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OfflineNewbieS
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Best fat burning supplements?
    #5799406 - 06/28/06 01:28 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Is there any fat burning supplement you've had good experiences with? I'd like to add something to my diet and excercise and I'm curious as to what product at my local GNC would be best.

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Offlinebarfightlard
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Re: Best fat burning supplements? [Re: Newbie]
    #5799642 - 06/28/06 02:42 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

caffene nicotine, low cal and fat diet, exercise


--------------------

"What business is it of yours what I do, read, buy, see, say, think, who I fuck, what I take into my body - as long as I do not harm another human being on this planet?" - Bill Hicks

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InvisibleAlteredAgain
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Re: Best fat burning supplements? [Re: barfightlard]
    #5799739 - 06/28/06 03:14 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

i recommend any of those except nicotine. nicotine will not help you to lose weight. and if you're drinking coffee, make sure to drink lots of water afterwards to make up for the water loss. drink only water, focus on proper diet and exercise. set realistic goals. good luck.

Edited by AlteredAgain (06/28/06 03:15 PM)

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Invisibleeligal
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Re: Best fat burning supplements? [Re: Newbie]
    #5801358 - 06/28/06 11:29 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Yea, dont take those other fat burner pills that you see at some places. Those dont work most of the time and can be rather unhealthy from what Ive heard.

Just eat healthy and have fun workin out, and dont stress out too much about gains or whatever.


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\m/ Spanksta \m/

"do you have the freedom to do with your nervous system what you want?"

"MolokoMilkPlus said:
I'll respect you if you let me give you a blow job"

"tactik said:
respect the can."


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OfflineRamlaen
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Re: Best fat burning supplements? [Re: eligal]
    #5802283 - 06/29/06 06:44 AM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Fat burners are for the most part a waste of money/time, it will barely increase results for the good ones, and they all have slight risks associated with them

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Invisiblegoobler
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Re: Best fat burning supplements? [Re: Newbie]
    #5802341 - 06/29/06 07:36 AM (17 years, 8 months ago)

winstrol

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OfflineNewbieS
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Re: Best fat burning supplements? [Re: goobler]
    #5806281 - 06/30/06 08:37 AM (17 years, 8 months ago)

That's kind of what I figured.  None of them sound like they're really worth the money.  I've heard good things about stackers but their lack of support from the FDA and the speediness kind of turned me off.  I still wanna be able to sleep at night  :tongue:

Edited by Newbie (06/30/06 08:38 AM)

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Invisiblegoobler
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Re: Best fat burning supplements? [Re: Newbie]
    #5806529 - 06/30/06 10:54 AM (17 years, 8 months ago)

I suppost you are refering to legal means

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InvisibleBoom
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Re: Best fat burning supplements? [Re: goobler]
    #5808015 - 06/30/06 11:05 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Well since the majority of his posts are in Mush Cult.. I don't see how Winstrol would be out of the question

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Offlinebrowndustin
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Re: Best fat burning supplements? [Re: Newbie]
    #5808707 - 07/01/06 01:59 AM (17 years, 8 months ago)

You can stack sesamin with basically anything. It's cheap as hell... you could start with that because I've heard a lot of good things about it.


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When the stress burns my brain it's like acid raindrops
maryjane is the only thing that makes the pain stop

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Offlinefunnybunny
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Re: Best fat burning supplements? [Re: browndustin]
    #5808964 - 07/01/06 04:09 AM (17 years, 8 months ago)

The best thing for burning fat is oxygen. Make exercise and a lot of it will get inside you!

For miracles, hoodia gordonii.

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Invisiblei8an8th
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Re: Best fat burning supplements? [Re: funnybunny]
    #5809078 - 07/01/06 06:58 AM (17 years, 8 months ago)

The best fat burner is DNP.. It can raise your metabolisim 30%... People have been known to shed over 1 pound of fat a day..


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:sporedrop:

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InvisibleBrainiac
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Re: Best fat burning supplements? [Re: funnybunny]
    #5809093 - 07/01/06 07:15 AM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Yerba Mate
Health Benefitis.
For Better Health
By Daniel Mowrey, Ph.D.
Yerba Mate
What is it?
Mate is as tea-like beverage consumed mainly in Argentina, Uruguay, Paraguay and southern Brazil. It is brewed from the dried leaves and stemlets of the perennial tree Ilex paraguarensis ("Yerba Mate").
The name "Mate" derives from the quichua word "matí" that names the gourd (Lagenaria vulgaris) that is traditionally used to drink the infusion.
The scientific name Ilex paraguarensis was given by the French naturalist and botanist Auguste de Saint Hilaire in 1822, the tree belongs to the family Aquifoliaceae and grows between the parallels 10° and 30° (South) in the Paraná and Paraguay rivers basins. It is a plant typical of the Alto Paraná region, Alto Uruguay region and the Argentine NE. It is a tropical or subtropical plant, needing high temperatures, high humidity and up to 1500 mm of annual rain. On average, 300,000 tons of Mate are produced each year.

In the wild, the plant needs about 25 years to develop completely, reaching in that case a height of up to 15 meters.
The leaves are alternated, cuneiform, elliptical or oval, with the border slightly serrated.
It flowers between the months of October and December. The flowers are small, polygamous, dioicous, with calix and corolla in a tetrameric disposition. The fruit resembles a pepper berry. Among several varieties, there are three that are the most important: "angustifolia", "longifolia" and "latifolia".

Mate has a characteristic mature flavor which is somewhat sweet, bitter, withered leaf like, and alfalfa-like, similar to that obtained from tea (Camellia sinensis)[1]. Of the 196 volatile chemical compounds found in Yerba Mate, 144 are also found in tea.
The infusions of Ilex paraguarensis are less astringent than those made of tea.

It is used in popular medicine and employed in commercial herbal preparations as a stimulant to the central nervous system, a diuretic, and an antirheumatic [2].

Some Guaraní words related to Mate:
Barbacuá: from mbarambacuá = ma (pile) + ra (euphonic) + mbacuá (toasted or roasted thing)
Caä: Yerba Mate.
Caá-guará: Mate drinker.
Caá-i-guá: Mate gourd (literally: container of the water of Yerba Mate)
Caá-u-ei: thirst of Mate.
Mboroviré: Yerba Mate slightly "canchada" (desiccated and broken)
Sapeca, sambeca or sapeá: pocá, peá or mbecá (to open) + za or sá (eye) = to open the globules or vesicles of the Yerba Mate by the heating process.
Ticuá cá ay: "cebar el Mate" (literally: to throw water in the hole)

Classification:
Division: Anthophyta
Class: Magnoliopsida
SubClass: Rosidae
Order: Celastrales
Family: Aquifoliaceae

References:
1.Kawakami, M. and Kobayashi, A.; Volatile Constituents of Green Mate and Roasted Mate, J.Agric.Food Chem. 39, 1275 (1991)
2.Gosmann, G., Schenkel, E.P. and Seligmann, O.; A New Saponin from Mate, Ilex Paraguarensis, J.Nat.Pbod. 52(6), 1367 (1989)
3.Vazques, A. and Moyna, P.; Studies on Mate Drinking, J. Ethnopharmacology 18, 267 (1986)


Yerba Mate, or Mate as it is often called, is a South American herb that has won many admirers in wide-ranging parts of the world.
In the search for a natural stimulant devoid of side effects and toxicity, Mate currently holds the most hope.
An invigorator of the mind and body, a natural source of nutrition, and a health promoter par excellence, Mate deserves the attention of every person interested in optimum health. Yerba Mate was introduced to colonizing and modern civilizations by the primitive Guarani Indians of Paraguay and Argentina.
It has seemingly always been the most common ingredient in household cures of the Guarani.
In modern Argentina and Paraguay, however, Mate tea has become almost pathologically ritualized in a manner reminiscent of coffee and tea abuse in Western and Eastern countries. Among the native Guarani, on the other hand, the natural use of Mate for healthful purposes has persisted.
They use it to boost immunity, cleanse and detoxify the blood, tone the nervous system, restore youthful hair color, retard aging, combat fatigue, stimulate the mind, control the appetite, reduce the effects of debilitating disease, reduce stress, and eliminate insomnia.

Mate (flex paraguariensis) is an evergreen member of the holly family.
It grows wild in Argentina, Chile, Peru, and Brazil, but is most abundant in Paraguay where it is also cultivated. The plant is classified vaguely, according to Western herbal medicine, as aromatic, stimulant, bitter, aperient (laxative), astringent, diuretic, purgative, sudorific (sweat inducing), and febrifuge (fever reducing).
Mate contains numerous vitamins and minerals.
There is the usual array of resins, fiber, volatile oil, and tannins that characterize many plant substances.
And there is also carotene; vitamins A. C, E, B-1, B-2 and B-complex; riboflavin; nicotinic acid; pantothenic acid; biotin; magnesium; calcium; iron; sodium; potassium; manganese; silicon; phosphates; sulfur; hydrochloric acid; chlorophyll; choline; and inositol. In 1964 one group of investigators from the Pasteur Institute and the Paris Scientific Society concluded that Mate contains practically all of the vitamins necessary to sustain life.

In addition to the regular nutrients, Mate contains a substance belonging to a specialized class of chemical compounds called xanthines.
Though only small amounts of these substances occur in Mate, their presence has generated a huge amount of attention.
The primary xanthine in Yerba Mate is called Mateine.
The substance probably contributes little, if anything, to the overall activity of the plant, but has drawn a disproportionate share of speculation. Some xanthines are obviously less desirable, such as caffeine. Others, such as theophylline and theobromine, have specialized action and a characteristic set of side effects.
Although the xanthines have similar chemistries, each has a unique set of properties. Researchers at the Free Hygienic Institute of Hamburg, Germany, concluded that even if there were caffeine in Mate, the amount would be so tiny that it would take 100 tea bags of Mate in a 6-ounce cup of water to equal the caffeine in a 6-ounce serving of regular coffee. Consequently, the active principle in Yerba Mate is not caffeine!

There is only one effect that seems to be shared by all xanthines:
smooth muscle relaxation. It is this action that makes them (with the exception of caffeine, in which smooth muscle relaxant effects are diminished by other side effects) good clinical dilators of the bronchi and hence useful in the treatment of asthma.
Mateine appears, then, to possess the best combination of xanthine properties possible. For example, like other xanthines, it stimulates the central nervous system; but unlike most, it is not habituating or addicting.
Likewise, unlike caffeine, it induces better, not worse, attributes of sleep.
It is a mild, not a strong, diuretic, as are many xanthines. It relaxes peripheral blood vessels, thereby reducing blood pressure, without the strong effects on the medulla oblongata (end part of the brain connecting to the spine) and heart exhibited by some xanthines.
We also know that it improves psychomotor performance without the typical xanthine-induced depressant after effects.
Dr. Jose Martin, Director of the National Institute of Technology in Paraguay, writes, "New research and better technology have shown that while Mateine has a chemical constituency similar to caffeine, the molecular binding is different. Mateine has none of the ill effects of caffeine." And Horacio Conesa, professor at the University of Buenos Aires Medical School, states, "There is not a single medical contraindication" for ingesting Mate.
Clinical studies show, in fact, that even individuals with caffeine sensitivities can ingest Mate without adverse reactions.

GASTROINTESTINAL PROPERTIES

Perhaps the main area to benefit from Mate is the gastrointestinal tract.
Reported effects range from immediate improvement in digestion to the ability to repair damaged and diseased gastrointestinal tissues. Constipation, acute or chronic, can easily be overcome through the use of Mate. Mate appears to work mainly by softening the fecal mass, but it also appears to stimulate normal movement of the intestines to some degree.

EFFECTS ON THE NERVOUS SYSTEM

Better than any other xanthine alkaloid, Mate has the ability to increase mental alertness and acuity and to do it without any side effects such as nervousness and jitters.
It seems to act like a tonic, stimulating a weakened and depressed nervous system and sedating an overexcited one. Our knowledge of Mate's effects is currently limited to observations of behavior changes such as more energy and vitality; better ability to concentrate; less nervousness, agitation, and anxiety; and increased resistance to both physical and mental fatigue.
Improvement in mood, especially in cases of depression, often follows drinking the tea.
This may be a direct or indirect result of increased energy.
One of the remarkable aspects of Mate is that it does not interfere with sleep cycles; in fact, it has a tendency to balance the cycles, inducing more rapid eye movement (REM) sleep when necessary, or increasing the amount of time spent in delta states (deep sleep).

CARDIOVASCULAR EFFECTS

Heart Ailments of all kinds have been treated or prevented through Yerba Mate use. Yerba Mate supplies many of the nutrients required by the heart for growth and repair.
In addition, it increases the supply of oxygen to the heart, especially during periods of stress or exercise. Mate has become a favorite of body builders and anyone interested in the health benefits of exercise.
The metabolic effects of Mate appear to include the ability to maintain aerobic glycolysis (breakdown of carbohydrates) during exercise for longer periods of time.
This results in burning more calories, increasing cardiac efficiency, and delaying anaerobic glycolysis and the resulting buildup of lactic acid during exercise.
Reports of Mate reducing blood pressure are not uncommon.

EFFECTS ON THE IMMUNE SYSTEM

A consistent observation in most South American literature on Mate is that it increases the immune response of the body, stimulating natural resistance to disease.
This results in a nourishing and strengthening effect on the ill person, both during the course of the illness and during convalescence, sometimes dramatically accelerating recovery times.
Exact mechanisms of Mate's action have not been worked out, but they involve both a direct action against infectious organisms, and an effect on overall resistance to disease.
The nutritional content of the plant probably plays a major role here, but it is also probable that other constituents contribute to the action by stimulating the activity of white blood cells.

NUTRITIONAL PROPERTIES

The interaction of the many nutrients in Mate have never been systematically studied. But the stories surrounding the nutritional application of Mate tea are nothing short of amazing.
Mate is often used as a staple food, sometimes substituting for such important foods as bread and vegetables.
It easily eliminates the sensation of hunger and can impart as much invigoration as a full meal, according to the well-known Chilean herbalists J. Zin and R. Weiss.
Peace Corps workers have reported cases in which large groups of natives remain in good health for extended periods of drought and famine, even though they eat only one small meal per day.
How so? By drinking copious amounts of Yerba Mate tea.
Some natives spend their entire lives on such a diet and live to very advanced ages, sometimes in excess of 100 years. South American governments have adopted the practice of encouraging mothers, especially in the poorer regions, to include Yerba Mate in the diet of their school-age children.

Yerba Mate
Chemical Features and Therapeutic Properties
From a chemical point of view, Ilex paraguariensis (Yerba Mate) can be evaluated under its food chemical aspect or as a raw material for several byproducts.
Long before its chemical composition was known, Indians used Yerba Mate not only due to the beverage's taste but also and mainly because they knew its virtues, chiefly an increased resistance to fatigue and its thirst and hunger mitigation powers.

Studies show that the Yerba Mate has the following components:
water, cellulose, gums, dextrin, mucilage, glucose, pentose, fat substances, aromatic resin, legumin, albumin, xanthine, theophylline, caffearin, folic acid, caffeic acid, viridic acid, chlorophyll, cholesterin and essence oil.
Ashes contain great amounts of potassium, lithium, folic, sulfuric, carbon, chloric and citric acids, beside magnesium, manganese, iron, aluminum and arsenic traces.

Xanthine, theophylline and theobromine are three strongly related alkaloids found in Yerba Mate and are the most interesting compounds from a therapeutic standpoint.
The Yerba Mate's xanthine rate averages 1.60%, whereas it is 1.10% in infusions.


Average composition of Yerba Mate (100 gr.)

Minimum amount Maximum amount Average amount
Moisture 5.36 9.80 8.17
Proteins 8.30 13.45 10.89
Carbohydrates 9.70 14.18 12.04
Starch 2.56 6.63 4.55
Glucose 1.30 6.14 3.84
Fibers 14.96 19.95 16.96



Mineral composition of Yerba Mate (100 gr.)

Minimum amount Maximum amount Average amount
Ashes 6.310 7.780 6.910
Chlorine (g) 0.082 0.160 0.116
Sulphur 0.082 0.168 0.125
Phosphorus (g) 0.074 0.214 0.120
Calcium 0.597 0.824 0.668
Magnesium 0.134 0.484 0.337
Potassium (g) 1.181 1.554 1.350
Sodium (g) 0.000 0.003 0.002
Iron (mgs) % --- 94.000 59.900
Cuprum (mgs) 0.600 1.600 1.260
Manganese (mgs) 30.200 183.000 133.180



Vitaminic contents of Yerba Mate (100 gr.)

Minimum amount Maximum amount Average amount
Caroffin (mgs) 0.639 2.267 1.234
Caroffin (vitamin A UI) 1.065 3.779 2.095
Thiamin (gamma) 62.300 313.100 222.700
Riboflavin 246.000 573.900 404.300
Ascorbic acid 8.200 20.700 11.900


Therapeutic Properties
Yerba Mate is basically a stimulant drink, eliminates fatigue, stimulating metal and physical activity.
It has a beneficial effect on nerves and muscles; it also enhances intellectual work.

Due to the central stimulant effects of xanthine jointly with the activation of reserve substances, the cardiovascular activity strengthens the organism.
Xanthine has a well-known effect on the central nervous system, that stimulates mental energy.

Thanks to its vitamin B complex, Yerba Mate collaborates to sugar intake in man's muscles, nerves and cerebral activity; vitamins C and E act as organic defense and on the organism's tissues; mineral salts, jointly with xanthine, help the cardiovascular work and blood circulation by decreasing blood pressure, since xanthine acts as a vasodilator. In such circumstances, hunger can feel as satisfied.

Yerba Mate enhances diuresis and is very useful for bladder troubles.
Yerba Mate also acts on the digestive tube by activating peristaltic movements; it facilitates digestion, attenuates gastric troubles and enhances evacuation and urination. Yerba Mate's stimulant action is longer than that of coffee and does not have side effects such as insomnia and irritability.

Researches at the Paris Pasteur Institute confer to Yerba Mate a very important role in the cell regeneration process.

Sources
Yerba Mate - La bebida que revitaliza. Gobierno de la provincia de Misiones.
Secretaria de comercio exterior e integración. Argentina.

Valduga, Eunice.
Chemical and anatomic characterization of Ilex paraguariensis Saint Hilaire leaf and some species used in adulterating Yerba Mate.
Post-graduation thesis presented at the University of Paraná, Curitiba, in 1995.

You can find it in most co-op stores its not a pill,it's tea like


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:Awesketch:

:cool: Fair is Fair :devil:

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InvisibleBravo
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Re: Best fat burning supplements? [Re: Brainiac]
    #5809468 - 07/01/06 11:30 AM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Burn Fat, Less appetite, Lots of energy=http://www.lookingtrim.net/

I like lookingtrim. It's safe and it works. You have to cycle off every few weeks so you don't burn out your adrenals but it works. Remember to drink a ton of water with this stuff.

For a more intense and less safe approach here are similar products with much higher dosages http://www.thatswholesale.com/db69.html


--------------------
"You do not see things as they are, you see things as you are." -Dyer

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OfflineNomis
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Re: Best fat burning supplements? [Re: Newbie]
    #5856925 - 07/14/06 03:10 AM (17 years, 8 months ago)

L-carnitine is meant to be a pretty good fat burner, it transports stored fat to the mitochondria to be burnt as energy.

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OfflinePowerTrip
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Re: Best fat burning supplements? [Re: Nomis]
    #5859297 - 07/14/06 07:29 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

There is nothing exceptionally healthy which will accelerate fat loss to any great degree. It is based mainly on diet and amount of cardio. Caloric intake has to be less than daily caloric output for fat to be burned.


--------------------
I spit reality, instead of what you usually learn
and I refuse to be concerned with condescending advice
cause I'm the only motherfucker that can change my life

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Offlinebrowndustin
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Re: Best fat burning supplements? [Re: PowerTrip]
    #5861913 - 07/15/06 01:43 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

I could agree and disagree with that. While I personally would use cutters like DNP, Clen or any other banned "supplements", I think that there's a lot you could do with moderation and still stay extremely safe. I would assume that someone would obviously research their supplements and diet for both good and bad effects first.

That's why I'd recommend starting off with something like sesamin. I'm going to be taking this during my winter bulk so I can stay lean while gaining weight. It's cheap as hell and not dangerous, so I don't think I can go wrong.


--------------------
When the stress burns my brain it's like acid raindrops
maryjane is the only thing that makes the pain stop

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