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OfflineNomad
Mad Robot

Registered: 04/30/02
Posts: 422
Last seen: 15 years, 9 months
Disbelief revisited...
    #1045564 - 11/12/02 03:34 AM (20 years, 10 months ago)

If you believe that the earth is round, you are a believer. Everywhere you look at, the earth is flat. Even when looking down from an airplane, the earth still appears flat. You believe that the earth is round simply because other people told you it is. How childish and silly that is! At least those who firmly believe in aliens have actually seen them.

If you believe in objective reality, you are a believer. Even in a dream, Swami's rock will hurt you. Even in a dream will you duck to avoid the pain when it is hurled towards you. There really is no need to invoce objective reality. If you do that, I guess you do it because it gives meaning to life. After all, if the universe vanishes with you upon death, there wouldn't be much a point in sticking around here any longer. Thus, believing in objective reality is a very pragmatic choice. But a belief it is nonetheless, and consensus won't make it any less so. At another time, in another age, YOU would have been the one to defend your childish and silly little belief in natural laws against the consensus that nature is manipulated by living entities.

If you believe in anything just because it gives you meaning, and that includes the belief in such arbitrary concepts like "free will", you are a believer. If you then point out the fallacy of someone who finds meaning by believing in chakras, aliens, or a personified god... well, I guess that makes you a hypocrite.

I enjoy the theory that there is an objective reality. It surely is a fascinating theory that I am not the only conscious being around, that all of you experience consciousness in the same way. It's a great theory, and I like this particular theoretical idea very much. But I also enjoy Shroomism's more esoteric theories about the universe. Some of them contain wisdom, some of them are beautiful, and a lot of them are very funny. And I'm definitely a big fan of the McKenna space elves.

But can you - regardless of what and why you believe - can you, for one moment, just disbelieve and BE? Can you do that... now?


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InvisibleFreakQlibrium
Son of Uncle Meat
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Registered: 06/06/02
Posts: 19,058
Loc: Toronto Canada
Re: Disbelief revisited... [Re: Nomad]
    #1045726 - 11/12/02 08:04 AM (20 years, 10 months ago)

But can you - regardless of what and why you believe - can you, for one moment, just disbelieve and BE? Can you do that... now?



interesting post Nomad. i was reading a somewhat obscure book this past Summer, "How to believe in nothing"(and set yourself free) by Michael Mikita.....it touched/touches on many of the self same points that you raised in your post

      It seems easy to do in theory(suspending one's own personal belief system/sytsems) but turns out to much more difficult when applied to daily life....rightly or wrongly, most of us have our own "pet" beliefs, some of them we have carried over from as far back as infancy and they are so ingrained that they seem to form some kind of tangible basis for our world view.

      Relinquishing them seems to call for a GR8 deal of self analysis and being able to discern which beliefs are life enhancing and which are not.....i personally believe that the key(to me) is to "keep the ones that are childlike and get rid of the ones that are childish"* This is an ongoing day to day process for me......

* source of that quote is unknown, i heard Richard Dreyfuss(sp?) say that along time in an interview.....he didn't know who said it either :grin: 


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"Being crazier than a shithouse rat is not sufficient grounds for banishment"



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OfflineAdamist
ℚṲℰϟ✞ЇѺℵ ℛ∃Åʟḯ†У
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Registered: 11/23/01
Posts: 10,211
Loc: Bloomington, IN
Last seen: 8 years, 6 months
Re: Disbelief revisited... [Re: Nomad]
    #1046319 - 11/12/02 01:06 PM (20 years, 10 months ago)

Awesome post.  :smile: 


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General Interest > Philosophy, Sociology & Psychology
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