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 arpnuke
Always changing
Registered: 09/11/06
Posts: 230
Last seen: 12 years, 9 months
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 "Experienced users need less of the drug to trancend the ego" 
#8728769 - 08/05/08 12:23 PM (15 years, 8 months ago) |
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I've read similar phrases on various hallucinogen dosage charts. I've tripped around 20 times on mostly mushrooms and a couple high dose (~30 HBWR strength) LSA experiences. Marijuana is really psychedelic for me in that I get the lucid, ego in the backseat, and the moment riding shotgun feeling along with tracers. I'll see smiling faces of alien-like beings and sometimes humans while looking into the darkness or a forest, tracers turning into beautiful mandala-like or floral patterns, etc. All of the visuals are definitely not there, yet still OEV with just the imaginative mind at play. Weed today is nothing like it was before I had tripped. I still have fun and get the munchies, but the ego transcendence is very similar to the feeling from mushrooms/LSA rather than "Fuuuuck dudes, lets play some video games or drive to taco bell."
Statements similar to the title do seem accurate from my experience. It's about learning how to tune in to where tripping always seems to put people during good trips. People that have also tripped seem to get closer to the ego transcendence state than those that have not. You can just see it in the face through lack of judgment, attraction, repulsion, just open observation. Anyone else notice similar phenomenon or think I'm crazy?
Now a question for the crazy diamonds that experience reduced tolerance and have wild, alive, and far-off eyes. I've never had LSD, but will be dosing soon. I've got 220mic (or just strong) blotter per perforation that should be quartered. Part of me wants to trip balls and take 250-350mics and the other part says I don't need as much to get there as others. Maybe one high dose first time followed by low doses to understand the drug?
Peace & light you guys
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 KillerPicklez
Registered: 12/13/07
Posts: 16,920
Loc: 
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 Re: "Experienced users need less of the drug to trancend the ego" [Re: arpnuke]
#8728817 - 08/05/08 12:36 PM (15 years, 8 months ago) |
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I think you are definitely able to do more with less when you are experienced and you are able to relate more of what the experience should be and what you want the outcome to be.
As far as your LSD experience I would do the exact opposite. Start with a smaller dose and once you are comfortable with that drug then step out a bit further. Just because LSD is a psychedelic like mushrooms they are both completely different substances which yeild completely unique experiences and should be treated that way!
have fun! be safe!
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SolomonTheShaman
I love to travel
Registered: 07/06/08
Posts: 211
Last seen: 14 years, 8 months
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Re: "Experienced users need less of the drug to trancend the ego" [Re: arpnuke]
#8728827 - 08/05/08 12:38 PM (15 years, 8 months ago) |
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Never done acid, but I tend to agree with your argument about marijuana and mushrooms, or any substance for that matter I suppose. After some experiences with a particular substance, I can see how it would take less of that substance to achieve the ego transcendence. Familiarity with say, the feeling or the places mushrooms take you, one may need less mushrooms to get to that state, the mind I think, can fill in the gaps maybe where some of the drug would be lacking.
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"Live as if you were to die tomorrow. Learn as if you were to live forever."
-Mohandas Gandhi
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KillerPicklez
Registered: 12/13/07
Posts: 16,920
Loc:
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Re: "Experienced users need less of the drug to trancend the ego" [Re: SolomonTheShaman]
#8728848 - 08/05/08 12:42 PM (15 years, 8 months ago) |
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Quote:
SolomonTheShaman said:
Familiarity with say, the feeling or the places mushrooms take you, one may need less mushrooms to get to that state, the mind I think, can fill in the gaps maybe where some of the drug would be lacking.
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thirdking
Plant Gnosticist
Registered: 08/05/08
Posts: 15
Last seen: 15 years, 6 months
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Re: "Experienced users need less of the drug to trancend the ego" [Re: arpnuke]
#8729061 - 08/05/08 01:27 PM (15 years, 8 months ago) |
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I'm not sure if that is true, at least with regards to cannabis. It seems that the first few times I got high, it was a really profound experience. Now it's just a good time.
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"If you take a psychedelic, and you're not afriad you did too much, you didn't do enough."
- Terence Mckenna
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deranger
Registered: 01/21/08
Posts: 6,840
Loc: off the wall
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Re: "Experienced users need less of the drug to trancend the ego" [Re: arpnuke]
#8729170 - 08/05/08 01:51 PM (15 years, 8 months ago) |
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this is true ime... enough psychedelic use will sensitize the awareness, allowing for more receptivity in the experience. this is especially true when combined with daily meditation.
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publicenemy1
Dr. Funkenstein
Registered: 11/27/07
Posts: 2,396
Loc: Cumberland Mine
Last seen: 9 years, 5 months
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Re: "Experienced users need less of the drug to trancend the ego" [Re: deranger]
#8729599 - 08/05/08 03:39 PM (15 years, 8 months ago) |
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i know from experience that experience users def need less to transcend ego. i would start smaller so you get comfortable with the drug and then try meditating while peaking or post peak, if thats your thing... if not smoke some herbs as it will definitely kick it up.
but ummmm, yeah... the more you drop, the easier to transcend ego. i think its due to being in that state so much that you know "shortcuts".
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BE HERE NOW
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Plasmid
Absent
Registered: 06/01/08
Posts: 1,719
Last seen: 15 years, 3 months
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Re: "Experienced users need less of the drug to trancend the ego" [Re: arpnuke]
#8729675 - 08/05/08 03:59 PM (15 years, 8 months ago) |
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Well, you may've seen my posts where I say that ego death is not possible to experience and whatnot, so I'll have to be clear what I'm referring to here. I also do not believe that it is possible to experience 'complete' ego transcendence.
Instead of "ego transcendence," I will talk about "ego disruption" which refers to a profound and substantial change and reshaping of how one perceives one's self. This does not necessarily need to involve delusion changes in ego, such as one experiencing themselves as a cat. This refers to changes in how one understands their relationship to any one or more of the following: their mind and body, their family and friends, civilization, society, God / divine beings, physical reality, etc.
I genuinely think that, generally, it is more difficult for experienced psychedelic users to undergo ego disruption.* This is because experienced users will have some idea of how a psychedelic drug can confront them. Ego disruption is a process of new perceptions of one's self arising to challenge, refute and reshape the former understanding of one's own being. Experience with psychedelics allows one to develop defensive mechanisms against ego disruption. Such defensive mechanisms may merely involve denial, distortion, rationalization, dissociation, repression, etc.
For example:
Denial could involve thinking to one's self that "this always happens with psychedelics, just ignore it, it's not true.")
Distortion is easier for an experienced user to use than for an inexperienced person. A distortion with a psychedelic could involve changing one's environment in order to bring about a perceptual change. For example, a person who is challenged with feelings of being selfish could take a look at their blood donor card (that's a simple example I just thought off the top of my head).
Rationalization is a more direct manner of refuting the challenging new perception of self using argumentation to dispute the basis or implication of the perception.
Dissociation fragments mental processes. A user may accept the ego disruption as a temporary part of one's person while under the influence of psychedelics, while dissociating the sober identity. Dissociation could also involve compartmentalizing ego disruption to the point that the challenge seems directed at another entity (could be coupled with projection). Repression can also fit under dissociation if it is severe enough.
I think that the ego has strong defensive mechanisms that can easily become accustomed to even very powerful psychedelic experiences and that more experiences simply make it far more difficult for the drug to genuinely disrupt, challenge and reshape the ego.
* - this is partly why people may experience a psychedelic 'losing its magic' after a number of experiences.
Quote:
You can just see it in the face through lack of judgment, attraction, repulsion, just open observation. Anyone else notice similar phenomenon or think I'm crazy?
No, I don't think you're crazy, but I think you're wrong. I think that it's the first time trippers who are likely to experience the strongest form of ego disruption that they'll ever experience. I also just think that many people are too biased towards thinking that ego disruption is an inherently beneficial process and hence want to believe that they're good at it (which is really just another way of inflating one's own ego).
Quote:
Maybe one high dose first time followed by low doses to understand the drug?
Seeing as I don't remotely accept that you possibly know the amount of LSD on your blotter (220 micrograms? No, I think it's 222.455 micrograms), I'd just go for it and take it all, but it's up to you.
Others:
Quote:
Just because LSD is a psychedelic like mushrooms they are both completely different substances which yeild completely unique experiences and should be treated that way!
This is something that I may be relatively notorious for completely disagreeing with, though you may now respond very differently to LSD just because of the power of suggestion. I personally see very little difference between psilocin and LSD (which isn't to say that I see no major differences; there are some big differences and a number of small differences - it's just that I think they're FAR FAR FAR more similar than different). Some have suggested that I don't notice the differences because I am too stupid to see them, so if you're as stupid as I am, then don't go into the experience looking for differences or expecting anything. Just go with it. (But yes, seriously, one person has blatantly said that intelligence has to do with how you perceive these drugs and since I don't see the differences, I'm stupid - which I think is really just a circular argument and it pisses me off that people not only don't want to listen to what I experience but want to flat out deny that my perceptions are even possible).
Edited by Plasmid (08/05/08 04:10 PM)
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Tennessee Jed
Psychonaut
Registered: 07/06/08
Posts: 1
Loc: Tennessee
Last seen: 14 years, 5 months
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Re: "Experienced users need less of the drug to trancend the ego" [Re: Plasmid]
#8730174 - 08/05/08 05:50 PM (15 years, 8 months ago) |
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I've actually found the opposite is true. It takes a lot more dose or mush to take me to the same places a smaller one would have maybe a year ago. I have to be more than just really tripped out to experience ego-death.
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