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 GabbaDj
BTH
Registered: 04/08/01
Posts: 19,682
Loc: By The Lake
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 Illegal My Ass.. 
#5087929 - 12/20/05 11:22 PM (18 years, 3 months ago) |
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I still say FUCK MY UNION...
With that said.. The NYC strike is not Illegal.
Talks went past the deadline, the talks then stalled time and time again and the workers at the advice of their union decided to strike..
I just watch a woman say on the news "we are all losing out pensions, we all have to pay for our health insurance"...
While I dont support 100% coverage by an employer, I do support pensions, pay raises and other employee benefits that counties and states have been trying to take away from workers..
If any employer should be held to set an example it should be the county and state employers.. Without that high bar set, companies have a free ticket to do whatever they want..
How can any of this be good for Americans?
ONE MILLION DOLLARS A DAY!... That is what a judge said is the fine for the union if they continue the strike.. Also employees will be fined two days pay for every day that they strike...
Several thousand AMERICANS will lose their homes, their retirements and their dreams and all because the city refuses to figure out alternative ways to provide the $$$ for its employees.
I hope that this foes on past the new years. I hope that people stand up and AMERICANS across the country protest this injustice.
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GabbaDj
FAMM.ORG
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 daimyo
Monticello
Registered: 05/13/04
Posts: 7,751
Last seen: 12 years, 2 months
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Re: Illegal My Ass.. [Re: GabbaDj]
#5087951 - 12/20/05 11:26 PM (18 years, 3 months ago) |
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Americans are too fat to stand up for anything other than more McDonalds.
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"I have sworn upon the altar of God eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man."
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lonestar2004
Live to party,work to affordit.
Registered: 10/03/04
Posts: 8,978
Loc: South Texas
Last seen: 13 years, 20 days
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Re: Illegal My Ass.. [Re: GabbaDj]
#5088004 - 12/20/05 11:41 PM (18 years, 3 months ago) |
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Estimated daily cost of a strike to the city - $400,000,000
Average Salary for a Subway/Bus operator - $62,000
Starting Salary for a NYPD Police officer - $25,100
Trying to get support from a public that makes less money (on average), will get less salary increases (3.5% versus the TWU's request for 8%), and will have to work over a decade longer (TWU retires at 55)....while making them walk to work in 25 degree weather - Priceless
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America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"
We have "reckless fiscal policies"
America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.
Americans deserve better
Barack Obama
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Seuss
Error: divide byzero
Registered: 04/27/01
Posts: 23,480
Loc: Caribbean
Last seen: 2 months, 6 days
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Re: Illegal My Ass.. [Re: GabbaDj]
#5088476 - 12/21/05 03:51 AM (18 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
The NYC strike is not Illegal.
Talks went past the deadline, the talks then stalled time and time again and the workers at the advice of their union decided to strike..
http://edition.cnn.com/2005/US/12/20/nyc.transit/index.html:
Quote:
NEW YORK (CNN) -- A judge ruled a strike by New York transit workers illegal on Tuesday afternoon, while millions of commuters battled their way home in frigid temperatures.
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Just another spore in the wind.
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looner2
ABBA fan
Registered: 06/20/04
Posts: 3,849
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Quote:
lonestar2004 said:
Estimated daily cost of a strike to the city - $400,000,000
Average Salary for a Subway/Bus operator - $62,000
Starting Salary for a NYPD Police officer - $25,100
Trying to get support from a public that makes less money (on average), will get less salary increases (3.5% versus the TWU's request for 8%), and will have to work over a decade longer (TWU retires at 55)....while making them walk to work in 25 degree weather - Priceless
I can't fathom those kind of benefits. These aren't air traffic controllers or anything. How much skill does it take to collect bus tickets? I say we ship some illegal immigrants up there. That will show how much their job is worth.
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I am in love with Acidic_Sloth
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psilomonkey
Twisted brainwrong of a oneoff man mental
Registered: 08/08/03
Posts: 812
Loc: Airstrip One
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We have almost exactly the same union problems with London Underground. The ultra-lefty leader of the RMT (Rail, Maritime and Transport Workers Union) Bob Crowe is very keen on strike action, as he knows they can hold the city to ransom. They get paid similar amounts, about 32,000 ukp, plus lots of benefits.
Thatcher brought in very tough anti-union legislation, to the point that an illegal strike would pretty much end the RMT, (their assets frozen, leaders possibly jailed), but they still strike after a ballot, usually favouring one-day strikes to hit city business.
We even have a song about them... http://www.backingblair.co.uk/london_underground/ (explicit lyrics)
(not sure why backingblair are hosting it, but its what google came up with)
Edited by psilomonkey (12/21/05 06:25 AM)
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GabbaDj
BTH
Registered: 04/08/01
Posts: 19,682
Loc: By The Lake
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Re: Illegal My Ass.. [Re: looner2]
#5088898 - 12/21/05 08:47 AM (18 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
I can't fathom those kind of benefits. These aren't air traffic controllers or anything. How much skill does it take to collect bus tickets? I say we ship some illegal immigrants up there. That will show how much their job is worth.
Its not about how hard the job is or how skilled a person must be.. Its all about paying your citizens a liveable wage..
60K a year isnt shit in New York. People used to be able to buy a home, save for retirement and send their kids to college on 60K a year and one income homes were the American way of life..
Now, even in the rural states, these wages are forcing people to make sacrafices unherd of by our Grandparrents.
Its the cities job to take care of its citizens and when they fail to take care of even their employees its jsut a warning sign of bad things comming...
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GabbaDj
FAMM.ORG
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rawtoxic
Stranger
Registered: 10/06/02
Posts: 2,097
Loc: smokey mountains
Last seen: 13 years, 7 months
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Re: Illegal My Ass.. [Re: GabbaDj]
#5088943 - 12/21/05 08:57 AM (18 years, 3 months ago) |
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60K is a pretty liveable wage. Out-of-pocket cost yearly for an employer has to be to close $75K+ (benefits, etc).
5K a month - That should put some campbells soup on the table plus a little escargot.
County workers in my county make like $12.50 an hour with benefits. I applied for a pot hole filling job a while ago. That is around 26K a year.
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looner2
ABBA fan
Registered: 06/20/04
Posts: 3,849
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Re: Illegal My Ass.. [Re: GabbaDj]
#5088989 - 12/21/05 09:15 AM (18 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
GabbaDj said:
Quote:
I can't fathom those kind of benefits. These aren't air traffic controllers or anything. How much skill does it take to collect bus tickets? I say we ship some illegal immigrants up there. That will show how much their job is worth.
Its not about how hard the job is or how skilled a person must be.. Its all about paying your citizens a liveable wage..
60K a year isnt shit in New York. People used to be able to buy a home, save for retirement and send their kids to college on 60K a year and one income homes were the American way of life..
Now, even in the rural states, these wages are forcing people to make sacrafices unherd of by our Grandparrents.
Its the cities job to take care of its citizens and when they fail to take care of even their employees its jsut a warning sign of bad things comming...
Absolutely ridiculous. The poor ticket punchers can't afford the condo in manhattan? Boo hoo. With 60,000 a year, move into the suburbs and even further surrounding the city. Commute an hour or so a day and live in towns that are much less expensive.
Sacrices unheard of by our grandparents? Do you expect a real response from that? Seriously, is your entire post satire?
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I am in love with Acidic_Sloth
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zappaisgod
horrid asshole
Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 7 years, 10 months
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Re: Illegal My Ass.. [Re: GabbaDj]
#5089044 - 12/21/05 09:31 AM (18 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
GabbaDj said:
Quote:
I can't fathom those kind of benefits. These aren't air traffic controllers or anything. How much skill does it take to collect bus tickets? I say we ship some illegal immigrants up there. That will show how much their job is worth.
Its not about how hard the job is or how skilled a person must be.. Its all about paying your citizens a liveable wage..
Bullshit. Lazy ass trash can emptiers are not worth the same money as a plumber. If all you can do is empty 47 trash cans a day then maybe you shouldn't have kids. Bus drivers, yeah there's a toughie. Mechanics, prevailing wage for mechanics in private employ in NYC
Bus & Truck Mechanics & Diesel Engine Specialists $48,730 $51,390 $35,050 $55,570
49-3042 Mobile Heavy Equipment Mechanics, Except Engines $49,100 $46,880 $28,580 $59,360
see below for category explanation
Quote:
60K a year isnt shit in New York. People used to be able to buy a home, save for retirement and send their kids to college on 60K a year and one income homes were the American way of life..
LIE
"New York City Region
Wage data are from the 2000, 2001, 2002, 2003 and 2004 OES survey, and have been adjusted to second quarter 2005 by making cost-of-living adjustments.
SOC Code Title Annual Wages ($)
Mean Median Entry * Experienced**
00-0000 Total, All Occupations $50,250 $38,470 $19,670 $65,540
http://www.labor.state.ny.us/workforceindustrydata/apps.asp?reg=nyc&app=wages
Whether 1 income homes used to be or not is irrelevant. What is relevant is that those days are gone for everybody else. What, you think you're special? Shut the fuck up and get back to work. Everybody else except cops and firemen retire at 65, not all with pensions and not all with health insurance. Shut the fuck up and get back to work. TWU workers, anybody can be one. Easily replacable. YOU ARE ALREADY OVERPAID.
Quote:
Now, even in the rural states, these wages are forcing people to make sacrafices unherd of by our Grandparrents.
Its the cities job to take care of its citizens and when they fail to take care of even their employees its jsut a warning sign of bad things comming...
You are already well taken care of. Too well. The Pied Piper of morons, Toussaint, has led you down a pretty ugly path. Even your International leadership has offered to step in and says you're being assholes. Shut the fuck up and get back to work. It is the extortionate bastards of the TWU who are screwing the citizens of NYC with their ILLEGAL job action. You do know what illegal means, don't you? It means that there is a law being violated, in this case, the Taylor law, which gave them the right to collective bargaining at the price of not being able to strike. They want the right to strike, then we rescind their right to collective bargaining. I'm sure with all their valuable skills they'll be able to findiing highly lucrative jobs in a competitive free market.
It's the cities job to take care of ALL of it's citizens. Every nickel spent on whiny Transit workers comes out of some other person's pocket, whether it's a worker in another field or the taxpayer. They have it too good already. A monkey's wage for a monkeys work. What, you want a twelfth paid day off? Give me a fucking break. They don't get anywhere near the abuse they deserve or are going to get in the future.
The MTA offer is more than fair. The strike is illegal. And Toussaint is fucking the membership for his own aggrandizement.
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zappaisgod
horrid asshole
Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 7 years, 10 months
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Re: Illegal My Ass.. [Re: rawtoxic]
#5089065 - 12/21/05 09:37 AM (18 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
rawtoxic said:
60K is a pretty liveable wage. Out-of-pocket cost yearly for an employer has to be to close $75K+ (benefits, etc).
For a little reality check
60K gross
5K FICA
5K Pension (guess here)
1K unemployment and disability
10K Workers comp ( this will vary by job but is probably about a good average)
7K Health ins (Cheaper than it would cost a private individual with a family of 4)
Close to 90K actual cost
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lonestar2004
Live to party,work to affordit.
Registered: 10/03/04
Posts: 8,978
Loc: South Texas
Last seen: 13 years, 20 days
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Re: Illegal My Ass.. [Re: GabbaDj]
#5089084 - 12/21/05 09:42 AM (18 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
GabbaDj said:
Its the cities job to take care of its citizens and when they fail to take care of even their employees its jsut a warning sign of bad things comming...
is that statement a joke??
how ironic, the taxpayer pays the public employee to take care of them....
"This strike causes not only inconvenience, but hardship and suffering as well. The TWU workers want respect, but they show no respect for us."
"I'm a little tired of walking on this bridge when something happens," said Timothy Arthur, 38, a security guard hiking across the Manhattan Bridge from his home in Fort Greene, Brooklyn, to his job at a downtown investment company.
"This is not a big thing or a disaster or an attack. This is about a contract. I've got a contract, too. I'm honoring it," he said. "And you know what? I'm really, really cold."
Nancy Torres, 27, hoofed the 12 miles from her home in Queens to her job as a receptionist at a dentist's office near Ground Zero. "My back is hurting, but I'll be fine," said the single mother of four, who was soldiering along Queens Blvd. in Sunnyside.
"The strike is extortion against everyone in New York, especially the riders, many of whom are worse off than the strikers."
http://www.nydailynews.com/front/story/376574p-319918c.html
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America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"
We have "reckless fiscal policies"
America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.
Americans deserve better
Barack Obama
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rawtoxic
Stranger
Registered: 10/06/02
Posts: 2,097
Loc: smokey mountains
Last seen: 13 years, 7 months
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lonestar: Where did you get the $60k a year figure from?
Zappaisgod: thanks for correcting my figures I was low balling with $75K  and I align with your opinions.
I have a feeling these people REALLY don't make that much money, I can't find it written anywhere.
Lots of peoples with bachelors make a little more than half of that.
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zappaisgod
horrid asshole
Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 7 years, 10 months
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Re: Illegal My Ass.. [Re: rawtoxic]
#5089273 - 12/21/05 10:28 AM (18 years, 3 months ago) |
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Their pay is slightly above that for average NYC dwellers in all the categories I listed: average, starting, experienced.
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Baby_Hitler
Errorist
Registered: 03/06/02
Posts: 27,652
Loc: To the limit!
Last seen: 50 minutes, 26 seconds
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Re: Illegal My Ass.. [Re: GabbaDj]
#5089950 - 12/21/05 01:18 PM (18 years, 3 months ago) |
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You will all soon be replaced by robots.
Plumbers too.
So you goin to work or not boy? Huh?
Hup! HUP!
Cross that line, be a rebel/hero.
Baby Hitler commands you!!!
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This space for rent
Edited by Baby_Hitler (12/21/05 01:22 PM)
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lonestar2004
Live to party,work to affordit.
Registered: 10/03/04
Posts: 8,978
Loc: South Texas
Last seen: 13 years, 20 days
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Re: Illegal My Ass.. [Re: rawtoxic]
#5090003 - 12/21/05 01:28 PM (18 years, 3 months ago) |
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"At present, monopolist NYC Transit train operators have a starting salary of $52,644. Police officers and firefighters currently start at $25,100 while sanitation workers start at $26,000."
http://www.lewrockwell.com/orig6/brennan5.html
The offer called for a 9 percent wage increase, phased in over three years. The union demanded annual 8 percent raises for three years. Currently, train operators, station agents and cleaners earn an annual base salary of between $47,000 and $55,000.
http://cbs2chicago.com/business/finance_story_352155621.html
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America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"
We have "reckless fiscal policies"
America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.
Americans deserve better
Barack Obama
Edited by lonestar2004 (12/21/05 01:31 PM)
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daimyo
Monticello
Registered: 05/13/04
Posts: 7,751
Last seen: 12 years, 2 months
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$50K a year to clean? That takes the meaning right out of "If I can make it there, I'll make it anywhere".
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"I have sworn upon the altar of God eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man."
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The_Red_Crayon
Exposer of Truth
Registered: 08/13/03
Posts: 13,673
Loc: Smokey Mtns. TN 
Last seen: 6 years, 11 months
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Re: Illegal My Ass.. [Re: GabbaDj]
#5091061 - 12/21/05 06:45 PM (18 years, 3 months ago) |
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Things like this could easily spark a riot. I wouldnt tread on this situation lightly. People need to realize that when an entire industry is threatening a strike something serious has to be dont to compromise the situation.
What we get here is two hardheads both giving eachother a hard time. Ever heard of the Great Rail Strike of 1877
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GabbaDj
BTH
Registered: 04/08/01
Posts: 19,682
Loc: By The Lake
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Re: Illegal My Ass.. [Re: daimyo]
#5091095 - 12/21/05 06:54 PM (18 years, 3 months ago) |
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Are you all Canadian?
How is it that you can all be against better living for American workers?
$60K or even $80K isnt that much for anyone to live on. In California the association of Realtors announced that an average home need an income of $130K to afford a home. In NY its the same.
America was founded on workers fighting for better conditions and fair pay, Unions were started to provide this for them and they continue to fight for all of us, not just for the union members...
How can sooooo many people be so blind?
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GabbaDj
FAMM.ORG
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bukkake
Registered: 05/28/05
Posts: 2,764
Loc: Classified
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Re: Illegal My Ass.. [Re: GabbaDj]
#5091121 - 12/21/05 07:01 PM (18 years, 3 months ago) |
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Those against the strike continue the Social Darwinist climate both Democrats and Republicans have instilled in us, meant to turn us against one another. But hey, it has worked, especially as showcased in this thread. Commuters are furious with the workers, the workers furious with the state that fucks them over. And those against the workers mention those who are even less paid and fucked over.
As one who relies on public transportation myself, I would especially be infuriated with NJTransit if they deserted me at my usual stops to both work and college. Not that they usually and casually routinely don't anyway. I have found they show up whenever the hell they feel like it. I feel both the pain of the commuters and the workers. Especially around this time of season...
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