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OfflineTobolam
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Sphagnum NON-PEAT MOSS for casings?
    #6621780 - 02/28/07 07:32 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

I have a bag of Sphagnum moss that is not harvested from peat. Is it still viable for casing?

p.s. I really did do my best trying to search the forums

Edit: If it is viable, does anyone know if the pH would be lower, as it doesn't contain peat, which I understand from the forum, is the acidic part?

Edited by Tobolam (02/28/07 07:33 PM)

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OfflineVampireSlayer
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Re: Sphagnum NON-PEAT MOSS for casings? [Re: Tobolam]
    #6621799 - 02/28/07 07:40 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

is it that decorative looking stuff that looks like thick greenish yellow pubic hair? if so then it is worthless as a casing layer.


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OfflineTobolam
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Re: Sphagnum NON-PEAT MOSS for casings? [Re: VampireSlayer]
    #6621863 - 02/28/07 07:56 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

No i mean this

Edit: Mine is MUCH MUCH finer

Edited by Tobolam (02/28/07 07:57 PM)

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OfflineVampireSlayer
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Re: Sphagnum NON-PEAT MOSS for casings? [Re: Tobolam]
    #6621947 - 02/28/07 08:22 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

nope that won't work man, go get some miracle grow moisture grow


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OfflineRogerRabbitM
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Re: Sphagnum NON-PEAT MOSS for casings? [Re: VampireSlayer]
    #6622084 - 02/28/07 09:03 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

That stuff is for lining hanging baskets to keep the soil in. Useless for mycology.
RR


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InvisibleBlutjager
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Re: Sphagnum NON-PEAT MOSS for casings? [Re: VampireSlayer]
    #6622091 - 02/28/07 09:04 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Pikashroom said:
nope that won't work man, go get some miracle grow moisture grow


:yesnod:

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OfflineTobolam
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Re: Sphagnum NON-PEAT MOSS for casings? [Re: Blutjager]
    #6622110 - 02/28/07 09:07 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Thanks

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Offlinefromthemoon
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Re: Sphagnum NON-PEAT MOSS for casings? [Re: Tobolam]
    #6627660 - 03/02/07 10:44 AM (17 years, 30 days ago)

I also say no, not for standared casing, but...

It can be used to case a cake - PC it - wrap it around a brithed cake, hold w/ sterial rubber band, dunk, keep it watered through pinning/fruiting. It can help increase a cake yeild by 2. However, it is very prone to green mold and other contams after 1st/2nd flush.


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Offlinekristen
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Re: Sphagnum NON-PEAT MOSS for casings? [Re: fromthemoon]
    #6627677 - 03/02/07 10:49 AM (17 years, 30 days ago)

Why people continue to recommend Miracle Grow Moisture Control I don't know. It has right on the label perlite, coir, and fertilizer. 3 things you don't want in a casing. If you're going to be lazy, get Jiffy Mix, the proper thing.

Edited by kristen (03/02/07 10:52 AM)

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OfflineCiv
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Re: Sphagnum NON-PEAT MOSS for casings? [Re: kristen]
    #6627694 - 03/02/07 10:54 AM (17 years, 30 days ago)

Quote:

perlite, coir, and fertilizer. 3 things you don't want in a casing.




A small amount of perlite is wonderful in a substrate or caseing- it provides air to the knotts that are forming in the substrate.  No, not 50% perlite but a good handfull or two depending on what your doing.  Coir is not a good substrate?  Do a search :smile:


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Invisiblecreamcorn
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Re: Sphagnum NON-PEAT MOSS for casings? [Re: kristen]
    #6627834 - 03/02/07 11:48 AM (17 years, 30 days ago)

Quote:

kristen said:
Why people continue to recommend Miracle Grow Moisture Control I don't know. It has right on the label perlite, coir, and fertilizer. 3 things you don't want in a casing. If you're going to be lazy, get Jiffy Mix, the proper thing.




why do people reccomend it?  because it works awesome.

perlite makes air pockets and gives structure to a casing layer.  when used in small amounts (as is in the mix), a very good thing.

coir encourages mycelium to run into the casing layer.  when used in a small amount (again, as is in the mix), a very good thing.

the amount of fertilizer so small it is negligible and has also been proven many times over to niether harm the grow, nor encourage contaminates as some might suggest.  so, not a good or a bad thing.  totally irrelevant if anything.

nothing wrong with jiffy mix either as you suggest, but the miracle gro product is much easier to find in stores, its sold at a lot more places much more commonly than jiffy mix.  another good thing!
don't bash it til you try it :thumbup:

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Offlinekristen
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Re: Sphagnum NON-PEAT MOSS for casings? [Re: creamcorn]
    #6627880 - 03/02/07 12:11 PM (17 years, 30 days ago)

Perlite is not going to provide any significant amount of air, you should be providing that by other means. And I said coir was not good in casings. The reason it runs so good into it, is because it's nutritive. You can get equal results with a properly balanced custom casing mixture. Whether it's "negligible" or not, I wouldn't use 2 nutrient sources in a casing layer, they're designed to be non-nutritive and nutrition=contamination. I doubt you'll find a study that proves MGMC has an equal edge over a custom mix, because no mycologist who is about maximum yield and optimum conditions would be using it.

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Invisiblecreamcorn
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Re: Sphagnum NON-PEAT MOSS for casings? [Re: kristen]
    #6627941 - 03/02/07 12:38 PM (17 years, 30 days ago)

*sigh*

have you been paying attention to the boards much? lots of us who are concerned with maximum yield and optimal conditions use it and prefer it. we have studied it. most of us who do use it, take it straight out of the bag, skip pH buffering, and despite an incorrect assumption that fertilizer is nutritive (which it is not, nutritive implies carbon source), even with all these shortcuts taken experience very low contamination rates.

if you want to read studies, read up on "compost at casing" effect, or "casing inoculum" - this is a procedure where nutritive sources are intentionally added to casing layers to encourage mycelium to run through it. they are proven to work when done correctly. did you know, peat is actually a nutrition source? its low in nutrients, but not completely inert. it is plant material after all. case in point: green mold will grow on peat. how do you suppose that happens if it has 0 nutrients? did you know the reason it is used is for the casing inoculum effect? did you know small portions of coir in casing serves us the same identical purpose? before you say "no mycologist would..." research why mycologists DO the things they do and the underlying theory and reasoning. the old saying "casings must be non nutritious" isn't quite as literal as it sounds... its more or less a quick way to discourage people from putting things too high in nutrients in their casings. casings should in fact be low in nutrients but not necessarily devoid of them. the only *true* non-nutritious casing layer that we use would be a straight vermiculite one... and as you probably know, this doesn't work as well as peat/verm mixed. did you ever stop to wonder why that is?

perlite does not "provide" air. it makes air pockets. there's a difference. of course the cultivator or fruiting environment provides the air. but, humid air pockets (which is what perlite creates) near the substrate surface is prime for pin development.

no, of course there's not a published study in literature specifically on MGMC, but if you're telling me the collective experience of dozens of us here who've been using it for months is useless and that we're totally imaginging the great yeilds we've been getting, suit yourself... but please do not simply re-hash outdated conventional wisdom that has actually been proven wrong to some extent, without trying it first hand.

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Offlinekristen
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Re: Sphagnum NON-PEAT MOSS for casings? [Re: creamcorn]
    #6628466 - 03/02/07 03:43 PM (17 years, 30 days ago)

A lot of things will work for a casing and give great yields. Doesn't mean they are ideal or that you couldn't do better with something simple like Jiffy Mix which is at least buffered. Half-assing mycology won't get you the yields that people yearn for.

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Invisiblecreamcorn
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Re: Sphagnum NON-PEAT MOSS for casings? [Re: kristen]
    #6628786 - 03/02/07 05:00 PM (17 years, 30 days ago)

i guess you're right


(cased with straight MGMC)

i suppose that's horrible yield, and definitely half assed... what was i thinking paying attention to reality instead of living in a fantasy world where baseless claims are the only correct answer? silly me... see you guys later, i'm going to go take up knitting, i'm not cut out for this mycology stuff

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OfflineVampireSlayer
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Re: Sphagnum NON-PEAT MOSS for casings? [Re: creamcorn]
    #6628945 - 03/02/07 05:32 PM (17 years, 30 days ago)

Quote:

creamcorn said:
i guess you're right


(cased with straight MGMC)

i suppose that's horrible yield, and definitely half assed... what was i thinking paying attention to reality instead of living in a fantasy world where baseless claims are the only correct answer?  silly me... see you guys later, i'm going to go take up knitting, i'm not cut out for this mycology stuff




:lol:


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OfflineHotnuts
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Re: Sphagnum NON-PEAT MOSS for casings? [Re: VampireSlayer]
    #6629022 - 03/02/07 05:51 PM (17 years, 30 days ago)

That stuff is absolutely loaded with contaminate spores also. I thought i'd use some to humidify a small terrarium and there were more cobweb types of mold growing on that stuff than you'd believe. Even with consistant FAE, the damn molds gobbled it up.

People have been using potting soils for cubensis for over a decade now and they work excellent. Just buy the cheapest bag you can find and use it.

Edited by Hotnuts (03/02/07 08:12 PM)

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OfflineTobolam
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Re: Sphagnum NON-PEAT MOSS for casings? [Re: Hotnuts]
    #6629052 - 03/02/07 06:02 PM (17 years, 30 days ago)

Guys, can this moss be used as a bulk substrate? I'd think it has the nutrients and porosity that would make it quite perfect for that job.

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Offlinekristen
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Re: Sphagnum NON-PEAT MOSS for casings? [Re: Tobolam]
    #6629070 - 03/02/07 06:06 PM (17 years, 30 days ago)

More can explain a good yield other than the casing. It's one of many parts.

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OfflineHotnuts
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Re: Sphagnum NON-PEAT MOSS for casings? [Re: Tobolam]
    #6629269 - 03/02/07 06:54 PM (17 years, 30 days ago)

Quote:

Tobolam said:
Guys, can this moss be used as a bulk substrate?




No.

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