are you in a hurry I hope not because growing mushrooms is all about patience but if you you want to take advantage of the temperature drop in combination with full colonization, a drop in co2 and the introduction if light then colonizing at slightly warmer temps can have an advantage. Understand all substrains are different my recommendations are general they will provide increased success overall CONSISTENTLY If you isolate a prolific pinner (another handle of mine at another site LOL) you don't need to do much to have consistent high yields that's why we isolate to find the best characteristics such as size, quantity, disease resistance and of course potency.


--------------------
Getting the most out of your casings!, A pinning strategy.
Oyster Shell "Flour" $2 for 1lb. a hell of a deal :wink:
Not what is overlay but rather what overlay is
Gas Exchange vs. FAE

"We all have priorities. I used a closet once setup a nice little lab trouble was all the shit that was in there ended up in the bedroom that pissed off the GF then I ended up dumping her as she was getting in the way of my sterile culture technique! Ya I got priorities too!!!"

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InvisibleCH HELL
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Re: How do these look? (first grow) [Re: hyphae]
    #10618202 - 07/03/09 10:06 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

hyphae said:
What we need here is more open minds not sheep we need our members to really understand the whys before the hows because the whys will answer so many of the hows before even being asked. Understanding is the key to success.





Yeap, and I am not a yes man. lol

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InvisibleAlexP
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Re: How do these look? (first grow) [Re: hyphae]
    #10618210 - 07/03/09 10:10 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Hyphae, if I hadn't rated you I would.


--------------------
"To feel today what one felt yesterday isn't to feel - it's to remember today what was felt yesterday, to be today's living corpse of what yesterday was lived and lost." Fernando Pessoa

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Offlinejerrylove
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Re: How do these look? (first grow) [Re: AlexP]
    #10618700 - 07/04/09 12:39 AM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Hyphea Howdy Bro Ham. I think even with all the temp and grow speed bla bla bla stuff. The one thing no one is telling the new guy is that patients is the key. I remember my first go I would practically watch the jars all day. IT'S MADDENING I TELL YOU MADDENING!!!! lol. You need to walk away for a few days and then peek. I bet things will look better then, and tape those holes up with micro pore tape aka cloth tape.


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:mushroom2:THOSE WHO KNOW DONT TALK!:mad:THOSE WHO DONT KNOW CANT TALK.:smile: (Timothy Leary):mushroom2:
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Offlinehyphae
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Re: How do these look? (first grow) [Re: jerrylove]
    #10619916 - 07/04/09 09:37 AM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

jerrylove said:
Hyphea Howdy Bro Ham. I think even with all the temp and grow speed bla bla bla stuff. The one thing no one is telling the new guy is that patients is the key. I remember my first go I would practically watch the jars all day. IT'S MADDENING I TELL YOU MADDENING!!!! lol. You need to walk away for a few days and then peek. I bet things will look better then, and tape those holes up with micro pore tape aka cloth tape.



Quote:

hyphae said:
The point being are you in a hurry I hope not because growing mushrooms is all about patience


:wink:


--------------------
Getting the most out of your casings!, A pinning strategy.
Oyster Shell "Flour" $2 for 1lb. a hell of a deal :wink:
Not what is overlay but rather what overlay is
Gas Exchange vs. FAE

"We all have priorities. I used a closet once setup a nice little lab trouble was all the shit that was in there ended up in the bedroom that pissed off the GF then I ended up dumping her as she was getting in the way of my sterile culture technique! Ya I got priorities too!!!"

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