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Invisibleadrug

Registered: 02/04/03
Posts: 15,800
Good news in the war on our personal freedom.
    #10209305 - 04/21/09 06:43 PM (14 years, 10 months ago)

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/04/21/AR2009042102125.html

Quote:

High Court Limits Searches of Suspect's Car After Arrest

By Robert Barnes
Washington Post Staff Writer
Tuesday, April 21, 2009 2:10 PM

The Supreme Court today sharply limited the power of police to search a suspect's car after making an arrest, acknowledging that the decision changes a rule that law enforcement has relied on for nearly 30 years.

In a decision written by Justice John Paul Stevens, an unusual five-member majority said police may search a vehicle without a warrant only when the suspect could reach for a weapon or try to destroy evidence or when it is "reasonable to believe" there is evidence in the car supporting the crime at hand.

The court noted that law enforcement for years has interpreted the court's rulings on warrantless car searches to mean that officers may search the passenger compartment of a vehicle as part of a lawful arrest of a suspect. But Stevens said that was a misreading of the court's decision in New York v. Belton in 1981.

"Blind adherence to Belton's faulty assumption would authorize myriad unconstitutional searches," Stevens said, adding that the court's tradition of honoring past decisions did not bind it to continue such a view of the law.

"The doctrine of stare decisis does not require us to approve routine constitutional violations."

Stevens was joined by two of his most liberal colleagues -- Justices David H. Souter and Ruth Bader Ginsburg -- and two of his most conservative -- Justices Antonin Scalia and Clarence Thomas.

The decision overturned a three-year prison sentence for Arizonan Rodney Gant, who had been convicted of cocaine possession. Police found the drug in a search of his car, following his arrest for driving with a suspended license. Gant had already walked away from his car when he was arrested, and he sat handcuffed a distance away while police searched his car.

"Police could not reasonably have believed either that Gant could have accessed his car at the time of the search or that evidence of the offense for which he was arrested might have been found therein," Stevens wrote.

Justice Samuel A. Alito Jr., writing for the four dissenters, said the court's insistence that its precedents had been misinterpreted was simply a cover for getting rid of a decision with which it disagreed.

He said the replacement of what had been an easy-to-understand "bright line" rule for police "is virtually certain to confuse law enforcement officers and judges for some time to come."

The court's new rules will endanger arresting officers, he said, and "cause the suppression of evidence gathered in many searches carried out in good-faith reliance on well-settled case law."

He was joined by Chief Justice John G. Roberts Jr. and Justices Anthony M. Kennedy and Stephen G. Breyer.

The case is Arizona v. Gant.



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OfflineDeekay
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Re: Good news in the war on our personal freedom. [Re: adrug]
    #10209568 - 04/21/09 07:17 PM (14 years, 10 months ago)

that's a surprising decision but i hate the broad terms they use. 'reason to believe' my ass


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Offlinesuburbanned
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Re: Good news in the war on our personal freedom. [Re: Deekay]
    #10209731 - 04/21/09 07:38 PM (14 years, 10 months ago)

So what does this mean in leymans terms?



lets hope fastfred comes in with his legal knowhow

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OnlineAlan RockefellerM
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Re: Good news in the war on our personal freedom. [Re: suburbanned]
    #10209846 - 04/21/09 07:54 PM (14 years, 10 months ago)

It means that if they arrest you for a traffic violation they can't automatically search your car.

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InvisibleLe_Canard
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Registered: 05/16/03
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Re: Good news in the war on our personal freedom. [Re: adrug]
    #10209975 - 04/21/09 08:13 PM (14 years, 10 months ago)

Awesome. :congrats: This is good news indeed.

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OfflineHumility
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Re: Good news in the war on our personal freedom. [Re: Le_Canard]
    #10210013 - 04/21/09 08:19 PM (14 years, 10 months ago)

I dunno, it's certainly better than nothing but it doesn't sound like anyone carrying a load is getting any cards back in their hands.  "I smell pot!"  Sound familiar?

As long as officer discretion is the extent of the burden of proof required until our rights are null and void, we won't ever be "free" or even any more "free".

All this aside, I'm completely opposed to government as a general concept and really would just rather that people left me alone and weren't threatening to hurt me when I haven't hurt anyone else.


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Offlinej0nnyb0y05
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Re: Good news in the war on our personal freedom. [Re: Humility]
    #10210310 - 04/21/09 09:12 PM (14 years, 10 months ago)

yea if you read it, it really doesnt change anything for pot

"reason to believe" at the crime at hand can mean anything. They pull you over for a california roll..."i think i smell pot" new crime at hand and they search your shit.

it doesnt mean anything, unless its odorless drugs then they cant search it, so i guess its cool? what ev just sounds the same to me


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OfflineNoviseer
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Re: Good news in the war on our personal freedom. [Re: Humility]
    #10210527 - 04/21/09 09:51 PM (14 years, 10 months ago)

This is good for potheads because it's just more ammo that their lawyers/public defenders can use in plea deals / suppression motions (getting the evidence knocked out).  Of course, there are a lot of cops out there that'll do a no holds barred vehicle search as soon as they catch a glimpse of dreadlocks, but this makes it harder for those shenanigans to hold up in court.  It might not sound like a big deal but overruling NY v. Belton is a big blow to prosecutors.


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Offlinepasucks
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Re: Good news in the war on our personal freedom. [Re: Noviseer]
    #10212491 - 04/22/09 08:21 AM (14 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Noviseer said:
This is good for potheads because it's just more ammo that their lawyers/public defenders can use in plea deals / suppression motions (getting the evidence knocked out).  Of course, there are a lot of cops out there that'll do a no holds barred vehicle search as soon as they catch a glimpse of dreadlocks, but this makes it harder for those shenanigans to hold up in court.  It might not sound like a big deal but overruling NY v. Belton is a big blow to prosecutors.




Exactly, the defense lawyer would call to the judges attention the docket # of such case Belton vs NY, and judges don't like to have their decisions overturned in an appellate court.

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Invisiblefeelfunny
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Re: Good news in the war on our personal freedom. [Re: pasucks]
    #10213683 - 04/22/09 01:26 PM (14 years, 10 months ago)

police have and always will do what they want no one there to police the cops, if they want to search they will even if you don't like it, what are you going to do about it


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InvisibleLe_Canard
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Re: Good news in the war on our personal freedom. [Re: feelfunny]
    #10213922 - 04/22/09 02:18 PM (14 years, 10 months ago)

This is true, alas. And if they get caught in a lie, they'll lie again to cover up. In court, it's their word against yours and the judge usually sides with the cop. :frown:

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Offlineneopet nub
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Re: Good news in the war on our personal freedom. [Re: Le_Canard]
    #10214849 - 04/22/09 05:23 PM (14 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

ToiletDuk said:
Awesome. :congrats: This is good news indeed.




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OnlineAlan RockefellerM
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Re: Good news in the war on our personal freedom. [Re: feelfunny]
    #10215124 - 04/22/09 06:06 PM (14 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

police have and always will do what they want no one there to police the cops, if they want to search they will even if you don't like it, what are you going to do about it




If a cop searches you illegally you can file a complaint at the station, and a week later follow up to make sure they took some disciplinary action.  If they don't take action then you can file a complaint against the management with the state police and lots of people will get in trouble and they will take the complaints seriously in the future.

Also you can make a web site that gives the cops name and describes the illegal search, your complaint number, etc.  The next time that cop does the same thing a google search will turn it up and your lawyer can use that info in the motion to suppress, if the cop is a documented liar it will be more likely to succeed.

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Invisibleadrug

Registered: 02/04/03
Posts: 15,800
Re: Good news in the war on our personal freedom. [Re: j0nnyb0y05]
    #10216764 - 04/22/09 09:59 PM (14 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

j0nnyb0y05 said:
yea if you read it, it really doesnt change anything for pot

"reason to believe" at the crime at hand can mean anything. They pull you over for a california roll..."i think i smell pot" new crime at hand and they search your shit.

it doesnt mean anything, unless its odorless drugs then they cant search it, so i guess its cool? what ev just sounds the same to me




Personal freedoms include a lot more than just pot.

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OfflineCubie
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Re: Good news in the war on our personal freedom. [Re: feelfunny]
    #10216776 - 04/22/09 10:02 PM (14 years, 10 months ago)

THe police will just say they saw you trying to stash something. Or the classic "i smell weed"

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