|
Some of these posts are very old and might contain outdated information. You may wish to search for newer posts instead.
|
georgeM
Human
Registered: 07/05/05
Posts: 1,748
Loc: Osage Cuestas
|
Re: Morels: Limestone, run-off, and pH--a study [Re: Mr. Mushrooms]
#10288992 - 05/05/09 08:14 AM (14 years, 10 months ago) |
|
|
You and your damn data collection, next thing you know you are going to disprove the notion that fairies actually produce fairy ring mushrooms! Why don't you take up dungeons and dragons or something! Hey nerd, watch were you are going nerd, don't lose you glasses. Hey nerd, don't fuck with me or i'll break your pocket protector. Hey nerd I'm going to make you eat those fucking mushrooms nerd. Hey nerd, I just saw a library card, you better go grab it!
Ok, sorry about all that nerd stuff, it was fun to type. Good work, I might have to start retroactively testing soil PH on my property, the morels are approaching the end of their fruiting cycle here but I know exactly where the productive patches are are. There is a fair amount of limestone at the farm, I suspect the bedrock beneath the topsoil in the best spots is relatively shallow and there is a fair amount of surface rock as well.
hmmmm
Great pictures by the way.
|
Mr. Mushrooms
Spore Print Collector
Registered: 05/25/08
Posts: 13,018
Loc: Registered: 6/04/02
|
Re: Morels: Limestone, run-off, and pH--a study [Re: georgeM]
#10290555 - 05/05/09 01:51 PM (14 years, 10 months ago) |
|
|
Well, the hypothesis took another turn today. I finally picked most of the mushrooms from the Identification pleez thread and the pH was around 6.6!!!
wtf?
Obviously we need more data and more morels.
How is your diet going by the way? I'm just under 300 now and I feel GREAT!
--------------------
|
2859558484
Growery is Better
Registered: 01/10/06
Posts: 8,752
Last seen: 3 years, 6 months
|
Re: Morels: Limestone, run-off, and pH--a study [Re: Mr. Mushrooms]
#10290879 - 05/05/09 02:50 PM (14 years, 10 months ago) |
|
|
nice experimentation
--------------------
|
georgeM
Human
Registered: 07/05/05
Posts: 1,748
Loc: Osage Cuestas
|
Re: Morels: Limestone, run-off, and pH--a study [Re: Mr. Mushrooms]
#10291037 - 05/05/09 03:22 PM (14 years, 10 months ago) |
|
|
are you taking a wide sampling of PH levels in areas that do not produce morels as well. You know what is going to happen? You will find minor inconsistencies in your sample but just enough compelling evidence to warrant undertaking more expansive work next spring. You can't expect to wrap something like this up in three or four weeks! We are talking years buddy... and probably some travel... you will also need minions.
The diet is just fine, I'm holding steady.
|
Mr. Mushrooms
Spore Print Collector
Registered: 05/25/08
Posts: 13,018
Loc: Registered: 6/04/02
|
Re: Morels: Limestone, run-off, and pH--a study [Re: georgeM]
#10292976 - 05/05/09 08:00 PM (14 years, 10 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
georgeM said: are you taking a wide sampling of PH levels in areas that do not produce morels as well. You know what is going to happen? You will find minor inconsistencies in your sample but just enough compelling evidence to warrant undertaking more expansive work next spring. You can't expect to wrap something like this up in three or four weeks! We are talking years buddy... and probably some travel... you will also need minions.
The diet is just fine, I'm holding steady.
I'm only beginning to sample. But yes, I immediately checked areas in the forest where no morels are found so I could crosscheck.
So far I am finding an interesting correlation between Tulip Populars and morels. The exact thing I didn't want to find. I simply do not believe in the mycorrhizal hypothesis. It just occurred to me yesterday that the Morels they were growing in artificial conditions were Blacks. That means something.
Glad to hear about the diet. Wait till you're older. If you eat like that you'll swell up like a house. Look at me.
--------------------
Edited by Mr. Mushrooms (05/06/09 12:19 PM)
|
Mr. Mushrooms
Spore Print Collector
Registered: 05/25/08
Posts: 13,018
Loc: Registered: 6/04/02
|
Re: Morels: Limestone, run-off, and pH--a study [Re: Mr. Mushrooms]
#10296763 - 05/06/09 12:30 PM (14 years, 10 months ago) |
|
|
--------------------
|
Alan Rockefeller
Mycologist
Registered: 03/10/07
Posts: 48,355
Last seen: 3 hours, 42 minutes
|
Re: Morels: Limestone, run-off, and pH--a study [Re: Mr. Mushrooms]
#10296824 - 05/06/09 12:45 PM (14 years, 10 months ago) |
|
|
You need shoes with spikes on the bottom that test the PH, and a computer with GPS to log the data.
|
georgeM
Human
Registered: 07/05/05
Posts: 1,748
Loc: Osage Cuestas
|
Re: Morels: Limestone, run-off, and pH--a study [Re: Mr. Mushrooms]
#10299641 - 05/06/09 09:30 PM (14 years, 10 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
So far I am finding an interesting correlation between Tulip Populars and morels. The exact thing I didn't want to find. I simply do not believe in the mycorrhizal hypothesis. It just occurred to me yesterday that the Morels they were growing in artificial conditions were Blacks. That means something.
I'm sort of inclined to believe mycorrhizal associations are a component of the morel life cycle but not absolutely essential. Who knows... maybe when you finish with your PH Meter game you can dig up a tulip poplar and inspect the root system under magnification to confirm the presence or absence of a mantle... but yeah... you would probably find it but then how the hell would you know if it belonged to a Morchella spp. -- so many damned variables to contend with.
|
Mr. Mushrooms
Spore Print Collector
Registered: 05/25/08
Posts: 13,018
Loc: Registered: 6/04/02
|
Re: Morels: Limestone, run-off, and pH--a study [Re: georgeM]
#10299784 - 05/06/09 10:00 PM (14 years, 10 months ago) |
|
|
That could be true but I don't want to believe it. You'd think with all the advancements in mycology someone would have figured it out by now. But OH NOES, they're too busy with genetic similarities, pseudolineages and renaming every mushroom under the sun to focus in on something as trivial as growing Morels.
I've seen tons of photos of artificial grown Morels. All of them were Blacks.
--------------------
|
wolfe
Stranger
Registered: 01/20/09
Posts: 17
Last seen: 14 years, 6 months
|
Re: Morels: Limestone, run-off, and pH--a study [Re: Mr. Mushrooms]
#10300214 - 05/06/09 11:42 PM (14 years, 10 months ago) |
|
|
certain factors can change ph quickly- hours in nature and less
for one thing ph means positive hydrogen count
when the ground is soaked, really soaked, the ph will be different than the same piece of soil damp, and these are both different than said soil dry... depending on the vegetation decomposing, and the amount of active decomposition happening, damp soil can raise and lower in ph as it dries... trust me peat based soil acidifies as it ages... adding epsom salt counter acts this but thats for the growery...
alfalfa "fixes" nitrogen, other plants fix(concentrate) patassium, decreasing the nitrogen content of soil in a ratio differing from the depletion of patassium,... will result in raised ph.
Using up the patassium lowers the ph. salt are basic but can easily be washed away. The nutrient content in both ratio and total ppm(parts per million) also changes ph
alot of ash from the fire place or whatever usually raises ph however it is my understanding that burnt oak is rather acidic. manny grasses effect ph quickly (not just GRASS) actually faster than stinky grass,
Wood decomposes in vary-ing ph's
temperature changes ph... 7.0 ph is based on room temperature distilled water.
I propose the theory that the ph of fruiting for a morel may be different than the same soil the week later that the morel is found.
for accurate testing some one with a yearly morel spot should check and log the changing ph as the rain dries out before the morels fruit
Mr Mushrooms this would explain the acidic morels (assumung that there is a ph to morel equation)
perhaps the activly changing ph from the drying of the ground and the thawing of the soil is the true trigger for morels
danny, try lightly sprinkling a couple of table spoons of epsom salt on your morel wash water plantation the mycelia ant the fruit may not need the same ph
do apples decompose basic?
|
Mr. Mushrooms
Spore Print Collector
Registered: 05/25/08
Posts: 13,018
Loc: Registered: 6/04/02
|
Re: Morels: Limestone, run-off, and pH--a study [Re: wolfe]
#10300242 - 05/06/09 11:51 PM (14 years, 10 months ago) |
|
|
Nice, wolfe, and thanks.
Apples produce acetic acid. What do you think? I have a theory on that.
Thanks for the chemistry lesson on pH. I'm sure others will find it helpful. As I am taking these tests I always take distilled water with me to soak the soil as an alternate test. What I'm thinking now is I need a better meter. This is just a cheap, garden meter. I should get one of those fancy, shmancy digital jobs that read to 1/10.
Not all apples trees produce morels. In fact, the stories are about old apple trees. Why is that? The single obvious difference are the branches. Old trees in old, unused apple orchards aren't pruned. If you know anything about them they have tons of suckers and little branches. Each little twig collects water until a veritable flood of water funnels down the trunk.
It's only a hypothesis, but it makes sense.
Similarly, the trunks on Tulip Populars are tall, long and high. The bark is vertically grooved. The water should just race down the trunk faster than most trees and create a flush of water. Perhaps that is the reason. Only testing will tell.
--------------------
|
BlimeyGrimey
Collector of Spores
Registered: 08/24/05
Posts: 3,792
Loc: Puget Sound
|
Re: Morels: Limestone, run-off, and pH--a study [Re: Mr. Mushrooms]
#10349445 - 05/16/09 05:07 PM (14 years, 10 months ago) |
|
|
Morels like soils with pH around 7 because it helps neutralize the acids they produce to eat bacteria.
When morels digest sugars such as glucose they produce acidic byproducts. Try adding glucose to a jar of morel mycelium. Eventually the jar will stop growing due to acid production. Adding some wood ash might help the mycelium recover.
Maybe people should try using yogurt or milk as an additive to help stimulate the morel mycelium into fruiting. It may recreate the bacteria bloom that happens in early spring.
-------------------- Message me for free microscopy services on Psilocybe, Panaeolus, and Gymnopilus species. Looking for wild Panaeolus cinctulus and Panaeolus olivaceus prints.
|
|