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OfflineHankHill
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I am confused about birthing
    #7440124 - 09/22/07 11:14 AM (16 years, 5 months ago)

I have 3 jars that are now fully colonized or at least 99% colonized, all surface area is covered.

The rest are well on their way, perhaps max of 4 days they will be, I'm betting sooner.

So, what do I do with these jars? I thought you let them sit there (they are verm/BRF) until mushrooms start growing in them, then you rinse them off and soak for 24 hours, and put in the fruiting chamber, dunk and roll, etc.

Someone said that this doesn't happen, at least that was my understanding, that once they are fully colonized you wait about 5 days and then you dunk and roll, the waiting is to ensure full solidification of the mycelium.

Now, what if I want to case? Is it okay to just case one or two of my batch to get an understanding of how it works, and fruit the rest? Will those pose any contamination issues?

For instance there are a few cakes that some of the uncolonized verm is so wet that I feel like breaking that off and casing these rather than waiting to see if this tiny portion gets colonized.

But when you case, do you put the casing tray IN the fruiting chamber along with all the other cakes? If the casing messes up will this compromise the others?

I'm a bit unsure, are you supposed to wrap the casing with saran wrap until mycelium pins, then take it off and put it in the chamber? Before it pins do you just stick it anywhere you want, like in the closet by the jars.

If you case do you have to wait the 5 or so days after full colonization, or can you crumble right as soon as they are fully colonized?

Do I need to sterilize my fruiting chamber before I prepare it?



also one jar has this fugly little circle circled in red, and I'm not sure what it is, it's a slight yellowish tint to a degree, and its been there forever.

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Offlinepeaceandlove
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Re: I am confused about birthing [Re: HankHill]
    #7440147 - 09/22/07 11:20 AM (16 years, 5 months ago)

Still a newb here but this would be my advice.

If you're birthing the cakes make sure they are all colonized 100%. if not leave them til they absolutly are or you will probably get a contam on that 95% colonized cake you worked so hard for. (Happened to me) If they really haven't grown anymore myc in like 2 weeks maybe you should birth and cut off the uncolonized part, crumble and case.

As for birthing the cakes, just fill up those half pint jars with water and put them all in the fride overnight for a dunk. Then sprinkle on some vermiculite, shake off the extra and throw it into the FC. Goodluck xD


--------------------
"For the Horde!"

Edited by peaceandlove (09/22/07 11:21 AM)

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OfflineHankHill
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Re: I am confused about birthing [Re: peaceandlove]
    #7440184 - 09/22/07 11:30 AM (16 years, 5 months ago)

fill the jars with water without taking the cakes out?

is there a reason to do this over the way illustrated in RR's videos?

i ought to wait 2 weeks right now from this point even though 3 are already fully colonized? This is a bit long, its been 3 weeks since inoculation.....

I heard 5 days was more appropriate?

Do the jars begin to grow mushrooms in them on their own without my meddling?

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OfflineanarchOi
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Re: I am confused about birthing [Re: HankHill]
    #7440283 - 09/22/07 11:57 AM (16 years, 5 months ago)

if you want to fruit the cakes themselves, you should wait atleast a day after fully colonized, then simply just birth them and put them in your terrarium

if you want to case some cakes, birth them into a brand new ziplock bag, then squeeze most of the extra air out and crush up the cake until it's a fine but still slightly chunky mess

then put that in your tray and case it, make sure it's got plenty of water, the un-dunked cake will suck up most of the excess, assuming you use sterile technique there shouldn't be a contam problem


--------------------

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OfflineHankHill
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Re: I am confused about birthing [Re: anarchOi]
    #7443724 - 09/23/07 10:54 AM (16 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

anarchOi said:
if you want to fruit the cakes themselves, you should wait atleast a day after fully colonized, then simply just birth them and put them in your terrarium

if you want to case some cakes, birth them into a brand new ziplock bag, then squeeze most of the extra air out and crush up the cake until it's a fine but still slightly chunky mess

then put that in your tray and case it, make sure it's got plenty of water, the un-dunked cake will suck up most of the excess, assuming you use sterile technique there shouldn't be a contam problem



my baking tray is really giant, do people put more than one cake in a casing tray?

i am speculating it could hold perhaps 2 or 3, but am not quite sure

how do you keep the casing wet, is this what the perlite in the fruiting chamber provides, or are we misting the top layer ?

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OfflineJack86
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Re: I am confused about birthing [Re: HankHill]
    #7443751 - 09/23/07 11:03 AM (16 years, 5 months ago)

is dunking and rolling complety ness? iv seen meny teks were it dosent mention doing so?
cheers

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Offlinejuris1
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Re: I am confused about birthing [Re: HankHill]
    #7443784 - 09/23/07 11:13 AM (16 years, 5 months ago)

Your casing layer will provide the moisture for your cased substrate because when you mixed your casing material, you should have used water in it. You want the casing material to be at field capacity, which simply means when you pick up a hand full and squeeze it, a few drops of water should drip out. You don't want it soaking wet. If you watched RR's videos on Youtube, he explained it there. You can mist the top layer of your casing if you want to.

I would recommend using more than one cake to crumble and case. I just did two cakes this way, but my tray wasn't that large. It was a round plastic container, maybe 6 inches in diameter and about three and a half inches tall. I put a layer of moist verm on the bottom. Then put my two crumbled cakes on top of that, then put my casing layer on top. Then put your aluminum foil on that and poke some holes in it and put in your closet, incubator for about 3-4 days. After about three days or so, you should see some spots of mycelium already growing. These first high spots of mycelium, should be patched. Patching means to just get some of your casing material (may have to make some more if you don't have any left over) and cover those high spots of mycelium. The reason you do this is to ensure that you get even growth of the mycelium growing on top of your casing layer. Once you patch these spots, you can then place the container in your FC. Not sure of your FC setup, but if you have perlite in the bottom, that will help with your RH. However, the casing layer will probably provide the humidity due to the water/moisture in it. It's ok to have RH in the upper 90's while pinning (or waiting on pinning), but from what i've read on here, you want your RH to be around 85-90% while they are growing.

Go read Hyphae's "A Perfect Pinning Strategy: Getting the Most Out of Your Pins"
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/3290155/an/0/page/0

Also read this tek: 50/50+
https://www.shroomery.org/54/50-50-Casing-Tek

These two should tell you everything you need to know! They are great.


--------------------
"In Vino Veritas"

Mycology (from the Greek μύκης, meaning "fungus") is the study of fungi, their genetic and biochemical properties, their taxonomy, and their use to humans as a source for tinder, medicinals (e.g., penicillin), food (e.g., beer, wine, cheese, edible mushrooms) and entheogens, as well as their dangers, such as poisoning or infection.


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OfflineHankHill
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Re: I am confused about birthing [Re: HankHill]
    #7443819 - 09/23/07 11:29 AM (16 years, 5 months ago)

i just rinsed 3 cakes that looked quite colonized, but the rinsing process makes them look a lot less full of mycelium now, i can clearly see the verm beneath a smaller layer of mycelium uniformly around the cake

is this normal? i am about to look at the videos and see what his look like

my jars don't look nearly as full as his,
will they continue to grow in the fruiting chamber ?
did i mess something up?
its been at least 1 day since full colonization for some and 2-3 days for others. but the video says to wait a week.... oops?.

juris1S thank you,
if i were to case i was planning on just using vermiculite for everything, will this work or is it better to go get better ingredients, which i can do

i don't think i'm going to case these 3 cakes at least,

which videos does RR explain casing in, i have watched 'lets grow mushrooms' several times and i do not recall any such thing.

Edited by HankHill (09/23/07 11:40 AM)

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OfflineHankHill
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Re: I am confused about birthing [Re: HankHill]
    #7446684 - 09/24/07 06:02 AM (16 years, 5 months ago)

I am going to put these 3 jars into the FC today.

Will they be okay and catch up on any more growth that they may need to do?

I am going to wait until Friday or so to birth the other fully colonized cakes. (which aren't quite fully colonized yet i don't think, so maybe sat-sun-mon)

could this create any conceivable issues?

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Offlinejuris1
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Re: I am confused about birthing [Re: HankHill]
    #7446846 - 09/24/07 08:10 AM (16 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

HankHill said:
i just rinsed 3 cakes that looked quite colonized, but the rinsing process makes them look a lot less full of mycelium now, i can clearly see the verm beneath a smaller layer of mycelium uniformly around the cake

is this normal? i am about to look at the videos and see what his look like

**It's ok to see the the verm a little through the mycelium. However, as you mentioned, you may have birthed a little early. The whole reason for waiting a week after full colonization is for the mycelium to get a good foothold on the substrate. As long as your jars were 100% when you birthed you will be ok. Also, if you haven't done so, make sure and dunk your cakes overnight (24hrs) to hydrate your cakes before putting into your FC.

my jars don't look nearly as full as his,
will they continue to grow in the fruiting chamber ?
did i mess something up?

**Well, are you using the same size jars he is in the video. He is using the short 1/2pt jars. Also, he is using a different species than what you are probably using. He was growing edibles in that video. That may be a reason that his look a little different than yours. I used the tall tapered 1/2pt jars, and mine are pinning as we speak. You'll be fine. Also, after you birth your cakes, dunk them overnight, and then roll them in dry verm (you may want to put your verm in the oven for 25min @ 350 - to help rid any contams, but not necessary). After you place them in the FC, with the verm on the outside, wait about 30 min then go back and spray/mist your cakes. This verm will act as a casing layer to help give your cakes more moisture. So, to finally answer your question, your cakes will continue to grow mycelium in the FC, considering all things go right. You should see some growth w/in 3-4 days. The myc will start to cover the verm and you should see knots start to form soon thereafter. IMPORTANT: Make sure you fan several times a day. I almost made a mistake and ruined my cakes b/c I didn't get enough FAE for the first few days. Luckily, I got it under control before they went bad! It's better to fan too much than not enough. If you don't, CO2 build up will cause your mycelium to get puffy, like little cotton balls. Sorry for the ramble...


its been at least 1 day since full colonization for some and 2-3 days for others. but the video says to wait a week.... oops?.

**Like I said above, it's best to wait a week after full colonization, but 4-5 days will be ok. If you don't wait a week, and birth right away, the cakes are just gonna sit in the FC for a week anyways while the myc takes over the substrate. Might as well just let them do it in the jar to help reduce risk of contams! Also, if you plan on casing any of your cakes by doing the crumble and case method, you don't have to let them sit in the jar for  a week after full colonization. Once they are 100%, birth them into a ziplock baggy, and then crumble them up real good. Some people let the crumbled cakes stay in the bag overnight to let the myc recover, but it's not necessary. I didn't do that and mine are doing great.

juris1S thank you,
if i were to case i was planning on just using vermiculite for everything, will this work or is it better to go get better ingredients, which i can do

**I wouln't recommend using plain verm for your casing. Did you read the two links I showed you in my earlier post? Just follow the 50/50 casing tek. Peat moss and verm shouldn't be hard to find. For my casings that I just did (first time ever), I used MGMC, verm, hydrated lime, and gypsum. MGMC=Miracle Grow Moisture Control. The "+" ingredients aren't necessary(hyd lime, gypsum). Just read those two teks, and it will tell you everything you need to know!!! Do it. Read it. I promise it's good stuff! :thumbup:  Also, if you want, you can add a layer of moist verm or even a layer of 50/50 on the bottom of your casing tray. Then put your crumbled cakes and then your casing material.... It's all in the articles/posts


i don't think i'm going to case these 3 cakes at least,

which videos does RR explain casing in, i have watched 'lets grow mushrooms' several times and i do not recall any such thing.

**Unless RR has put some more videos on Youtube, the casing tek is on the 2dvd set that he sells. I would strongly recommend buying that dvd set. There's a $10 discount for Shroomery members. I've learned so much from them. They talk about the pf tek, casings, grains, cloning, making prints/syringes, using agar, etc.... So much stuff. Just do a search on Youtube for MushroomsRR, I think that's RR's screen name for Youtube. Or, just search "Let's Grow Mushrooms" and see what comes up.





--------------------
"In Vino Veritas"

Mycology (from the Greek μύκης, meaning "fungus") is the study of fungi, their genetic and biochemical properties, their taxonomy, and their use to humans as a source for tinder, medicinals (e.g., penicillin), food (e.g., beer, wine, cheese, edible mushrooms) and entheogens, as well as their dangers, such as poisoning or infection.


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OfflineHankHill
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Last seen: 16 years, 3 months
Re: I am confused about birthing [Re: juris1]
    #7448158 - 09/24/07 03:45 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

edit: one of my jars sprouted a tiny mushroom.
do you discard these when you rinse it off, do you leave them attached
can you eat them?


thanks for all the help!

you might note all your responses are within a giant quote box

i am preparing the verm in oven for the rolling as we speak, they have soaked for 24 + hours

no i didn't read the casing links.

is the yield worth the extra risk of contam ? I know it is worth the extra effort.

i should have 7 or so cakes fruiting and I'd imagine, even if PF has a relatively low yield, this will be more tripping than I can do for a period of time, and I could do casing on my 2nd grow,

is this so? wagering each cake out to give me at least 3 grams or so?

the only question with casing, lets say the casing gets messed up and contams, with this pose a threat to healthy cakes that are in the same chamber

if not i will probably case a few simultaneously to experiment.

a salvia trip saturday has me wondering what in the world i'm interested in psychedelics for anyway

i am more inclined to have fun than to speak to extra dimensional beings, as benevolent as they are, Buddhas they were..... its a bit much for the noggin!

(and I am one of them)

Edited by HankHill (09/24/07 04:01 PM)

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Offlineveda_sticks
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Re: I am confused about birthing [Re: HankHill]
    #7448332 - 09/24/07 04:48 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

http://deoxy.org/8circuit.htm

i dont belive wot i just done, i typed a very large post rpelying to several points in ur post and i feckin stupidly done a search to fine the link i posted above, and now i have lost the entire post.

im not typing it again, in short salvia is very different to any other phycodelic, it comes on very fast and strong, and even threshold effects (salvia gravity) can be very disconcerting to some (i almost broke thru, had a very mild 1 minute trip, confusing, being in 3 different places at once, one of which was actualy from a dream from when i was younger) after that i left it alone.

while i cannot disagree with the occasional use of drugs for a bit of fun, there are much better uses that it can be put to.

My boss who is very experienced in pretty much most drugs (who runs his own company) when i told him i was growing sh rooms, he said to me. Do not take it all the time!!! only take it when u want to go somewhere!!!!! Trust me, i know plenty of people who are casualty's of psychedelics

Anyway, read this article, u may not understand it and it may be a little "heavy" (i have read it twice so far and still do not completely understand it) but it may give u some understanding on what discus ions have being going on about consciousness and the development of it. Of coarse its all theory and as far as i know has not been totally proven, but it gives u something to think about.

However, do not take this as an excuse to try and reach a particular ciruit of consciousness just by taking a particular drug.!!


--------------------

PF TEK - writeup by EvilMushroom666
Lets Grow Mushrooms - RogerRabbit & RoadKills website with sample videos plus the full PF TEK video series. Alot of great information - BUY THE DVD
Cakes can and will pin! - So you think cakes suck for pins. Your wrong
Franks Simple Coir/Verm Tek
Franks Proper Pasturisation Tek
Franks Spawning To Bulk - Monotub
Professor Pinheads RTV Injection Port Tek
Foo Mans No Soak WBS Prep Tek

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OfflineHankHill
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Re: I am confused about birthing [Re: veda_sticks]
    #7449335 - 09/24/07 09:11 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

thank you for that link

this is quite fascinating and quite true

so here is something:

my cakes smell strongly like wine, but i don't see how they would be contaminated

they are sitting in the chamber

looking at the ones still in jars i'm wondering if i have the so called 'myc-piss' there are little splotches here and there but they don't look anything like any form of mold whatsoever

some of the cakes smelled mushroomy and some a bit like wine

is this something to fret over?

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