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 LitCloset
hypochondriac
Registered: 04/01/09
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 Artificial introduction of sugars into plants for increased growth rate 
#10172085 - 04/15/09 02:55 PM (15 years, 4 days ago) |
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Hi there, first real post. Glad to meet you!
So i looked around and couldn't find anything on this, maybe i used the wrong words when searching who knows. Anyway the idea is to inject different sugars into plants in order to accelerate growth. i asked my bio teacher about it a while ago and she told me that it was the dumbest idea she has ever heard... I'm thinking its a great idea.
plants in tissue culture use sugar from the media as their main source of energy, not light. photosynthesis ultimately results in sugar production. why not just inject the sugar in the proper dilution into plants, at the roots or stem?
i plan to take multiple clones from a potato of mine or possibly some datura (or any ideas for a fast growing plant with a thick stem or roots?) and set up an experiment. i have not decided on a sugar or sugars to use, where to inject, the concentrations, how often to inject etc. i think i may just go along with the paper minus the isotopes.
How about:
3 plants grown under CFL's in my closet with watering everyday in potting soil
3 plants in the same conditions as above but injected with saline or other control solution
3 plants in the same conditions as above except with the sugar mix i decide on
6 plants placed in the dark, or at least very low light, 3 with injection of sugar 3 without.
give me your ideas! let me know if this has already been covered multiple times, if so I'm sorry.
I know it sounds crazy to some people but after a few minutes searching, here is a paper:
http://www3.interscience.wiley.com/journal/120716669/abstract
Effects of Exogenous Injection of Different Sugars on Leaf Photosynthesis, Dry Matter Production and Adenosine 5'-Diphosphate Glucose Pyrophosphorylase (AGPase) Activity in Sweet Potato, Ipomoea batatas (Lam.)
M. Kadowaki , F. Kubota & K. Saitou Laboratory of Plant Production Physiology, Division of Bioresource and Bioenvironmental Sciences, Graduate School, Kyushu University, Hakozaki, Higashi-ku, Fukuoka 812–8581, Japan
ABSTRACT
Solutions of sucrose, glucose and fructose were artificially injected into the stems of sweet potato plants. The effects of solution injection on both dry matter production and the activity of adenosine 5'-diphosphate glucose pyrophosphorylase (AGPase) in tuberous roots were investigated and compared. The total weight of carbon (TC) artificially and photosynthetically supplied to a plant during the treatment period of 40 days was 0.987–1.869 times the weight of photosynthetically assimilated carbon alone. At the final sampling time, the dry matter weight of tuberous roots in the plants injected with sugar solutions showed a 2.73–9.13-fold increase over that of the control plant. The root weight linearly increased with TC. The activity of AGPase was also enhanced by solution injections, with 27–63 % increases compared to the control, but was not significantly related to TC. The injection of sugar solutions is concluded to have a dual effect on root production in sweet potato. One effect is that the increased sugar concentration in the plant increases AGPase and sink activities, and the other effect is that the increased carbon supply quantitatively promotes starch synthesis and accumulation in roots.
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 Brainiac
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Registered: 04/29/06
Posts: 13,259
Loc: 與您的女朋 
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 Re: Artificial introduction of sugars into plants for increased growth rate [Re: LitCloset]
#10172101 - 04/15/09 02:59 PM (15 years, 4 days ago) |
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I know if you spray worm compost tea onto the plant.After the light go out, it will make it grow faster....
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LitCloset
hypochondriac
Registered: 04/01/09
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Re: Artificial introduction of sugars into plants for increased growth rate [Re: Brainiac]
#10172137 - 04/15/09 03:06 PM (15 years, 4 days ago) |
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you know i have not looked into the uptake of sugar by roots. maybe a sterile solution of sugar in a tube with a rubber injection port on top. take one large root at push it down through the port into the solution. i swear ive seen something like that before.
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TheManWithTheHat
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Re: Artificial introduction of sugars into plants for increased growth rate [Re: LitCloset]
#10172150 - 04/15/09 03:08 PM (15 years, 4 days ago) |
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Quote:
LitCloset said:
you know i have not looked into the uptake of sugar by roots. maybe a sterile solution of sugar in a tube with a rubber injection port on top. take one large root at push it down through the port into the solution. i swear ive seen something like that before.
Ho' my god.
I considered this before.
I was thinking something like a cact-IV.
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Brainiac
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Re: Artificial introduction of sugars into plants for increased growth rate [Re: TheManWithTheHat]
#10172155 - 04/15/09 03:09 PM (15 years, 4 days ago) |
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5HTSynaptrip
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Re: Artificial introduction of sugars into plants for increased growth rate [Re: Brainiac]
#10172233 - 04/15/09 03:24 PM (15 years, 4 days ago) |
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Well, Advanced Nutrients makes a carboload water additive that worked nicely for fattening up buds of MJ.
You guys ever try a Grapple? This company infuses grape juice into apples. I fuckin love them.
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Science is a way of thinking much more than it is a body of knowledge. - My hero, who will be forever remembered, Carl Sagan.
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LitCloset
hypochondriac
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Re: Artificial introduction of sugars into plants for increased growth rate [Re: 5HTSynaptrip]
#10172324 - 04/15/09 03:41 PM (15 years, 4 days ago) |
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I have never heard of a grapple, now i need to try one!
i have heard of molasses being used in organic farming but damn that was a lot more uses than i could imagine. the problem with adding it straight to soil is (after 2 minutes of reading on my part) that it is energy for the soil microbes not necessarily the plant. from another two minutes of searching it appears that glucose (as expected) is transferred into plant cells via active transport, though i don't know if this is the case when the osmotic pressure is really high outside of the cell... more reading needed on my part that's for sure.
yeah here it is. its a Na+/glucose transporter that's used. so injection would bypass the energy required to transport all the glucose into the roots.
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LitCloset
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Re: Artificial introduction of sugars into plants for increased growth rate [Re: LitCloset]
#10172475 - 04/15/09 04:14 PM (15 years, 4 days ago) |
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How about using tobacco? it grows pretty fast and i have experience with it. here is a paper that talks about what happens when 3 different sugars are injected into tobacco at different parts.
Article
The translocation of photosynthetic products from mesophyll into midrib in tobacco plant III. The transformation of translocated 14C-sugars in the veins1
TOMOHIDE YAMAMOTO, SETSUKO SEKIGUCHI and MASAO NOGUCHI
Central Research Institute, Japan Monopoly Corporation Nishishinagawa, Shinagawa-ku, Tokyo, Japan
14C-U-sugars were introduced into tobacco plants through the mesophyll, the veins of the first order of branching, and the midrib, and 14C-compounds in the veins and the midrib which translocated towards the base of the midrib were traced during the period of 120 min after the 14C-sugar introductions.
1) When 14C-U-sucrose was introduced into the leaf, no matter what the means of feeding was, most of the 14C which translocated basipetally in the veins and the midrib was found in the form of sucrose.
2) When 14C-U-glucose or 14C-U-fructose was administered to the leaf dirough the cut vein of the first order of branching, most of the 14C which translocated basipetally in the veins and the midrib was found in the form of sucrose.
3) 14C-U-glucose or 14C-U-fructose injected into the vascular bundles of the midrib was translocated basipetally, as such, 10 and 30 min after injection; and at 30 min, the amount of the 14C-sucrose in the midrib attained 9–22% of the 80% ethanol-soluble 14C in the midrib.
4) When 14C-U-glucose or 14C-U-fructose was supplied to the mesophyll, the radioactivities of these hexoses were predominant in the first and second veins soon after application, then decreasing with a concomitant increase in the radioactivity of the 14C-sucrose.
From these results, it was inferred that in the veins of the first and second order of branching, glucose and fructose which moved from the mesophyll did not translocate as such, but were utilized for the synthesis of sucrose available for translocation via the midrib to the stem.
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LitCloset
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Re: Artificial introduction of sugars into plants for increased growth rate [Re: LitCloset]
#10173104 - 04/15/09 05:54 PM (15 years, 4 days ago) |
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sorry for the multiple post but i found some great stuff. this paper talks about using sucrose to grow plants in complete darkness. very promising.
I'm leaving the house right now to buy some 31 gauge 1cc or greater 1.5" diabetic syringes. i only had an 18 gauge 50ml in the house so when i tested it on a plant a few minutes ago it left huge holes and the flow rate was way to high for the plant. i just used a 10% vol/vol sucrose tap water mix and i pumped in 2.5ml. really i just wanted to see if the plant survived it, its a tiny 5 inch purple potato cutting. when i actually do this later tonight i want to make sure to inject the solution very very slowly and on a larger plant.
maybe place a needle in the stem, connect needle to reservoir of sugar solution which is hung above the plant. then the sugar can be continuously pumped into the plant by gravity...
for now how often should i inject and at the same point or at different points? should i just put some gasket glue on a part so that i have a self healing injection port?
I'm so lost, help! anyone care enough for me to take pictures and write up what im doing etc?
Sucrose availability on the aerial part of the plant promotes morphogenesis and flowering of Arabidopsis in the dark.
Roldán M, Gómez-Mena C, Ruiz-García L, Salinas J, Martínez-Zapater JM.
Departamento de Mejora Genética y Biotecnología, Subdirección General de Investigación y Tecnologia, Instituto National de Investigación y Tecnología Agraria y Alimentaria, Ctra de la Coruña km 7, 28040 Madrid, Spain.
Conditions to promote dark morphogenesis and flower-ing in Arabidopsis have previously been limited to liquid cultures and to a few laboratory ecotypes. We have obtained development and flowering of Arabidopsis plants under complete darkness by growing them on vertical Petri dishes containing solid agar medium with sucrose. Under these conditions, all the ecotypes tested were able to develop, giving rise to etiolated plants that flowered after producing a certain number of leaves. Dark-grown plants showed similarities with phytochrome-deficient mutants and were different from de-etiolated or constitutive photomorphogenesis mutants such as det and cop. Late- and early-flowering ecotypes, showing large differences in flowering time and leaf number under long days, flowered with a similar number of leaves when grown in the dark. Rapid dark flowering of late-flowering ecotypes was not an effect of darkness but the result of the interaction between dark and sucrose availability at the aerial part of the plant, since sucrose also had an effect when plants were grown in the light. Gibberellin-deficient and insensitive mutants were delayed in the initiation of flowers in the dark, indicating a role for these hormones in flowering promotion in the dark. The late-flowering phenotype of mutants at different loci of the autonomous and long-day-dependent flowering induction pathways was rescued in dark growth conditions. However, the late-flowering phenotype of ft and fwa mutants was not rescued by sucrose either in the dark or in the light, suggesting a different role for these genes in flowering induction.
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Prof. Astro
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Re: Artificial introduction of sugars into plants for increased growth rate [Re: LitCloset]
#10173183 - 04/15/09 06:08 PM (15 years, 4 days ago) |
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This sounds promising and I will be monitoring it, I don't have a real input on actions but from reading I see you have a good head on your shoulders, keep it updated.
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ethnoguy
"Raper of Mother Nature"
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Re: Artificial introduction of sugars into plants for increased growth rate [Re: Prof. Astro]
#10174000 - 04/15/09 08:30 PM (15 years, 4 days ago) |
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Molasses, corn syrup, and honey are regularly used with cannabis to increase the size of buds (up to 20%). Its not unheard of, and it actually is fairly common practice with indoor growers such as myself.
EG
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LitCloset
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Re: Artificial introduction of sugars into plants for increased growth rate [Re: ethnoguy]
#10174609 - 04/15/09 09:58 PM (15 years, 3 days ago) |
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ethnoguy, are you talking about addition to soil/hydroponic media or injection into the plant?
i got the syringes, its just a matter of deciding between rooting potato clones or growing corn from seed. which would be best for this?
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LitCloset
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Re: Artificial introduction of sugars into plants for increased growth rate [Re: LitCloset]
#10175677 - 04/16/09 12:46 AM (15 years, 3 days ago) |
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ok, here is the start of my experimenting, please somebody experiment along with me and pleeeeeeease be very critical, i feel funny even trying this.
this is a tree being injected at the base with fungicide:
This is a poor little potato clone that i have started experimenting with today:
as you can see i placed a 30ga 0.5" needle with a 1cc capacity into the base of the plant. its in a good 0.25". the syringe started with 0.995ml of 5%vol/vol sucrose/tap water solution (not sterile). i removed the plunger and placed a small foil cap on.
closeup of needle in poor wittle plant:
so the hope is that if i stop watering the plant and place it on a heating pad (on high) that it will be sooo starved for water it will slowly suck in the thick sucrose solution from the needle, giving it a super boost of energy. maybe this will lead to increased mass etc. this is really just a test to see if the plant is killed within the first few days before i put many other poor plants in its situation. the plant is in the same lighting it recieved before this brutality. the foil cap keeps stuff out of the solution and the plunger is removed to stop back pressure.
im sure it will just get contaminated and die. in the future things will proably have to be sterile with tar or glue around the injection site etc.
let me know what you think
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Dr. uarewotueat
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Re: Artificial introduction of sugars into plants for increased growth rate [Re: LitCloset]
#10175875 - 04/16/09 01:49 AM (15 years, 3 days ago) |
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where's your control?
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ethnoguy
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Re: Artificial introduction of sugars into plants for increased growth rate [Re: Dr. uarewotueat]
#10176564 - 04/16/09 08:40 AM (15 years, 3 days ago) |
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My thoughts too uare. You really need two clones for this experiment. 1 to play with, and 1 to treat as normal. Perhaps even a third plant too.
Various sugars can be used in both soil and hydroponic applications. The molasses or whatever is added to the nutrient solution and added to your medium. Many nutrient companies make their own sugar based product (i.e. sugar daddy).
The only thing I have seen recently that is injectable are nematodes that prevent deformed carrots. Well, I think. I'll have to look through my garden catalogs again.
EG
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LitCloset
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Re: Artificial introduction of sugars into plants for increased growth rate [Re: LitCloset]
#10176755 - 04/16/09 09:29 AM (15 years, 3 days ago) |
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no control at the moment. as i said earlier im going to have at least 3 of each of the 4 treatment groups. this is just to make sure i dont kill the plant right off. i do have other plants under the lights in the same room, you could call them the control. this is not the official experiment yet.
as of this morning 0.005ml of the solution have left the syringe. i really think that the solution is to viscous, im going to try half at 3%. the lights where out for the last 12 hours along with the heating pad btw, so this may be why so little has been used.
most importantly my pretty little potato is still alive, im going to start preparing other plants later today for the actual test (as outlined in one of my excessive post above).
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sushi
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Re: Artificial introduction of sugars into plants for increased growth rate [Re: LitCloset]
#10177847 - 04/16/09 01:25 PM (15 years, 3 days ago) |
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I've actually tried this before and I couldn't get it to work, I mean it obviously isn't like giving an injection to an animal, you get a lot of resistance when trying to push the plunger of the needle down and at least when I tried it [on cacti] I would either damage the plant or all the sugar water would just come right back out the puncture hole. Your idea of forcing the plant to suck the solution out of the needle sounds a little better but I can tell you right now you're going to have issues with contamination/rot if you don't keep everything sterile! Also more input, 5% vol/vol is far to much sugar, it can be toxic you know [you don't want to be injecting a highly hypertonic solution]! Try 3% w/v [30g/L] of sucrose, that's closer to the concentration in plant tissue and what is used in tissue culture media. As far as I am aware adding sugar water to the soil, in whatever form has little to do with the plant absorbing the sugar through its roots [think about it for a moment, a 20% increase in biomass from a ~few teaspoons of sugar?] and everything to do with increasing populations of beneficial soil born microorganisms.
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LitCloset
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Re: Artificial introduction of sugars into plants for increased growth rate [Re: sushi]
#10180277 - 04/16/09 08:00 PM (15 years, 3 days ago) |
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im afraid of this turning into tissue culture, i hate having to sterilize things and having to worry about them all the time, thats why besides my toluene degrader isolate work i just garden  i want to develop a method that anyone can use in their garden to dramatically increase their yield. I will design something that needs only clean conditions to be used assuming it is possible to boost growth with sugar.
candy: preserved with sugar. sure sugar solutions are yummy for microbes but in high concentrations they inhibit their growth, maybe develop a method that takes advantage of this and doesn't kill the plant with high osmotic pressure. 6% is way too high, that was proven this morning. i checked on the amount of liquid sucked from the syringe it was practically zero. i got fed up and stuck the plunger in. the solution went into the plant soooooo easily and it wasnt pouring out of anywhere, no even around the needle, back pressure was practically nothing. may need to use a larger needle. total volume taken up by the plant in the picture was 0.5ml. in contrast it took less than .05ml to burst holes in another clone of mine last night not on the heating pad and recentley watered. i like.
remember i had the plant under moderate lighting but on a heat pad set on full blast. i also did not water. the plant must have dried out and the solution was to thick to suck in such a small needle. so i need a less viscous solution and it seems 3% is a great solution to grow plants off so, thats what i will try tonight.
about an hour ago i planted 18 corn seeds, they resulting ears are suppose to be completely black, its called black Aztec sweet corn. this will be the plant i use for the official first experiment. i know clones would be better but i dont have any plants large enough to use right now.
i also took one more potato cutting and placed it straight in 3% solution. its in the light for now but in a day or two its going in the dark. hopefully the sugar concentration will keep off microbes for a little bit...  i need to bring this stuff to the lab and use our 150 gallon autoclave to sterilize it.
btw sushi i find your post on plant culture media, verrrry interesting. have you tried removing the agar to form a broth then grown along with normal high lighting? that would be the point inbetween what i want to acomplish and what your already doing. i need to read into it i admit (busy time of the school year) but can high light hurt a plant in culture? assuming the light doesn't grow out the media.
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oh_you_know
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Re: Artificial introduction of sugars into plants for increased growth rate [Re: LitCloset]
#10181289 - 04/16/09 10:15 PM (15 years, 2 days ago) |
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i think this will fail just cause you have no control plant. you seemed to have just jumped right in
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LitCloset
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Re: Artificial introduction of sugars into plants for increased growth rate [Re: oh_you_know]
#10186244 - 04/17/09 06:09 PM (15 years, 2 days ago) |
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oh_you_know, i will admit right off that i have posted way too much so it is hard to read through all my ramblings. i do have a plan (which i stated above) which involves at least 8 controls. (i bumped it up from 3 to 4 per treatment group)
so:
4 corn in grow room as usual
4 corn in grow room with treatment (injection of carbohydrate via method im still working out)
4 corn in dark
4 corn in dark with treatment equal to treated group in grow room.
goal is to have only one variable in each test. treatment group/ control 1 will determine if growth from carb injection is higher in a lit condition vs no treatment in lit condition. treatment group/control 2 will determine if growth from carb injection is higher in the dark than growth in dark with no injection.
im really thinking of using the heating pad so ill use for all the plants making it not a variable.
growing in the dark should have the most dramatic affect. growing in the light should test the feasibility of adding the injection treatment to everyday plants.
i appreciate the criticism, i really do but please don't say this will fail because of no control when there will be controls. im trying to plan this out and not just jump in, that is the purpose of these post. the corn was just planted yesterday, treatment has not begun.
the first question has been answered, does injecting sugar into a plant outright kill it. awnser is no at least not after several days at the concentration and volume i have been using.
next question is how should i inject the carbs, it looks like driving off water with a heating pad and then injecting is the best way to deliver the carbs with out any resistance from the plant. but ill keep fiddling.
i want to start treatment on the corn as soon as its first true leafs have developed and a new pair are emerging. mass as well as height will be the factors that determine growth.
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sushi
Mmmm
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Re: Artificial introduction of sugars into plants for increased growth rate [Re: LitCloset]
#10187178 - 04/17/09 09:08 PM (15 years, 2 days ago) |
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LitCloset: The agar just serves to support the plant as it is growing, you can do liquid tissue cultures [more complex and typically consisting of isolated plant cells in solution] or use liquid agarless media + cotton/foam raft/whatever but you need something to keep the plant material from 'drowning'. I have grown cultures without agar using cotton and rafts before but I prefer agar. As for lighting I have put some of my cultures under a 1000W HPS light and it didn't seem to negatively affect them, but it is totally superfluous, all the sugars the plant needs are in the media, more light wont make them grow any faster! I was actually thinking about your potential contamination problems and not wanting to work in a sterile environment all the time etc. There is a product called PPM [Plant Preservative Mixture], I can't post a link because of the forum rules [as far as I know] but it's easy to find on google. It's designed for tissue culture, and is really great stuff, it prevents the growth of bacteria and fungi without interfering with the plant growth. Adding that to your injections would take care of any contamination problems [if you have them - it's been my experience that all sorts of nasty stuff grows like crazy in 3% sugar solution!].
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