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OfflineGrowingVines
Slowly Changinginto a Tree
Registered: 08/22/02
Posts: 301
Loc: GA
Last seen: 15 years, 1 month
Re: My Sadness [Re: ]
    #1060949 - 11/17/02 09:10 PM (21 years, 8 months ago)

i totally agree with ya'll. I will say that the first idea of christianity was good. Just basic, be kind to people. Then people found the power and corrupted it and doomed any of those religious to be truely the "one" religion. A revolution is at hand my brothers. Sooner or later these evil people shalt be delt with. I will be here to help my brothers.


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Peace out my brothers, for everyone has a bit of insanity in them

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Offlinejohnnyfive
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Registered: 07/02/02
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Re: My Sadness [Re: GrowingVines]
    #1061142 - 11/17/02 10:31 PM (21 years, 8 months ago)

YES there is a revolution going on!

Congrats my friend you've stepped out of the matrix!!!!


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And the gameshow host rings the buzzer (brrnnntt) oh and now you get a face full of face!

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OfflineGrowingVines
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Re: My Sadness [Re: johnnyfive]
    #1061333 - 11/18/02 12:01 AM (21 years, 8 months ago)

How shall it start? what are the ideas of the people?


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Peace out my brothers, for everyone has a bit of insanity in them

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Anonymous

Re: My Sadness [Re: GrowingVines]
    #1061362 - 11/18/02 12:14 AM (21 years, 8 months ago)

Are you willing to kill to bring peace?

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OfflineGrowingVines
Slowly Changinginto a Tree
Registered: 08/22/02
Posts: 301
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Re: My Sadness [Re: ]
    #1061366 - 11/18/02 12:16 AM (21 years, 8 months ago)

most likely not.
but if truely necessary maybe.


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Peace out my brothers, for everyone has a bit of insanity in them

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InvisibleShroomismM
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Re: My Sadness [Re: ]
    #1061377 - 11/18/02 12:22 AM (21 years, 8 months ago)

In what situation does killing lead to peace?

Violence does not equal peace. It only breeds more violence.

The only thing I can think of is if you are being attacked, and you defend yourself. But could the attack have been avoided in the first place with better communication?



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InvisibleThorA
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Re: My Sadness [Re: Shroomism]
    #1061637 - 11/18/02 02:28 AM (21 years, 8 months ago)

Exactly what Shroomism said...

We defeat ourselves if we allow this idealistic change to occur through violence...

Its a change of the mindset, not a forced change of might over others. People have to change on their own time and that will take a long time for people to start seeing the light.

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OfflineGrowingVines
Slowly Changinginto a Tree
Registered: 08/22/02
Posts: 301
Loc: GA
Last seen: 15 years, 1 month
Re: My Sadness [Re: Thor]
    #1063109 - 11/18/02 03:01 PM (21 years, 8 months ago)

its hard to make people change ther views of life. very hard. i've been trying, not through violence.


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Peace out my brothers, for everyone has a bit of insanity in them

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InvisibleThorA
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Re: My Sadness [Re: GrowingVines]
    #1063499 - 11/18/02 05:17 PM (21 years, 8 months ago)

Yes, thats why an intellectual revelution will take quite some time..

I think the upcoming immense changes with the advent of Nano technology and its wide sweeping affects will start this revelution moving much quicker..

Science is our hope :smile:

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Anonymous

Post deleted by Moe Howard [Re: Thor]
    #1063691 - 11/18/02 06:40 PM (21 years, 8 months ago)


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InvisibleThorA
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Re: My Sadness [Re: ]
    #1063978 - 11/18/02 07:46 PM (21 years, 8 months ago)

In reply to:

Science is utterly fallible in uniting anything. Science and technology have always been a tool for war. Sure, it was always fine and nice to do some scientific experiments- but how could the army use it? the military?



Science is what the people use it for, don't you think that far into the future it could be possible we find less need for war than we do today?

In reply to:

Patriotism, now seemingly despised by many, was developed in the middle ages to stabilize countries and whatnot.



Its been around since the begining of time I would think.. Don't you think Rome used patriotism? Byzantines? etc...

In reply to:

Patriotism was used in the creation of a new sense of government... really it was a very good thing. Why is it being so despised now?



Because it is based on emotion and not logic.. I don't want to say its that simple, but truly Patriotism is an emotion and one that is easily abused and has been abused throughout the ages.. Patriotism is not healthy anymore, it may have done more good in old ages but not today.

We are becoming a smaller world thanks to technology; borders don't seem so important anymore and what will eventually happen is that we will think less of ourselves as Canadians, Americans, Russians, etc.... and more of ourselves as humans... When we start to expand out to the stars, do you think we will still consider ourselves more by our countries or more by our home planet?

In reply to:

Technological advances always come in little bumps or whatnot. Every related or merged technological piece is just an improvement on its precursors. There are very very very few revolutional technological pieces. The rate at which revolutions occur lessens every time any little revolutional article is created or discovered. With a decreasing rate as such- human technological advance will converge upon a point, or else move at a speed of near nothing - not nearly fast enough to reach any perfection.



Up to this point most technological advances have been 'bumps', that I could agree with.... Although the Computer revelution is something that exploded our rate of advance.... The next step that many great thinkers see as an huge advance will be the nano age and its countless applications... Not to mention the possibility of allowing humans to live for 100's possibly even 1000's of years in the future.. This will dramatically change our way of life, how we behave and how we think...

In reply to:

Emotions and feelings- keystones of humanity, are not scientifically plausible.



Emotion is man's greatest gift and greatest curse. Understanding our emotions and getting in more in tune with them is part of our evelution.. Hopefully further in the future we will all learn to use emotion more to our own benefit instead of our own detriment.

In reply to:

Current times have a hard time grasping such a concept which 1000 years ago was easily grasped, but only because of their circumstances. All of your ideas have been shared in many ways by ages past. We have had a couple of revolutional technological ideas in the past 100 years and are, as always, overestimating everything.



How are we overestimating things? The rate of advance is speeding up substantially thanks to the computer age... I find it more likely that the next 500 years will bring about incredible technological and societal change.... Human development will not move as fast, but it will be forced to adapt to a brave new world and its new challenges.

In reply to:

I find many of the current ideas laughable, but, of course, i'ts current etiquette to not throw out a new idea as bad, because it might not be. No, its much more fashionable to justify dreams and impossiblities for the exceptions to every rule to be supreme. Through history, people have always expected a shift toward unity and whatnot to come soon- but only in times that such an outcome fitted them.



What specifically do you find laughable? A shift to unity is overstating things, an evelution to more unity amongst humankind is what I speak of.

In reply to:

I find the faith in science very disturbing. It is not something to trust, ever. The ways in which science work are very false and flawed. While I will agree to some of its achievement- it is hardly anything to boast about and believe in.



I'd rather trust truth and science over preachers and belief in a higher power. The people who use the science are the ones responsible for it being good or bad.. If we move forward and become less warlike, isn't just quite plausible that we will use more science for good than bad?

I don't believe in science as a god or solution to all, I see it as a powerfull tool in which change in humanity will be brought about by its advances.. See science cares not of if we like an advance or not, its only concern is to learn more and to better understand our world/universe...

Science is change, change is good, and the future promises great leaps in scientific achievements.. Those factors will force a humankind of today to change the way we think, live, feel, etc...

Does God want these things? Or is God more about control and keeping things just the way they are...

Don't fear science, don't fear the future, because we as a species have the hope for a better tommorow even though there's lots of skeptics today..

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Anonymous

Post deleted by Moe Howard [Re: Thor]
    #1064099 - 11/18/02 08:41 PM (21 years, 8 months ago)


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InvisibleThorA
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Re: My Sadness [Re: ]
    #1064512 - 11/18/02 11:04 PM (21 years, 8 months ago)

In reply to:

Science... is irrelevant proof with biased conviction. Any set of data can be interpreted in a myriad of different ways



So science that proves why a light bulb works is somehow flawed? Science is what the human condition created to help understand the world around us, human curiosity is one of our most treasured instincts. We learn by wanting to understand things, to learn.... Science is the result of that human condition.

In reply to:

It is never objective- it is a highly obscured form of "proving" prejudices- it will always remain so.


Never objective? Is the science of gravity not objective? "Always remain so" ?

In reply to:

I just have come to hate everything it is.



Could this be the reason you don't have an open mind to science? Hate is an emotion that all humans should live without, it does not better the human condition.

In reply to:

Romans did not feel patriotism- that is something hard to understand today. Certainly, they thought their empire nice and big and strong- but they didnt care if it was Roman- only that they were the "greatest"



Romans did indeed have patriotism, in fact this is not something you can debate... Do you have another meaning to the word patriotism? Romans were patriotic, scathingly so.

Here's the dictionary meaning of Patriotism so we are clear on this:
patriotism

\Pa"tri*ot*ism\, n. [Cf. F. patriotisme.] Love of country; devotion to the welfare of one's country; the virtues and actions of a patriot; the passion which inspires one to serve one's country. --Berkley.


In reply to:

How are you overestimating things? In the same exact way all of humanity has throughout all of time! No matter what kind of revolution- it is a revolution and viewed as a keystone for a utopian future. Depending on how society views it at the time, the size of the keystone is exagerated accordingly.



You choose to believe what you want, I have no problem with that.. However you do not know how things will turn out, and like I said before I am not saying a future utopia is what this is about... Have you heard of the Dark ages? Industrial Revelution? Computer age? These are descriptions of pieces of history that saw great change.. I am speaking of this in the same manner, the Nano Age will be upon us.... We know this because its the next logical step, and we are seeing the beginings of this even today.

I don't see any point that I made as an overestimation at all, rather a view that I have of the future. It can take hundreds or thousands of years, but its coming... We can't deny progress and human evelution. So I still don't see where you state this is overestimating...

On the subject of emotion versus logic... Would you prefer that we ignore logic as a species and live only by emotion? You think we'd survive very long on only our emotions?

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InvisibleShroomismM
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Re: My Sadness [Re: Thor]
    #1064541 - 11/18/02 11:15 PM (21 years, 8 months ago)

Science performs a critical role, but let us not rely too heavily on science for interpretation of our reality. We must come to an understanding of the relationship between spirituality and science, and utilize them both simultaneously with an open heart and mind to find the truth. Theories can be inacurate, so we should be open to change at any time and always seeking to improve our knowledge. We are hardly omniscient beings, at least on the conscious level... therefore we should never set ourselves too firmly into a fact when it could be leading us astray from the actual process at hand.. maintaining a flexible belief system and always yearning to learn more is an efficient science. We cannot know all the answers at once, and there is always more to learn.


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InvisibleThorA
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Re: My Sadness [Re: Shroomism]
    #1064566 - 11/18/02 11:20 PM (21 years, 8 months ago)

I don't want anyone to think I mean by supporting science that I mean ignoring spirituality... I feel that self spirituality is hugely important for the future of our species....

I liken the approach of the Bhuddists to what I would like to see more people do, approach the world from within first... The Ego is a serious problem if we are to allow hatred, jealousy, etc. control our lives and that of our people.

I just don't want organized religion to survive much longer, I want us to move away from that towards people who no longer need idol worship to feel spiritual, but rather to feel spiritual within themselves...

Hope that clears it up, I'm not some anti-spirituality guy who thinks one extreme (science) is the solution to all.. I after all use mushrooms and its impossible to think there is nothing out there but science :wink:


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Anonymous

Re: My Sadness [Re: Thor]
    #1064986 - 11/19/02 01:48 AM (21 years, 8 months ago)

I really don't know what to say.

I am impressed and thankful that you chose to post a few of your thoughts on these matters in this forum.

I am uncomfortable with delineating the differences in our outlook on this matter.

Cheers,

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