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OfflineSuchSmartMonkeys
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problems possibly? jars slowed down or stopped?
    #6858803 - 05/01/07 03:31 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

okay, this is my first time growing mushies. I currently have 4 jars of P. ostreatus and 4 jars of H. erinaceus growing on rye grain (used RRs rye preparation tek). I got my syringes from spore works, they gave me live culture syringes. After sterilization and the whole like, I injected each one of the jars with about 1.5 CCs of the culture fluid on 4/20. Since then, they have been inside of a big plastic tub (with see through sides) in my closet with the lights off. I've pulled them out to check them once every day or so, that's all the light exposure they have been getting really. I noticed that one of the oyster jars had a very small green spot, so i removed it from the tank (and the green fuzzines has continued to get bigger...i'm just going to trash it). I'm not concerned about this contam, what i'm concerned about is the fact that the oyster mushrooms are definitely colonizing much quicker than the lion's manes.
Also, one of the oyster jars is growing super fast compared to all of the others. It seems like the lion's manes started to grow (there is definitely small amount of mycelium strands running through some areas) for a couple days, but then just went on pause, then a day or two ago the oysters seemed to have gone on pause as well, all except one. there just hasn't been much, if any development i've been able to notice...
here are some pics, and sorry if what i just said is long winded...


the jar on the left is the one that is colonizing the most...every day i look at it, there is very noticeable change, the other slowed down though...

the one on the left is oyster, and th one on the right is lion's manes

then here are my 3 other jars of lion's manes, there's so little growth, it's hard to see in the pics

this is just another picture of the one that is taking off like madness more close up...

should i continue to worry about the ones that aren't colonizing too fast, or should i just wait? just go ahead and deal with the one that is colonizing real fast once it has fully colonized, then deal with the others when they get there as well?
the contam jar isn't pictured, i'll post that later


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OfflineRogerRabbitM
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Re: problems possibly? jars slowed down or stopped? [Re: SuchSmartMonkeys]
    #6858911 - 05/01/07 03:53 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

Different species colonize at different rates. Lion's mane mycelium can look almost invisible, yet still be growing. In fact, many times a lion's mane substrate that is fully colonized and fruiting will not even look like it's colonized. Check out this one.
RR


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"I've never had a failed experiment.  I've only discovered 10,000 methods which do not work."
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OfflineSuchSmartMonkeys
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Re: problems possibly? jars slowed down or stopped? [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #6858974 - 05/01/07 04:10 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

thank you much on that insight...anything i can do about my oyster jars colonizing at different rates? once colonized it can sit for a couple days while others are colonizing still? also, if it's so hard to see the lion's mane mycelium, how will i know when its time for the mid-colonization shake? also, when i shake the jars at mid-colonization, how vigorous do i shake? thanks RR...you've been a great help, can't wait till your movie comes out, i'll definitely be getting a copy

edit: i actually just went to look at my jars one more time, and although it looks as if there is very little in the lion's manes jars, there is enough mycelial structure that i can turn the jars, almost upside down (didn't invert it all the way, didn't want it to fall apart...) and all of the kernels, even on top, hold together. the oysters that look much more colonized still have a few bits that move around on top when the jars are just tilted....when do i want to shake these jars? seems like it will be harder to tell than th oysters...i've already got a pretty good idea on whn to do those...


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Edited by SuchSmartMonkeys (05/01/07 04:20 PM)

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OfflineRogerRabbitM
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Re: problems possibly? jars slowed down or stopped? [Re: SuchSmartMonkeys]
    #6859504 - 05/01/07 06:42 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

I was going to suggest turning them upside down to see if they hold together. I'd suggest a good shaking now. I use a bicycle tire and bang the jar a few times against it until each and every kernel is separated. You won't shake again until the day you spawn them to bulk, when you'll bang them again on a tire in order to pour out of the jar. They can sit for a week or two at room temperature after full colonization without problems.

If you have a good lion's mane culture, it will begin pinning invitro at about the time of full colonization. You'll see pins forming on the top. Just shake these into the rye and spawn, they'll be fine.
RR


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semper in excretia sumus solim profundum variat

"I've never had a failed experiment.  I've only discovered 10,000 methods which do not work."
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OfflineSuchSmartMonkeys
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Re: problems possibly? jars slowed down or stopped? [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #6861615 - 05/02/07 02:44 AM (16 years, 10 months ago)

the lion's manes can all be turned upside down without crumbling, but the oyster's can't yet, they still crumble around a little bit... i might bang the lion's manes on my bike tire a little right now to let them mix up a little, then wait a day or two for the oysters and see how they continue with the colonization...

edit: i just took 2 of my lion's manes jars, flipped them upside down, they held, and i banged them on by bike tire and they fell and mixed up pretty good, then i tossed them back in my spawning chamber...then i took the one oyster mushroom jar that had colonized the most and flipped it upside down, did the same, a few chunks from the top stayed stuck together quite a bit more, but i tried to shake it so they were submerged a little, so the top is still even. i wanted to leave 2 of each to colonize a litle more, because the 2 oyster ones look like they aren't colonized enough yet for shaking, and i don't know about the manes, i want to experiment a little, i'll shake them day after tomoorrow at the latest.


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Edited by SuchSmartMonkeys (05/02/07 02:55 AM)

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OfflineRogerRabbitM
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Re: problems possibly? jars slowed down or stopped? [Re: SuchSmartMonkeys]
    #6862595 - 05/02/07 11:30 AM (16 years, 10 months ago)

Only shake once until the day you're ready to spawn them to bulk, then give the second shake to loosen them up for spawning. Some grow guides recommend several shakings, but that is bad advice.
RR


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semper in excretia sumus solim profundum variat

"I've never had a failed experiment.  I've only discovered 10,000 methods which do not work."
Thomas Edison

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OfflineSuchSmartMonkeys
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Re: problems possibly? jars slowed down or stopped? [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #6863047 - 05/02/07 02:00 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

i gave a couple the shake last night, but i'm still afraid they aren't getting enough air if that's what they need also....still little development in the jars that weren't flipped...should i unscrew the caps a little? or take off the tape?


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OfflineFreeSporePrints
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Re: problems possibly? jars slowed down or stopped? [Re: SuchSmartMonkeys]
    #6863481 - 05/02/07 03:50 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

In nature generally mycelium isn't shaked..so i prefer to shake it just at the time of the inoculation. We have to serve the mycelium, not stress it. Follow the (suggestions of the ) Rabbit :smile:

Fabio

ps. don't they have an hole on every lid? if not puncture with a hot knife and add cotton or polyfill. If they have a port for the gas exchange do not worry, the mycelium needs more oxygen during the pinning and during the next steps, but not too much during the spawn. you want to prevent dehydratation of the grains.

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OfflineSuchSmartMonkeys
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Re: problems possibly? jars slowed down or stopped? [Re: FreeSporePrints]
    #6864081 - 05/02/07 05:57 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

he recommended giving it one good shake mid colonization a few posts, just bumping it on a bike tire...what i really want to know about is wether i need to crack the lids or take off the tape...do they need air exchange during colonization?


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Re: problems possibly? jars slowed down or stopped? [Re: SuchSmartMonkeys]
    #6865829 - 05/03/07 12:44 AM (16 years, 10 months ago)

Yes, ONE good shake until the grains are completly singulary separated...i was telling you my opinion :smile:

Have the lids a stuff like this? for gas exchange?

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OfflineSuchSmartMonkeys
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Re: problems possibly? jars slowed down or stopped? [Re: FreeSporePrints]
    #6866047 - 05/03/07 02:57 AM (16 years, 10 months ago)

so at this point would you recommend taking the tape off the holes and putting cotton balls or TP into the holes?

edit:
for experimentation-sake (i don't want to fuck up all of my jars at once...) i took the tape off of half of my jars and opened a pack of 'sterile' q-tips, and used the cotton nib from the end to put in the hole...i'll see how those look in a day or two, and if they've begun to progress again, i will do the same to the others...

Edited by SuchSmartMonkeys (05/03/07 03:44 AM)

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OfflineRogerRabbitM
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Re: problems possibly? jars slowed down or stopped? [Re: SuchSmartMonkeys]
    #6866869 - 05/03/07 10:33 AM (16 years, 10 months ago)

You MUST have filtered gas exchange during colonization. Most of us use tyvek or synthetic filter disks over the holes in the lid. Cotton will work, but keep it dry. The problem now is anything you use won't be sterile. The filter needs to get sterilized along with the grains. However, they won't grow without air, so you have nothing to lose.

Here's another shameless plug: In my soon to be released DVD, I describe and demonstrate synthetic filter disks, tyvek, polyfill, and Agar's injection port filtered lids and how to use them on grain jars when you prep the grains.
RR


--------------------
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semper in excretia sumus solim profundum variat

"I've never had a failed experiment.  I've only discovered 10,000 methods which do not work."
Thomas Edison

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OfflineSuchSmartMonkeys
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Re: problems possibly? jars slowed down or stopped? [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #6867670 - 05/03/07 01:55 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

alright, even though i did the operation about 12 hours ago, it already looks like there's a few new strands of growth in there in a few spots, and it all still look contam free....i'm going to take the others the same way later this afternoon/evening and hope for the best....


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OfflineSuchSmartMonkeys
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Re: problems possibly? jars slowed down or stopped? [Re: SuchSmartMonkeys]
    #6872087 - 05/04/07 12:19 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

yeah! they all got a fresh breathe, and the holes each had cotton put in them. There was a great amount of growth since that was done (yestrday morning i guess?) so i shook the last couple jars that hadn't been shaken yet, and all is looking well thus far...i'm still freaked out by those lion's manes, it looks like nothing is in there, but it holds the structure of the rye together....


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