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 daussaulit
Forgetful
Registered: 08/06/02
Posts: 2,894
Loc: Earth
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 Tryptamine HCl and making more potent shrooms. 
#1028405 - 11/06/02 02:11 PM (21 years, 5 months ago) |
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I've been doing a lot of reading here and searching on the net to find ways to spike the mixture to make it more potent. I have found a link that have experimented with these things to increase the psilocybin and psilocyn content in the mushrooms. Tryptamine HCl has been added to cakes and increased the psilocybin and psilocyn content dramatically.
I have read numerous times tryptophan, an amino acid, does nothing because the mycelium never absorbs it, so it is a waste of money.
http://www.fanaticus.com/gartz.htm
This was done 5 years ago. Has anyone done it recently?
Edited by daussaulit (11/07/02 01:23 PM)
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I_Stain_Blue
abominableshroomman
Registered: 08/19/02
Posts: 395
Loc: police state
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 Re: Tryptamine HCL and Tryptophan [Re: daussaulit]
#1028535 - 11/06/02 02:41 PM (21 years, 5 months ago) |
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but where can you get tryptamine hcl? 
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Be Here Now
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daussaulit
Forgetful
Registered: 08/06/02
Posts: 2,894
Loc: Earth
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Re: Tryptamine HCL and Tryptophan [Re: I_Stain_Blue]
#1028541 - 11/06/02 02:43 PM (21 years, 5 months ago) |
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I found a place that sell it along with other tryptamine derivatives for chemical research. So anyone have any information? I can't post up the link, but if you want it PM me.
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browho4d
The Brody Who?What?
 
Registered: 10/27/02
Posts: 299
Loc: Incoherent
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Re: Tryptamine HCL and Tryptophan [Re: daussaulit]
#1028619 - 11/06/02 03:01 PM (21 years, 5 months ago) |
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This shits high 25 grams $330.
Kinda high but, I don;t know how much is needed each time.
It's been discontinued at health stores but some stores still have a stockpile of it.
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THIS PROCEDURE HAS NOT BEEN VALIDATED FOR STERILITY HOWEVER THOUGH IT HAS BEEN SPRAYED WITH DUSTER.
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whiterasta
Day careobserver
Registered: 04/09/02
Posts: 1,780
Loc: Oregon
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 Re: Tryptamine HCL and Tryptophan [Re: daussaulit]
#1028690 - 11/06/02 03:16 PM (21 years, 5 months ago) |
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A man of great power and wisdom once told me "USE THE SEARCH" but i'll just say yes it works with tryptamine HCl and probably with a number of other interesting relatives(the 5-MeO derivitive?)  .Not NEARLY enough research has been done in this area.I can forsee a future of "tailored" fungi with a multitude of psychadelic profiles such as Peele's Lepiota grown on a woodrose or morning glory substrate  .But until restrictions on research are likely to remain for some time we may never know if these peices of information have not already been developed. WR
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To old for this place
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daussaulit
Forgetful
Registered: 08/06/02
Posts: 2,894
Loc: Earth
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Re: Tryptamine HCL and Tryptophan [Re: browho4d]
#1028699 - 11/06/02 03:19 PM (21 years, 5 months ago) |
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well if you clicked on the link and read the article, it says you need at the maximum of .1 grams per jar. So technically that's enough for 250 jars, and that comes to about $1.32 per jar to add the tryptamine HCL.
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browho4d
The Brody Who?What?
Registered: 10/27/02
Posts: 299
Loc: Incoherent
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Re: Tryptamine HCL and Tryptophan [Re: daussaulit]
#1028745 - 11/06/02 03:34 PM (21 years, 5 months ago) |
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Well first of all I'm to busy to click on your link sorry.
Thats good news then 1.32 is a good price for up to three times the potency.
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THIS PROCEDURE HAS NOT BEEN VALIDATED FOR STERILITY HOWEVER THOUGH IT HAS BEEN SPRAYED WITH DUSTER.
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Zero7a1
Leaving YourWasteland
Registered: 10/23/02
Posts: 3,594
Loc: Passing Cloud
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Re: Tryptamine HCL and Tryptophan [Re: whiterasta]
#1028774 - 11/06/02 03:44 PM (21 years, 5 months ago) |
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so im guessing your saying taking the properties from the plants used in decomposition to take on those properties... but what about like the mush left over after cooking san pedro or peyote. could that be used as an enhancemnt in your grow? or is there properties of the cactus that would kill the shrooms or provide it with no nutrients or is it to hard to break down? nutrients useless?
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daussaulit
Forgetful
Registered: 08/06/02
Posts: 2,894
Loc: Earth
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Re: Tryptamine HCL and Tryptophan [Re: Zero7a1]
#1029697 - 11/06/02 07:18 PM (21 years, 5 months ago) |
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there are no nutrients, and there are no other plants that would be added to the substrate, just a tryptamine salt, nothing more than a chemical. It's a precursor to psilocybin and psilocin.
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 rhizo
herb eater
Registered: 10/31/02
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Re: Tryptamine HCL and Tryptophan [Re: whiterasta]
#1030244 - 11/06/02 09:47 PM (21 years, 5 months ago) |
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"A man of great power and wisdom once told me "USE THE SEARCH" but i'll just say yes it works with tryptamine HCl and probably with a number of other interesting relatives(the 5-MeO derivitive?)"
The 5meo derivitive is 5-methoxy-tryptamine(aka melatonin)? So if you have 3 mg pills of melatonin one could add 25-30 pills to a cake for a small scale test. I wonder if the filler would be a problem.
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An optimist is never pleasantly surprised.
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daussaulit
Forgetful
Registered: 08/06/02
Posts: 2,894
Loc: Earth
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Re: Tryptamine HCL and Tryptophan [Re: rhizo]
#1030368 - 11/06/02 10:18 PM (21 years, 5 months ago) |
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thank you for restating the obvious. If you followed that link it you will have read using tryptamine will increase the potency and that it has been done successfuly. But anyone do it it more recently? because if it'll increase the psilocybin content by more than 5x, and the psilocin content even higher, why isn't everyone doing it?
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Dogomush
Barbless Aryan
Registered: 10/05/02
Posts: 1,286
Loc: The Canadian west coast
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 Re: Tryptamine HCL and Tryptophan [Re: daussaulit]
#1032017 - 11/07/02 10:06 AM (21 years, 5 months ago) |
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I know of a canadian supplier of very potent (8 gms an ayahuasca dose) Mimosa Hostilis rootbark. The cost is 60$ canadian for a hundred grams. I brewed up some DMT tea the other day and used it in place of water in my Tapalpa Cubensis substrate. The spores germinated yesterday, I'll post and let you all know how it works out. 
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Zero7a1
Leaving YourWasteland
Registered: 10/23/02
Posts: 3,594
Loc: Passing Cloud
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Re: Tryptamine HCL and Tryptophan [Re: daussaulit]
#1037889 - 11/08/02 11:05 PM (21 years, 5 months ago) |
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what if you extracted the prime alkaloids from mescaline? would this be just like lacing the chemical? i guessi would have to know a lot about chemistry and to understand that you cant cross alkaloids when the chemicals in one substance dont respond to those in another like mescaline and trytophan. if i knew the chemicals in mescaline right now i would have posted them but i understood why you would the main stem ingredient on the cakes or whatever but i was just wondering if there would be anyway to fuse properties of psychadelics. i dont know if you have ever seen dune or not but i think it would be cool if there was something like the spice. but whose to say thats not shrooms... i dont know but thinking about that movie and what they did is pretty interesting.
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bowling-name
sleuth
Registered: 09/24/02
Posts: 282
Loc: Mirror in the Sky
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Re: Tryptamine HCL and Tryptophan [Re: daussaulit]
#1038072 - 11/09/02 12:54 AM (21 years, 5 months ago) |
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" because if it'll increase the psilocybin content by more than 5x, and the psilocin content even higher, why isn't everyone doing it?"
While I don't claim to speak for the Shroomery as a whole. I can think of a number of reasons:
1) Many people who cultivate mushrooms do so because they want to have a "natural" form of psychedelic. Arguably adding a research chemical (even one that is benign) would breach this philosophy as it would be an "unnatural" adulterant to what is to many people a sacred sacrament.
2) While the per-unit cost is not bad, the initial investment is prohibitive, especially for the beginner. That, and in the U.S. (like MOST chemicals these days), tryptamine is a watched chemical. So a forged identity and mail drop are acquisition prerequisites for security reasons. Rolling your own requires an investment of time to understand the chemistry in excess of the amount of time it takes to understand the entire cultivation process.
3) Potency is only one of MANY appreciable aspects of cultivation. Even the more advanced growers often like to preserve and perfect the individual qualities of each strain, even comparing the type of trip each strain results in. These distinctions might be overly-subjective (I've always suspected the "heady" vs. "stoning" trip differentiations from satvia vs. indica mj plants were disengenous since the only known active alkaloid, THC might exist in similar quantities despite strain), but mushroom cultivators like to fuss over their babies just as much as mj growers. Not everyone will be happy to put their hard-won fungus on "steroids." Old habits die hard, especially as newer growers often only learn the methods but not the UNDERLYING PRINCIPLES of mycology from their established mentors. This results in what PF terms "pop mycology," of which precursors in your substrate are not a part.
4) From a commercial standpoint, those who sell their mushrooms would not be able to charge much more than what is a standard price, no matter how much more potent their cubes are. Connisseurs might be willing to shell out a little more for a particular strain, but skeptical buyers might suspect they are getting the DEA's description of 'magic mushrooms:' a dried edible variety sprinkled with LSD.
So, despite the potential benefits, I would venture to say that most newbies are not aware of this possibility, and most old timers don't see a need for it.
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Remy
Bitches Brew
Registered: 06/04/02
Posts: 1,343
Loc: Atlanta, GA
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Re: Tryptamine HCl and making more potent shrooms. [Re: daussaulit]
#1038720 - 11/09/02 11:25 AM (21 years, 5 months ago) |
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L-Tryptophan, the natural precursor to psilocybian and psilocin is a cheap and easy to get supplement.
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daussaulit
Forgetful
Registered: 08/06/02
Posts: 2,894
Loc: Earth
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Re: Tryptamine HCl and making more potent shrooms. [Re: Remy]
#1038726 - 11/09/02 11:30 AM (21 years, 5 months ago) |
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yeah, it's really easy to get, but what's the point? I've read about two different experiments that used tryptophan and nothing happened, it didn't get absorbed my the myeclium, just as stated in the 1st post.
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vaporbrains
Cub Scout
Registered: 09/09/02
Posts: 539
Loc: ghetto# 03479
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Re: Tryptamine HCl and making more potent shrooms. [Re: daussaulit]
#1039038 - 11/09/02 02:32 PM (21 years, 5 months ago) |
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you have to convert the tryptophan to tryptamine. where can i get the tryptophan, remy?
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All refrences to and statements concerning mushrooms, mushroom cultivation, and mushroom related paraphrenalia refer specifically to the cultivation of legal species.
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daussaulit
Forgetful
Registered: 08/06/02
Posts: 2,894
Loc: Earth
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Re: Tryptamine HCl and making more potent shrooms. [Re: vaporbrains]
#1039078 - 11/09/02 03:01 PM (21 years, 5 months ago) |
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I read over the process of the conversion process, but due to my lack of chemistry skills, I am stumped. I did find a vendor online that sells tryptamine HCL.
Where can you get tryptophan? www.google.com
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Dogomush
Barbless Aryan
Registered: 10/05/02
Posts: 1,286
Loc: The Canadian west coast
Last seen: 19 years, 1 month
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Re: Tryptamine HCL and Tryptophan [Re: bowling-name]
#1041629 - 11/10/02 06:44 PM (21 years, 5 months ago) |
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I don't see what is "unnatural" about adding plant matter or an isolated alkaloid to the mushroom substrate. The mycelium absorbs the tryptamines and produces its own. Seems like a pretty natural process. I can think of a lot of good reasons to do this: It's cheap, it's natural, one would only need to grow a few cakes to get a personal year's stash, and it impresses friends. Sounds good to me.
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hsalf
bad O lover
Registered: 10/28/02
Posts: 147
Loc: not from around here
Last seen: 19 years, 5 months
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Re: Tryptamine HCl and making more potent shrooms. [Re: daussaulit]
#1041695 - 11/10/02 07:30 PM (21 years, 5 months ago) |
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them_26 wrote this. Also floating out there is a thread under the same user name that lists the DEA's type 1 & 2 chemical watch lists. And please PLEASE do not use Advance Scientific EVER for your chems. There is strong evidence that they are a DEA front.
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