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Redthunder25
Student of Mycology


Registered: 06/25/08
Posts: 143
Loc: US
Last seen: 15 years, 2 months
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I'm having serious problems with cracked jars
#10053902 - 03/27/09 02:00 PM (15 years, 9 months ago) |
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Lately it seems that my pc cracks almost all of my jars. When I started out none out of my first 15-20 cracked and of the last 3 batches all but 1 in each cracked. I thought it was because I lifted the weight too quick but just now I started a batch and after about 1 minute of heat I heard a "tink" like a jar cracked so I opened it up. Like I had thought 1 of them was busted. The pressure hadn't even begun build up yet. I've looked up everything for this and found nothing. Anybody know what's going on? I'd rather stop wasting jars in bunches.
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Breakfast Crew
Cheerios



Registered: 01/20/09
Posts: 1,985
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Re: I'm having serious problems with cracked jars [Re: Redthunder25]
#10053931 - 03/27/09 02:03 PM (15 years, 9 months ago) |
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I hope your not seriously opening your PC while its still cooking. Are you dropping your jars into hot water?
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Redthunder25
Student of Mycology


Registered: 06/25/08
Posts: 143
Loc: US
Last seen: 15 years, 2 months
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Re: I'm having serious problems with cracked jars [Re: Breakfast Crew]
#10053959 - 03/27/09 02:05 PM (15 years, 9 months ago) |
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I have them about 2 inches from the bottom. And I only opened it because it had zero pressure. The water was just about to boil.
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beengonetoolong
Gravy Train Conductor



Registered: 06/01/08
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Re: I'm having serious problems with cracked jars [Re: Breakfast Crew]
#10053962 - 03/27/09 02:06 PM (15 years, 9 months ago) |
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WTF kind of jars are you using? Jars shouldnt crack before pressure even builds up, doesnt make much sense.. Can you elaborate ? You're saying the jars are cracking before any pressure builds up? So its just from warm/hot water?
Are you elevating the jars off of the bottom of the cooker?
How old are the jars? Good jars only have a life expectancy of about 10 years.
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Breakfast Crew
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Registered: 01/20/09
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Re: I'm having serious problems with cracked jars [Re: beengonetoolong]
#10053978 - 03/27/09 02:08 PM (15 years, 9 months ago) |
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So you dropped room temperature jars into near boiling water....theres your problem.
Drop an ice cube into hot water and see what happens to the cube.
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Redthunder25
Student of Mycology


Registered: 06/25/08
Posts: 143
Loc: US
Last seen: 15 years, 2 months
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Re: I'm having serious problems with cracked jars [Re: beengonetoolong]
#10053988 - 03/27/09 02:09 PM (15 years, 9 months ago) |
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Half pint mason jars, less than a year old. I know it sounds strange, that's why I got on and posted. I have no idea what could crack a jar that quick.
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Redthunder25
Student of Mycology


Registered: 06/25/08
Posts: 143
Loc: US
Last seen: 15 years, 2 months
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Re: I'm having serious problems with cracked jars [Re: Redthunder25]
#10053996 - 03/27/09 02:10 PM (15 years, 9 months ago) |
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I did not drop them into boiling water. I set them on a plate on top of a trivet while everything was still cold. They were about 1 inch above the water.
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Redthunder25
Student of Mycology


Registered: 06/25/08
Posts: 143
Loc: US
Last seen: 15 years, 2 months
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Re: I'm having serious problems with cracked jars [Re: Redthunder25]
#10054033 - 03/27/09 02:15 PM (15 years, 9 months ago) |
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Could it be possible that I have too much water in the pc and at the beginning of the cycle it could be boiling up to the jars?
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NineInchNails
Stranger

Registered: 03/01/09
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Re: I'm having serious problems with cracked jars [Re: Breakfast Crew]
#10054042 - 03/27/09 02:16 PM (15 years, 9 months ago) |
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There are a few variables here, but let's see if I can narrow them down for you.
Do you have your jars spaced off of the bottom of the PC? If not then you should. Never set your jars directly on the bottom of the PC without something to prop them up off the bottom.
The PC is capable of producing MUCH higher temps than boiling water can. If you lift the weight that releases the pressure rapidly. You shouldn't do that. This can cause the water to boil up over the tops of your jars. I'm not 100% positive, but I think that doing this may cause the pressure inside your jars to rapidly release (prematurely) and can cause bad things to happen. If you allow the jars to cool off a bit inside the PC then this pressure slowly equalizes.
When you start up the PC you have the heat on high. Once the PC starts to spit then you turn the heat down quite a bit. You want the PC to spit approx once every 15 seconds. Are you leaving your PC on high the whole time?
I have yet to crack a single jar. It's not because I'm special, it's because I keep my jars off the bottom, fire up the stove, once the things spits I turn it down, PC anywhere from 45-70 min at 15psi at this point, and turn off the flame to allow the PC to cool down on its own before fooling with the weight. To tell you the truth ... I usually put a fan in front of my PC (a few feet away). I haven't found that doing this hurts a damn thing. It speeds up the cooling process significantly.
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NineInchNails
Stranger

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Re: I'm having serious problems with cracked jars [Re: NineInchNails]
#10054090 - 03/27/09 02:21 PM (15 years, 9 months ago) |
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I usually have enough water to cover approx the lower 1/4 to the lower 1/3 of my jars. I also use foil on top.
By the way ... are you using solid lids screwed on tight?
If you are then loosten your lids a 1/2 turn before or after you cover them with foil. My grain jars have a 'free air exchange' hole covered with tyvek so I keep them on tight.
My 'liquid culture' jars have RTV silicone inoculation points so I loosten those lids before I PC them. Once I'm done with the PC I remove the jars, wait for the jars to cool down to room temp, then I tighten the lids. Some people use a 'filter syringe' in their liquid cultures so that allows the jars to breath durring cool down.
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Redthunder25
Student of Mycology


Registered: 06/25/08
Posts: 143
Loc: US
Last seen: 15 years, 2 months
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Re: I'm having serious problems with cracked jars [Re: NineInchNails]
#10054103 - 03/27/09 02:23 PM (15 years, 9 months ago) |
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I do everything you do. I turn the heat down once it starts to spit and raise them off the bottom. On a couple batches I lifted the weight right after the cycle ended. I thought for sure that was it but this is unexplainable. I'm now thinking I just had too much water in the pc and in the process of heating up the water boiled up over the jars. I dumped some out and started it again.
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gotfungus
get some

Registered: 11/03/08
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Re: I'm having serious problems with cracked jars [Re: NineInchNails]
#10054115 - 03/27/09 02:25 PM (15 years, 9 months ago) |
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it could just be a bad batch of glass.
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Redthunder25
Student of Mycology


Registered: 06/25/08
Posts: 143
Loc: US
Last seen: 15 years, 2 months
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Re: I'm having serious problems with cracked jars [Re: Redthunder25]
#10054120 - 03/27/09 02:26 PM (15 years, 9 months ago) |
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I'm using the pf tek.
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Redthunder25
Student of Mycology


Registered: 06/25/08
Posts: 143
Loc: US
Last seen: 15 years, 2 months
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Re: I'm having serious problems with cracked jars [Re: Redthunder25]
#10054123 - 03/27/09 02:27 PM (15 years, 9 months ago) |
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I'm using jars from two separate case bought about a month apart.
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gotfungus
get some

Registered: 11/03/08
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Re: I'm having serious problems with cracked jars [Re: Redthunder25]
#10054135 - 03/27/09 02:30 PM (15 years, 9 months ago) |
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out of ideas then
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Redthunder25
Student of Mycology


Registered: 06/25/08
Posts: 143
Loc: US
Last seen: 15 years, 2 months
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Re: I'm having serious problems with cracked jars [Re: gotfungus]
#10054142 - 03/27/09 02:31 PM (15 years, 9 months ago) |
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I'm hoping it was the water level. I'll know tonight when I open it up.
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NineInchNails
Stranger

Registered: 03/01/09
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Re: I'm having serious problems with cracked jars [Re: gotfungus]
#10054151 - 03/27/09 02:33 PM (15 years, 9 months ago) |
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I do find it hard to believe that the jars would crack just from being boiled over, but I'm by far an expert. PCs are typically used for faster canning in comparison to boiling jars to be sealed for decades.
Perhaps your problem is having messed with the weight. Maybe all hell breaks loose once you rapidly drop pressure forcing everything to rapidly expand inside the PC.
Bad glass … maybe, but damn … 15-20 jars? That’s a bad run of luck. Doubtful, but possible.
I personally have never propped my jars up above the water. Mine have always been immersed at least 25% into the water. On second thought … maybe it was from being boiled over like that.
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Redthunder25
Student of Mycology


Registered: 06/25/08
Posts: 143
Loc: US
Last seen: 15 years, 2 months
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Re: I'm having serious problems with cracked jars [Re: NineInchNails]
#10054158 - 03/27/09 02:34 PM (15 years, 9 months ago) |
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The first 15-20 DIDN'T crack using the same exact setup.
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Green2whitethumb
Lumberjack



Registered: 02/27/09
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Re: I'm having serious problems with cracked jars [Re: Redthunder25]
#10054266 - 03/27/09 02:55 PM (15 years, 9 months ago) |
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Read the directions for your PC and FOLLOW THEM!!! (this will tell you how much water to put in, and how to heat it up properly)
Don't ever touch your weight until the sides of the PC is at ROOM TEMP!!! Come on bro.
Make sure your PC has a bottom insert to keep jars off the bottom, if not, use jar lid bands or crumpled tin foil.
PC jars with the rubber seal (on the lid) facing UP, not down as normally done w/ canning. Make sure the lid has holes in it (for inoculation and breathing)and that it is not tight, loose is OK, and a tyvek or filter breather also (see any tek). Cover the tops with foil.
I'm not just saying this for shits and jiggles. If ALL above information is followed to a T, you won't see a cracked jar again.
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RogerRabbit
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Re: I'm having serious problems with cracked jars [Re: Green2whitethumb]
#10054651 - 03/27/09 03:51 PM (15 years, 9 months ago) |
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To add to the above, perhaps you're overloading. Make sure when you load the jars, there is space around each one. The glass expands slightly as it heats and if the jars are jammed in tight, they'll break. It's better to use two or three rows stacked on top of each other than for them to be jammed in tightly side to side.
As said above already, make sure you have holes in the lids, the jars are elevated out of the water on a trivet or jar lid rings, and don't touch the PC until after it cools enough to touch without gloves. NEVER lift the weight to let pressure out. RR
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