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Offlineomu_negru
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very small fruits
    #10092251 - 04/02/09 04:15 AM (15 years, 9 months ago)

Hi there guys , i'm in need of help again. After a period when the only thing i saw was the green bastard i decided to drastically reduce the amount of bulk sub i use and go with a ratio of 1:1 or even just plain old grain spawn. The problem is that the fruits look really small and frail even if there was massive pinning . Now im asking you , should i continue misting the casing and hope for more or should i just give it a dunk now while the fruits are still under developement? Also are there any other reasons other than insuficient water for this? I figured the casing should hold enough mositure and the grains will provide ample nutrients and a lil water but apparently i was wrong somewhere. I also have a tray with grain : cpoo/coir in a proportion of 1:1 but it has not pinned yet. Thanks in advance

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OfflineIAmABanana
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Re: very small fruits [Re: omu_negru]
    #10092272 - 04/02/09 04:23 AM (15 years, 9 months ago)

Once pin heads form, stop misting the casing. Water is not the only factor in determining fruit size. Another major factor is substrate depth. What species is this anyway? (I'm assuming cubensis).

The casing doesn't really hold much moisture, it provides a micro climate for primordia growth. The water content should not be an issue on the first flush. Did you remember to simmer your grains? Get your bulk sub to field capacity?

You need to give us a better rundown of the procedures you used.

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Offlineveda_sticks
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Re: very small fruits [Re: IAmABanana]
    #10092319 - 04/02/09 04:48 AM (15 years, 9 months ago)

substrate moisture conent is probably the main factor in small mushrooms.

Please give more details of your substrate and growing conditions.

You may be able to pour some water down the sides of your tray and then drain it off after a few hours. I think that should hydrate it to support the flush, but wait for a more experienced cultivator to chime in


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Franks Simple Coir/Verm Tek
Franks Proper Pasturisation Tek
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Offlineomu_negru
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Re: very small fruits [Re: veda_sticks]
    #10092549 - 04/02/09 06:21 AM (15 years, 9 months ago)

its wheat grain ...at least the one in question. Truth is i like to boil my wheat a lil dry because of contams. So you're saying a dunk couldnt hurt ... thanks. The other ones are wwheat grain and coir/cpoo....I dont know if it matters but the myc in question has been from G2G not spores. Even tho the original spores have been gone for some time , the myc is really fast colonizing and looks really healthy so i erased old age in my mind....Perhaps im mistaking

Edit : Depth is approximately 11 cm or a bit over 4 inches

Edited by omu_negru (04/02/09 06:27 AM)

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Offlineiskinbash
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Re: very small fruits [Re: omu_negru]
    #10092557 - 04/02/09 06:25 AM (15 years, 9 months ago)

dont do a full dunk. Just set it in a tray of water overnight. Dont soak all your developing fruits.


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OfflineIAmABanana
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Re: very small fruits [Re: iskinbash]
    #10092900 - 04/02/09 08:41 AM (15 years, 9 months ago)

You can also "inject" distilled water into the substrate itself. I haven't tried this myself, but I read about others that have.

IMO, if you're "soaking" the substrate as others suggested above, I would give it a rinse afterward, before placing it back into fruiting conditions (especially if using a sterilized casing layer).

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OfflineRogerRabbitM
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Re: very small fruits [Re: IAmABanana]
    #10092995 - 04/02/09 09:08 AM (15 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

IAmABanana said:
Once pin heads form, stop misting the casing. Water is not the only factor in determining fruit size. Another major factor is substrate depth. What species is this anyway? (I'm assuming cubensis).

The casing doesn't really hold much moisture, it provides a micro climate for primordia growth. The water content should not be an issue on the first flush.




Sorry, but that is flat-out wrong.  I can't just let it slide.  I've worked for many years to overcome bad advice that was given out in the early days when mushrooms growing was not understood.

NEVER stop misting.  Growing mushrooms require moisture AND fresh air.  If you're providing the proper amount of fresh air, your fruits and your substrate will dry out.  This leads to small fruits.  You MUST mist from the pin stage all the way to mature fruits if you want a proper flush.

Quote:

The casing doesn't really hold much moisture



Again, incorrect.  The purpose of a casing layer(when used) is to hold moisture to support the flush.  By misting, or even pouring water directly on the casing layer surface, the mycelium that has partially colonized the casing can absorb this moisture and carry it to the substrate, where it can help the developing mushrooms to grow.

The reason deeper substrates support larger flushes and fruits is because larger substrates hold more moisture.  If you give proper moisture control to small substrates, they will perform well too.  It's all about water, as can be seen by the picture below of very large mushrooms on a very small substrate.  It's all about misting and fresh air, from initiation through harvest.
RR



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Offlineomu_negru
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Re: very small fruits [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #10093049 - 04/02/09 09:19 AM (15 years, 9 months ago)

Thanks for the input everyone....i just gave it a dunk and i hope for the best....usually dunking will delay fruiting a bit for me but i hope ill see em pick up in size

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Re: very small fruits [Re: omu_negru]
    #10093509 - 04/02/09 11:15 AM (15 years, 9 months ago)

damm if you stopped misting for half a day i would think things would start drying & slowing down..

if your using the shotgun which works very well if you do it like RR says.. easy as fuck!!!!!!!! two big ass tubs fit nicely in my closet

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OfflineIAmABanana
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Re: very small fruits [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #10096728 - 04/02/09 07:41 PM (15 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

RogerRabbit said:
Quote:

IAmABanana said:
Once pin heads form, stop misting the casing. Water is not the only factor in determining fruit size. Another major factor is substrate depth. What species is this anyway? (I'm assuming cubensis).

The casing doesn't really hold much moisture, it provides a micro climate for primordia growth. The water content should not be an issue on the first flush.




Sorry, but that is flat-out wrong.  I can't just let it slide.  I've worked for many years to overcome bad advice that was given out in the early days when mushrooms growing was not understood.

NEVER stop misting.  Growing mushrooms require moisture AND fresh air.  If you're providing the proper amount of fresh air, your fruits and your substrate will dry out.  This leads to small fruits.  You MUST mist from the pin stage all the way to mature fruits if you want a proper flush.

Quote:

The casing doesn't really hold much moisture



Again, incorrect.  The purpose of a casing layer(when used) is to hold moisture to support the flush.  By misting, or even pouring water directly on the casing layer surface, the mycelium that has partially colonized the casing can absorb this moisture and carry it to the substrate, where it can help the developing mushrooms to grow.

The reason deeper substrates support larger flushes and fruits is because larger substrates hold more moisture.  If you give proper moisture control to small substrates, they will perform well too.  It's all about water, as can be seen by the picture below of very large mushrooms on a very small substrate.  It's all about misting and fresh air, from initiation through harvest.
RR






Thanks for the corrections. Apparently, not I'll the advice I've received in the past is up to par.

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