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 deCypher
Registered: 02/10/08
Posts: 56,232
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 Re: how can athiests exist?  [Re: Grapefruit]
#10283892 - 05/04/09 01:54 PM (14 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
Grapefruit said:
Atheism in the strong sense is pretty ridiculous anyway.
How about atheism in the strong sense about the flying spaghetti monster?
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We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars.
  
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 Grapefruit
Freak in the forest
Registered: 05/09/08
Posts: 5,744
Last seen: 3 years, 3 months
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Re: how can athiests exist? [Re: deCypher]
#10283903 - 05/04/09 01:56 PM (14 years, 11 months ago) |
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Flying spaghetti monsters are mostly, falsified. Not completely but mostly.
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Little left in the way of energy; or the way of love, yet happy to entertain myself playing mental games with the rest of you freaks until the rivers run backwards.
"Chat your fraff
Chat your fraff
Just chat your fraff
Chat your fraff"
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Grapefruit
Freak in the forest
Registered: 05/09/08
Posts: 5,744
Last seen: 3 years, 3 months
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Re: how can athiests exist? [Re: Grapefruit]
#10283928 - 05/04/09 02:02 PM (14 years, 11 months ago) |
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I don't believe in santa claus as much as i don't believe in god though as i see no evidence.
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Little left in the way of energy; or the way of love, yet happy to entertain myself playing mental games with the rest of you freaks until the rivers run backwards.
"Chat your fraff
Chat your fraff
Just chat your fraff
Chat your fraff"
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laserpig
Weedmaster_P
Registered: 04/28/09
Posts: 7,468
Last seen: 11 years, 10 months
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Re: how can athiests exist? [Re: Poid]
#10283963 - 05/04/09 02:08 PM (14 years, 11 months ago) |
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Carl Sagan has an absolutely wonderful quote which I can't find right now, but it's to the following effect:
What the religious man misunderstands is that science, though it robs the world of God, does nothing to rob the world of beauty. The more is known about the world the more wondrous it appears, and if the religious man seeks beauty, love, and wholeness (as most purport to do), then turning to science would do them much good in their pursuit.
Personally, I do not believe in God because I have never seen any reason to -- but I absolutely believe that the world is vast, beautiful, intricate, and fulfilling beyond measure. Are these not the feelings that belief in God is meant to evoke? And does knowing these things about the world based on real investigation and realization not strengthen one's awareness of them?
It seems to me that belief in God does nothing but place an intermediate entity between oneself and the beauty of the universe. What is to be gained from doing so? I see no benefit.
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Poid
Shroomery's #1 Spellir
Registered: 02/04/08
Posts: 40,372
Loc: SF Bay Area 
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Re: how can athiests exist? [Re: laserpig]
#10283981 - 05/04/09 02:12 PM (14 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
laserpig said:
It seems to me that belief in God does nothing but place an intermediate entity between oneself and the beauty of the universe. What is to be gained from doing so? I see no benefit.
Hey, conformity has its benefits! 
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Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. -- Bob Dylan   fireworks_god said:It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.
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mad_cow
He hates these cans!
Registered: 05/01/09
Posts: 317
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Re: how can athiests exist? [Re: deCypher]
#10284061 - 05/04/09 02:28 PM (14 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
deCypher said:
Quote:
mad_cow said:
Assumptions, you know what they say about that don't you? I have no dogma and am rational. Try again.
I would consider 'knowing' the truth to be the definition of dogma. I am rational and am also aware that I do not know anything for certain except for the fact that I exist; all other beliefs I have are merely guesses supported by evidence and not facts.
Ok, I have evidence of higher beings. I do not have evidence all the way up to God. I also have evidence that I would much rather study the higher beings than atheism.
Prove that you exist.
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mad_cow
He hates these cans!
Registered: 05/01/09
Posts: 317
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Re: how can athiests exist? [Re: laserpig]
#10284065 - 05/04/09 02:29 PM (14 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
laserpig said:
It seems to me that belief in God does nothing but place an intermediate entity between oneself and the beauty of the universe. What is to be gained from doing so? I see no benefit.
If God is real this sentence makes no sense.
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laserpig
Weedmaster_P
Registered: 04/28/09
Posts: 7,468
Last seen: 11 years, 10 months
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Re: how can athiests exist? [Re: mad_cow]
#10284073 - 05/04/09 02:30 PM (14 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
mad_cow said:
Prove that you exist.
I'm sorry, but this is the dumbest shit a person can say when arguing with an atheist.
You are talking to the person, how the fuck do you justify challenging their existence?
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Poid
Shroomery's #1 Spellir
Registered: 02/04/08
Posts: 40,372
Loc: SF Bay Area
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Re: how can athiests exist? [Re: mad_cow]
#10284088 - 05/04/09 02:32 PM (14 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
mad_cow said:
Quote:
laserpig said:
It seems to me that belief in God does nothing but place an intermediate entity between oneself and the beauty of the universe. What is to be gained from doing so? I see no benefit.
If God is real this sentence makes no sense.
WTF is God? 
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Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. -- Bob Dylanfireworks_god said:It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.
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mad_cow
He hates these cans!
Registered: 05/01/09
Posts: 317
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Re: how can athiests exist? [Re: laserpig]
#10284116 - 05/04/09 02:38 PM (14 years, 11 months ago) |
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No it isn't stupid, it has nothing to do with Atheism. You could be AI. You could be living in a dream, in which you would still exist but not in the form you think you are in. I could be dreaming you.
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laserpig
Weedmaster_P
Registered: 04/28/09
Posts: 7,468
Last seen: 11 years, 10 months
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Re: how can athiests exist? [Re: mad_cow]
#10284132 - 05/04/09 02:40 PM (14 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
mad_cow said:
Quote:
laserpig said:
It seems to me that belief in God does nothing but place an intermediate entity between oneself and the beauty of the universe. What is to be gained from doing so? I see no benefit.
If God is real this sentence makes no sense.
If two equals zero, almost every statement in mathematics makes no sense. Fortunately, statements only have to make sense in relation to things which are real. Mathematicians don't have to account for the case in which zero equals two because there is no observable system in which it's true. We don't have to account for the case in which god exists because there's no observable system in which it's true.
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Poid
Shroomery's #1 Spellir
Registered: 02/04/08
Posts: 40,372
Loc: SF Bay Area
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Re: how can athiests exist? [Re: mad_cow]
#10284133 - 05/04/09 02:40 PM (14 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
mad_cow said:
No it isn't stupid, it has nothing to do with Atheism. You could be AI. You could be living in a dream, in which you would still exist but not in the form you think you are in. I could be dreaming you.
 , if he was AI, living in a dream, or being dreamed by you, then by definition, he exists! 
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Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. -- Bob Dylanfireworks_god said:It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.
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Poid
Shroomery's #1 Spellir
Registered: 02/04/08
Posts: 40,372
Loc: SF Bay Area
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Re: how can athiests exist? [Re: laserpig]
#10284139 - 05/04/09 02:41 PM (14 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
laserpig said:
Quote:
mad_cow said:
Quote:
laserpig said:
It seems to me that belief in God does nothing but place an intermediate entity between oneself and the beauty of the universe. What is to be gained from doing so? I see no benefit.
If God is real this sentence makes no sense.
If two equals zero, almost every statement in mathematics makes no sense. Fortunately, statements only have to make sense in relation to things which are real. Mathematicians don't have to account for the case in which zero equals two because there is no observable system in which it's true. We don't have to account for the case in which god exists because there's no observable system in which it's true.
Religion. Imaginations. 
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Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. -- Bob Dylanfireworks_god said:It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.
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mad_cow
He hates these cans!
Registered: 05/01/09
Posts: 317
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Re: how can athiests exist? [Re: Poid]
#10284172 - 05/04/09 02:49 PM (14 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
Poid said:
, if he was AI, living in a dream, or being dreamed by you, then by definition, he exists!
I dreamed about a dog last night and I can't find him anywhere. You think he exists?
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Poid
Shroomery's #1 Spellir
Registered: 02/04/08
Posts: 40,372
Loc: SF Bay Area
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Re: how can athiests exist? [Re: mad_cow]
#10284190 - 05/04/09 02:52 PM (14 years, 11 months ago) |
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Of course he does, or else why would you even mention him?
What do you think the word 'real' means? What do you think existence is? How are dreams unreal and/or nonexistent?
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Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. -- Bob Dylanfireworks_god said:It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.
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laserpig
Weedmaster_P
Registered: 04/28/09
Posts: 7,468
Last seen: 11 years, 10 months
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Re: how can athiests exist? [Re: Poid]
#10284198 - 05/04/09 02:54 PM (14 years, 11 months ago) |
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Uh Poid by that logic all something requires to exist is for someone to think it exists ... which would imply that despite all evidence, god is one of the most real things there is.
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mad_cow
He hates these cans!
Registered: 05/01/09
Posts: 317
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Re: how can athiests exist? [Re: Poid]
#10284210 - 05/04/09 02:57 PM (14 years, 11 months ago) |
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Real - being an actual thing; having objective existence; not imaginary:
A dream is real. Are the objects in the dream real. It is a real dream character but is it a real dog? No, you have to feed real dogs.
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Poid
Shroomery's #1 Spellir
Registered: 02/04/08
Posts: 40,372
Loc: SF Bay Area
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Re: how can athiests exist? [Re: laserpig]
#10284216 - 05/04/09 02:58 PM (14 years, 11 months ago) |
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Not necessarily. God and other imaginary characters exist as thought forms; those thought forms are real in and of themselves, but they may not exist beyond one's imagination.
Eric Cartman is real, but he's not an actual human being.
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Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. -- Bob Dylanfireworks_god said:It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.
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Poid
Shroomery's #1 Spellir
Registered: 02/04/08
Posts: 40,372
Loc: SF Bay Area
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Re: how can athiests exist? [Re: mad_cow]
#10284232 - 05/04/09 03:01 PM (14 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
mad_cow said:
Real - being an actual thing; having objective existence; not imaginary:
A dream is real. Are the objects in the dream real. It is a real dream character but is it a real dog? No, you have to feed real dogs.
So is your imagination nonexistant?
You have to feed real dogs real food, and dream dogs dream food. The dream dog is real, nonetheless, because it exists. God exists as this vague phenomenon that apparently nobody can define, and nothing more.
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Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. -- Bob Dylanfireworks_god said:It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.
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mad_cow
He hates these cans!
Registered: 05/01/09
Posts: 317
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Re: how can athiests exist? [Re: Poid]
#10284241 - 05/04/09 03:03 PM (14 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
Poid said:
Not necessarily. God and other imaginary characters exist as thought forms; those thought forms are real in and of themselves, but they may not exist beyond one's imagination.
Eric Cartman is real, but he's not an actual human being.
Yes Poid, Eric Cartman is a real cartoon character, but not a real person. The easter bunny is a real thought form not a real bunny. Write that down.
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