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Offlinehamloaf
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Re: Strain/Race/Variety Thread [Re: stonesun]
    #13162946 - 09/07/10 11:21 PM (13 years, 4 months ago)

Gotcha!  Gotta' post to become clear.  :super:

Nice P. tampanensis on BRF grow.

I'm likin' that (favorited).


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Re: Strain/Race/Variety Thread [Re: hamloaf]
    #13163101 - 09/08/10 12:09 AM (13 years, 4 months ago)

Docs a sexpert.


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Invisible13shroomsM
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Re: Strain/Race/Variety Thread [Re: Base Icks]
    #13163233 - 09/08/10 12:43 AM (13 years, 4 months ago)

:crazybeard:


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Invisibleanonjon
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Re: Strain/Race/Variety Thread [Re: 13shrooms]
    #13163688 - 09/08/10 05:16 AM (13 years, 4 months ago)

It doesn't matter where you grow Koh Samui. It doesn't matter matter if it's multispore or isolate. When you grow it out, it will look like Koh Samui.

The same is true of every other strain. Sure, many are the same as they've been renamed by diff cultivars. It doesn't change the fact that there are distinctive genetic lines.

I won't let anyone slide on saying PE is an exception that defies the rule. PE is the definitive example of how serious the variation within this species is. You can't just toss it. But PE aside look at this pic.

This morphology is not due to environmental factors. This is a typical Koh Samui Phenotype:


Look at this typical dimpled cap of a PES Amazon:

It would be impossible to mistake this for ecuador, puerto, b+, orissa,...

Look at this taproot feature of the costa rica strain. Very typical, even in multispore:

These examples are not few and far between. If what 13shrooms was saying was true, the vendors would not bother to carry such a variety of strains.

He claims I couldn't distinguish between puerto and amazon if the syringes weren't labeled. Hardly even a challenge. Puerto doesn't get nearly as big and the stems form a sprawling mass in a very dense pinset. Amazon has a certain pattern to the cap that puerto does not. Also you wouldn't find dimples on the Puertos. They look totally different when grown out and even a total noob could look thru Cervantes Journal and figure out which was the puerto and which was the amazon.

Just another TC on the bandwagon of this myth that serves no other purpose than discouraging strain fads. I'm not saying this isn't a laudable purpose, but I'm not gonna stand here and let people tell me that I'm clueless and that it's "no wonder I'm not a TC".  At least I'm not intentionally lying to the noobs.

btw,


Edited by anonjon (09/08/10 07:55 AM)


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InvisibleFungal growth
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Re: Strain/Race/Variety Thread [Re: anonjon]
    #13164279 - 09/08/10 09:38 AM (13 years, 4 months ago)

my question is if a cube is a cube is a cube, why are they so different from each other?
my crs look like other peoples crs, but they look completely different from my g.t.'s. which look different
from my orissa's. im not even sure why i need to explain this, it seems obvious.
the cube is a cube mantra is broken as soon as you say 'except for p.e.'
if there is one exception there are bound to be others. that is the logical assumption,
at least to leave the possibility open. to know there is an exception but still cling to
'cube is a cube' seems a bit unreasonable.
living things adapt to thier environment sure, but they will also mutate to exploit said
environment to the best of thier abilities. cubes grow around the world. they have adapted to
many similar but different ecosystems. these adaptations are passed to thier dna.
but whatever. its only my opinion. im  not a tc. but like most of them, i am an amatuer.
trust who you want, but see for yourself.


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InvisibleDoc_T
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Re: Strain/Race/Variety Thread [Re: Fungal growth]
    #13164456 - 09/08/10 10:40 AM (13 years, 4 months ago)

They look different yes.
But, the name does not indicate what they will look like.
And they all grow the same.

Maybe yours have spots and mine don't. Maybe some are tall and some are short.
But you can't predict which is what based on the name, and it doesn't matter anyway, since MS = random variation (within limits).

We aren't the only folks to do this, there's a fierce debate among birdwatchers about the same topic.
Depending on how you count them, Canada Geese may have 10-12 subspecies. Or about four. Or they are all one species.

Same thing with Flickers, it's either 1, 2, or three species. Fistfights have broken out over it.


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Edited by Doc_T (09/08/10 10:43 AM)


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Invisibleanonjon
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Re: Strain/Race/Variety Thread [Re: Doc_T]
    #13164501 - 09/08/10 10:56 AM (13 years, 4 months ago)

With time and experience you begin to sort out the environmental factors from the genetics. Every strain has a telos that it could achieve given the right parameters.

The geese is a great analogy except that most people here aren't really interested in taxonomy. They just want to know what to expect from the spores they purchased from a position of practicality and curiosity. If we were to browbeat every noob who makes bad assumptions about his 'strain', we'd drive people away. Perhaps we already have, in the name of keeping a tidy forum.

And maybe that sacrifice is worth it, except I fail to see the purpose in browbeating people within the strain thread. It's supposed to be free reign in here. Instead, you get obnoxious TC's jumping in just to tell us how stupid we are.

Humorously, 13shrooms is posting in another thread how super awesome potent the crs strain is. How is that not inconsistent. I reject your facepalm and insert my own :facepalm:.


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InvisibleDoc_T
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Re: Strain/Race/Variety Thread [Re: anonjon]
    #13164509 - 09/08/10 11:00 AM (13 years, 4 months ago)

I hope he's posting about how great his particular subset of crs genetics is.

As far as browbeating, meh.
People ask the question, then don't want to believe the answer. So you say it again. And again. And again.

IF you had a print of "known lineage" then you may may able to derive something from the name.
But given who grows these things, I don't think the name is worth the bag it's written on in 99% of cases.

Some, you can tell.
I got my Oak Ridge from Jeetered, it's as 'authentic' as any OR and anybody that got a print I grew got a sincere Oak Ridge.
But that's the only one of mine I have any personal confidence in.


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Invisible13shroomsM
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Re: Strain/Race/Variety Thread [Re: Doc_T]
    #13164721 - 09/08/10 12:03 PM (13 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Humorously, 13shrooms is posting in another thread how super awesome potent the crs strain is.




c'mon now, I simply said 1g of crs knocked my dick in the dirt, I didnt say that substrain is known to be uber potent just that that dose rocked my world. 

go twist someone elses words so it can fit your meager beliefs. :stoner:


Quote:

Every strain has a telos that it could achieve given the right parameters.





this is the same thing I was saying only in diff words, not everybody has the same conditions to cultivate in and therefore will not get the same look from every grow of the same substrain.  like Doc_T @ high elevation can grow the same cube variety as me and I bet money they will look different. :mushroom2:

Im done, have fun repeating yourself. :plur:


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InvisibleFungal growth
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Re: Strain/Race/Variety Thread [Re: 13shrooms]
    #13164790 - 09/08/10 12:20 PM (13 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

13shrooms said:


Im done, have fun repeating yourself. :plur:




lol!
a cube is a cube is a cube is a cube is a cube is a cube is a cube is a cube is a cube is a cube is a cube is a cube is a cube is a cube is a cube is a cube is a cube is a cube is a cube is a cube is a cube is a cube is a cube is a cube.
repeat.

:mel:


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Invisibleanonjon
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Re: Strain/Race/Variety Thread [Re: 13shrooms]
    #13164949 - 09/08/10 12:50 PM (13 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

13shrooms said:
Im done, have fun repeating yourself. :plur:




Why? Apparently we concur.

Quote:

13shrooms said:
Quote:

Every strain has a telos that it could achieve given the right parameters.





this is the same thing I was saying only in diff words




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Offlinelibertaire
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Re: Strain/Race/Variety Thread [Re: anonjon]
    #13167647 - 09/08/10 08:39 PM (13 years, 4 months ago)

My 2 cents, and I've said this before.  A cube is NOT a cube.  Just because we haven't been observant or curious enough to be able to distinguish, either macroscopically or on a genetic level, between each specific variation in genotype, does not mean that each strain is not genetically unique.  However, as was demonstrated be anonjon and javadog earlier, with some experience, you can indeed take an educated guess at what a strain is based on looks.  Having said that, your experience with a particular strain may vary from the norm because of:

1.) Environmental factors
2.) Mutations caused by chemical or uv exposure
3.) Random genetic mutation

So basically, a cube is not a cube, but because there are a number of factors that influence a particular colony's phenotype, and also, because it is really the same species we are working with here, it can be hard to tell one strain from the next.  Not impossible, but it's not easy either.


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Offlinehamloaf
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Re: Strain/Race/Variety Thread [Re: libertaire]
    #13169059 - 09/09/10 06:45 AM (13 years, 4 months ago)

Cubensis are a single specie no matter what section of the world it's from.
It's still a cubensis hence a cube is a cube.
(everybody knows, with the exception of PE)

Genetic variances in said cubes come from RACE of the cubensis and human intervention.


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InvisibleFungal growth
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Re: Strain/Race/Variety Thread [Re: hamloaf]
    #13169325 - 09/09/10 08:38 AM (13 years, 4 months ago)

one thing everyone agrees on is that p.e. is somehow genetically different from other cubes, right?
so, what is it exactly that makes p.e. so different? why is it the only one that can possibly be
genetically unique?


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Offlinehamloaf
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Re: Strain/Race/Variety Thread [Re: Fungal growth]
    #13169343 - 09/09/10 08:43 AM (13 years, 4 months ago)

PE is the one that was found then isolated near a nuclear waste plant, no?


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InvisibleEvilMushroom666
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Re: Strain/Race/Variety Thread [Re: hamloaf]
    #13169357 - 09/09/10 08:47 AM (13 years, 4 months ago)

You might be thinking Oak Ridge perhaps


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Offlineidunno
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Re: Strain/Race/Variety Thread [Re: hamloaf]
    #13169368 - 09/09/10 08:50 AM (13 years, 4 months ago)

They just say a cube is a cube B/C  A) they usually have the same growth parameters, Ie temps substrate etc,  B) Usually same colouring, IE yellow to orange caps white stems- C) contain around the same active chemical ratios- of psilicibon psycilian  .5 to 2.2%. Thats why they say a cube is a cube-


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Invisibletruskool
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Re: Strain/Race/Variety Thread [Re: hamloaf]
    #13169388 - 09/09/10 08:55 AM (13 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

LiquidMyce said:
PE is the one that was found then isolated near a nuclear waste plant, no?



Yea that is oak ridge found in the dessert where the a-bomb was tested in NV I think.  PE was found in the amazon wild I believe looking like a penis and further isolated to maintain those characteristics


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Offlinehamloaf
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Re: Strain/Race/Variety Thread [Re: truskool]
    #13169395 - 09/09/10 08:57 AM (13 years, 4 months ago)

Thanks for clarifying that, guys.  :super:


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InvisibleDoc_T
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Re: Strain/Race/Variety Thread [Re: truskool]
    #13169405 - 09/09/10 08:58 AM (13 years, 4 months ago)

Oak Ridge is in Tennessee. Los Alamos, NM is where the Trinity test took place.
Both locations were crucial to the Manhattan Project.


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