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Invisiblejohnm214
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Joe Biden's (Author of Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation) daughter filmed snorting cocaine
    #10071732 - 03/30/09 01:24 AM (11 years, 4 months ago)

Joe's Resume, skip if you're familiar with the man to My Question listed below and the story.

Biden's Curriculum Vitae:

 
  • Authored the Rave Act that allows property owners to be prosecuted and have their property seized for law enforcement to play around with if drug use occurs on premises that could have been forseen, like at a concert, among other things.  Joe said glow sticks were drug paraphernalia in the introduction of the law.  Has been used to shut down concerts, marijuana advocacy group meetings, medical marijuana dispensaries, and to seize property from the landlords and threaten the same for groups the DEA or police don't like (marijuana advocacy groups for example).

  • Came up with the Drug Czar office and successfully passed the legislation and funding. 

  • Responsible for the mandatory minimum drug sentences for victimless crimes in the Comprehensive Crime Control Act of 1984. 

  • Pushed for harsh penalties on crack, giving rise the the 500:1 disparity between the cocaine salts and cocaine base.

  • Pushed for the Office of National Drug Control Policy creation and funding (thank them for much of the bullshit misleading marijuana ads you see and other unscientific propaganda hurled at teens ).

  • Led the charge on criminalizing steroid use, favoring even higher prison terms for mere possession by adults.

  • Would ban smoking nationwide in public places by federal, rather than state or local, law.

  • Wants to keep it a crime for twenty year olds to drink alcohol, opposes lowering the age from 21.

  • Supported the "Drug Free School Zone" laws that treat you like you were selling to six year olds if you have drugs within 1,000 feet of a school, even if in your own home behind closed doors or at a concert with other adults.

    And finally.....

  • Saved us all from submarine drug smugglers by closing the "submarine exception" that long plagued us.









My question:


How much you want to bet if this is true that it will be a "private family matter" rather than leading to the seizure of the place she was snorting coke and prosecution of her and the owners of the building as the rave act calls for?


How much you want to bet this will be a "private family matter" that Biden asks for "our understanding" and privacy on rather than a relentless criminal prosecution leading to mandatory minimum incarceration terms?


I'm constantly struck by the discord between people who support and even promote (as Biden does, one of the largest drug war crusaders) the war on drugs and the public criminal prosecution of victimless criminals and the way in which they deal with personal matters affecting their friends and relatives.



Is he going to support the relentless prosecution and jailing of his daughter, in the public courts, for a private act that harmed nobody?  Or is he going to be a hypocrite and say when its his daughter its not a criminal matter, and requires love and private reflection rather than public indictment, incarceration and asset forfeiture as his laws provide for?

Quote:

A video purporting to show Ashley Biden -- daughter of Vice President Joe Biden -- snorting cocaine reportedly is being offered for sale.

The New York Post reported that it was shown a 90-second clip of a 42-minute video by a lawyer claiming to represent an anonymous "friend" of the vice president's daughter. The lawyer, Thomas Dunlap, and another man say the video shows Biden's daughter using the drug at a house party this month in Delaware.

Dunlap reportedly told the Post that the video was legally obtained, and that Ashley Biden was aware that she was being filmed. The Post reported that it refused to pay for the video, though Dunlap told the newspaper that one news organization had offered $250,000 for the rights to the tape.

On Sunday, Radaronline.com reported that Dunlap, an attorney for the Washington, D.C. firm Dunlap, Grubb and Weaver, dropped the seller of the tape as a client after learning the scene was recorded on a hidden camera.

The Web site said Dunlap said he did not want to be involved in the sale because of the publicity around the story.

The Post reported that the video shows a 20-something woman with light skin and long brown hair taking a red straw from her mouth and bending over a desk, inserting the straw into her nostril and snorting from lines of white powder.

The woman appears to resemble the 27-year-old Biden, a social worker who was a visible presence during her father's campaign for the White House.

Dunlap refused to name the person who shot the video, but told the Post that he knew Ashley Biden well and had attended other parties with her at which there were illegal drugs. The lawyers said the person who shot the video used a camera with a hard-drive that he later destroyed, drilling into the device and tossing it into a lake.





http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009/03/28/video-offered-sale-purports-bidens-daughter-snorting-cocaine/
Will Biden accept public investigation and prosecution of his daughter and those involved, or will he claim it is a "private family matter"- seemingly contrary to his long history of drug war crusading?
You may choose 2
Biden will accept the public investigation and prosecution.
Biden will hypocritically claim it is a "private family matter" and ask for our understanding.
I am STAL
Other / I don't think its hypocritical for Biden to claim its a private family matter so this poll is bullshit


Votes accepted from (03/30/09 01:22 AM) to (No end specified)
You must vote before you can view the results of this poll



Edited by johnm214 (03/30/09 11:40 AM)


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Offlinezouden
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Re: Author of the Rave Act, Drug Czar Legislation, et cet (Biden)'s Daughter caught snorting coke. [Re: johnm214]
    #10071998 - 03/30/09 03:04 AM (11 years, 4 months ago)

You're forgetting the obvious: he'll deny the video show his daughter snorting coke. Then he'll say it's a personal family matter.


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OfflineSeussA
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Re: Author of the Rave Act, Drug Czar Legislation, et cet (Biden)'s Daughter caught snorting coke. [Re: zouden]
    #10072197 - 03/30/09 04:49 AM (11 years, 4 months ago)

Maybe she just wants to run for president some day.  Being a hypocrite seems to be a prerequisite these days.


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Re: Author of the Rave Act, Drug Czar Legislation, et cet (Biden)'s Daughter caught snorting coke. [Re: Seuss]
    #10072268 - 03/30/09 05:18 AM (11 years, 4 months ago)

These days? Brush on your history.


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Re: Joe Biden's, author of the Rave Act and Drug Czar legislation, daughter filmed snorting coke. [Re: johnm214]
    #10072773 - 03/30/09 09:06 AM (11 years, 4 months ago)

It might not even be his daughter. I have seen no evidence yet that it is his daughter, merely allegations that the girl on video is her. Is it or isn't it? Who knows?



Phred


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Offlinelonestar2004
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Re: Joe Biden's, authored Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation, daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: johnm214]
    #10072801 - 03/30/09 09:14 AM (11 years, 4 months ago)

Is her last name Palin?

No?

then there is nothing to see here.......


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Re: Joe Biden's, authored Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation, daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: lonestar2004]
    #10072806 - 03/30/09 09:16 AM (11 years, 4 months ago)

Don't be ridiculous.


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OfflineRedstorm
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Re: Joe Biden's, authored Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation, daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: Redstorm]
    #10072810 - 03/30/09 09:17 AM (11 years, 4 months ago)

Also, let's not forget this isn't the first time she's been in legal trouble. She also like to get drunk and mess with police officers, too.


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Invisiblejohnm214
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Re: Joe Biden's, author of the Rave Act and Drug Czar legislation, daughter filmed snorting coke. [Re: Phred]
    #10072855 - 03/30/09 09:28 AM (11 years, 4 months ago)

There is no evidence other than the parroted allegations echoing around the newspapers that Dunlap says its her (he claims to know her in the above story) and testimonials, which is why I prefaced my remarks by asking how much you want to bet if it turns out to be true....


What i want to know is WTF was the deal with the lawyer drilling a hole through the tape and then desecrating a wetland with the likely toxic contents?


Can someone explain how a lawyer you retain to represent you gets away with destroying your property like that?  Even if he decided the tape was illegaly obtained, how can he destroy the evidence of at least one and possibly more crimes?  I'm guessing it was meerly a copy from teh way the stories are written, but still... weird


The whole thing sounds weird.  The lawyer who was shopping the tape knew biden's daughter well and still represented the owner of the tape?


I'm willing to bet the allegations are true given the lawyer's testimonials, but the news will parrot a lie for days after its demonstrably false, so I'm certainly not sure of anything (except that biden will be a hypocrite and ask for privacy rather than accepting the fate of his daughter and the property owners under the laws he authored).


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Re: Joe Biden's, authored Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation, daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: Redstorm]
    #10073196 - 03/30/09 10:48 AM (11 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Redstorm said:
Don't be ridiculous.





:rolleyes:





i know you dont believe in media bias but just do a google news search on the daughter of Sarah Palin......(Bristol)

TODAYS NEWS!

Bristol Palin and Levi Johnston split

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/nationworld/chi-palin_family-tabmar13,0,1061701.story



Palin's Ex Has No Regrets, May Reconcile With Bristol
http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/Politics/story?id=7089090&page=1




Sarah Palin Blows Another Teachable Moment: Margaret Carlson

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601039&sid=aUoRTqRtwOPE&refer=home


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We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

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Re: Joe Biden's, author of the Rave Act and Drug Czar legislation, daughter filmed snorting coke. [Re: johnm214]
    #10073203 - 03/30/09 10:50 AM (11 years, 4 months ago)

i am sure there is still a copy of the video around. the lawyer is probably trying to save his ass by saying he destroyed it. holding a tape of the vice presiden't daughter snorting coke is kind of dangerous.


i doubt there will be any kind of serious prosecution either john. if concrete evidence does surface, he will claim it is a family matter, and until then he will just deny it.


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Re: Joe Biden's, author of the Rave Act and Drug Czar legislation, daughter filmed snorting coke. [Re: JT]
    #10073942 - 03/30/09 01:29 PM (11 years, 4 months ago)

I would love to see her rot in prison for laws her father supports.

Someone needs to go on record and say she needs to be made an example out of and prosecuted to the FULLEST extent of the law.


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Re: Joe Biden's, author of the Rave Act and Drug Czar legislation, daughter filmed snorting coke. [Re: Green_T]
    #10074248 - 03/30/09 02:30 PM (11 years, 4 months ago)

I'm torn here.

On one hand, I don't like seeing anyone go to jail for non-violent drug crimes.

On the other hand, the law should be equally applied to all people, no matter who they are.


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Re: Joe Biden's, author of the Rave Act and Drug Czar legislation, daughter filmed snorting coke. [Re: Redstorm]
    #10074293 - 03/30/09 02:41 PM (11 years, 4 months ago)

Yeah, injustice is injustice.


I've always felt prosecutorial discretion is largely bullshit, the laws should be enforced as written or not at all. 


I do think she should be prosecuted, however; if that would be the normal course for this evidence.  While I don't like to see high profile people treated worse, I do wonder how this can be ignored by the local or federal authorities in good conscious given how clear the evidence is.  And biden's own law would allow the house to be seized and the owners prosecuted if they were aware of any illegal drug usage.  Or do we only use those strong measures on people we don't like?  Only if you really piss off the folks in charge do they use the full range of laws available?  Their was drug dealing in that video under the definitions used by the state and federal laws- how could that be ignored?  And there was also surely crack, with its illogicaly higher penalties, involved under the ridiculous definition of that (which defies chemistry).

Of course this is bullshit and of no harm to anyone, but how is that any different then any other drug crime?  It isn't.


Mostly I want to see the public recognize the inherent contradiction between biden's relentless criminalization of victimless crimes and the continual upping of the (mandatory) penalties and his inevitable statements (through spokesmen) that this is a private family matter rather than the serious felony him and his ilk have turned it into.


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Re: Joe Biden's, author of the Rave Act and Drug Czar legislation, daughter filmed snorting coke. [Re: johnm214]
    #10074399 - 03/30/09 02:57 PM (11 years, 4 months ago)

I agree with you 100% as usual.


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Re: Joe Biden's, author of the Rave Act and Drug Czar legislation, daughter filmed snorting coke. [Re: Green_T]
    #10074850 - 03/30/09 04:18 PM (11 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

green_titan said:
I would love to see her rot in prison for laws her father supports.

Someone needs to go on record and say she needs to be made an example out of and prosecuted to the FULLEST extent of the law.





I think Tim Leary got eight years for a small amount of pot. I don't think it was even his. He took responsibility for his daughter who got busted. I think the amount was one joint.


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Re: Joe Biden's, author of the Rave Act and Drug Czar legislation, daughter filmed snorting coke. [Re: Icelander]
    #10077625 - 03/30/09 11:07 PM (11 years, 4 months ago)

It's elite privilage and of course they won't go after her if it does turn out to be her.  I like your post, it's well organized and provides many good points but I think many on this forum are aware of much of this allready. 
What I did learn that I wasn't aware of was that Biden was behind the drug free school zones law that I fell under awhile back, which just adds to the disdain I feel for the man.


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Re: Joe Biden's (Author of Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation) daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: johnm214]
    #10079631 - 03/31/09 11:00 AM (11 years, 4 months ago)

I feel bad for his daughter, because she didn't do anything wrong, but I'm also glad that this happened.  Because this asshole Biden is responsible for ruining the lives of THOUSANDS of people.  Of course his daughter will skate because why should she be subject to Biden's draconian drug laws like everyone else? 










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Re: Joe Biden's (Author of Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation) daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: Learyfan]
    #10080288 - 03/31/09 01:15 PM (11 years, 4 months ago)

Just another dipshit politician.:shrug:


--------------------
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Re: Joe Biden's (Author of Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation) daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: Icelander]
    #10080461 - 03/31/09 01:44 PM (11 years, 4 months ago)

I don't give two shits about this dumb bint's coke habit.


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Re: Joe Biden's (Author of Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation) daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: zappaisgod]
    #10080646 - 03/31/09 02:13 PM (11 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
I don't give two shits about this dumb bint's coke habit.






but what about Bristol and Levi breaking up and getting back together again? do you give a shit about that? :grin:


Edited by lonestar2004 (03/31/09 02:23 PM)


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Re: Joe Biden's (Author of Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation) daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: lonestar2004]
    #10080754 - 03/31/09 02:29 PM (11 years, 4 months ago)

OH HELL YES!  They're back together?  How wonderful.  That news makes my dick :penis:


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Re: Joe Biden's (Author of Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation) daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: zappaisgod]
    #10081294 - 03/31/09 03:50 PM (11 years, 4 months ago)

So is there actually anything there that could lead to a prosecution, or did I miss something? Being on video, doing coke, isn't something you can prosecuted for.

Biden will probably either remain quiet about the whole thing, or pull the "these are difficult circumstances for our family, I thank you for your understanding/we're breaking up due to creative differences". They probably have a rolodex of press statements that they use for these situations.

It seems like all president/vice president's daughters get into drugs. I guess besides Obama's, considering their age.


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Re: Joe Biden's (Author of Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation) daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: Twirling]
    #10081342 - 03/31/09 03:58 PM (11 years, 4 months ago)

Give them time


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Re: Joe Biden's (Author of Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation) daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: zouden]
    #10081441 - 03/31/09 04:19 PM (11 years, 4 months ago)

The only chance this has of being investigated is if it happened in the same area as Phelp's bong hit, because the douche bag sheriff there will take it personal and launch an entire investigation all to find out that he can't prosecute someone based on an image.

Personally, I could care less about this girl's drug habit and I don't think anyone should go to jail for this victim-less crime.  Though, I do hope that it causes Biden to realize how much of a dumbass he is...


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Re: Joe Biden's (Author of Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation) daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: weephar]
    #10081534 - 03/31/09 04:35 PM (11 years, 4 months ago)

> Personally, I could care less about this girl's drug habit

If you could care less, then you must care some (in order to be able to care less), which is kind of odd given the rest of what you wrote.  Why do you care about her drug habit?


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Re: Joe Biden's (Author of Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation) daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: Seuss]
    #10081571 - 03/31/09 04:42 PM (11 years, 4 months ago)

This is one of my pet peeves. I don't know how so many people get that simple phrase wrong. :confused:


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Re: Joe Biden's (Author of Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation) daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: Seuss]
    #10081572 - 03/31/09 04:42 PM (11 years, 4 months ago)

Its a personal goal of his to care less, that's all hes saying.  New Years resolution and such


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Re: Joe Biden's (Author of Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation) daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: Seuss]
    #10081905 - 03/31/09 05:21 PM (11 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Seuss said:
> Personally, I could care less about this girl's drug habit

If you could care less, then you must care some (in order to be able to care less), which is kind of odd given the rest of what you wrote.  Why do you care about her drug habit?



I could care less always gets me as well. Argh!

Up here in the Northeast one that really winds me up is "so didn't I".


--------------------
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Re: Joe Biden's (Author of Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation) daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: Seuss]
    #10082979 - 03/31/09 07:40 PM (11 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Seuss said:
> Personally, I could care less about this girl's drug habit

If you could care less, then you must care some (in order to be able to care less), which is kind of odd given the rest of what you wrote.  Why do you care about her drug habit?




Exactly, I am trying to care less, but then this article came and made me care a little...so I am trying to care less about it.


--------------------
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Offlinezouden
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Re: Joe Biden's (Author of Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation) daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: weephar]
    #10084920 - 04/01/09 01:22 AM (11 years, 4 months ago)

Well... good luck with that :thumbup:


--------------------
I know... that just the smallest
                                                part of the world belongs to me
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Re: Joe Biden's (Author of Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation) daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: zouden]
    #10085124 - 04/01/09 02:29 AM (11 years, 4 months ago)

So Biden expects us parents to keep out kids off of drugs or else he will throw our kids in prison but he can't even keep his daughter off coke and of course she will be able to learn the easy way :rolleyes:


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Re: Joe Biden's (Author of Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation) daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: zouden]
    #10085718 - 04/01/09 07:36 AM (11 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

zouden said:
Well... good luck with that :thumbup:




Thanks, it is gonna be a long road...


--------------------
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OfflineYrat
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Re: Joe Biden's (Author of Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation) daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #10085732 - 04/01/09 07:41 AM (11 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

luvdemshrooms said:
Quote:

Seuss said:
> Personally, I could care less about this girl's drug habit

If you could care less, then you must care some (in order to be able to care less), which is kind of odd given the rest of what you wrote.  Why do you care about her drug habit?



I could care less always gets me as well. Argh!

Up here in the Northeast one that really winds me up is "so didn't I".




lol.  never heard "so didn't I" up here, it's always been "I didn't either" for me.


--------------------
"There are a thousand hacking at the branches of evil
to one who is striking at the root."
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Re: Joe Biden's (Author of Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation) daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: Yrat]
    #10085927 - 04/01/09 08:43 AM (11 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Yrat said:
Quote:

luvdemshrooms said:
Quote:

Seuss said:
> Personally, I could care less about this girl's drug habit

If you could care less, then you must care some (in order to be able to care less), which is kind of odd given the rest of what you wrote.  Why do you care about her drug habit?



I could care less always gets me as well. Argh!

Up here in the Northeast one that really winds me up is "so didn't I".




lol.  never heard "so didn't I" up here, it's always been "I didn't either" for me.



How about..... "it weren't me"?

You're in the NE?


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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OfflineYrat
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Re: Joe Biden's (Author of Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation) daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #10086000 - 04/01/09 09:12 AM (11 years, 4 months ago)

ya, haven't really heard that one either, that sounds like something that would come out of some swamp in the south :lol:

ok, enough derailing this thread haha


--------------------
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to one who is striking at the root."
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OfflineLearyfanS
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Re: Joe Biden's (Author of Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation) daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: Coaster]
    #10088616 - 04/01/09 05:21 PM (11 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Coaster said:
So Biden expects us parents to keep out kids off of drugs or else he will throw our kids in prison but he can't even keep his daughter off coke and of course she will be able to learn the easy way :rolleyes:




Exactly.  I would love to meet him and say "Sir, you are a strong proponent of harsh penalties for drug possession.  Your daughter was recently seen using illegal drugs on video.  Will your daughter be subject to the same draconian drug laws as everyone else."










--------------------
--------------------------------


Mp3 of the month: Tides In - Trip With Me



Edited by Learyfan (04/01/09 05:21 PM)


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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: Joe Biden's (Author of Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation) daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: Learyfan]
    #10092950 - 04/02/09 08:55 AM (11 years, 4 months ago)

Do you think the rules of evidence should be suspended because she's an asshole's daughter?


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Re: Joe Biden's (Author of Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation) daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: zappaisgod]
    #10116053 - 04/06/09 11:07 AM (11 years, 4 months ago)

This is eye opening for me, I had no idea that Biden is such a complete asshole.


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Re: Joe Biden's (Author of Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation) daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: Lancaster]
    #10116184 - 04/06/09 11:27 AM (11 years, 4 months ago)

Why not?  You were told repeatedly.


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Re: Joe Biden's (Author of Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation) daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: zappaisgod]
    #10116206 - 04/06/09 11:31 AM (11 years, 4 months ago)

Yeah, but not by anyone knowledgeable. God damn there goes my faith in politics again. I JUST GOT IT BACK DAMMIT. :sad:


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Re: Joe Biden's (Author of Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation) daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: Lancaster]
    #10116240 - 04/06/09 11:35 AM (11 years, 4 months ago)

You got it back because some unqualified jerk off from possibly the most corrupt political system in the country managed to gull a bunch of retards and MSM cunts into electing him?  You were not paying attention and now you have the whore you deserve.  I don't deserve it but you do.


--------------------


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Re: Joe Biden's (Author of Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation) daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: zappaisgod]
    #10116267 - 04/06/09 11:39 AM (11 years, 4 months ago)

Calm down zaps.


And what do you mean about the rules of evidence?


I'm calling for her to be investigated (presuming that's the standard action).  If the rave act is good for others its good enough for the house she was in.


I have little doubt that the investigation will reveal she was using cocaine.


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Re: Joe Biden's (Author of Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation) daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: zappaisgod]
    #10116333 - 04/06/09 11:48 AM (11 years, 4 months ago)

Woah woah woah, chill out bro.

I see where you're coming from, but after the Bush fiasco I genuinely believed that McCain was going to be elected and there would be another 8 years of fucked up shit. The prospect of Sarah Palin, one of the worst candidates to ever run on a presidential ticket, being a step away from president was so sickening to me that I was ecstatic that Obama was elected. Am I glad he was elected over McCain? You bet. Am I glad he is the president? Hell no, he is nearly as far away from the ideal as McCain was, when you look at how things should actually be. I've given up on this country anyway.


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Re: Joe Biden's (Author of Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation) daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: johnm214]
    #10116561 - 04/06/09 12:20 PM (11 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

johnm214 said:
Calm down zaps.


And what do you mean about the rules of evidence?


I'm calling for her to be investigated (presuming that's the standard action).  If the rave act is good for others its good enough for the house she was in.


I have little doubt that the investigation will reveal she was using cocaine.



Based on what?  Don't you actually have to have some cocaine?  Not some video of her snorting chalk.

I'm sure she was tooting, as well, but that aint enough.  That's the rules of evidence I spoke of.


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Re: Joe Biden's (Author of Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation) daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: Lancaster]
    #10116590 - 04/06/09 12:26 PM (11 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Lancaster said:
Woah woah woah, chill out bro.

I see where you're coming from, but after the Bush fiasco I genuinely believed that McCain was going to be elected and there would be another 8 years of fucked up shit. The prospect of Sarah Palin, one of the worst candidates to ever run on a presidential ticket, being a step away from president was so sickening to me that I was ecstatic that Obama was elected. Am I glad he was elected over McCain? You bet. Am I glad he is the president? Hell no, he is nearly as far away from the ideal as McCain was, when you look at how things should actually be. I've given up on this country anyway.



You were duped.  You were duped into believing Barry was the Messiah, that Sarah Palin was dumb or a creationist or a whole bunch of other shit, that John McCain was a big meanie and a whole bunch of other shit.  Because you didn't pay attention.  Now you're complaining.  Joe Biden has been a national stage idiot for decades.  As far away from the ideal as McCain?  Bullshit, Obama is the biggest fraud ever.  His resume amounts to exactly zero. 

Since you have given up, please, give up entirely and stop fucking up the efforts of people who still care.


--------------------


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Re: Joe Biden's (Author of Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation) daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: zappaisgod]
    #10116615 - 04/06/09 12:31 PM (11 years, 4 months ago)

No you do not have to have cocaine recovered by law enforcement to investigate or prosecute for cocaine possesion and dealing (she was doing both it seemed).


All that needs to be established to indict is that it is more likely than not that she was dealing and possesing cocaine at some location.


Just send out subpoenas for trial and the grand jury to the people indentified in the video and the story and get your indictment and conviction.  Probably can seize the house too.


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Re: Joe Biden's (Author of Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation) daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: zappaisgod]
    #10116647 - 04/06/09 12:37 PM (11 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
now you have the whore you deserve.  I don't deserve it but you do.




:yesnod:


i know this Dentist from Chicago who moved his practice down here because of state income taxes.  I'm not sure what state income taxes are but apparently they suck! :grin:

anyway he is a big Obama supporter and was upset because he was going to have to drop a few patients to stay under the Obama $250,000 tax increase....


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

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OfflineLancaster
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Re: Joe Biden's (Author of Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation) daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: zappaisgod]
    #10116703 - 04/06/09 12:47 PM (11 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
Quote:

Lancaster said:
Woah woah woah, chill out bro.

I see where you're coming from, but after the Bush fiasco I genuinely believed that McCain was going to be elected and there would be another 8 years of fucked up shit. The prospect of Sarah Palin, one of the worst candidates to ever run on a presidential ticket, being a step away from president was so sickening to me that I was ecstatic that Obama was elected. Am I glad he was elected over McCain? You bet. Am I glad he is the president? Hell no, he is nearly as far away from the ideal as McCain was, when you look at how things should actually be. I've given up on this country anyway.



You were duped.  You were duped into believing Barry was the Messiah, that Sarah Palin was dumb or a creationist or a whole bunch of other shit, that John McCain was a big meanie and a whole bunch of other shit.  Because you didn't pay attention.  Now you're complaining.  Joe Biden has been a national stage idiot for decades.  As far away from the ideal as McCain?  Bullshit, Obama is the biggest fraud ever.  His resume amounts to exactly zero. 

Since you have given up, please, give up entirely and stop fucking up the efforts of people who still care.




I wasn't duped into believing Sarah Palin is dumb or creationist, she is both of those things. She has a degree in journalism. Obama went to Harvard. She would have been a disaster. Biden may be a prick, but at least he is knowledgeable. I clearly stated as well that I never thought Obama was the messiah, just that he was better than McCain.

How am I "fucking up the efforts of people who still care"? I'm just giving my opinion here. Must have caught you on a bad day or something.


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Re: Joe Biden's (Author of Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation) daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: Lancaster]
    #10116717 - 04/06/09 12:49 PM (11 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

johnm214 said:

I wasn't duped into believing Sarah Palin is dumb, She has a degree in journalism.

Obama went to Harvard.





 
DUPED


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

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Re: Joe Biden's (Author of Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation) daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: Lancaster]
    #10116728 - 04/06/09 12:52 PM (11 years, 4 months ago)

George Bush has degrees from Yale (B.A.) and Harvard (M.B.A.)

does that make him smarter than Obama?


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama


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OfflineLancaster
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Re: Joe Biden's (Author of Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation) daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: lonestar2004]
    #10116745 - 04/06/09 12:56 PM (11 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

lonestar2004 said:
George Bush has degrees from Yale (B.A.) and Harvard (M.B.A.)

does that make him smarter than Obama?




He comes from a family of oil barons and his father ruled the world, so forgive me if I am skeptical of his ability to get into those schools on academic merit alone.


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Re: Joe Biden's (Author of Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation) daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: Lancaster]
    #10116787 - 04/06/09 01:05 PM (11 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Lancaster said:
Quote:

lonestar2004 said:
George Bush has degrees from Yale (B.A.) and Harvard (M.B.A.)

does that make him smarter than Obama?




He comes from a family of oil barons and his father ruled the world, so forgive me if I am skeptical of his ability to get into those schools on academic merit alone.




so what?

Obama's grand parents who raised him were wealthy, and sent him to the most expensive private schools and most elite Colleges....


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama


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Re: Joe Biden's (Author of Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation) daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: Lancaster]
    #10116788 - 04/06/09 01:05 PM (11 years, 4 months ago)

Barack Obama was admitted to Harvard law school without ever having received any kind of honors at all while an undergrad at Columbia.  That is unheard of.  He was 100% Affirmative Action admission, which is even more fraudulent than usual in his case because he was not disadvantaged.

Sarah Palin is most clearly not dumb.


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Re: Joe Biden's (Author of Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation) daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: zappaisgod]
    #10116800 - 04/06/09 01:08 PM (11 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:


Sarah Palin is most clearly not dumb.





but she does not have Testicles like Joe Biden so she must be dumb....


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama


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Re: Joe Biden's (Author of Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation) daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: zappaisgod]
    #10116850 - 04/06/09 01:23 PM (11 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
Sarah Palin is most clearly not dumb.




Have you seen this?




This video



is fascinating to watch as well. She descends into vague talking points when she doesn't understand something. In this case, she says absolutely nothing that is related to the question. This small clip convinced me of her ability to lead.

She was a populist, chosen to appeal to the older conservative base that emphasizes and values small town politics, and one of the many groups in america that values commonality and unintelligence.  This is evident in Palin's frequent references to "Joe Six Pack" and how she would constantly make an effort to remind you of your neighbor's wife. I just don't want my neighbor running the country.


Edited by Lancaster (04/06/09 01:31 PM)


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Re: Joe Biden's (Author of Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation) daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: Lancaster]
    #10116875 - 04/06/09 01:27 PM (11 years, 4 months ago)

did Johnm214 PM you that youtube?  :smirk:


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama


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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: Joe Biden's (Author of Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation) daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: Lancaster]
    #10116883 - 04/06/09 01:28 PM (11 years, 4 months ago)

She didn't perform well on TV.  So what?


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Re: Joe Biden's (Author of Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation) daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: zappaisgod]
    #10116907 - 04/06/09 01:33 PM (11 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
She didn't perform well on TV.  So what?




She didn't "perform" well at all, ever. Even someone who gets stage fright should be able to respond to a question without sounding like she did. Does that not make it obvious to you that she had absolutely no idea what she was talking about?


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Re: Joe Biden's (Author of Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation) daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: lonestar2004]
    #10117573 - 04/06/09 03:33 PM (11 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

lonestar2004 said:
Quote:

zappaisgod said:
now you have the whore you deserve.  I don't deserve it but you do.




:yesnod:


i know this Dentist from Chicago who moved his practice down here because of state income taxes.  I'm not sure what state income taxes are but apparently they suck! :grin:

anyway he is a big Obama supporter and was upset because he was going to have to drop a few patients to stay under the Obama $250,000 tax increase....




How does dropping patients help you save money? I guess that's why he's a dentist, not an accountant :grin:


--------------------
I know... that just the smallest
                                                part of the world belongs to me
You know... I'm not a blind man
                                                    but truth is the hardest thing to see


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Re: Joe Biden's (Author of Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation) daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: zouden]
    #10120000 - 04/06/09 09:58 PM (11 years, 4 months ago)

He means he has to make less money to stay below the tax rate Obama is pushing.


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Re: Joe Biden's (Author of Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation) daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: Lancaster]
    #10120912 - 04/07/09 12:59 AM (11 years, 4 months ago)

What's the point in that? It's not like you save money by being in a lower tax bracket. You only pay higher tax on whatever's above the bracket.


--------------------
I know... that just the smallest
                                                part of the world belongs to me
You know... I'm not a blind man
                                                    but truth is the hardest thing to see


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OfflineSeussA
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Re: Joe Biden's (Author of Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation) daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: zouden]
    #10121321 - 04/07/09 04:13 AM (11 years, 4 months ago)

> It's not like you save money by being in a lower tax bracket.

It is exactly that you save money by being in a lower tax bracket.  You do the math:

$251,000 taxed at 65%
$249,000 taxed at 35%

I'll take the second, thank you very much.


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Offlinezouden
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Re: Joe Biden's (Author of Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation) daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: Seuss]
    #10121719 - 04/07/09 07:10 AM (11 years, 4 months ago)

Oh come on Seuss.

249,000 = 249000*0.35 = $87150 tax owed = $161850 net
251,000 = 249000*0.35 + 2000*0.65 = $88450 tax owed = $162550 net


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Re: Joe Biden's (Author of Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation) daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: zouden]
    #10122013 - 04/07/09 09:10 AM (11 years, 4 months ago)

It doesn't work that way Seuss.  You only pay the higher rate on the last dollar, not all the dollars.  Even Australians know that. 

Anyway, he is making the decision to earn less because it becomes less rewarding to work more.  Consider that with all the taxes he will have to pay his last dollar earned will be worth about 25 cents (don't forget state and other taxes).  Why bother?

When you earn more money and get to keep say 50 or 60 cents on the dollar it's worth it.  When you only get a lousy fucking quarter, well, fuck that shit, I'm going home.


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OfflineSeussA
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Re: Joe Biden's (Author of Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation) daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: zappaisgod]
    #10122228 - 04/07/09 10:01 AM (11 years, 4 months ago)

> It doesn't work that way Seuss.  You only pay the higher rate on the last dollar, not all the dollars.  Even Australians know that. 

Oh sure, take all the fun out of it.  :wink:


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Re: Joe Biden's (Author of Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation) daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: zappaisgod]
    #10124108 - 04/07/09 03:49 PM (11 years, 4 months ago)

Yes, I agree with that analysis. Usually the tax rates are graduated such that people don't choose to forego a higher income, but I'm sure some people do. But it's still wrong to say that
Quote:

he was going to have to drop a few patients to stay under the Obama $250,000 tax increase....



He wouldn't have had to, but maybe he wanted to. Dropping patients means getting less money. Regardless of the tax situation.


--------------------
I know... that just the smallest
                                                part of the world belongs to me
You know... I'm not a blind man
                                                    but truth is the hardest thing to see


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Offlinelonestar2004
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Re: Joe Biden's (Author of Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation) daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: zouden]
    #10124137 - 04/07/09 03:55 PM (11 years, 4 months ago)

right he doesn't "have" to drop any patients. but it does not make any sense for him to see any more patients once he goes over the $250,000.


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama


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Re: Joe Biden's (Author of Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation) daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: lonestar2004]
    #10124359 - 04/07/09 04:32 PM (11 years, 4 months ago)

That's fine, maybe he'd rather spend time with his family or something.

I just had to pick on that particular statement because I've seen this mistake (thinking that earning more gives you less money) made many, many times before. I don't understand how so many people fail to comprehend income tax brackets :shrug:

It's the same as when people say "Oh yeah Bill Gates is doing all this charity work in Africa, but it's really just a tax dodge" like there's some way to gain money while giving it away?

We now return to your scheduled programming :grin:


--------------------
I know... that just the smallest
                                                part of the world belongs to me
You know... I'm not a blind man
                                                    but truth is the hardest thing to see


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Invisiblejohnm214
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Re: Joe Biden's (Author of Rave Act, ONDCP, and Drug Czar legislation) daughter filmed snorting cocaine [Re: zouden]
    #10124422 - 04/07/09 04:41 PM (11 years, 4 months ago)

Well yeah, you are correct on that end.


But its also eroneous for you to presume the income tax bracket and proportion of the money in it is the only consequence of being above various thresholds.


Often various government graces are tied to the gross income or other matters.  So there may very well be more substantial reasons to forgo that compensation.



Having done some work on figuring out the estate tax of a relative, I can say that many times your benifits and writeoffs are affected in complicated ways.


It is one problem I have with our tax structure: for anyone who can't be pretty proficient with spreadsheets, it can be quite difficult to calculate your actual exposure and make intelligent decisions thereby- especially when so much is tied up iin decisions you make.



For example, the issue of forming certain trusts to allow a couple to use their individual federal or state estate tax credit  is pretty straightforward: it is almost always benificial to those inheriting the money for the trust to be formed and is seldom a signifigant problem for those bequeathing the money to do so.

It really seems like it is just a "gotcha" provision to catch people that are ignorant, psychologically averse to thinking and planning these things, or unable to forsee the need (like young deaths).


Really stupid and sad, in my opinion, that the government would play such games.


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