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InvisibleFeeling_of_Sound
Psychedelic Theorist
Male


Registered: 11/30/07
Posts: 627
Loc: Infinite Possibilities
abolish the electoral college.
    #9184173 - 11/04/08 06:35 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

It was put into effect back in the day because the founding fathers believed the citizens of this country were too ill-informed/stupid to make an educated decision.

What with the media coverage, internet, and schooling I think the electoral college should be removed. The electors don't need to heed voters' wishes even if the votes are overwhelmingly weighed towards one specific candidate. I think we should count the actual individual votes and decide that way. forget representational democracy, how bout true democracy.


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"Once expanded to the dimensions of a larger idea,
[the mind] never returns to its original size."

  -Oliver Wendell Holmes


"Consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds." - Ralph Waldo Emerson


[quote] underfliptown said:
Adaptation to a sick society is no measure of mental health. [/quote]

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InvisibleDieCommie

Registered: 12/11/03
Posts: 29,258
Re: abolish the electoral college. [Re: Feeling_of_Sound]
    #9184180 - 11/04/08 06:36 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

It was put into effect back in the day because the founding fathers believed the citizens of this country were too ill-informed/stupid to make an educated decision.





Source?

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Offlinemonkeywrench
Why Not?


Registered: 09/16/08
Posts: 908
Last seen: 18 days, 21 hours
Re: abolish the electoral college. [Re: DieCommie]
    #9184223 - 11/04/08 06:41 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

most people are stupid or at least ignorant.


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[quote]skalthren said:
It's nice of you to imply that I've been brainwashed by the government, but the truth is that I'm simply intelligent enough to recognize the subtleties of these issues instead of going "durr hurr, weed should totally be legal!"[/quote]

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Offlinemoe.phan
listening for the secret
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Registered: 10/15/08
Posts: 2,592
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Re: abolish the electoral college. [Re: monkeywrench]
    #9184234 - 11/04/08 06:43 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

i couldn't agree more. its way outdated and needs to be removed. LET THE VOTERS DECIDE

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Invisiblezorbman
blarrr
Male

Registered: 06/04/04
Posts: 5,952
Re: abolish the electoral college. [Re: Feeling_of_Sound]
    #9184917 - 11/04/08 08:16 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

Obama is clobbering McCain right now in the electoral college but in the popular vote Obama only leads by one percent!


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“The crisis takes a much longer time coming than you think, and then it happens much faster than you would have thought.”  -- Rudiger Dornbusch

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Invisiblepinkfloydms
!!!!!
Male

Registered: 05/26/04
Posts: 4,470
Loc: City of Dreams
Re: abolish the electoral college. [Re: zorbman]
    #9185220 - 11/04/08 09:04 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

That will change when the west coast reports in.


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Muppet Said:

so yeah:
- 'sex' five times
- once with a man
- once with a cadaver
- and thrice with actual women(all of which were prostitutes)
Best story ever!

www.panicstream.com :thumbup:

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Invisiblepinkfloydms
!!!!!
Male

Registered: 05/26/04
Posts: 4,470
Loc: City of Dreams
Re: abolish the electoral college. [Re: zorbman]
    #9185548 - 11/04/08 09:43 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

zorbman said:
Obama is clobbering McCain right now in the electoral college but in the popular vote Obama only leads by one percent!




They just said on CNN that his popular vote would prolly be the largest win seen since Lyndon B. Johnson.


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Muppet Said:

so yeah:
- 'sex' five times
- once with a man
- once with a cadaver
- and thrice with actual women(all of which were prostitutes)
Best story ever!

www.panicstream.com :thumbup:

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Invisiblehamandcheese
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Registered: 06/02/08
Posts: 12,530
Loc: Next Level
Re: abolish the electoral college. [Re: Feeling_of_Sound]
    #9185913 - 11/04/08 10:31 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

are you implying using just the popular vote?


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Invisiblemofo
Hobby Jingoist


Registered: 04/05/08
Posts: 2,232
Loc: Donkey Kong Kill Screen
Re: abolish the electoral college. [Re: hamandcheese]
    #9185940 - 11/04/08 10:34 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

hamandcheese said:
are you implying using just the popular vote?




I think that's an excellent idea, along with single transferable vote.  What would that require anyway?  A constitutional amendment, I assume?

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InvisibleFeeling_of_Sound
Psychedelic Theorist
Male


Registered: 11/30/07
Posts: 627
Loc: Infinite Possibilities
Re: abolish the electoral college. [Re: hamandcheese]
    #9185980 - 11/04/08 10:40 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

hamandcheese said:
are you implying using just the popular vote?


That, or if we don't want too radical of a change, how bout making is so that the electoral votes can be split up instead of all of a state's votes being assigned to the majority leader. That way there's still a representative democracy but the will of the people is more specifically carried out based on a more personal survey of a smaller group of people.


--------------------
"Once expanded to the dimensions of a larger idea,
[the mind] never returns to its original size."

  -Oliver Wendell Holmes


"Consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds." - Ralph Waldo Emerson


[quote] underfliptown said:
Adaptation to a sick society is no measure of mental health. [/quote]

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InvisibleDieCommie

Registered: 12/11/03
Posts: 29,258
Re: abolish the electoral college. [Re: Feeling_of_Sound]
    #9186011 - 11/04/08 10:45 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Feeling_of_Sound said:
That, or if we don't want too radical of a change, how bout making is so that the electoral votes can be split up instead of all of a state's votes being assigned to the majority leader.




I support that wholeheartedly.  That is superior to the current system and to a popular vote.

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Invisiblehamandcheese
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Registered: 06/02/08
Posts: 12,530
Loc: Next Level
Re: abolish the electoral college. [Re: Feeling_of_Sound]
    #9186020 - 11/04/08 10:46 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

a popular vote would be horrible. sound good, who ever most people vote for should be the winner. but that means the residents of a state like rhode island vote means nothing. therefore they go unrepresented, and rural votes dont mean shit either. candidates need only cater to large states and big cities.

the idea of letting state split votes is much better and more likely, nebraska and maine already do that.


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OfflinePsuper
Psilocybin


Registered: 02/12/08
Posts: 2,874
Loc: PNW
Last seen: 3 years, 6 months
Re: abolish the electoral college. [Re: hamandcheese]
    #9186034 - 11/04/08 10:48 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

How would reform or abolishment of the electoral college go about? I am interested in getting involved in the fight against the EC. Anyone have any info on this for a young activist???  ~Pixie~


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Clinical Management of High Dose Psilocybin Sessions:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FbHOTIqjZLk

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InvisibleautomanM
blasted chipmunk
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Registered: 09/18/03
Posts: 8,272
Re: abolish the electoral college. [Re: Feeling_of_Sound]
    #9186052 - 11/04/08 10:51 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

I think the electoral college was a great idea. If it were not in place, most elections would be decided by the coastal states. I imagine land owner rights would basically die as would anything else that doesn't matter to coastal citizens. It would make campaigning a lot easier, though. Candidates could spend all their time in Florida, New York, Pennsylvania, California, and Texas. In just those states, you can talk to 110,000,000 Americans.


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No, no, you're not thinking, you're just being logical. ~ Niels Bohr

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InvisibleFeeling_of_Sound
Psychedelic Theorist
Male


Registered: 11/30/07
Posts: 627
Loc: Infinite Possibilities
Re: abolish the electoral college. [Re: hamandcheese]
    #9186060 - 11/04/08 10:51 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

Edit: never mind


--------------------
"Once expanded to the dimensions of a larger idea,
[the mind] never returns to its original size."

  -Oliver Wendell Holmes


"Consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds." - Ralph Waldo Emerson


[quote] underfliptown said:
Adaptation to a sick society is no measure of mental health. [/quote]

Edited by Feeling_of_Sound (11/04/08 10:55 PM)

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OfflineMrBump
Third prize is you're fired
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Registered: 10/01/02
Posts: 4,263
Loc: Denver, Colorado
Last seen: 4 years, 8 months
Re: abolish the electoral college. [Re: hamandcheese]
    #9186076 - 11/04/08 10:54 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

hamandcheese said:
a popular vote would be horrible. sound good, who ever most people vote for should be the winner. but that means the residents of a state like rhode island vote means nothing. therefore they go unrepresented, and rural votes dont mean shit either. candidates need only cater to large states and big cities.

the idea of letting state split votes is much better and more likely, nebraska and maine already do that.




a conservative friend of mine thinks taking away the electoral college would have a downside. all the people who commit voter fraud by voting several times would actually have more of an impact on the outcome. If they vote several times in a small state at least there's only a small percentage of electoral votes that would be corrupted.


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If it weren't for the bloody corpses, I wouldn't have any corpses at all.

There are two ways to get to the top of an oak tree: start climbing or sit on an acorn.

Are you a carrot, an egg, or a coffee bean?

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Invisiblehamandcheese
Sandwich
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Registered: 06/02/08
Posts: 12,530
Loc: Next Level
Re: abolish the electoral college. [Re: Feeling_of_Sound]
    #9186101 - 11/04/08 10:58 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

it doesnt matter where youd want to put the votes, it matters where the votes come from.  like automan said ALL of the campaigning would be in your big states, and cities.

think about why we have both a senate and the house and how the number of members of each are determined.


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Offlinezouden
Neuroscientist
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Registered: 11/12/07
Posts: 7,091
Loc: Australia
Last seen: 14 years, 5 months
Re: abolish the electoral college. [Re: automan]
    #9186615 - 11/05/08 12:31 AM (15 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

automan said:
I think the electoral college was a great idea. If it were not in place, most elections would be decided by the coastal states.



But that's because that's where most of the people are. If most people live in cities, shouldn't they get most of the vote? Surely the power of each vote should be the same for each person, and the only way to do that is with a popular vote. I don't see why rural people should get a disproportionally bigger say in the election.


--------------------
I know... that just the smallest
                                                part of the world belongs to me
You know... I'm not a blind man
                                                    but truth is the hardest thing to see

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Offlinewildchild68
lion in a coma
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Registered: 11/19/07
Posts: 5,115
Last seen: 9 years, 10 months
Re: abolish the electoral college. [Re: hamandcheese]
    #9186791 - 11/05/08 12:59 AM (15 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

hamandcheese said:
a popular vote would be horrible. sound good, who ever most people vote for should be the winner. but that means the residents of a state like rhode island vote means nothing. therefore they go unrepresented, and rural votes dont mean shit either. candidates need only cater to large states and big cities.






That's only looking at it from the state perspective though.

A person's vote would would be assigned the same importance no matter what state they live in.

I think both of these proposed systems would be better than the one we have now.


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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
Two inch dick..but it spins!?
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Registered: 11/29/01
Posts: 34,247
Loc: Lost In Space
Re: abolish the electoral college. [Re: Feeling_of_Sound]
    #9188197 - 11/05/08 10:41 AM (15 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Feeling_of_Sound said:
It was put into effect back in the day because the founding fathers believed the citizens of this country were too ill-informed/stupid to make an educated decision. 



For the sake of argument, assuming that is the reason, last nights results prove it.


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You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers

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