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InvisibleMetasyn
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Psychedelics and children
    #5191676 - 01/17/06 04:01 PM (18 years, 2 months ago)

I know this is a somewhat taboo topic in our culture (even our drug-friendly subculture), but what is your opinion about pre-adolescent children being given psychedelics?

This can be potentially dangerous territory, because a child's mind is still forming and a psychedelic agent could seriously mess with development, but on the other hand it could possibly be beneficial - by training their minds to be continually malleable, not falling into the aggressive, egoistic patterns of adulthood, retaining the child-mind, etc.

Clearly there has been no research into this, and few if any anecdotal reports.

What do you think? It is morally acceptable to give psychedelic drugs to children? What about in a ritualistic, spiritual context - the same way one would expose children to the spirituality of religion? Would you ever consider given them to your children?

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OfflineThe_Hobbit
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Re: Psychedelics and children [Re: Metasyn]
    #5191802 - 01/17/06 04:31 PM (18 years, 2 months ago)

Umm.. I think the earliest age that I would have been ready for psychedelics is 14. Everything was too good before that point. I wouldn't want to ruin my innocence. 14 is when I learned self awareness and respect, so I figure that's when I became a man.


--------------------
Smoking my hobbit leaf...
Please keep in mind that I am just a human being. Please read my posts carefully and interpret their meaning for yourself.

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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Psychedelics and children [Re: The_Hobbit]
    #5191830 - 01/17/06 04:41 PM (18 years, 2 months ago)

there is no need to do this
and little gain to do this

it is a personal exploration -
&
a big part of coming of age is that
you do it without your parent.


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:confused: _ :brainfart:🧠  _ :finger:

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InvisibleVeritas
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Re: Psychedelics and children [Re: Metasyn]
    #5191851 - 01/17/06 04:48 PM (18 years, 2 months ago)

Adulthood is already an altered state, and when we alter it again, perhaps we are attempting to get back to the non-altered state we knew as children.

Children may take the drugs of conformity, dogma, hopelessness, and intolerance. If their consciousness is thus altered, they may choose for themselves, as adults, to swallow the blue pill or the red. Whether these pills are literal or figurative should be left up to them.

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OfflineDeviate
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Re: Psychedelics and children [Re: Veritas]
    #5191904 - 01/17/06 05:05 PM (18 years, 2 months ago)

when i took drugs i took to them to feel how i used to feel when i was a child, so i don't think its necessary for children to take drugs.

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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: Psychedelics and children [Re: Metasyn]
    #5191928 - 01/17/06 05:12 PM (18 years, 2 months ago)

NO!


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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OfflineGomp
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Re: Psychedelics and children [Re: Metasyn]
    #5191952 - 01/17/06 05:23 PM (18 years, 2 months ago)

I was poisoned with shroom at the age of 2..

maybe not so Psychedelic, but it sure had its impact on me...

:wink:

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InvisibleVirgilKane
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Re: Psychedelics and children [Re: Icelander]
    #5191957 - 01/17/06 05:24 PM (18 years, 2 months ago)

It seems to me that if pre-adolescent children are around adults that use Psychedelics then they could learn much more from the counseling that such adults could give them than they ever could from the experience they would have themselves at such a young age, which in my opinion would, in all probablility, scar them.

If they were given this example of viewing life this way, at this young an age, they may never have to take psychedelics at all.


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Absense of evidence is not evidence of absense...

"Religion is a defense against a religious experience"
              Carl G. Jung

 
"So really, ordinary reality is a kind of chemical habit, sanctioned by culture, which says it's okay to use certain drugs, eat certain foods, and have certain sexual behaviors. However, when you transcend all this pre-conditioning by returning to the original wisdom of the animal body, then you discover this immense dimension of opportunity. For some people, it is a frightening risk. To me, that's the psychedelic experience."
Terence McKenna

Edited by schapper (01/17/06 05:25 PM)

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Invisibledorkus
don't look back
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Re: Psychedelics and children [Re: Gomp]
    #5192000 - 01/17/06 05:42 PM (18 years, 2 months ago)

The Obelix of mindspace? No wonder you always seem spiked and psychic.

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OfflineFospher
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Re: Psychedelics and children [Re: Metasyn]
    #5192109 - 01/17/06 06:17 PM (18 years, 2 months ago)

Im not so sure I whole heartily agree on giving children mind-warping drugs, but I do think that psychedelics do have a direct correlation to kids. It's like they're spun out all the time. Always running around, laughing, having the best time in the world while we're just sitting around, being solemn. I always try to think like a kid, a child sets no boundaries of what he/she might ever accomplish, because there are no limits of what we can do - just limitations that we set for ourselves.


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010001100100001001000101!

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InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
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Re: Psychedelics and children [Re: Metasyn]
    #5192116 - 01/17/06 06:20 PM (18 years, 2 months ago)

Giving entheogens to children may interfere with the developmental process. Once they are 18 or so all is well for most people, but before that is risking the childs welfare. I was introduced to acid when I was 17, but I was 18 before I got "serious" about it. I turned out alright...I think.


--------------------
"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda

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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: Psychedelics and children [Re: VirgilKane]
    #5192119 - 01/17/06 06:20 PM (18 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

schapper said:
It seems to me that if pre-adolescent children are around adults that use Psychedelics then they could learn much more from the counseling that such adults could give them than they ever could from the experience they would have themselves at such a young age, which in my opinion would, in all probablility, scar them.

If they were given this example of viewing life this way, at this young an age, they may never have to take psychedelics at all.




While they may never "have" to take psychedelics, what a shame to miss that experience.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
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Posts: 10,689
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Re: Psychedelics and children [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #5192123 - 01/17/06 06:23 PM (18 years, 2 months ago)

On second thought...just put 1200mics of acid in the baby's bottle...


--------------------
"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda

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InvisibleIcelander
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Registered: 03/15/05
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Re: Psychedelics and children [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #5192131 - 01/17/06 06:25 PM (18 years, 2 months ago)

I turned out alright...I think.

:rofl2:

That is worth a whole other thread.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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OfflineDeviate
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Re: Psychedelics and children [Re: Icelander]
    #5192164 - 01/17/06 06:33 PM (18 years, 2 months ago)


While they may never "have" to take psychedelics, what a shame to miss that experience.


not necessarily, i know a few people who would give anything to take back their psychedelic experiences.

Edited by Deviate (01/17/06 06:34 PM)

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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: Psychedelics and children [Re: Deviate]
    #5192177 - 01/17/06 06:36 PM (18 years, 2 months ago)

True. But in a healthy environment with proper support and a positive cultural context; I doubt that would happen often.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Offlinelancifer
Stranger

Registered: 01/14/06
Posts: 82
Loc: Beautiful B.C.
Last seen: 18 years, 1 month
Re: Psychedelics and children [Re: Icelander]
    #5192251 - 01/17/06 06:53 PM (18 years, 2 months ago)

I think, and practice, the idea of entheogenic susbtances being shared with children. The few (25) times i've done ayahuasca I've had my children beside me. My daughter has done mushrooms (about a half a gram) with a cricle of older women when she turned 7. My son is going to drink ayahuasca when he turns 7. Both of my kids were raised according to the 'Continuum Concept' (google it) and you don't separate them off as some sort of 'half finished human' type of gibberish.
They have both tasted ayahuasca. In traditional cultures there IS no age limit for imbibing substances. Alcoholic drinks are freely quaffed by mom and tot alike. Ayahuasca is the FIRST thing children in Amazonia taste, it takes priority over mother milk. The idea of 'a coming of age' is a decidedly Monotheistic idea. Once you've survived to the age of 7, in all likely hood you'll live to the age your culture tends to live to.
Neither of y children have ever been to a doctor. Their aches and pains and illness's are dealt with, with cannabis based medicines. Their only 'Health care' comes from our family Doctor of Traditional Chinese Medicine and Naturopath, both of whom have had quite a effect on our cannabis based (ie. doesn't get you high) medicinals.
If you don't entrain your children to the world view you live in, or if you are uncomfortable about the life you live...don't do it. Let 'society' train your kids. Send them to daycare (vide:public school) and hide your love of plant based experiences so that they grow up with the same guilt and shame as you feel.
What a ridiculous notion! I love my life and the way i live it. it has been hard at times, but c'est la vie! Children are not lapdogs, puppies, or any other notion you might have of them. Hell, my 5 and 10 year olds are most likely smarter than me already, they have had a good start. Nothing like when i grew up and no one taught me how to drink correctly (yes, there is a correct way), tried to make me afraid of a plant/fungus etc. those days are kaput and good riddance to them. If you wear your morality in every day life, there is no other option but to be clear with everyone you have discourse with. Your kids more so.
lancifer


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A map of the world that does not include Utopia is not worth glancing at. O.Wilde

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InvisibleMushmanTheManic
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Registered: 04/21/05
Posts: 4,587
Re: Psychedelics and children [Re: Metasyn]
    #5192254 - 01/17/06 06:53 PM (18 years, 2 months ago)

The potential harm from giving a youngster drugs seems to outweigh the benefits.

But, thats other peoples children.... MY KIDS however I'm hoping to raise as schizophrenic drug-fueled super-intellegent fluoro sociopaths. :syringe: Imagine a bunch of little Charles Mansons running around shouting out gibberish, its gonna be so cute.

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InvisibleIcelander
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Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
Re: Psychedelics and children [Re: lancifer]
    #5192281 - 01/17/06 06:59 PM (18 years, 2 months ago)

Then if you're doing 7 grams of shrooms give your kids 7 grams.

Growing up in the 70s I got to meet some kids that took LSD when they were very  young. I don't think it did them any good by the way they were experiencing life when I met them.

Having said this. There may be conditions where it would be appropriate for children to use. But considering this culture and the way children are raised to be basically disenfranchised from themselves as is, I would still have to say NO.


And welcome to the Shroomery. :thumbup:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

Edited by Icelander (01/17/06 06:59 PM)

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Offlinelancifer
Stranger

Registered: 01/14/06
Posts: 82
Loc: Beautiful B.C.
Last seen: 18 years, 1 month
Re: Psychedelics and children [Re: MushmanTheManic]
    #5192302 - 01/17/06 07:02 PM (18 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

MushmanTheManic said:
The potential harm from giving a youngster drugs seems to outweigh the benefits.




I think people get caught up in simple statements or platitudes. The very word 'drug' conjures up some mad chemist boiling ever increasingly lethal doses of pesticides!
Give kids LSD...nope!
Give kids PCP...nope!
Let them eat a mushroom stem on an important date in their lives with sane adults around...yep!
Let them always drink ayahuasca if they can gag it down...yep!
Soothe a scrape with comfrey and cannabis salve...yep!
Ease the flu with a mild cannabis soup...yep!
There is a difference between 'drugs' and 'plants'.
lancifer


--------------------
A map of the world that does not include Utopia is not worth glancing at. O.Wilde

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