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OfflineRhizoid
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8th flush with verm-only casing...
    #6970006 - 05/26/07 03:18 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

Maybe pure vermiculite isn't the optimal casing choice, but it does have one big advantage: it can never get contaminated.

I call this the "Reinheitsgebot tek". The ingredients are: psilocybe cubensis spores, rye, water, vermiculite. That's all!



The picture above shows the 8th flush. Fruiting chamber was a 2 liter plastic bag.

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Offlinexaxphaanes
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Re: 8th flush with verm-only casing... [Re: Rhizoid]
    #6970009 - 05/26/07 03:19 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

wow that thing is fukin small


--------------------
"Anything i say is fictional"
  what you should look for in manure

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Invisiblemyndreach
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Re: 8th flush with verm-only casing... [Re: Rhizoid]
    #6970025 - 05/26/07 03:26 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Rhizoid said:
it does have one big advantage: it can never get contaminated.





You've just hit on something big man...next time this is the method SWIM will use.

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Offlinexaxphaanes
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Re: 8th flush with verm-only casing... [Re: myndreach]
    #6970028 - 05/26/07 03:27 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

myndreach said:
Quote:

Rhizoid said:
it does have one big advantage: it can never get contaminated.





You've just hit on something big man...next time this is the method SWIM will use.





that isnt really true the substrate can still get contaminated


--------------------
"Anything i say is fictional"
  what you should look for in manure

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OfflineRhizoid
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Re: 8th flush with verm-only casing... [Re: xaxphaanes]
    #6970073 - 05/26/07 03:44 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

xaxphaanes said:
wow that thing is fukin small



Yup, it's a micro-grow. It produces more than I can handle though, so it's good enough for me. And I think the micro-grow niche has been sort of neglected here lately.

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OfflineRhizoid
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Re: 8th flush with verm-only casing... [Re: xaxphaanes]
    #6970095 - 05/26/07 03:58 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

xaxphaanes said:that isnt really true the substrate can still get contaminated



True, the substrate can get contaminated, but this has never been a problem for me with cubes on rye as long as the jars colonized without problems.

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Invisiblemyndreach
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Re: 8th flush with verm-only casing... [Re: xaxphaanes]
    #6970135 - 05/26/07 04:19 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

xaxphaanes said:
Quote:

myndreach said:
Quote:

Rhizoid said:
it does have one big advantage: it can never get contaminated.





You've just hit on something big man...next time this is the method SWIM will use.





that isnt really true the substrate can still get contaminated




well yeah but that won't happen with a fully colonized substrate...not until at least many flushes in when the myc gets weak

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Offlinexaxphaanes
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Re: 8th flush with verm-only casing... [Re: myndreach]
    #6970306 - 05/26/07 05:29 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

myndreach said:
Quote:

xaxphaanes said:
Quote:

myndreach said:
Quote:

Rhizoid said:
it does have one big advantage: it can never get contaminated.





You've just hit on something big man...next time this is the method SWIM will use.





that isnt really true the substrate can still get contaminated




well yeah but that won't happen with a fully colonized substrate...not until at least many flushes in when the myc gets weak




i dont see how this is any diffrent with any other method on these boards a verm casing is a very poor casing to begin with since it doesnt hold an optimal microclimate for mycelium growth/pin formation you still have to pasterize the verm just like you would for peat/verm so i dont see the point in using verm and verm can contaminate just like anything else that is moist


--------------------
"Anything i say is fictional"
  what you should look for in manure

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Invisiblemyndreach
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Re: 8th flush with verm-only casing... [Re: xaxphaanes]
    #6970385 - 05/26/07 06:18 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

well it's not a biological material, it's mineral...that's why i think it won't

the first grow SWIM ever did was from a growkit from amsterdam...it was the best grow bar none since...that was a pure verm casing.

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Offlinexaxphaanes
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Re: 8th flush with verm-only casing... [Re: myndreach]
    #6970416 - 05/26/07 06:29 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

like stated before it can work just far from optimal and this wouldnt even be the 100th or even 1000th time someone has done this nothing new about this method and nothing special about it you will get way better reaults from a 50/50 method just my experience in this matter and other old hands that have commented on this before in the past


--------------------
"Anything i say is fictional"
  what you should look for in manure

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Offlineatomic1
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Re: 8th flush with verm-only casing... [Re: xaxphaanes]
    #6970463 - 05/26/07 06:45 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

xaxphaanes said:
like stated before it can work just far from optimal and this wouldnt even be the 100th or even 1000th time someone has done this nothing new about this method and nothing special about it you will get way better reaults from a 50/50 method just my experience in this matter and other old hands that have commented on this before in the past


:yesnod:
Not trying rain on anyones parade but its true.

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Offlinegerbletits
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Re: 8th flush with verm-only casing... [Re: atomic1]
    #6970498 - 05/26/07 06:52 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

has anyone ever noticed that xaxphaanes never has anything nice to say? i bet 750 of your total posts are bashing other peoples ideas and grows, not to mention half the shit you say is wrong. have you ever gotten 8 flushes from one pan??? i doubt it, and still you bash him, saying your way is better....

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Invisiblemyndreach
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Re: 8th flush with verm-only casing... [Re: gerbletits]
    #6970504 - 05/26/07 06:54 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

xax had some useful info on a post of mine last week, but yeah i've noticed it's 95% negative

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InvisibleLayYouIn
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Re: 8th flush with verm-only casing... [Re: myndreach]
    #6970527 - 05/26/07 07:00 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

myndreach said:
Quote:

Rhizoid said:
it does have one big advantage: it can never get contaminated.





You've just hit on something big man...next time this is the method SWIM will use.




i thought this was all known for a long time.

all i use is vermiculite for my casings, but they can still get contaminated, since the mycelium will grow through, and that's what can get contaminated.  the reason i choose to only use vermiculite is because i already have it on hand and i like to keep it all simple.

2 half pint BRF/VERM jars, crumbled, then vermiculite sprinkled over...





:thumbup:

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Offlinexaxphaanes
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Re: 8th flush with verm-only casing... [Re: gerbletits]
    #6970530 - 05/26/07 07:01 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

for one this isn't my way but many many many many many mycologists way i.e Stamets also has a similar casing recipe i am not trying to bash anyone i learn from the old hands and use there methods that are working and have worked for years sorry if i seemed rude or what not but when you see a post like this every week it is pretty ridiculous when all they had to do is use the search function and find out the same information,also i would like for you to show me were my information has been wrong and if it is wrong we are all still learning something new everyday one method a year ago is found to be wrong this year and then this year a new method will come out and be disproved next year happens allot in mycology.but if you can pm me the links of were misinformation is i would be happy to correct it.


--------------------
"Anything i say is fictional"
  what you should look for in manure

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OfflineCaptainLinger
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Re: 8th flush with verm-only casing... [Re: xaxphaanes]
    #6970601 - 05/26/07 07:18 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

Well I hardly think it warrants getting pissed over. There are always going to be jackasses asking about casings without reading google/search. This was just some guy not inciting other people to change, just broadcasting a pretty spiffy yield.

And yes, vermiculite is less likely (not impossible) to be contaminated. It's the upside to a lot of down sides, which we all can read about on the archives.

Anyhow getting militant over 50% of the makeup of one's casing is a bit silly. They both work quite well.

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Offlinefiggusfiddus
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Re: 8th flush with verm-only casing... [Re: CaptainLinger]
    #6970729 - 05/26/07 07:52 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

I had really good results with my first casing ever, which was pure verm. It was birthed almost two months ago, and still sprouts a fruit now and then. It has experienced no contamination whatsoever, even though it's more or less spent, and even though it sat in a greenhouse with actively sporulating trich for about two days (!!). Here are the specifics:

One 10oz PF cake, B+ strain. Broken and crumbled in nickel-sized pieces over verm, with moist verm layer spread on top, which it was allowed to colonize for four days. Couldn't really tell when it was done colonizing except by feeling the texture of the material with a clean fork; it's hard to tell when verm is done colonizing since it doesn't noticeably change color. First flush was seven dry grams. Next flush was three dry grams. Subsequent flushes have been about .5g to 1g. I can't really call it flushing any more when it fruits, since it tends to be irregular and to involve one or two mushrooms, but technically it's well past its eighth flush, and the only problem I've seen is some minor bacterial growth where I missed dead pins. A spray of peroxide and a dunk/flush cleared that up, and I just picked two more (admittedly scrawny) fruits off it yesterday.

I don't get quarter-ounce first flushes from my cakes, and I don't think most people would get better than that even if they'd cased with 50/50, considering the small amount of substrate (10oz BRF, as I said). I really don't see what's so bad about pure verm, and I think I'm going back to it when my next batch of straw is colonized. Maybe I'll change my mind with experimentation with 50/50, but I simply don't see the benefit from the added risk of adding organic material to my casing. Cubes don't require microbes to pin, and in my (limited) experience, at least my type (in terms of coarsity, resulting fluffiness, etc) of verm produces good pinning conditions.


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FGSFDSFGSFDSFGSFDSFGSFDSFGSFDS
FGSFDSFGSFDSFGSFDSFGSFDSFGSFDS
FGSFDSFGSFDSFGSFDSFGSFDSFGSFDS

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Invisiblemyndreach
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Re: 8th flush with verm-only casing... [Re: figgusfiddus]
    #6970875 - 05/26/07 08:30 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

10oz. pf cake? i oz. = .6 pints, so that's 6 pints of cake material...that's 12 1/2 pint jars...how did you get ONE cake that big?

Edited by myndreach (05/26/07 08:31 PM)

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Invisiblemyndreach
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Re: 8th flush with verm-only casing... [Re: myndreach]
    #6970877 - 05/26/07 08:31 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

maybe it's cos of my mood, but im lost lol :P

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Offlinefiggusfiddus
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Re: 8th flush with verm-only casing... [Re: myndreach]
    #6970891 - 05/26/07 08:35 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

You're very lost, and I have no idea what screwed up your math! A half pint is eight ounces. Meaning this was very slightly (25%) more than a half pint cake. How did you imagine that a fluid ounce is more than a half-pint?


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FGSFDSFGSFDSFGSFDSFGSFDSFGSFDS
FGSFDSFGSFDSFGSFDSFGSFDSFGSFDS
FGSFDSFGSFDSFGSFDSFGSFDSFGSFDS

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