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Offlinelonestar2004
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Democrats Drop Troop Pullout Dates From Iraq Bill
    #6956067 - 05/23/07 10:08 AM (16 years, 10 months ago)

WASHINGTON, May 22 — Congressional Democrats relented today on their insistence that a war spending measure sought by President Bush also set a date for withdrawing troops from Iraq. The decision to back down, described by senior lawmakers and aides, was a wrenching reversal for some Democrats, who saw their election triumph as a call to force an end to the war. A Democratic effort to include timelines prompted Mr. Bush’s veto of the original bill last month, producing a political impasse.

“We don’t have a veto-proof Congress,” said Senator Harry Reid of Nevada, the majority leader.

Representative Steny H. Hoyer of Maryland, the House Democratic majority leader, said the new bill was still being assembled, but he acknowledged the political reality facing Democrats. “The president has made it very clear that he is not going to sign timelines,” said Mr. Hoyer. “We can’t pass timelines over his veto.”

The concession to the president was proving so difficult for the Democratic leadership that by this afternoon, the lawmakers had not yet publicly acknowledged that the timelines would disappear. House Democrats were preparing to advance two separate measures, to enable antiwar lawmakers to support popular domestic spending but not the money for the war. House Democrats were to review the proposal later this evening, but lawmakers were already predicting that many would not support the war spending.

Under the new plan approved by Democratic leaders, Congress would send Mr. Bush the money for the war and include a series of benchmarks that attracted 52 votes in the Senate last week. The Iraqi government could lose some foreign aid if it fails to show sufficient progress but the president would be given the authority to suspend any penalties.

The agreement with the White House and Republicans would be tied to approval of as much as $20 billion in domestic spending sought by Democrats, as well as an increase in the minimum wage. Republican leaders said that would be hard for some lawmakers in their party to accept, but that they would probably allow it in exchange for the war spending.

The Democratic leaders’ concession infuriated one of their own, Senator Russell D. Feingold of Wisconsin, who failed last week in his attempt to win passage of a measure that would have cut off money for the war next spring.

“I cannot support a bill that contains nothing more than toothless benchmarks and that allows the president to continue what may be the greatest foreign policy blunder in our nation’s history,” he said. “There has been a lot of tough talk from members of Congress about wanting to end this war, but it looks like the desire for political comfort won out over real action. Congress should have stood strong, acknowledged the will of the American people, and insisted on a bill requiring a real change of course in Iraq.”



http://www.nytimes.com/2007/05/22/washington/22cnd-cong.html?ei=5065&en=2d27446ebbab5252&ex=1180497600&adxnnl=1&partner=MYWAY&pagewanted=print&adxnnlx=1179936004-Nj731Js6wt6dLxJ4F/VMOA

"The Iraqi government could lose some foreign aid if it fails to show sufficient progress but the president would be given the authority to suspend any penalties.”

:rofl2: :rofl2:  :rofl2:  :rofl2:  :rofl2:  :rofl2:


Democrats Drop Troop Pullout Dates From Iraq Bill

But they still have them dates on their calenders......


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America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama

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OfflineRedstorm
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Re: Democrats Drop Troop Pullout Dates From Iraq Bill [Re: lonestar2004]
    #6956107 - 05/23/07 10:18 AM (16 years, 10 months ago)

What pussies the Dems are.

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InvisibleAlteredAgain
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Re: Democrats Drop Troop Pullout Dates From Iraq Bill [Re: Redstorm]
    #6956283 - 05/23/07 11:16 AM (16 years, 10 months ago)

no surprise, they're only playing their part of the play.:pinkelephant:


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Offlinegluke bastid
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Re: Democrats Drop Troop Pullout Dates From Iraq Bill [Re: Redstorm]
    #6956391 - 05/23/07 11:47 AM (16 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Redstorm said:
What pussies the Dems are.




This is a new low. I hate this bullshit. :crankey:


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:hst:
Society in every form is a blessing,
but government at its best is but a necessary evil
 
- Thomas Paine

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Offlinededjam
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Re: Democrats Drop Troop Pullout Dates From Iraq Bill [Re: AlteredAgain]
    #6956504 - 05/23/07 12:16 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

AlteredAgain said:
no surprise, they're only playing their part of the play.:pinkelephant: 




so true

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Offlinegluke bastid
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Re: Democrats Drop Troop Pullout Dates From Iraq Bill [Re: dedjam]
    #6956642 - 05/23/07 12:42 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

gopenguins said:
Quote:

AlteredAgain said:
no surprise, they're only playing their part of the play.:pinkelephant: 




so true




Well then does anyone have any productive suggestions for how we go about getting our soldiers and time and money out of Iraq?


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:hst:
Society in every form is a blessing,
but government at its best is but a necessary evil
 
- Thomas Paine

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Invisiblezorbman
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Re: Democrats Drop Troop Pullout Dates From Iraq Bill [Re: gluke bastid]
    #6956695 - 05/23/07 12:55 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

They don't have the votes to overide a Presedential veto so I'm not sure what people expect them to do.

If they stonewall then the troops won't get funded and that would be political suicide.

I imagine they are going to keep reintroducing the bill and it will gain support each time until a veto-proof majority passes it.

Or "Shove it down his throat" as Biden said.


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“The crisis takes a much longer time coming than you think, and then it happens much faster than you would have thought.”  -- Rudiger Dornbusch

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Offlinededjam
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Re: Democrats Drop Troop Pullout Dates From Iraq Bill [Re: gluke bastid]
    #6956762 - 05/23/07 01:10 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

gluke bastid said:

Well then does anyone have any productive suggestions for how we go about getting our soldiers and time and money out of Iraq?




vote Ron Paul in 2008

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Offlinegluke bastid
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Re: Democrats Drop Troop Pullout Dates From Iraq Bill [Re: dedjam]
    #6956790 - 05/23/07 01:16 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

gopenguins said:
Quote:

gluke bastid said:

Well then does anyone have any productive suggestions for how we go about getting our soldiers and time and money out of Iraq?




vote Ron Paul in 2008




You've got to be kidding me. If the democratic party is backing down from oppossing the war, what on earth makes you think the republicans are going to let Ron Paul end the Iraq war?


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:hst:
Society in every form is a blessing,
but government at its best is but a necessary evil
 
- Thomas Paine

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InvisibleAlteredAgain
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Re: Democrats Drop Troop Pullout Dates From Iraq Bill [Re: gluke bastid]
    #6956910 - 05/23/07 01:48 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

Voting Ron Paul for president next year seems to be a smart choice if he puts the money where his mouth is.


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Offlinegluke bastid
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Re: Democrats Drop Troop Pullout Dates From Iraq Bill [Re: AlteredAgain]
    #6956925 - 05/23/07 01:51 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

It just doesn't make sense to me that a party that has wholely embraced neo-conservatism to a dogmatic degree even associates itself with someone who is so liberal. It just seems too good to be true and I smell deception. :sherlock:


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:hst:
Society in every form is a blessing,
but government at its best is but a necessary evil
 
- Thomas Paine

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InvisibleAlteredAgain
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Re: Democrats Drop Troop Pullout Dates From Iraq Bill [Re: gluke bastid]
    #6956940 - 05/23/07 01:55 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

From what i've been reading up to this point I thought it is the neo-conservative side of the Republican party who is trying to silence and censor him from the mainstream. Have I missed something? :confused:


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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: Democrats Drop Troop Pullout Dates From Iraq Bill [Re: AlteredAgain]
    #6957028 - 05/23/07 02:15 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

I am not aware of anybody trying to silence or censor Mr. Paul. He has gotten tons of free publicity, appeared in two debates and still can't draw flies.
http://www.galluppoll.com/content/?ci=27598

Rudy Giuliani 29

John McCain 23

Fred Thompson 12

Mitt Romney 8

Newt Gingrich 6

Sam Brownback 2

Tommy Thompson 1

Mike Huckabee 1

Tom Tancredo 1

George Pataki 1

Duncan Hunter *

Jim Gilmore *

Chuck Hagel *

Ron Paul 0

That's from May 16. The other darling of this community, Mike GRavel is tracking exactly the same among Democrats. Neither of them has any business taking up any more debate space. Bye.

Far be it from me to ascribe an overall intelligence to the American electorate that doesn't show any evidence of existing, but when you all glom onto such marginalized nonentities as your heroes du jour it certainly brings to mind the phrase "lunatic fringe". As in "I know you're out there." "Welcome to earth."


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Offlinelonestar2004
Live to party,work to affordit.
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Re: Democrats Drop Troop Pullout Dates From Iraq Bill [Re: zappaisgod]
    #6957125 - 05/23/07 02:38 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

Fred Thompson (12 percent) beats Ron Paul even though he has not announced his candidacy, Participated in any Debates, or raised any money$$$$$$$$  :wink:



--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama

Edited by lonestar2004 (05/23/07 03:00 PM)

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OfflineRedstorm
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Re: Democrats Drop Troop Pullout Dates From Iraq Bill [Re: zorbman]
    #6957378 - 05/23/07 03:35 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:


They don't have the votes to overide a Presedential veto so I'm not sure what people expect them to do.

If they stonewall then the troops won't get funded and that would be political suicide.




At the same time, they are endorsing a spending bill. It just has a pullout section in it. If the Republicans continue to reject it, they will be the ones who won't fund the troops.

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OfflineSneezingPenis
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Re: Democrats Drop Troop Pullout Dates From Iraq Bill [Re: AlteredAgain]
    #6957749 - 05/23/07 05:32 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

there is a play in my hometown that deals with the "what if" if women all around the world stopped putting out until the war was over.

Think about how quick the war would be over if women just banded together and withheld the pussy for one week.

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Offlinevintage_gonzo
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Re: Democrats Drop Troop Pullout Dates From Iraq Bill [Re: zappaisgod]
    #6957791 - 05/23/07 05:43 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

blah blah blah.... who gives a shit what the gallup poll says? it seems to me that your only way of telling off ron paul is by somehow showing that he is behind in some poles? when has that shown the best candidate?

and why would you label someone who supports paul the "lunatic fringe" what exactly has he said thats so whacky?

Edited by vintage_gonzo (05/23/07 05:47 PM)

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InvisibleSilversoul
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Re: Democrats Drop Troop Pullout Dates From Iraq Bill [Re: lonestar2004]
    #6958208 - 05/23/07 07:18 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

It's official: The Dems have betrayed their mandate.

This news makes me sick to my stomach. I can just see their response: "Well, we didn't want people to think we didn't support the troops!" How fucking pussified can they get? Am I deluded in thinking that America might actually vote for a party that has the balls to stick to their guns and not buckle under pressure?


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InvisibleAnnapurna1
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Re: Democrats Drop Troop Pullout Dates From Iraq Bill [Re: zorbman]
    #6958412 - 05/23/07 07:59 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

zorbman said:
They don't have the votes to overide a Presedential veto so I'm not sure what people expect them to do.

If they stonewall then the troops won't get funded and that would be political suicide.

I imagine they are going to keep reintroducing the bill and it will gain support each time until a veto-proof majority passes it.

Or "Shove it down his throat" as Biden said.




that sounds like a cop-out..and a very bad one at that...at the very least..they could have blamed king george for widthholding the funding that they passed...

in either case..unless the american ppl are willing to take matters into our own hands instead of relying on democraps (fat chance)..then its over and the neocons have won...the country will either sink into political apathy under grinding repugnican totalitarianism.. or else erupt into a nazi-like frenzy if ppl choose to be on the winning side instead...


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"anchor blocks counteract the process of pontiprobation..while omalean globes regulize the pressure"...

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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: Democrats Drop Troop Pullout Dates From Iraq Bill [Re: vintage_gonzo]
    #6958533 - 05/23/07 08:19 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

vintage_gonzo said:
blah blah blah.... who gives a shit what the gallup poll says? it seems to me that your only way of telling off ron paul is by somehow showing that he is behind in some poles? when has that shown the best candidate?




Please pay attention. My only point about the polls was in response to AlteredAgain's assertion that someone was trying to silence and censor him. I can only assume that has something to do with his imminent exclusion from any more debates. The man has gotten far more coverage than he deserved already. If you had read my entire post wherein I express a general disdain for the general intelligence of the mob it is nonetheless the mob which will choose the next president and giving this asshat any more space detracts from the more serious debates.
Quote:





and why would you label someone who supports paul the "lunatic fringe" what exactly has he said thats so whacky?




This is probably the third thread about Paul. Check some of the others if you're that interested, I get sick of repeating myself.


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