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rustypan
downinit

Registered: 02/27/09
Posts: 156
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Avoiding Re-Boiling Jar Stench- *Trusted Cultivators Opinion Requested*
#10079502 - 03/31/09 10:34 AM (15 years, 9 months ago) |
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This topic came up this weekend in the cult section, I had an idea, but wanted to wait till now to bring it up. (I didn't want all the "weekend warriors" posting on it.)
Someone had a contam issue in rye jars, and as normally suggested to re-use the jars, it was said to boil the jars for an hour before opening. I had an idea, and wanted to find out "why this wouldn't work". As the title states, I am only curious to the view of the people that actually know whats up around here. (Trusted Cultivators). Not interested noob guesses, I've got plenty of those on my own. Thanks in advance.
Quote:
ABC said: Yes, if you want to save the jars, throw them in a pot of boiling water for an hour. This will kill all the bacteria. (might stink up the kitchen though, so turn on the fan)
Hey...
Just for shits, giggles, and friendly conversation, I was wondering. I've had to go through the process of "reboiling" fucked up jars of rye myself in the past. And yes it REALLY smells up the house. But, what about this instead???
What about taking a syringe, filling it up w/ 10cc of bleach (perhaps more than 1 syringe full) take the jar out side, shoot it with the bleach, shake, wait an hour or two to let the bleach do its thing, killing the bacteria that may go airborne otherwise. While waiting, fill up a 5 gallon bucket with water, put a few cups of bleach and mix thoroughly...
Then pop the top off the jar, dump grain into an awaiting trash bag, and quickly submerge jar(s) into bleach water for a good soaking. Then later take the jars into the kitchen for a much easier soap wash in the sink, then for a run in the dishwasher???
Would this method be easier on the nose than the first option? Would the bleach syringes kill the bacteria, making the jars safe to open? How much bleach would it take to shoot into the jars to kill the funk???
Just wondering out loud, I REALLY hate the smell of re-boiling jars 
Peace.
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RogerRabbit
Bans for Pleasure



Registered: 03/26/03
Posts: 42,214
Loc: Seattle
Last seen: 1 year, 10 months
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Re: Avoiding Re-Boiling Jar Stench- *Trusted Cultivators Opinion Requested* [Re: rustypan]
#10079563 - 03/31/09 10:46 AM (15 years, 9 months ago) |
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If it's bacteria, simply dump the shit out and wash the jar with soap and water. You only need to boil or destroy mold infested jars to prevent the spores from filling up your house, and sticking to the walls, your clothes, etc. As for bacteria, you release that much every time you cough or take a dump. I'm sure the trash basket in your kitchen is puking a lot more bacteria into the air than a bacillus infected jar. RR
-------------------- Download Let's Grow Mushrooms
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"I've never had a failed experiment. I've only discovered 10,000 methods which do not work."
Thomas Edison
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veda_sticks
Cultivator




Registered: 07/29/07
Posts: 14,191
Loc: UK
Last seen: 5 years, 13 days
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Re: Avoiding Re-Boiling Jar Stench- *Trusted Cultivators Opinion Requested* [Re: RogerRabbit]
#10079599 - 03/31/09 10:54 AM (15 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
RogerRabbit said: If it's bacteria, simply dump the shit out and wash the jar with soap and water. You only need to boil or destroy mold infested jars to prevent the spores from filling up your house, and sticking to the walls, your clothes, etc. As for bacteria, you release that much every time you cough or take a dump. I'm sure the trash basket in your kitchen is puking a lot more bacteria into the air than a bacillus infected jar. RR
Im glad i popped by here, im sure i have recomended to sterilise bacteria infested jars in the past. Even though i know bacteria generaly isnt airbourne unless carried with something else.
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rustypan
downinit

Registered: 02/27/09
Posts: 156
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Re: Avoiding Re-Boiling Jar Stench- *Trusted Cultivators Opinion Requested* [Re: RogerRabbit]
#10079620 - 03/31/09 10:58 AM (15 years, 9 months ago) |
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Thank you. Still learning the ropes, and terminologies. I've picked up various contams before I got better at working in my glove box, proper temperatures and air exchange (learning by my mistakes/missteps).
Would my idea work on mold?
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RogerRabbit
Bans for Pleasure



Registered: 03/26/03
Posts: 42,214
Loc: Seattle
Last seen: 1 year, 10 months
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Re: Avoiding Re-Boiling Jar Stench- *Trusted Cultivators Opinion Requested* [Re: veda_sticks]
#10079623 - 03/31/09 10:58 AM (15 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
Even though i know bacteria generaly isnt airbourne unless carried with something else.
Bacteria is airborne all the time. It's in the air everywhere. It's one of the reasons we build gloveboxes and/or laminar flow hoods. It's also the reason we use products such as Oust, which are not effective against molds. It's also the reason milk gets sour if left out. RR
-------------------- Download Let's Grow Mushrooms
semper in excretia sumus solim profundum variat
"I've never had a failed experiment. I've only discovered 10,000 methods which do not work."
Thomas Edison
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veda_sticks
Cultivator




Registered: 07/29/07
Posts: 14,191
Loc: UK
Last seen: 5 years, 13 days
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Re: Avoiding Re-Boiling Jar Stench- *Trusted Cultivators Opinion Requested* [Re: RogerRabbit]
#10079638 - 03/31/09 11:01 AM (15 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
RogerRabbit said:
Quote:
Even though i know bacteria generaly isnt airbourne unless carried with something else.
Bacteria is airborne all the time. It's in the air everywhere. It's one of the reasons we build gloveboxes and/or laminar flow hoods. It's also the reason we use products such as Oust, which are not effective against molds. It's also the reason milk gets sour if left out. RR
and even someone who has been here a while can get pulled into misinformation.
--------------------
PF TEK - writeup by EvilMushroom666
Lets Grow Mushrooms - RogerRabbit & RoadKills website with sample videos plus the full PF TEK video series. Alot of great information - BUY THE DVD
Cakes can and will pin! - So you think cakes suck for pins. Your wrong
Franks Simple Coir/Verm Tek
Franks Proper Pasturisation Tek
Franks Spawning To Bulk - Monotub
Professor Pinheads RTV Injection Port Tek
Foo Mans No Soak WBS Prep Tek
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Brennus
Student of Life



Registered: 05/31/08
Posts: 3,297
Loc: SE United States
Last seen: 6 years, 10 months
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Re: Avoiding Re-Boiling Jar Stench- *Trusted Cultivators Opinion Requested* [Re: veda_sticks]
#10080303 - 03/31/09 01:18 PM (15 years, 9 months ago) |
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I just run a normal sterilization cycle (90 minutes @ 15 PSI) to sterilize contaminated jars before dumping.
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rustypan
downinit

Registered: 02/27/09
Posts: 156
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Re: Avoiding Re-Boiling Jar Stench- *Trusted Cultivators Opinion Requested* [Re: Brennus]
#10080450 - 03/31/09 01:42 PM (15 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
Brennus said: I just run a normal sterilization cycle (90 minutes @ 15 PSI) to sterilize contaminated jars before dumping.
Not asking what you do, no offense.
I am asking if the proposed method would work, as to AVOID re cooking the jars.
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rustypan
downinit

Registered: 02/27/09
Posts: 156
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Re: Avoiding Re-Boiling Jar Stench- *Trusted Cultivators Opinion Requested* [Re: rustypan]
#10093080 - 04/02/09 09:25 AM (15 years, 9 months ago) |
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*Bump*
How about it? Would this work on mold spores?
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Suntzu
Geek



Registered: 10/14/99
Posts: 1,396
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Re: Avoiding Re-Boiling Jar Stench- *Trusted Cultivators Opinion Requested* [Re: rustypan]
#10104492 - 04/04/09 10:18 AM (15 years, 9 months ago) |
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Hmm. It's not really a straightforward question, but I'll give it a shot.
Injecting bleach [assume 10%] will kill spores, both bacterial and mold, though you can never count on something like that being 100% effective. I.e., I wouldn't assume a moldy jar is safe to open in a clean area just because you've injected it.
Injecting bleach will produce a slurry of chlorinated protein/hydrocarbons [bleach+BRF/BS or whatever]. This isn't deadly or anything, but certainly a carcinogen or two will be produced. If it's bacterial, and a lot of ammonia is produced, very toxic gas can be created by adding bleach. I don't think Bacillus is a big ammonia producer, but you never know what's really growing in a bad jar.
When you inject bleach [or any liquid], the air volume inside the jar will be displaced. So just by injecting, you can 'push' mold spores out -- depending on your filter system, of course. Something to think about for sure.
I have never bleached a jar of BS, but I have added a bit of water to moldy BS. By shaking it a bit afterward, a high % of the spores are trapped in solution, so they dump out into a pile of sloppy nastiness instead of a green plume of nastiness. But that's a physical knockdown of spore load, not chemical bleaching.
I agree with RR, this 'boil for an hour' thing isn't necessary, assuming you pitch contam's at the first sign. 'Mold cakes', or other results of laziness [me=guilty] might warrant a pre-kill, but the real key is to dump 'em outside, perhaps rinse with an outside faucet, then scrub well with hot soapy water. Pay attention to filter systems -- when reused, they tend to break down and/or become nutrified over time, so that even after PCing they can serve as a contam wick.
Off topic, but to get back to your main question. . .I wouldn't even worry about the re-boiling step. Just dump contams in a timely manner and scrub the jars well.
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intlslacker
Strangler

Registered: 07/26/07
Posts: 359
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Re: Avoiding Re-Boiling Jar Stench- *Trusted Cultivators Opinion Requested* [Re: Suntzu]
#10104582 - 04/04/09 10:45 AM (15 years, 9 months ago) |
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If you're incredibly paranoid about airborne spores from a contaminated jar, wear elbow length rubber gloves and open the jars in a bucket filled with a bleach/water solution. No spores go airborne, bleach kills mold/bacteria, then just find a safe place to dump the bucket (i.e. not near where children play). Would that be clean enough for you?
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rustypan
downinit

Registered: 02/27/09
Posts: 156
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Re: Avoiding Re-Boiling Jar Stench- *Trusted Cultivators Opinion Requested* [Re: intlslacker]
#10104916 - 04/04/09 11:57 AM (15 years, 9 months ago) |
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Yes Suntzu, this idea would be done outdoors. As to the bleach, I was just talking about your garden variety bleach used for clothes. Was just thinking in the event of a contam issue, just shooting 10-20 cc of bleach into the injection port of the bad jar, shake, let sit for a few hours, then open/dump/clean.
Just a "what if" thread. Thats all... A hypothetical situation, to discuss an alternative to the stench re-boiling jars gone south causes. Thinking it would be an effective way to save the jar, without the energy consumption of running the stove for an hour and a half. Or, having the air conditioner competing with the heat produced in the kitchen.
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RogerRabbit
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Registered: 03/26/03
Posts: 42,214
Loc: Seattle
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Re: Avoiding Re-Boiling Jar Stench- *Trusted Cultivators Opinion Requested* [Re: rustypan]
#10109253 - 04/05/09 07:55 AM (15 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
rustypan said: Yes Suntzu, this idea would be done outdoors. As to the bleach, I was just talking about your garden variety bleach used for clothes. Was just thinking in the event of a contam issue, just shooting 10-20 cc of bleach into the injection port of the bad jar, shake, let sit for a few hours, then open/dump/clean.
No. The bleach wouldn't penetrate all the cells. We dunk cakes for 24 hours to fully hydrate them, so a few hours isn't going to be effective. Besides, bleach is not that effective on mold anyway. I'd suggest taking the jars outside to dump them out, or simply tossing them in the trash if you don't want to boil them. RR
-------------------- Download Let's Grow Mushrooms
semper in excretia sumus solim profundum variat
"I've never had a failed experiment. I've only discovered 10,000 methods which do not work."
Thomas Edison
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rustypan
downinit

Registered: 02/27/09
Posts: 156
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Re: Avoiding Re-Boiling Jar Stench- *Trusted Cultivators Opinion Requested* [Re: RogerRabbit]
#10110491 - 04/05/09 01:33 PM (15 years, 9 months ago) |
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Thanks. I appreciate all the replies. Was something I was curious about.
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