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InvisibleWhiskeyClone
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Fat loss vs. muscle gain
    #6350716 - 12/09/06 11:52 AM (17 years, 3 months ago)

Over the past four years I've gained maybe 20 pounds of body fat, mostly around my midsection.  My eating habits were pretty terrible for that time and the only exercise I got was incidental (my job is fairly physical in the summer months.)

A few weeks ago I put my foot down and changed my eating habits, started doing cardio 3 times a week and weight training 2-3 times a week.  I'm making healthier choices at every opportunity and I feel much better in general.

My first goal is to improve my general health.  My other goal is to increase muscular definition.  I am aware that this involves a)shedding body fat and b) adding muscle mass.

I've read and been told many times that it is not really possible to do both at the same time.  This makes sense to me, because how can you build muscle with a caloric deficit, and how can you shed fat with a caloric surplus?  Obviously I'm no expert in this field :shrug:

In any case, which should I focus on first?  Does it make sense to put my efforts mainly into cardio and reducing caloric intake until I've lost most of my spare tire, before I gear my diet and exercise routine towards building muscle?

Thanks for reading my post.


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Welcome evermore to gods and men is the self-helping man.  For him all doors are flung wide: him all tongues greet, all honors crown, all eyes follow with desire.  Our love goes out to him and embraces him, because he did not need it.

~ R.W. Emerson, "Self-Reliance"

:heartpump:

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Offline81Renaissance
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Registered: 11/01/06
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Last seen: 1 month, 4 days
Re: Fat loss vs. muscle gain [Re: WhiskeyClone]
    #6350773 - 12/09/06 12:12 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

In order to see results in both muscle definition and weight loss, make sure that your cardio is in the form of interval training, and more importantly, that your weight training is circuit training...this allows you to work on muscle TONE (not mass) and maintain an elevated heart rate throughout your weight training workout...
but DO the weights, it takes much more energy for your body to repair and maintain muscle tissue, and research shows that weight training increases RESTING metabolic rate for up to 48 hours post workout as opposed to cardio training the benefits of which last only 3-4 hours post workout.
Long story short do both cardio and weights (circuit training) to maximize weight loss.


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"Every passing moment is another chance to turn it all around."

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InvisibleVeritas
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Registered: 04/15/05
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Re: Fat loss vs. muscle gain [Re: WhiskeyClone]
    #6350811 - 12/09/06 12:26 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

This makes sense to me, because how can you build muscle with a caloric deficit, and how can you shed fat with a caloric surplus?




If you use stored calories (fat) for energy, whether you expend that energy walking to your car or repairing microscopic muscle tears (the way muscle mass is increased), you will lose fat.

Once you have built muscle, your body will use more calories sitting still (basal metabolic rate), and you can lose fat (slowly) without reducing your caloric intake.

IOW, it does matter which you focus on first, but they are not mutually-exclusive.  You will build muscle while losing fat (if you are consuming the appropriate number of calories AND stressing your muscles), and you will lose fat while building muscle (ditto).

For the greatest metabolic boost, I suggest cardio intervals 6 days a week in the early a.m. + 6 days of alternating upper/lower body weight training.  Caloric restriction can result in metabolic slowing (an evolutionary mechanism to conserve body mass during famine), so continue to eat good-sized portions of health-promoting foods.

:cool:

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Offlinebrowndustin
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Re: Fat loss vs. muscle gain [Re: Veritas]
    #6350860 - 12/09/06 12:54 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

Great stuff.

One thing I'd like to recommend is HIT cardio or sprints. Look at a sprinter vs a long distance runner. Both might be shredded, but sprinters clearly have more muscle. Don't stick to the "fat burning zone"... either do low impact cardio for a long time, or very explosive cardio for a short period of time. As much as I hate to admit it, jogging is a quick way to lose BOTH fat and muscle, something that sucks (I love jogging too).

If you're doing heavy compound lifting, you'll be able to burn fat as well. Just make sure that you have some decent nutrient timing and you should be able to strengthen up and gradually cut up as well.

If you've had a long layoff, the great part is that the first bit of fat comes off relatively easy. Good luck, man. You should check out bodybuilding.com. They've got a lot of good shit on their forums if you stay away from the drama. My posts there are a lot more useful too , I always come to the Shroomery when I'm stoned so I don't make sense or say something that's stupid or conflicting.


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When the stress burns my brain it's like acid raindrops
maryjane is the only thing that makes the pain stop

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Invisibleeligal
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Loc: California
Re: Fat loss vs. muscle gain [Re: WhiskeyClone]
    #6351241 - 12/09/06 02:41 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

Focus on both! Cardio and weights are a great mix.

And I agree with what everyone has said so far. :thumbup:

Cardio and weights both burn fat and with a healthy diet you will look great and more importantly feel great in no time at all.
Keep up the good work, you wont regret it.

PS: A while ago I read something about the testosterone levels being raised when you lift weights and when you do cardio. But testosterone levels were raised more when doing cardio. This means that your cardio will help your muscle mass aswell.
As long as you dont start doing 3 hour cross-country running your cardio wont be harming your muscle gains.


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\m/ Spanksta \m/

"do you have the freedom to do with your nervous system what you want?"

"MolokoMilkPlus said:
I'll respect you if you let me give you a blow job"

"tactik said:
respect the can."


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InvisibleWhiskeyClone
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Registered: 06/25/01
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Re: Fat loss vs. muscle gain [Re: eligal]
    #6351460 - 12/09/06 03:37 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

Thanks for your input everybody!  A little bit of guidance helps to keep me from doubting if my workout is efficient.  :thumbup:  I'm seeing (and feeling!) results already so I'll just stay the course and see where it takes me.

:cool: :thumbup:


--------------------
Welcome evermore to gods and men is the self-helping man.  For him all doors are flung wide: him all tongues greet, all honors crown, all eyes follow with desire.  Our love goes out to him and embraces him, because he did not need it.

~ R.W. Emerson, "Self-Reliance"

:heartpump:

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Offlineusernamer
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Registered: 02/22/05
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Last seen: 3 years, 11 months
Re: Fat loss vs. muscle gain [Re: WhiskeyClone]
    #6354982 - 12/10/06 05:12 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

WhiskeyClone said:
Over the past four years I've gained maybe 20 pounds of body fat, mostly around my midsection.  My eating habits were pretty terrible for that time and the only exercise I got was incidental (my job is fairly physical in the summer months.)

A few weeks ago I put my foot down and changed my eating habits, started doing cardio 3 times a week and weight training 2-3 times a week.  I'm making healthier choices at every opportunity and I feel much better in general.

My first goal is to improve my general health.  My other goal is to increase muscular definition.  I am aware that this involves a)shedding body fat and b) adding muscle mass.

I've read and been told many times that it is not really possible to do both at the same time.  This makes sense to me, because how can you build muscle with a caloric deficit, and how can you shed fat with a caloric surplus?  Obviously I'm no expert in this field :shrug:

In any case, which should I focus on first?  Does it make sense to put my efforts mainly into cardio and reducing caloric intake until I've lost most of my spare tire, before I gear my diet and exercise routine towards building muscle?

Thanks for reading my post.




Super clean diet, and supplement with branched chained amino acids (BCAA's).

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InvisibleColonel Kurtz Ph.D
What What?
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Registered: 07/22/04
Posts: 11,113
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Re: Fat loss vs. muscle gain [Re: usernamer]
    #6355059 - 12/10/06 05:34 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

I agree a good diet is the best way to help yourself, I'm doing mild excercise a few times a week and eating healthier and in just a few weeks I've gained a lot of muscular tone and lost the exact ammount of weight I wanted out :thumbup:


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:whatwhat:

There's no better way to rock out than with your cock out!!

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OfflineThe_Hobbit
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Re: Fat loss vs. muscle gain [Re: Colonel Kurtz Ph.D]
    #6356451 - 12/11/06 12:42 AM (17 years, 3 months ago)

Studies have estimated that for each pound of muscle that you add to your body, you burn an additional 35 to 50 calories per day. So, an extra 10 pounds of muscle will burn approximately 350 to 500 calories a day, or an extra pound of fat every 7 to 10 days, without making any other changes. In another study, researchers found that regular weight training boosts basal metabolic rate by about 15%. This is because muscle is 'metabolically active ' and burns more calories than other body tissue even when you're not moving.


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Smoking my hobbit leaf...
Please keep in mind that I am just a human being. Please read my posts carefully and interpret their meaning for yourself.

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Invisiblekaniz
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Registered: 07/23/04
Posts: 4,166
Loc: Ontario
Re: Fat loss vs. muscle gain [Re: The_Hobbit]
    #6357010 - 12/11/06 08:05 AM (17 years, 3 months ago)

I've found that doing

- 10 mins cardio
- weights
- 30 mins cardio
- situps
- stretching / yoga / etc
- soak in the sauna

Has done a great job at helping me lose weight and gain strength. I've dropped about 30 pounds in the past 3 or so months, lost over 2" off of my waist (went from 38" pants to 36, and now my 36s are getting pretty baggy). I've been getting regular gains in how much I can lift, and starting to see more tone/definition in my muscles.

I'm not really dieting, and if anything - I seem to be eating more than what I used to, but just eating healthier.

My primary goal is to strengthen my back, after having back problems for the past few years, and spending nearly a grand on the chiropractor - I really want to get my back into a healthy shape again, and a large part of that is losing the gut I had hanging over the waist of my pants :P

My only problem, is when doing upper-body, my back acts up now and then - so its been hard to push as hard as I would like. My right shoulder starts to hurt like, 'inside' of the joint before I really start to feel any sort of muscle fatigue, so I've been slow to see gains in what I can bench press / etc, which is getting kind of annoying. I've upped the weights signifigantly on like, everything EXCEPT for chest press and things that work my shoulders.

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InvisibleRavus
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Re: Fat loss vs. muscle gain [Re: WhiskeyClone]
    #6357344 - 12/11/06 10:43 AM (17 years, 3 months ago)

Focus on gaining muscle first, definitely. After a few months, if you're still not happy with the results, then you can focus on dieting and cardio while relaxing your weight-lifting routine, but for a healthier body more muscle mass and tone will help you more. Not to mention the fact that once you have more muscle mass to maintain, you can eat the same diet or more without gaining fat because your body will burn more calories to maintain the muscle mass you already have.


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So long as you are praised think only that you are not yet on your own path but on that of another.

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OfflineThe_Hobbit
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Re: Fat loss vs. muscle gain [Re: Ravus]
    #6360094 - 12/12/06 02:19 AM (17 years, 3 months ago)

Hey, Kaniz. You should consider dropping the machines and doing all free-weight exercises. You can do Dumbbell presses and pushups.


--------------------
Smoking my hobbit leaf...
Please keep in mind that I am just a human being. Please read my posts carefully and interpret their meaning for yourself.

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