Home | Community | Message Board


This site includes paid links. Please support our sponsors.


Welcome to the Shroomery Message Board! You are experiencing a small sample of what the site has to offer. Please login or register to post messages and view our exclusive members-only content. You'll gain access to additional forums, file attachments, board customizations, encrypted private messages, and much more!

Shop: Myyco.com Golden Teacher Liquid Culture For Sale   Bridgetown Botanicals Bridgetown Botanicals   Kraken Kratom Red Vein Kratom

Jump to first unread post Pages: 1 | 2 | 3 | Next >  [ show all ]
Invisiblemofo
Hobby Jingoist


Registered: 04/05/08
Posts: 2,232
Loc: Donkey Kong Kill Screen
I'm voting Mickey Mouse in '08
    #8827099 - 08/25/08 08:02 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Because a vote for Mickey Mouse is a vote of NO CONFIDENCE.

I think either of the two candidates will do nothing but further damage this great country of ours, and further subvert and repeal our rights.  I mean, I watch the news almost every night, and I don't even know what either of them stand for, except for a few "hot button" issues.  The media has replaced issues with campaign strategies, and that suits the candidates and apparently most Americans just fine.  I'm sick of it.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineRebirtha
I really like bread
Male User Gallery


Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 09/22/03
Posts: 5,680
Loc: over there
Last seen: 1 month, 14 hours
Re: I'm voting Mickey Mouse in '08 [Re: mofo]
    #8827114 - 08/25/08 08:05 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Fuck Mickey Mouse, Vote Grimace


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleMinstrel
Man of Science
Male User Gallery


Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 1,974
Loc: Hogtown
Re: I'm voting Mickey Mouse in '08 *DELETED* [Re: mofo]
    #8827152 - 08/25/08 08:10 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Learn about the free state project in New Hampshire.  Spoiling your ballot as you want to do is just whining.


--------------------

Edited by Minstrel (08/25/08 08:16 PM)

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineScavengerType
Male User Gallery

Registered: 01/24/08
Posts: 5,784
Loc: The North
Last seen: 10 years, 4 months
Re: I'm voting Mickey Mouse in '08 [Re: Minstrel]
    #8827170 - 08/25/08 08:13 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

why not burn your ballot instead. That's a traditional symbolic way to protest things like that are flammable or symbolized by something flammable.


--------------------
"Have you ever seen what happens when a grenade goes off in a school? Do you really know what you’re doing when you order shock and awe? Are you prepared to kneel beside a dying soldier and tell him why he went to Iraq, or why he went to any war?"
"The things that are done in the name of the shareholder are, to me, as terrifying as the things that are done—dare I say it—in the name of God. Montesquieu said, "There have never been so many civil wars as in the Kingdom of God." And I begin to feel that’s true. The shareholder is the excuse for everything."
- Author and former M6/M5 agent John le Carré on Democracy Now.
Conquer's Club

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleDieCommie


Registered: 12/11/03
Posts: 29,258
Re: I'm voting Mickey Mouse in '08 [Re: mofo]
    #8827175 - 08/25/08 08:14 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

If you dont like the most popular two, vote for somebody else who is real.  The only reason you think you can only choose from two, is because you think you can only choose from two.  Its a collective phenomenon thats a self fulfilling prophecy.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineScavengerType
Male User Gallery

Registered: 01/24/08
Posts: 5,784
Loc: The North
Last seen: 10 years, 4 months
Re: I'm voting Mickey Mouse in '08 [Re: DieCommie]
    #8827209 - 08/25/08 08:21 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Well you could just vote a third party, if you want to quietly throw your vote away, but if you want to show people your dissatisfaction with the election and the candidates burn that fucker up.


--------------------
"Have you ever seen what happens when a grenade goes off in a school? Do you really know what you’re doing when you order shock and awe? Are you prepared to kneel beside a dying soldier and tell him why he went to Iraq, or why he went to any war?"
"The things that are done in the name of the shareholder are, to me, as terrifying as the things that are done—dare I say it—in the name of God. Montesquieu said, "There have never been so many civil wars as in the Kingdom of God." And I begin to feel that’s true. The shareholder is the excuse for everything."
- Author and former M6/M5 agent John le Carré on Democracy Now.
Conquer's Club

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleDieCommie


Registered: 12/11/03
Posts: 29,258
Re: I'm voting Mickey Mouse in '08 [Re: ScavengerType]
    #8827233 - 08/25/08 08:24 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

The big two parties dont get a tally of how many ballots were burned.  They do get a tally of how many ballots chose neither of them.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineScavengerType
Male User Gallery

Registered: 01/24/08
Posts: 5,784
Loc: The North
Last seen: 10 years, 4 months
Re: I'm voting Mickey Mouse in '08 [Re: ScavengerType]
    #8827288 - 08/25/08 08:32 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Yea but are you trying to show the candidates you don't care for them or are you trying to show other people how disaffected you are and indeed that it is ok to show how disaffected you are with the candidates. It's possible such an action would cause a few onlookers who were just going to go in and vote for whatever candidate the thought was least bad to vote for an independent candidate. But I don't think voting third party has any real tangible results. Remember when Ralph Nader ran his major campaign, getting the most votes for a third party in a while and then George Bush never did anything to protect the environment, labor or consumer safety?


--------------------
"Have you ever seen what happens when a grenade goes off in a school? Do you really know what you’re doing when you order shock and awe? Are you prepared to kneel beside a dying soldier and tell him why he went to Iraq, or why he went to any war?"
"The things that are done in the name of the shareholder are, to me, as terrifying as the things that are done—dare I say it—in the name of God. Montesquieu said, "There have never been so many civil wars as in the Kingdom of God." And I begin to feel that’s true. The shareholder is the excuse for everything."
- Author and former M6/M5 agent John le Carré on Democracy Now.
Conquer's Club

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisiblemofo
Hobby Jingoist


Registered: 04/05/08
Posts: 2,232
Loc: Donkey Kong Kill Screen
Re: I'm voting Mickey Mouse in '08 [Re: DieCommie]
    #8827360 - 08/25/08 08:43 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Hmm, burning the ballot, that is a tantalizing option I hadn't thought of.  I could picture myself walking through my voting precinct with a flaming ballot in my hand with a stone faced, dead-eyed stare.  Not exactly my style though to be honest.  Besides, I don't like that it wouldn't be counted.

I think it would be great to get all the disenfranchised to rally around one ridiculous figure so that when the final tallies come in, they're forced to report that Mickey Mouse received 2% of the vote or whatever he would get.  I picked Mickey Mouse because he's the classic joke vote, he's an obnoxious corporate trademark, and his name has come to be associated with inferior quality workmanship.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineRedstorm
Prince of Bugs
Male


Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 10/08/02
Posts: 44,175
Last seen: 4 months, 29 days
Re: I'm voting Mickey Mouse in '08 [Re: ScavengerType]
    #8827376 - 08/25/08 08:46 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

ScavengerType said:
Yea but are you trying to show the candidates you don't care for them or are you trying to show other people how disaffected you are and indeed that it is ok to show how disaffected you are with the candidates. It's possible such an action would cause a few onlookers who were just going to go in and vote for whatever candidate the thought was least bad to vote for an independent candidate. But I don't think voting third party has any real tangible results. Remember when Ralph Nader ran his major campaign, getting the most votes for a third party in a while and then George Bush never did anything to protect the environment, labor or consumer safety?




The only reason third parties don't stand a chance is because the circular logic people employ by saying that "since 3rd parties can never win, I'll never vote for them".

How much sense does that make?

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisiblejohnm214
Male User Gallery

Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 05/31/07
Posts: 17,582
Loc: Americas
Re: I'm voting Mickey Mouse in '08 [Re: DieCommie]
    #8827381 - 08/25/08 08:47 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

DieCommie said:
The big two parties dont get a tally of how many ballots were burned.  They do get a tally of how many ballots chose neither of them.





exactly mickey mouse voting, or not voting, is childish.


Accomplishes nothing.


There are not two candidates, as has been said.  I won't vote for either of the two either.  Don't like federal intervention in your life?  Taxes that take your wealth for programs you don't support?

Vote for a libertarian.  Or if you like the greens, vote them.


You think the dems/reps care if you vote for mickey mouse or some fictional candidate?  No, they don't.


You think they care if you do vote, but don't vote for them?  Yes, they do.  You then represent someone who is more educated than most, I'd reckon, and who is acutely aware of their positiions and votes against them.  You are someone that could have voted for them, if they weren't so different from who you did vote.

If libertarians got 10% of the vote they would have a huge influence.  These would be folks who would love to vote for a mainstream candidate, but won't cuz of neglect of state and individual rights.  Then the politicians could adjust their views to be more rights friendly and allow states to keep more of their own money for their own programs.  When the vote even reaches ten percent, this will be enough 'swing' voters to elect anyone who cares to adopt a few of their issues- such as being against drugs and other victimless crimes but being against federal force stopping purely intrastate matters, or against redistributing taxes of the people to fund programs that violate a state's ability to govern themselves.


We've got a bunch of roadblocks all the time ran with federal money.  You get stopped and harrased due to federal funds being available for no purpose but these sobriety checkpoints (which find far more people with drugs, for example, than they do people intoxicated).

I won't vote for the 'two' candidates, but I will vote.  And that vote will be tallied and the people will see there is one guy who won't vote against liberty.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineScavengerType
Male User Gallery

Registered: 01/24/08
Posts: 5,784
Loc: The North
Last seen: 10 years, 4 months
Re: I'm voting Mickey Mouse in '08 [Re: Redstorm]
    #8827568 - 08/25/08 09:17 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Redstorm said:
The only reason third parties don't stand a chance is because the circular logic people employ by saying that "since 3rd parties can never win, I'll never vote for them".

How much sense does that make?




It's not just a circular logic How do you create awareness of your platforms without the $$$ that comes from either being a democrat or republican. It takes a lot for any third party system to get any attention never mind be able to clearly articulate their platforms. Furthermore most contemporary politicians rely on their base and pander to relative party outsiders. How is an independent candidate going to be capable of pandering so well without the media attention that requires cash and or outrageous actions.

And johny 10% libertarian vote? Really? come on man I doubt you could get that many.


--------------------
"Have you ever seen what happens when a grenade goes off in a school? Do you really know what you’re doing when you order shock and awe? Are you prepared to kneel beside a dying soldier and tell him why he went to Iraq, or why he went to any war?"
"The things that are done in the name of the shareholder are, to me, as terrifying as the things that are done—dare I say it—in the name of God. Montesquieu said, "There have never been so many civil wars as in the Kingdom of God." And I begin to feel that’s true. The shareholder is the excuse for everything."
- Author and former M6/M5 agent John le Carré on Democracy Now.
Conquer's Club

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisiblejohnm214
Male User Gallery

Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 05/31/07
Posts: 17,582
Loc: Americas
Re: I'm voting Mickey Mouse in '08 [Re: ScavengerType]
    #8827788 - 08/25/08 09:58 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

ScavengerType said:
Quote:

Redstorm said:
The only reason third parties don't stand a chance is because the circular logic people employ by saying that "since 3rd parties can never win, I'll never vote for them".

How much sense does that make?




It's not just a circular logic How do you create awareness of your platforms without the $$$ that comes from either being a democrat or republican. It takes a lot for any third party system to get any attention never mind be able to clearly articulate their platforms. Furthermore most contemporary politicians rely on their base and pander to relative party outsiders. How is an independent candidate going to be capable of pandering so well without the media attention that requires cash and or outrageous actions.

And johny 10% libertarian vote? Really? come on man I doubt you could get that many.





maybe publish your platform?


If people gave a shit they could figure shit out for themselves, same as I did.  I've never voted for someone or became aware of them cuz of an ad.


People should look who's running and check them out.  Its even easier for third party candidates since they seem more uniform from year to year in belief than the main party candidates.  While the dems and reps are the same on high taxes and gov't spending your money to tell you what you can and cannot do, and eviscerating state control, they seem to have differnt issues/platforms every year in the wedge issues.

Course with a mainstream candidate it is next to impossible to figure out what they want to do and how, since they are so vague.  At least if they were a legislator you can look at their votes.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleSenor_Doobie
Snake Pit Champion
 User Gallery


Registered: 08/11/99
Posts: 22,678
Loc: Trump Train
Re: I'm voting Mickey Mouse in '08 [Re: johnm214]
    #8827981 - 08/25/08 10:37 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Yeah, if only Sen. Obama or Sen. McCain were legislators...


--------------------
"America: Fuck yeah!" -- Alexthegreat

“Nothing can now be believed which is seen in a newspaper. Truth itself becomes suspicious by being put into that polluted vehicle. The real extent of this state of misinformation is known only to those who are in situations to confront facts within their knowledge with the lies of the day.”  -- Thomas Jefferson

The greatest sin of mankind is ignorance.

The press takes [Trump] literally, but not seriously; his supporters take him seriously, but not literally. --Salena Zeto (9/23/16)

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineScavengerType
Male User Gallery

Registered: 01/24/08
Posts: 5,784
Loc: The North
Last seen: 10 years, 4 months
Re: I'm voting Mickey Mouse in '08 [Re: Senor_Doobie]
    #8828918 - 08/26/08 02:31 AM (15 years, 6 months ago)

nobody reads platform papers. A candidate couldn't get .5% of the vote on their published platform. In fact, looking at how often politicians dodge the obligation to make definite statements about where they stand, I don't see any evidence to suggest that one's stance is in any way beneficial toward getting votes. More often than not the thing that gets votes are endorsements from respected people or abstract comments that stoke the emotions of morons.

The changing issues are usually buzz topics that have more to do with the art of pandering and attacking your opponent's credibility. Even if your libertarian party was a main party in the running it would probibly have to do this to try to win.


--------------------
"Have you ever seen what happens when a grenade goes off in a school? Do you really know what you’re doing when you order shock and awe? Are you prepared to kneel beside a dying soldier and tell him why he went to Iraq, or why he went to any war?"
"The things that are done in the name of the shareholder are, to me, as terrifying as the things that are done—dare I say it—in the name of God. Montesquieu said, "There have never been so many civil wars as in the Kingdom of God." And I begin to feel that’s true. The shareholder is the excuse for everything."
- Author and former M6/M5 agent John le Carré on Democracy Now.
Conquer's Club

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisiblejohnm214
Male User Gallery

Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 05/31/07
Posts: 17,582
Loc: Americas
Re: I'm voting Mickey Mouse in '08 [Re: ScavengerType]
    #8828970 - 08/26/08 02:48 AM (15 years, 6 months ago)

yeah people probably don't, but they should.  As well as take a look at what the candidate has attested to believing over time and how they've performed.


I agree with you though, and think stupid sound bites as well as some social type appeal to the party and its members draws people to a candidate.  Most people I think would vote for a party irregardless so this is why third parties are important.  People don't vote on issues, they vote for the party.  Like the blacks... Never vote republican, so why care about their issues?  Same w/ alot of republican voting blocks.


I agree the libertarians would change if they got to be serious contendors, but so what?  I won't vote for em if they stop doing things I support and they no longer seem like they put out the best candidates.  I support them now, not for all time.


People should vote for the best candidate and base that off of statements and records.


LIke plato I think said, maybe kant or someone?, you should live your life as if your actions would be adopted universally.  In voting, I think that is definatly true.  You shouldn't worry about historical success or whatever, cuz your support is of that candidate, and the vote tally has nothing to do w/ history.

Like I say, when a third party or group of them has enough votes to swing elections reliably, their positions will be hugely influential.  Since the main parties are often at stalemates up to election day with a few points difference, there is no reason why this can't happen in the future... And then the main contendors will have to make compromises and they no longer get to ignore huge blocks of their supporters and take folks' votes for granted.


Maybe one day we'll have a candidate be asked about national healthcare and he'll say "why does it matter?  Why should the president have anything to do with healthcare?  If states want to have a socialist system, let them, nothing I can or should do about it"

crime:  "I don't care unless it crosses state lines or comes from another country.  I don't care if people deal drugs/kill each other in nebraska, that's not my problem.  Ask the governor/legislature of NE what they want to do, not my problem."

et cet.  How refreshing would that be?

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinezouden
Neuroscientist
Male User Gallery

Registered: 11/12/07
Posts: 7,091
Loc: Australia
Last seen: 14 years, 5 months
Re: I'm voting Mickey Mouse in '08 [Re: johnm214]
    #8829017 - 08/26/08 03:01 AM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Refreshing, yes, but such a candidate would be eaten alive. People elect their leaders to lead, not to pass the buck on important issues, even if those issues are best left to the states. I doubt we'll see a return to federalism for that reason.


--------------------
I know... that just the smallest
                                                part of the world belongs to me
You know... I'm not a blind man
                                                    but truth is the hardest thing to see

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisiblehamandcheese
Sandwich
 User Gallery

Registered: 06/02/08
Posts: 12,530
Loc: Next Level
Re: I'm voting Mickey Mouse in '08 [Re: zouden]
    #8831462 - 08/26/08 04:32 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

don't waste your vote use it. if enough people vote third party eventually some day we may be able to legitmately choose from the lesser of three evils instead of two.

the founding fathers envisioned it entirely plausible to have  five or more canidates running in an election. as i see it now only a democrat or a republican can reasonably enter office but theres no reason that cant be changed... but ya gotta start somewhere.

if a third party managed to win even one electoral vote in a modern election it would be HUGE.  maybe delaware? its only 3 countys, or wyoming no body lives there... we could all move and flood thoose booths with third party votes :wink:


--------------------

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinenumonkei
Back! From thedigestive tractof dave theiguana!

Registered: 04/12/06
Posts: 2,500
Loc: A Tree
Last seen: 7 years, 5 days
Re: I'm voting Mickey Mouse in '08 [Re: ScavengerType]
    #8831511 - 08/26/08 04:41 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

ScavengerType said:
Yea but are you trying to show the candidates you don't care for them or are you trying to show other people how disaffected you are and indeed that it is ok to show how disaffected you are with the candidates. It's possible such an action would cause a few onlookers who were just going to go in and vote for whatever candidate the thought was least bad to vote for an independent candidate. But I don't think voting third party has any real tangible results. Remember when Ralph Nader ran his major campaign, getting the most votes for a third party in a while and then George Bush never did anything to protect the environment, labor or consumer safety?





Third parties have a VERY tangible effect in the electorate. They take votes away from those who would vote for one of the established parties, thus adding to the pool for whatever other major party is running.

You take it from the inside, or wait until the body is disaffected enough to abandon the other two parties to a majority of 1/3, and only AFTER the electoral college is reformed/removed, because that is why it is put into place. To keep the odd-ball out of office.

This requires the loss of influence of the mainstream media. This requires work, and the internet is likely the biggest threat to this traditional power structure they've ever seen.

This may not be a news-item, but Obama should NEVER have made it past the presidency. The main reason he did was because the networking done online, and the appeal to younger voters who sit out the polls. Like 9/10 of my friends.

No vote is...like letting police search your car. You have the right to refuse...until you don't. You have the right to vote, whether you have faith in it or not...until you don't.

We must defend the rights we have. Otherwise, the example is taken, it's realized that we are submissive, and they are taken as convenient.

That, historically speaking, is where things get REALLY bad. There are hundreds of examples, in similar contexts.



~Monk

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinezouden
Neuroscientist
Male User Gallery

Registered: 11/12/07
Posts: 7,091
Loc: Australia
Last seen: 14 years, 5 months
Re: I'm voting Mickey Mouse in '08 [Re: mofo]
    #8831531 - 08/26/08 04:45 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

>the founding fathers envisioned it entirely plausible to have  five or more canidates running in an election.

Then they should have chosen a better electoral system. FPTP voting only allows for two parties. Condorcet knew this, and he was around the same time as the founding fathers, though in their defence Condorcet was probably only just formulating his ideas when the constitution was written, so the founding fathers chose the best system they knew of (FPTP, the British system). However it is not the best system now, and it should have been updated long ago.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Condorcet_method


--------------------
I know... that just the smallest
                                                part of the world belongs to me
You know... I'm not a blind man
                                                    but truth is the hardest thing to see

Edited by zouden (08/26/08 04:46 PM)

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Jump to top Pages: 1 | 2 | 3 | Next >  [ show all ]

Shop: Myyco.com Golden Teacher Liquid Culture For Sale   Bridgetown Botanicals Bridgetown Botanicals   Kraken Kratom Red Vein Kratom


Similar ThreadsPosterViewsRepliesLast post
* Iraq vote leaves Dems looking like the losers
( 1 2 all )
lonestar2004 2,897 24 12/20/05 07:19 PM
by downforpot
* Ron Paul has my vote
( 1 2 3 4 all )
Syle 4,663 60 06/06/12 09:38 PM
by GosuTricks
* Poll: Obama, Hillary Beat GOP in '08 lonestar2004 1,252 4 07/21/07 08:50 PM
by xFrockx
* For those who intend to vote in the upcoming elections....please reconsider
( 1 2 all )
Mark_W 3,185 23 07/08/07 09:40 PM
by Icelander
* Bush Still Fudging the Numbers on Kerry's Tax Votes fft2 727 1 08/30/04 07:59 PM
by Vvellum
* Ron Paul Presidential candidate for 08, **INFO**
( 1 2 all )
ElectricJW 4,310 35 07/17/07 02:47 PM
by zappaisgod
* None Of The Above leads GOP '08 polls ArcofaJourney 1,518 18 07/23/07 08:51 PM
by Conservationist
* Rock the Vote! Kerry is going to lose huge in this election.
( 1 2 all )
Stein 2,287 38 09/01/04 11:21 AM
by Xlea321

Extra information
You cannot start new topics / You cannot reply to topics
HTML is disabled / BBCode is enabled
Moderator: Enlil, ballsalsa
3,438 topic views. 0 members, 13 guests and 5 web crawlers are browsing this forum.
[ Show Images Only | Sort by Score | Print Topic ]
Search this thread:

Copyright 1997-2024 Mind Media. Some rights reserved.

Generated in 0.028 seconds spending 0.004 seconds on 14 queries.