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Invisiblevandago
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Trying to save a dopesick friend........
    #10005270 - 03/19/09 11:39 PM (15 years, 12 days ago)

I have a friend.....he is really really dopesick......to the point where he stops just enough to not be sick anymore.....feels great.....and shoots up......

Everytime he relapses it's worse and worse.......the last two times he literally almost died and had to be taken to the hospital.....but is too proud to go to inpatient rehab because he thinks he can kick it on his own.....and he does enjoy tripping.....smoking.....and the lot......but dope is a huge wall for him......

Now he is on suboxone ( sp? ) when he is trying to stay clean....and I don't know much about it which is the main reason for this post....

I'm planning on letting him clean out for ten days......and picking him up on the first and bringing him to my house ( 3 hours from his house......I'm drug free at the moment....weed and all......and have no connections for any opiates )......he doesn't know this yet....but I know he will comply IF........


What is the deal with suboxone?  I assume it kills cravings and makes dope harder to get effects from????  Will it effect him not taking it?  I don't know of a suboxone clinic anywhere near here.....and I don't want to kidnap him and not be able to provide him something he needs......

I have a lot of plans on how to help him once he is here.....and get him back on his feet.....and make him find some passion in life again......I just don't want to play doctor and fuck it up......

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Invisiblevandago
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Re: Trying to save a dopesick friend........ [Re: vandago]
    #10005610 - 03/20/09 12:58 AM (15 years, 12 days ago)

I have enough money to cook for him dailey.....give him all the protein.....veggies....any health food I can find.......fish chicken and eggs all day for 20 days ( thats how long I plan on hardboring him....after that he's back on his own )......and I plan on making him jog with me and my dog dailey.

I'm also planning on making him go to shows ( hes a lot kid thick and thin ) as much as possible SOBER....and dance his fucking ass off......

I plan on taking him back into the woods as much as possible where he found his passion for life in the first place....

I plan on showing him as much interesting things as I can....on top of finding him a different place to live that isn't his sheltered apartment where he has no connections to the outside world except drug hook ups, and drug users.



He's full of love and I know he will let me help him....I just need to know how to continue to help him......

When I go get him it will be 12 days clean......as long as he doesn't fuck up in between now andthen......so it will be over the pain and agony hump....but not over the boredom hump....and trying to replace that feeling hump.....




Any and all suggestions are more than appreciated.....I wouldn't be who I was today without this guy.....and I plan on busting my fucking ass tenfold to help this son of a bitch through this and get him back on his feet.

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Offlineslickvic
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Re: Trying to save a dopesick friend........ [Re: vandago]
    #10007808 - 03/20/09 01:06 PM (15 years, 11 days ago)

I hate to be the barer or bad news, but your friend is going to quit when he decides to quit despite your great efforts.  It is a hard pill to swallow, but speaking from tons of expierence, its the way it is.  Even if you trap him at your house for a month or 6, at some point the guys gonna be on his own and if he hasnt quit in his head and heart for good, than its a matter of time. 
    You need to find a way to accept the reality of the power of addiction.  Your intentions are wonderful and your friend is lucky to have someone like you in his life, but its likley going to just set you up for a huge dissapointment, and resentment, and all that shit.  My best friend is currently fuckin around with smack too, i know it sucks. 

As for saboxon, i think its bad for junkies who are trying to quit. Yes its great to reduce withdrawls, but part of shitty side of being a dope addict is that when you dont have any you are sicker than a dog.  If doc perscribes your buddy with a script of saboxon, than all he has to do is pop one and hes good, making the life of an addict not to bad.  I have seen many more junkies use it this way than the way its intended for.

  In my opinion, stick out your arm of tough love, tell him your through carrying him on your back just so he can go and fuck you over again, my friend knows he is not welcome around if he isnt clean. 

  Also tell  him to stay away from the 12 step meetings aa and na.  THey suck, originated in the early 40's, in order to comply with the demands of the program you must rule out any possibility of alternative help, in turn secluding you to a program with a 95percent fail rate.  I have seen that program fuck up more people than it saves.  All it does is transfer the addiction to a bunch of crazies and bullshit dogma, and with out it/them your as desperate as that junkie feening for a fix.  Good luck brother...


--------------------
i tell you this, no eternal reward will forgive us now for Wasting the dawn...

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Offlineelectrics
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Re: Trying to save a dopesick friend........ [Re: slickvic]
    #10007891 - 03/20/09 01:18 PM (15 years, 11 days ago)

I have to chime in on this one becouse I have gone through what you're friend is going through!!! It's a horrible world to be addicted to opiates alot of people make light of it but it's a serious issue. Like -slickvic- has stated you personally have to want to change you're life. If this kid doesn't really want to kick the habit then he will percieve what you're doing to him as unfriendly. As for the suboxone or methadone all it does is prolong the inevitable it just hooks you on an opiate antaganist that's harder to kick then regular dope!!! Eventually as a junkie you have to go through the misery of being full blown sick which I wouldn't wish on my worst enemy!! Also as far as the 12 step N/A programs yeah they are sort of bull-shit but without a higher power in you're life you are never going to get better. I just hope you can help him out I've personally lost too many friends to heroin and hate it for anybody addicted...good luck and god speed..e


--------------------
"Listen now I'm talking I've been here for weeks, waiting in this growing crowd staring at my feet, The world around me is Turning I'm just standing still, The time has come for changes do something or I will" Phish

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Invisiblefilthee
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Re: Trying to save a dopesick friend........ [Re: vandago]
    #10007939 - 03/20/09 01:27 PM (15 years, 11 days ago)

goodluck man and you sound like a true good friend and your pal is lucky to have you:thumbup:

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Invisiblevandago
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Re: Trying to save a dopesick friend........ [Re: filthee]
    #10008041 - 03/20/09 01:48 PM (15 years, 11 days ago)

No that's the thing.....he wants to quit sooooo bad you have no clue.......and it's the same way....he knows he can't call me unless he is clean......

He stays clean for a couple weeks......and then starts using again due to his circumstances ( from my point of view ).......he lives in a tiny apartment in the middle of no where and he only talks to people in that area that do shit drugs.

He wants to move and start over......he just keeps finding himself dopesick before he can find a paper.....

I'm trying to give him a leg up........no one else has.....not one of his friends has tried to love him and be a friend......



I figure if I can get him up here.....and have him remember what it's like to be out and about again......he will have more to keep him from shooting up the next time.......TRUST ME HE WANTS TO QUIT AND TRIES DESPERATELY.....


He has done so many things to try.....and he just fucks up cause he isn't AWAY from the problem.......he definitely won't hate me for bringing him up here......he is always lonely as fuck and trying to get me to drive 3 hours to hang out with him.


I feel an opiate addiction is a lack of love.....and I just wanna show him the love he's always had so he can have another vice to lean on besides opiates.


Point being.....I'm doing this regardless......I know he wants, and will accept any help......

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Offlineslickvic
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Re: Trying to save a dopesick friend........ [Re: vandago]
    #10008172 - 03/20/09 02:09 PM (15 years, 11 days ago)

"I feel an opiate addiction is a lack of love"  comming from an x junkie, and someone who spent 2 years in a halfway house that held 300 addicts at a time, that absolutley incorrect. 

  Do what you think is right, only you are livingi the situation, we are simply putting our take on what you wrote above.  However, i can tell you have not personally delt with a serious addiction by the way you speak of it, and i can almost guerntee that you are setting yourelf up for failure. 

How long do you think he is going to live with you, and than what?  Will he inevetably return to his current situaion.  If he hasnt even racked up much time than i am willign to bet, he wont be able to help himself from trying to contorl it once he gets his health back and confidence. 

Also, just about all users "want" to quit, tried to quit a million times,  its not about, not wanting to quit at all.  Its about actually being able to refrain forever, despite getting shit on all day or week or month, having the drive and determination to say no to it.  That strength takes a long time, i am sure a lot longer than you are willing to keep him at your house.  Even if you keep him for a year or so, thats not healthy, he will at some point have to be on his own, and have that ability.  That can not be given, even will all the love in the world.  Not a soul on this planet can save your friend except himself. That is a fact.


--------------------
i tell you this, no eternal reward will forgive us now for Wasting the dawn...

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Offlineelectrics
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Re: Trying to save a dopesick friend........ [Re: slickvic]
    #10008297 - 03/20/09 02:28 PM (15 years, 11 days ago)

I think as long as like you said he wants to quit A+ what you're giving him is awsome!!! a friend and someone who will help him see the other fun activities that are offered in life. Alot of junkies don't have that and If I didn't have a caring family I'm sure I would be dead or still on smack right now..Just be careful with the suboxone or methadone or anything like that...It's better to kick the dope than let someone talk you into taking a antagonist and then coming of that medication. the withdrawls from Methadone or suboxone or bupinorphine are far worse then just coming of regular opiates. Dude you're a nice guy and you're friend is lucky to have you!! I really hope this is a success. E


--------------------
"Listen now I'm talking I've been here for weeks, waiting in this growing crowd staring at my feet, The world around me is Turning I'm just standing still, The time has come for changes do something or I will" Phish

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Invisiblevandago
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Re: Trying to save a dopesick friend........ [Re: slickvic]
    #10008436 - 03/20/09 02:48 PM (15 years, 11 days ago)

I'm bringing him to my home because:

1. It's far away from his secluded apartment in the woods that he never leaves because nobody is ever there to leave with him.

2.  He has been wanting to move out for a long time....find a new home.....find a job.....but literally everything is hours away from his house and he relapses every few weeks before he can find another spot and start fresh....he has money saved to do it....and he lives with his girlfriend who is not an addict and has money as well.

My theory is get him up here ( where he ws wanting to move anyways )....and help him look for a house he can afford and his chick and him can literally move up here and start fresh in a place not riddled with hate and bad memories. He will be staying with me for 20 days.....plenty of time to relocate.....and then it's his own life again and I did what I can do.....



I really appreciate all your views on the situation but trying to put more walls up for me isn't going to help what I'm trying to do.......he's going to put up enough......I AM DOING THIS....so please advice me on what to do once I do it.....not tell me to give up and let him fend for himself.

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OfflineJamio
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Re: Trying to save a dopesick friend........ [Re: vandago]
    #10025981 - 03/23/09 12:38 PM (15 years, 8 days ago)

The suboxone will kill the withdrawls and will block opiate receptors. However it is important to remember it is NOT going to kill his opiate cravings. He will need to find something to replace the void that will be there.

Basically I would get him a good hobby that is constructive (something like jogging or working out). You may want to try to keep him away from "triggers", things that would focus his mind on doing opiates (I know from personal experience listing to music that I would listen to while on pills would make me want them).

You truly are a wonderful friend for being so willing to help out your buddy. True friendship is so very rare.

I tip my hat to you sir.

:yourock::cheers:


--------------------

When The Power of Love,
Overcomes The Love of Power,
The World Will Know Peace.

Government - The TRUE WMD

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Invisiblevandago
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Re: Trying to save a dopesick friend........ [Re: Jamio]
    #10026075 - 03/23/09 12:52 PM (15 years, 8 days ago)

Well he wont be taking the suboxone which was my main worry......I didn't know what the symptoms of quiting that were.....

I plan on trying to avoid the party scene for a bit.  He smokes quite a bit of weed dailey, which I know will entice him to wanna push it a little further and get retarded high on H......

He's really willing to do this and he's talkin about lookin for work when he gets up here.......only time will tell tho.....

I'll keep you all posted.....thanks for the advice.

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Invisiblevandago
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Re: Trying to save a dopesick friend........ [Re: vandago]
    #10219435 - 04/23/09 11:01 AM (14 years, 11 months ago)

Everything is going extremely well.

Not quite as planned.  But clean and that's all I care about.

He hasnt used dope since st pattys day.  And he has been off suboxone since the 1st of april.

He didnt end up staying with me for a couple weeks......we actually figured out a way better plan and he's sticking with it so far.

He's over the major hump, so it's all about progressing forward from here on out.


Thanks for the support from those who gave it. 

Fuck you naysayers......I know when to have faith in someone :smile:

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Invisibleadrug

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Re: Trying to save a dopesick friend........ [Re: vandago]
    #10223243 - 04/23/09 10:33 PM (14 years, 11 months ago)

I don't think anyone was trying to be a naysayer. Its just that we've all had our personal experiences with addicts/addictions and its hard not to superimpose one's own experiences onto other people's situations.

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