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Invisibleit stars saddam
Satan

Registered: 05/19/05
Posts: 15,571
Loc: Spahn Ranch
The Persistence of Religious Programming
    #9552556 - 01/05/09 05:37 PM (15 years, 2 months ago)

It seems that many people, not just on this forum but in general, continue to struggle with and be influenced by the religious indoctrination they experienced as children, even after having realized its absurdity.  This is particularly apparent in those who are obviously intelligent enough to have rejected Biblical literalism but still attempt to integrate tenets of Christianity into their more rational philosophical beliefs.  An example of this would be the common tendency to refer to Being or the ultimate nature of reality as "God."

Fortunately, I seem to have escaped these psychological trappings, as I quit believing in God at a very young age.  There is a common saying that "there are no atheists in foxholes," meaning that even atheists will resort to prayer in frightening or stressful situations.  This has never been the case for me.  The idea of prayer, requesting assistance from a deity, is completely absurd to me.  For me, it's not a question of "what if?"  It's not even a question.  The idea of God and religion in general is almost entirely irrelevant to my life, as it's something I've never believed in and rarely even think about.  This may seem hypocritical as my title is "Satan," but I view the Bible as I would any other work of fiction, and I've always found Satan to be a rather compelling character.

Nevertheless, the fact that religious teachings have proven to be so persistent in the collective mind is a testament to the brilliance of their indoctrination methods.

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InvisibleSilversoul
Rhizome
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Registered: 01/01/05
Posts: 23,576
Loc: The Barricades
Re: The Persistence of Religious Programming [Re: it stars saddam]
    #9552704 - 01/05/09 05:56 PM (15 years, 2 months ago)

There is a middle ground between "literal word of God" and "pure fiction" and some of us view the Bible from that middle ground, seeing as a source of wisdom and a record of the lives of great prophets like Jesus.  Also, don't assume that all people of faith are brought up in religious families.  Some of us find God later in life.


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Invisibleit stars saddam
Satan

Registered: 05/19/05
Posts: 15,571
Loc: Spahn Ranch
Re: The Persistence of Religious Programming [Re: Silversoul]
    #9552752 - 01/05/09 06:04 PM (15 years, 2 months ago)

I actually think that religion is probably a fairly useful and perhaps even healthy psychological mechanism.  My mother is a Christian (incidentally, she wasn't brought up in a religious family), and it seems to be a very rewarding belief system for her.  She is a very happy and optimistic person.  In my opinion, it's fanaticism, not religion itself, that is ultimately destructive.

At the same time, it seems that the belief in an all-seeing God could possibly result in severe guilt and paranoia.

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InvisibledeCypher
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Registered: 02/10/08
Posts: 56,232
Re: The Persistence of Religious Programming [Re: it stars saddam]
    #9553011 - 01/05/09 06:40 PM (15 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

it stars saddam said: The idea of God and religion in general is almost entirely irrelevant to my life, as it's something I've never believed in and rarely even think about.




Relevant enough to make this post, though.  :tongue:


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We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars.

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Invisibleit stars saddam
Satan

Registered: 05/19/05
Posts: 15,571
Loc: Spahn Ranch
Re: The Persistence of Religious Programming [Re: deCypher]
    #9553066 - 01/05/09 06:48 PM (15 years, 2 months ago)

I said "almost."

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InvisibleOrgoneConclusion
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Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,441
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Re: The Persistence of Religious Programming [Re: it stars saddam]
    #9553079 - 01/05/09 06:50 PM (15 years, 2 months ago)

Yeah, deCyphillis - he did say 'almost'. :mad:


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InvisibledeCypher
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Re: The Persistence of Religious Programming [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #9553189 - 01/05/09 07:03 PM (15 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

OrgoneConclusion said:
Yeah, deCyphillis - he did say 'almost'. :mad:




You should be ashamed of yourself.


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We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars.

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InvisibleOrgoneConclusion
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Registered: 04/01/07
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Re: The Persistence of Religious Programming [Re: deCypher]
    #9553339 - 01/05/09 07:28 PM (15 years, 2 months ago)

I will be - when I sober up.


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InvisibleRahz
Alive Again
Male


Registered: 11/10/05
Posts: 9,301
Re: The Persistence of Religious Programming [Re: it stars saddam]
    #9554352 - 01/05/09 09:51 PM (15 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

It seems that many people, not just on this forum but in general, continue to struggle with and be influenced by the religious indoctrination they experienced as children, even after having realized its absurdity.




It seems absurd, yet I think the difficulty comes in as a result of the rejection as well as the falsehoods themselves. When a person has the parallels of life tied to a belief system, and the system is thrown away, the understanding of life may go with it.

It would be difficult to prove whether atheists pray, but many of them do cuss a figure they don't believe in. Why is this? What does God mean to a person who would take that name in vain?


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rahz

comfort pleasure power love truth awareness peace


"The object of opening the mind, as of opening the mouth, is to shut it again on something solid." - Gilbert Keith Chesterton

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InvisibleSilversoul
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Posts: 23,576
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Re: The Persistence of Religious Programming [Re: Rahz]
    #9554399 - 01/05/09 09:57 PM (15 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Rahz said:
It would be difficult to prove whether atheists pray, but many of them do cuss a figure they don't believe in. Why is this? What does God mean to a person who would take that name in vain?



I think many atheists do exhibit prayer-like behavior in the form of bargaining.  In stressful situations, they might say something like "Please God get me out of this."  Even if they leave the G word out of that sentence, the fact remains that they're appealing to some entity which, according to them, doesn't exist.


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InvisibleRahz
Alive Again
Male


Registered: 11/10/05
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Re: The Persistence of Religious Programming [Re: Silversoul]
    #9554465 - 01/05/09 10:05 PM (15 years, 2 months ago)

Yes, I agree.


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rahz

comfort pleasure power love truth awareness peace


"The object of opening the mind, as of opening the mouth, is to shut it again on something solid." - Gilbert Keith Chesterton

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OfflineAnxietyDrive
Aspiring Psychologist
Male


Registered: 01/03/09
Posts: 472
Last seen: 9 years, 1 month
Re: The Persistence of Religious Programming [Re: it stars saddam]
    #9554890 - 01/05/09 11:13 PM (15 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

it stars saddam said:
It seems that many people, not just on this forum but in general, continue to struggle with and be influenced by the religious indoctrination they experienced as children, even after having realized its absurdity.  This is particularly apparent in those who are obviously intelligent enough to have rejected Biblical literalism but still attempt to integrate tenets of Christianity into their more rational philosophical beliefs.  An example of this would be the common tendency to refer to Being or the ultimate nature of reality as "God."

Fortunately, I seem to have escaped these psychological trappings, as I quit believing in God at a very young age.  There is a common saying that "there are no atheists in foxholes," meaning that even atheists will resort to prayer in frightening or stressful situations.  This has never been the case for me.  The idea of prayer, requesting assistance from a deity, is completely absurd to me.  For me, it's not a question of "what if?"  It's not even a question.  The idea of God and religion in general is almost entirely irrelevant to my life, as it's something I've never believed in and rarely even think about.  This may seem hypocritical as my title is "Satan," but I view the Bible as I would any other work of fiction, and I've always found Satan to be a rather compelling character.

Nevertheless, the fact that religious teachings have proven to be so persistent in the collective mind is a testament to the brilliance of their indoctrination methods.




In some aspects, and possibly due to religious indoctrination, the word "God" has become acculturated, meaning that it has taken on a completely nonreligious meaning due to cultural use and misuse.

I don't think that all people, when they say "God Damn it", actually relate the meaning of the word "god" to deity, creator, or omniscient being. At least not consciously. The forces at work are an interplay of culture, religion, and language. The very essence of the word has morphed into some kind of slang aberration.

And i agree with what you stated about viewing the bible as a work of fiction. It is a tome that contains morality tale after morality tale, symbol after symbol, and archetype after archetype.

Of course for a student of religious studies, it is not entirely useless, and like many religious texts, it contains a vast amount of wisdom just waiting to be handed down.


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No trees were harmed in the writing of this signature; however, millions of electrons were mildly inconvenienced.

Edited by AnxietyDrive (01/05/09 11:29 PM)

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InvisibleRecondicom
Power of four
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Registered: 05/03/07
Posts: 226
Re: Pray [Re: it stars saddam]
    #9557190 - 01/06/09 11:18 AM (15 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

it stars saddam said:
It seems that many people, not just on this forum but in general, continue to struggle with and be influenced by the religious indoctrination they experienced as children, even after having realized its absurdity.  This is particularly apparent in those who are obviously intelligent enough to have rejected Biblical literalism but still attempt to integrate tenets of Christianity into their more rational philosophical beliefs.  An example of this would be the common tendency to refer to Being or the ultimate nature of reality as "God."

Fortunately, I seem to have escaped these psychological trappings, as I quit believing in God at a very young age.  There is a common saying that "there are no atheists in foxholes," meaning that even atheists will resort to prayer in frightening or stressful situations.  This has never been the case for me.  The idea of prayer, requesting assistance from a deity, is completely absurd to me.  For me, it's not a question of "what if?"  It's not even a question.  The idea of God and religion in general is almost entirely irrelevant to my life, as it's something I've never believed in and rarely even think about.  This may seem hypocritical as my title is "Satan," but I view the Bible as I would any other work of fiction, and I've always found Satan to be a rather compelling character.

Nevertheless, the fact that religious teachings have proven to be so persistent in the collective mind is a testament to the brilliance of their indoctrination methods.




    Many have the approach of philosophical inquiry. Is there  a Universal mechanism which configures prayer to reach/mind the absolute truth?  Practical enlightenment .  Albo, a Jewish mystic, combined Greek and Jewish philosophies on prayer into a new philosophy …worth a look… and how about the wishing well or the drug psyche?  Deconstruction takes a whole different meaning.
    Deconstruction follows rules, but sometimes is confusing… There are five apple in a basket…if you take three, how many apples do you have left to eat?


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Wave.
'And for this reason repentance (metanoia) is an elevating means. For he who feels impatience with the circunstances in which he finds himself, devises means of escape.
  Now the chief thing in purification is the will. For then both deeds and words lend a helping hand. But, when the will is absent, the whole purificatory discipline of initiation is...'

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