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CleverName
the cloudsshould know meby now...
Registered: 08/26/02
Posts: 1,121
Loc: red earth painted with mi...
Last seen: 18 years, 4 months
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are there morals?
#893477 - 09/19/02 11:40 AM (21 years, 6 months ago) |
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ok, right off the bat im ging to say this, i believe we all are one consiousness manifested in different forms, and in different realities, like many waves go up and down, but they are still the ocean (its hard to say what i mean, most of you understand i think) so, if thats the case dualties are only illusions, right and wrong all depends on your position...
this stuff have been disscused here before and may even be obvious to you guys here, but im new at this forum, so bear with me..
~love all, 1ne love~
-------------------- if you can't find the truth right where you are, where else do you expect to find it? this is the purpose
Edited by CleverName (09/19/02 11:44 AM)
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TheShroomHermit
Divine Hermit of the Everything
Registered: 02/19/02
Posts: 7,575
Loc: border of Canada and Mexi...
Last seen: 9 months, 10 days
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Re: are there morals? [Re: CleverName]
#893488 - 09/19/02 11:47 AM (21 years, 6 months ago) |
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YES
I think what I understand what your getting at... I don't think there is a good or bad/evil duality in existence, but I have my own reasons for that... just human nature... and perspectives.
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buttonion
Calmly Watching
Registered: 04/04/02
Posts: 303
Loc: Kansas
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Re: are there morals? [Re: CleverName]
#893631 - 09/19/02 01:18 PM (21 years, 6 months ago) |
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Yu ah on yo way yung grass-hoppa...
Morality is relative in the sense (we'll say "abstract sense") that there can be no right in the absence of wrong. They are both utterly dependent on each other, like you said peaks and valleys of a wave, backgrounds and foregrounds, and, bingo, duality is illusion.
Culturally speaking, however ("cultural sense"), human morality does not appear to be entirley relative. While it seems that everyone has there own idea of right and wrong, there are some moral universals- Incest, patricide, and a host of other behaviors regarded as reprehensible can be found across cultures and history.
And so,
right and wrong depends on your position
is true in that right only makes sense relative to wrong, but we can understand some specific cultural morals without a need to relate them to other cultures- they exist (egghh.. existence) in more of an absolute sense.
-------------------- Concepts which have been proved to be useful in ordering things easily acquire such an authority over us that we forget their human origins and accept them as invariable.- Albert Einstein
Edited by buttonion (09/19/02 01:19 PM)
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ChubbSubb
Zen Lunatic
Registered: 06/03/02
Posts: 612
Loc: Here.
Last seen: 20 years, 9 months
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Re: are there morals? [Re: CleverName]
#893681 - 09/19/02 01:32 PM (21 years, 6 months ago) |
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Welcome! I get what you are expressing in your post. This forum is great. Peace to all, Trev
-------------------- Those who know do not speak. Those who speak do not know.
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In(di)go
People of the sun.
Registered: 10/29/00
Posts: 8,157
Loc: Cologne, Germany
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Re: are there morals? [Re: CleverName]
#893695 - 09/19/02 01:38 PM (21 years, 6 months ago) |
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welcome, clevername! hava a nice stay
and i know exactly where you are coming from... to quote bill hicks right here...
"today a young man on acid realized that all matter is merely energy condensed to a slower vibration, that we are all one consciousness experiencing itself subjectively.. there is no such thing as death, life is only a dream and we are the imagination of ourselves... here's tome with the wather"
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Adamist
ℚṲℰϟ✞ЇѺℵ ℛ∃Åʟḯ†У
Registered: 11/23/01
Posts: 10,211
Loc: Bloomington, IN
Last seen: 9 years, 29 days
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Re: are there morals? [Re: CleverName]
#893896 - 09/19/02 03:13 PM (21 years, 6 months ago) |
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if thats the case dualties are only illusions, right and wrong all depends on your position
I once talked to a snake named Lucy who told me the same thing....... kinda changes your perception a bit huh?
-------------------- { { { ṧ◎ηḯ¢ αʟ¢ℌ℮мƴ } } }
Edited by Adamist (09/19/02 03:13 PM)
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Grav
Registered: 02/06/02
Posts: 4,454
Last seen: 11 years, 3 months
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Re: are there morals? [Re: In(di)go]
#893917 - 09/19/02 03:26 PM (21 years, 6 months ago) |
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Its not a war on drugs its a war on personal freedom thank you.
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Anonymous
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Re: are there morals? [Re: buttonion]
#894682 - 09/19/02 09:40 PM (21 years, 6 months ago) |
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Ethical relativism is fraught with error. I wish I had time to elaborate.
Cheers,
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Revelation
ॐ
Registered: 08/04/01
Posts: 6,135
Loc: heart cave
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Re: are there morals? [Re: CleverName]
#894761 - 09/19/02 10:52 PM (21 years, 6 months ago) |
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If all our ideas about morality are different, then it must be a subjective thing. So they don't exist in an objective sense, but they do exist.
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Anonymous
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Re: are there morals? [Re: ]
#895063 - 09/20/02 05:12 AM (21 years, 6 months ago) |
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Without an objective (or common) standard of morality, a civilization will descend into anarchy (I mean this in the negative sense - not self-government). When a society accepts moral relativism, their civilization is doomed to perish.
Edited by Evolving (09/20/02 05:13 AM)
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Phred
Fred's son
Registered: 10/18/00
Posts: 12,949
Loc: Dominican Republic
Last seen: 9 years, 2 months
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Re: are there morals? [Re: CleverName]
#895341 - 09/20/02 07:48 AM (21 years, 6 months ago) |
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There IS such a thing as objective morality. Given the nature of man, it cannot be otherwise. The problem is that very few people take the time to discover that morality, they merely accept whatever others around them claim is "moral".
Note that in this context I use "moral" in the sense of "good" and "right", and "correct", not in the sense of "what is accepted" or "what is customary".
For example, in Victorian England, it was considered "immoral" for a woman to expose her ankles in public. That is not a question of "morality" at all -- it is a matter of custom. Yet ALL societies proscribe theft and murder, because both behaviors are OBJECTIVELY immoral, regardless of what other customs and traditions the society may embrace.
pinky
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Anonymous
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Re: are there morals? [Re: ]
#895432 - 09/20/02 08:22 AM (21 years, 6 months ago) |
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Yes Evolving. The only ones that do not know this are those that do not want to know it.
Post more often if you can. You are missed by some in this forum.
Cheers,
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Swami
Eggshell Walker
Registered: 01/18/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
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Re: are there morals? [Re: CleverName]
#895873 - 09/20/02 12:24 PM (21 years, 6 months ago) |
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i believe we all are one consiousness manifested in different forms
If you truly believed this, it would be impossible to ever hurt another. Is this not true? Where did you get this idea and how do you live it?
-------------------- The proof is in the pudding.
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CleverName
the cloudsshould know meby now...
Registered: 08/26/02
Posts: 1,121
Loc: red earth painted with mi...
Last seen: 18 years, 4 months
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Re: are there morals? [Re: Swami]
#895922 - 09/20/02 01:02 PM (21 years, 6 months ago) |
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"it would be impossible to ever hurt another" each ego has its own desire, that may cross another desire, people hurt themselves all the time...
"consiousness manifested in different forms" everything settles in layers, everything.
"Where did you get this idea " sitting next to a stream, watching the life around me and thikning, "i was once this or that, and it was once me, the same atoms that make up any particular thing make up me also, ive been around since the first cause, i am the first cause and always will be, and so is everything else..." and so on
"how do you live it?" how do YOU live it, or him or her... i accept
-------------------- if you can't find the truth right where you are, where else do you expect to find it? this is the purpose
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CleverName
the cloudsshould know meby now...
Registered: 08/26/02
Posts: 1,121
Loc: red earth painted with mi...
Last seen: 18 years, 4 months
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Re: are there morals? [Re: CleverName]
#895928 - 09/20/02 01:09 PM (21 years, 6 months ago) |
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i believe the aspects of time and space mere illusions, there is no point A or point B, only point.
-------------------- if you can't find the truth right where you are, where else do you expect to find it? this is the purpose
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In(di)go
People of the sun.
Registered: 10/29/00
Posts: 8,157
Loc: Cologne, Germany
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Re: are there morals? [Re: Swami]
#895978 - 09/20/02 01:42 PM (21 years, 6 months ago) |
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clevername... i like your style!
Quote:
If you truly believed this, it would be impossible to ever hurt another. Is this not true? Where did you get this idea and how do you live it?
actually it is impossible... obviously there is a difference between physical and emotional (spiritual) pain... if you talk about physical pain the point is that you are not your body, so the pain is not inflicted to you, but to the vehicle you use to move around and accomplish tasks int his reality... and if you are talking about emotional pain, then i suggest you to realize that that kinda pain is never inflicted by someone else or by the situation, it is inflicted by yourself... you choose how you feel in certain situations, you choose how to react to certain things... you either feel hurt, or you realize that the other person is merely yourself acting in a different manner and understand the course of action... actually once you realize that we are all one you start controling your thoughts, words and deeds in order to not hurt anyone unless it is necesary...
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beatlesrock
Stranger
Registered: 11/23/01
Posts: 35
Last seen: 21 years, 6 months
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Re: are there morals? [Re: CleverName]
#895988 - 09/20/02 01:49 PM (21 years, 6 months ago) |
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there are no such things as universal morals. everything is subjective.
its funny that you say some morals are universal because every culture exibits some of them (incest, patricide, etc). well obviously they will! but its a little arrogant to think that everything in the universe revolves around man. man is a viewpoint. from mans viewpoint incest is wrong. not from the trees, the oceans, the animals, and the rest of the universe
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Swami
Eggshell Walker
Registered: 01/18/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
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Re: are there morals? [Re: beatlesrock]
#896657 - 09/21/02 12:43 AM (21 years, 6 months ago) |
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Incest was accepted for a long time in some cultures; especially among royalty to keep the family lineage pure.
It was only found to be amoral when there were genetic/medical complications from inbreeding - most notably hempophilia.
From the Christain point of view, it is hard to see where incest is immoral as they believe that all humans sprang from Adam and Eve, therefore...
-------------------- The proof is in the pudding.
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Sclorch
Clyster
Registered: 07/12/99
Posts: 4,805
Loc: On the Brink of Madness
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Re: are there morals? [Re: Swami]
#896696 - 09/21/02 01:11 AM (21 years, 6 months ago) |
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Swami: ...hempophilia...
What?! Yoos gotta problem with "the (morbid) love of hemp"?
-------------------- Note: In desperate need of a cure...
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Albino_Jesus
Clearly Retarded
Registered: 09/14/02
Posts: 1,698
Loc: Construction ahead...
Last seen: 14 years, 2 months
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Re: are there morals? [Re: CleverName]
#896703 - 09/21/02 01:16 AM (21 years, 6 months ago) |
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morals don't exist, but ethics do
-------------------- The only difference between the Republican and Democratic parties is the velocities with which their knees hit the floor when corporations knock on their door. -Ralph Nader
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