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Offlinewilshire
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question for alex
    #5133862 - 01/03/06 12:55 AM (18 years, 2 months ago)

would you prefer the US withdraw from iraq or maintain its presence there?


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Edited by wilshire (01/08/06 12:28 PM)

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InvisibleAlex213
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Registered: 08/22/05
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Re: question for alex123 [Re: wilshire]
    #5133872 - 01/03/06 12:59 AM (18 years, 2 months ago)

alex123

I don't know who this Alex123 is. Do you mean Alex213?

would you prefer the US withdraw from iraq

Yes.

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Offlinewilshire
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Re: question for alex123 [Re: Alex213]
    #5133882 - 01/03/06 01:02 AM (18 years, 2 months ago)

unless i'm mistaken, alex123 is the name you used to post under.

alex, what do you think would happen in iraq if the US pulled out?

also... this thread isn't just for alex231, but anyone who'd like to respond.


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Offlinegregorio
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Re: question for alex123 [Re: wilshire]
    #5134013 - 01/03/06 02:36 AM (18 years, 2 months ago)

It has gotten to the point that I no longer care what happens to Iraq if we pullout. We cant stay there forever. What happens...happens.

It is time the Iraqi's start taking responsibility for their own country; and if they are incapable of defending it, either from enemies abroad or from within, then they don't deserve to have their own country. The United States will just have to sit back and let the natural order of things run their course.

We cant stay their forever.

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InvisibleAlex213
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Re: question for alex123 [Re: wilshire]
    #5134043 - 01/03/06 03:27 AM (18 years, 2 months ago)

unless i'm mistaken

I'm sorry you must be mistaken. I've never heard of him. If you want to discuss this more take it to off topic as it's got nothing to do with politics.

alex, what do you think would happen in iraq if the US pulled out?


It's anybody's guess. That's why you don't launch wars in the first place unless you absolutely have to.

My guess is it would deflate the insurgency.

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Offlinewilshire
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Re: question for alex123 [Re: Alex213]
    #5134201 - 01/03/06 07:23 AM (18 years, 2 months ago)

It's anybody's guess.

so you have no prediction?

would things become more stable or less so? more violent or less so?


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InvisibleAlex213
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Re: question for alex123 [Re: wilshire]
    #5134300 - 01/03/06 09:00 AM (18 years, 2 months ago)

Did you see the last line of my previous post?

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Offlinewilshire
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Re: question for alex123 [Re: Alex213]
    #5134315 - 01/03/06 09:12 AM (18 years, 2 months ago)

you're an angry fella aren't you?

you sure you're not the same guy as alex123?


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Offlinewilshire
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Re: question for alex123 [Re: Alex213]
    #5134319 - 01/03/06 09:16 AM (18 years, 2 months ago)

if the insurgency would be deflated by the united states leaving iraq, for what purpose does the current administration maintain a presence there? it's expensive, in terms of lives, dollars, and votes. if you are correct that a pullout would deflate the insurgency, and presumably, military commanders with more information than you also realize this, for what purpose would they wish to keep troops in iraq?


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InvisibleAlex213
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Re: question for alex123 [Re: wilshire]
    #5134321 - 01/03/06 09:17 AM (18 years, 2 months ago)

you're an angry fella aren't you?


I'm a sweetheart. Your post simply didn't seem to take into account I'd said the insurgency would deflate so presumably you missed that bit.

you sure you're not the same guy as alex123?

Never heard of him.

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Invisiblelooner2
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Re: question for alex123 [Re: wilshire]
    #5134455 - 01/03/06 10:19 AM (18 years, 2 months ago)

What is the point? It is no secret the left doesn't care what happens in Iraq as long as America loses. They aren't hard to see through.


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I am in love with Acidic_Sloth


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OfflinePrajna
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Re: question for alex123 [Re: looner2]
    #5134781 - 01/03/06 12:48 PM (18 years, 2 months ago)

I don't really see how the right really cares what happens in Iraq either!

You have torn the joint apart, promised reconstruction, then bombed some more, built some nice permanent bases to forward project your power into the region, and now you are on to the next target...

Good job! :thumbup:


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Invisiblelooner2
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Re: question for alex123 [Re: Prajna]
    #5134996 - 01/03/06 01:40 PM (18 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Prajna said:
I don't really see how the right really cares what happens in Iraq either!




The right most definitely wants Iraq to succeed. How is that even in question?


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I am in love with Acidic_Sloth


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OfflineRedstorm
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Re: question for alex123 [Re: looner2]
    #5135069 - 01/03/06 01:58 PM (18 years, 2 months ago)

If the right cared enough about Iraq succeeding, they would stick it out and make sure it gets back up on its feet.

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OfflinePrajna
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Re: question for alex123 [Re: looner2]
    #5135103 - 01/03/06 02:05 PM (18 years, 2 months ago)

Ummm, what exactly have you guys done for Iraq?

I don't consider destroying what little infrastructure they had left, creating an environment that welcomes foreign terrorists and foreign influence...(alqueda and Iran)..., and killing between 25 - 100 thousand people to be a real boon to their society...

They now have a Shiite majority government that will probably align itself to the theocracy in Iran, and eventually lead it into a civil war for years to come...

Your president presented Iraq as a place to "fight them, so that we don't have to fight them here"...

How is that for caring about the Iraqi people?

Make their country into a battleground so that you are'nt fucking up your own neighborhood?

I know that you would probably support this, but I think the majority of your country has been misled...

So now that Iraq is a complete cluster fuck, and your troops have stable bases there and are safe, you will let the Iraqis degenerate into a giant power struggle for the vacuum...set them back to a point where it will take years to recover, and then move onto the next target...

You are now in a win-win situation, because you are the only stable power left in Iraq and if things there don't go you're way politically or economically you can very easily just re-insert yourself into the fray...

Tactically it's a great situation, but for the average Iraqi citizen it sucks, but then it shows that you don't really care about the Iraqi's at all anyway...

This whole "liberating" the Iraqi people thing is just a propaganda tool to gain public consent for an inhumane way of doing business...

It will work, but it is terrible...


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Invisiblelooner2
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Re: question for alex123 [Re: Prajna]
    #5135130 - 01/03/06 02:11 PM (18 years, 2 months ago)

You didn't answer the question. Just typical rant that made the claim:

I don't really see how the right really cares what happens in Iraq either!


and instead of justifying the position decided to answer:

Ummm, what exactly have you guys done for Iraq?

It is no mystery your kind doesn't see one thing good in Iraq, we know that. Spare us the endless doomsday analysis. Here is another chance to answer the question....

The right most definitely wants Iraq to succeed. How is that even in question?

Can you answer that?


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I am in love with Acidic_Sloth


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OfflinePrajna
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Re: question for alex123 [Re: looner2]
    #5135456 - 01/03/06 03:45 PM (18 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

looner2 said:
You didn't answer the question. Just typical rant that made the claim:

I don't really see how the right really cares what happens in Iraq either!


and instead of justifying the position decided to answer:

Ummm, what exactly have you guys done for Iraq?

It is no mystery your kind doesn't see one thing good in Iraq, we know that. Spare us the endless doomsday analysis. Here is another chance to answer the question....

The right most definitely wants Iraq to succeed. How is that even in question?

Can you answer that?




I just did!

sheesh...

No looner the people in power most definitely DO NOT CARE if the Iraqis "succeed", Iraq is a country under occupation who is being physically molded into being exactly what the U.S wants it to be...and the U.S government will have it no other way.

Has it ever crossed your mind that maybe the Iraqis don't want a democracy?

What if they want an Islamic theocracy like that which exists in Iran?

Would America except that?

What would you say if the Iraqis wanted a Communist government, with nuclear weapons, and no trade at all with the U.S at all?

Is it really up to them?

Their idea of "success", doesn't mean shit to the American government...

Your problem is that you cannot even FATHOM that there are people out there who DO NOT want it "the American way"...

America has an AGENDA in Iraq, and that trumps anything that the Iraqis might want...you of all people should know that...

It is soon to be nothing more than an American base for further deployment into the middle east...

Read the PNAC doctrine man, it's all spelled out there in black and white, this is not a "war on terrorism", it is an attempt to create a "Pax Americana", plain and simple...

And again, those currently in power DO NOT CARE about the "success" of the other countries in the plan, they only care about the "success" of America...


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Offlineelaspeinreason
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Re: question for alex123 [Re: Prajna]
    #5135492 - 01/03/06 03:59 PM (18 years, 2 months ago)

Iraq isn't being molded the way Americans seem fit , this isn't some country we annexed years ago , this is an ongoing war , PEOPLE HAVE GIVEN THERE LIVES, and noo one should ever utter the words " i dont care what happens" because if you could care less about Iraq then you are disgracing and not acknowledging the sacrifice that the soldiers have made. " it is soon to be an American base " - The Iraqi people are not pushovers , they dont accept it laying down. If anything they will always ( or at least until future generations ) be a half constituent of the American people. " Your problem is that you cannot even FATHOM that there are people out there who DO NOT want it "the American way"... " in regards to that statement i believe that you are absolutely right, they have there own agenda as well and believe that before any sort of " American way " lifestyle there will be a civil war. Although if you would like please digress on how the American Way ( the ideology NOT the actual way we sadly live our lives ) is such a bad concept ?

if you would like to discuss something pertinent to the Iraq war (\ without going back and forth at each other ) i suggest you work on an exit plan , or an alternative. otherwise you are ranting , and no one wants to hear it. AND IF YOU DIDN'T VOTE IN THE LAST ELECTION THAN PLEASE DO NOT ADD TO THIS CONVERSATION.


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Reality is merely an illusion, albeit a very persistent one

Diploid said:
What's with proclaiming freedom by abridging freedom? That makes no sense.

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OfflineThe_Red_Crayon
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Re: question for alex123 [Re: elaspeinreason]
    #5135672 - 01/03/06 04:57 PM (18 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

this is an ongoing war , PEOPLE HAVE GIVEN THERE LIVES, and noo one should ever utter the words " i dont care what happens" because if you could care less about Iraq then you are disgracing and not acknowledging the sacrifice that the soldiers have made. "




This logic scares me and quite frankly i see a lot of people with this code of thought. To me it doesnt seem right that the government is running our military into the ground. Situation in Iraq is not improving and in fact getting worse. Our total troop resources in Iraq about 150,000 troops is too small to police a country the size of Texas.

Second of all the absolute misuse of National Guard is ridiculous. National Guard and reserve units are supposed to stay at home and help natural disasters. Not be ran into the ground in Iraq. The complete waste of money Iraq has become is phenomenal... All this military equipment being degraded and depleted.

When 4 Iraqi Ragheads get a hold of a left over 105 mm artillery piece and rig it to a 30$ cellphone and destroy a 5 million dollar M1Abrahams or a Stryker. Who do you think will eventually win the war.

Quote:

You will kill 10 of our men, and we will kill 1 of yours, and in the end it will be you who tire of it.
Ho Chi Minh




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OfflinePrajna
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Re: question for alex123 [Re: elaspeinreason]
    #5135706 - 01/03/06 05:04 PM (18 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

elaspeinreason said:
Iraq isn't being molded the way Americans seem fit , this isn't some country we annexed years ago , this is an ongoing war , PEOPLE HAVE GIVEN THERE LIVES, and noo one should ever utter the words " i dont care what happens" because if you could care less about Iraq then you are disgracing and not acknowledging the sacrifice that the soldiers have made. " it is soon to be an American base " - The Iraqi people are not pushovers , they dont accept it laying down. If anything they will always ( or at least until future generations ) be a half constituent of the American people. " Your problem is that you cannot even FATHOM that there are people out there who DO NOT want it "the American way"... " in regards to that statement i believe that you are absolutely right, they have there own agenda as well and believe that before any sort of " American way " lifestyle there will be a civil war. Although if you would like please digress on how the American Way ( the ideology NOT the actual way we sadly live our lives ) is such a bad concept ?

if you would like to discuss something pertinent to the Iraq war (\ without going back and forth at each other ) i suggest you work on an exit plan , or an alternative. otherwise you are ranting , and no one wants to hear it. AND IF YOU DIDN'T VOTE IN THE LAST ELECTION THAN PLEASE DO NOT ADD TO THIS CONVERSATION.




I am not even from your country...

Does that mean I am not allowed to have an opinion?

It's an open forum man, and I will rant where I can, because people need to hear the other side sometimes, just because you don't agree with what I have to say doesn't mean that I have no right to say it...

I welcome disagreement, it changes my outlook and makes me a better person. Perhaps you should read the PNAC doctrine and then get back to me...

Because the conquest of Iraq has little to do with the Iraqi people and more to do with world domination...

You may not want to admit it but there is more to this than "the war on terrorism" or "WMD" or "liberation"...

And the sad fact of the matter is that the american government has little mind for the pawns that are destroyed for this goal...It is not me that doesn't care, it's them...


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