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InvisibleOneMoreRobot3021
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Republicans have a lot in common with the Taliban
    #3902054 - 03/11/05 10:36 AM (19 years, 12 days ago)

from dailykos.com, really well put I might add:

Once upon a time, it was easy for the American Right to smear its opponents on the left -- they could simply equate them with the nation's communist enemies. It didn't matter that the American "left" (Democrats) had more in common with the Right than international communism, the smear was useful.

Now, however, our international enemy -- Islamic radicalism -- is actually the polar opposite of what liberals stand for -- their actions on women rights are deplorable, they insist on theocracy, they loooveee torture and the death penalty, they demand to control the culture (TV, movies, music), they rail against rampant sexuality, they seek to spread their ideology via force, and they have a well-defined black-and-white sense of truth.

Remind you of a certain American party?

That's why hysterical assertions by the wingers that liberals hate America and want the terrorists to win are so absurd. As absurd as it would've been to claim that Reagan wanted the Communists to win the Cold War. The Taliban/Al Qaida/Hezbollah/Jihadists of the world are the exact embodiment of evil in the liberal mind. They are everything we are against, and against everything we are for.

In fact, they are exactly what we see in the Republican Party as the GOP continues to consolidate power -- creeping theocracy, moralizing, us versus them, embrace of torture, the need to constantly declare jihad on someone, hysterics over football-game nipples, control over "decency" on the airwaves, lyrics censorship, hostility to women freedoms, curtaling of civil liberties, and so on.

So it's pretty obvious -- we don't love terrorists. We don't want them to win. For them to win would be to realize our greatest fears. The muslim terrorist is truly the anti-liberal. Like matter and anti-matter.

Republicans, on the other hand, hate the terrorists because they're Muslim. But aside from that, they've got far more in common than they'll ever admit to themselves.

And it's high time we started to make that connection more forcefully.


--------------------
Acid doesn't give you truths; it builds machines that push the envelope of perception. Whatever revelations came to me then have dissolved like skywriting. All I really know is that those few years saddled me with a faith in the redemptive potential of the imagination which, however flat, stale and unprofitable the world seems to me now, I cannot for the life of me shake.

-Erik Davis

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InvisibleRandalFlagg
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Registered: 06/15/02
Posts: 15,608
Re: Republicans have a lot in common with the Taliban [Re: OneMoreRobot3021]
    #3902158 - 03/11/05 10:56 AM (19 years, 12 days ago)


In fact, they are exactly what we see in the Republican Party as the GOP continues to consolidate power

their actions on women rights are deplorable

What actions against women's rights have Republicans made?


they insist on theocracy

I don't think the Republicans insist on theocracy. They definately pander to Christians, but I don't see them doing anything like enforcing certain religious beliefs upon people.


they loooveee torture

What does this article mean by torture?


they demand to control the culture (TV, movies, music)

They don't demand to control the culture, but they do seem to try to enforce a certain standard when it comes to obscenity. Most Americans seem to agree with that.


they rail against rampant sexuality

So?


they seek to spread their ideology via force

Every extreme ideological or religious element attempts to do this.


and they have a well-defined black-and-white sense of truth.

And what is wrong with that?


By the way, I'm not a Republican. There are some definite nutballs in the Republican Party. And as a whole, the Republican Party does things I don't like. I just think it gets tiring to see baseless and hysterical attacks leveled against them about how they want to oppress women and shit like that. I've never seen them try to do stuff like that.

If people want to criticize the Republicans, I think they need to be more accurate with their complaints. They should criticize them for running up massive deficits, pandering to the Christians too much, and having at times overly aggressive foreign and covert policies.

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InvisibleRandalFlagg
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Re: Republicans have a lot in common with the Taliban [Re: OneMoreRobot3021]
    #3902460 - 03/11/05 11:49 AM (19 years, 12 days ago)

Another weird thing I have noticed about the far Left and the far Right:

The far Left way of thinking is much more prevalent in movies, TV shows, general media, and the youth of America. I tend to be more hostile to the far Left than the far Right. I think this is because I notice far Leftism much more in popular culture than I notice far Rightism. It seems whereever I turn I am confronted with political correctness, militant feminism, and pretentious liberals.

However, far Leftism seems to have very little political power. It seems to be a toothless yet brash ideology that has little hope of being instituted at the moment. How many far Left politicians do you see? Practically none.

Certain elements of the far Right are ridiculed(the racists for example), but other far Right elements have some power(the very conservative Christians for example).

It's really strange...the far Left has the most cultural exposure, but the far Right has more political power. That is a weird combination.

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InvisibleAnnapurna1
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Re: Republicans have a lot in common with the Taliban [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #3902854 - 03/11/05 12:38 PM (19 years, 12 days ago)

yeah right..like faux news is much too liberal...


--------------------


"anchor blocks counteract the process of pontiprobation..while omalean globes regulize the pressure"...

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InvisibleRandalFlagg
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Re: Republicans have a lot in common with the Taliban [Re: Annapurna1]
    #3903066 - 03/11/05 01:15 PM (19 years, 12 days ago)

Fox News is only one news network. That network and a lot of programming on AM radio are the only instances of Rightish media I can think of. Everything else in the media (TV shows, movies, music, and popular culture) is anywhere from being slightly Left to extremely Left.

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InvisibletrendalM
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Re: Republicans have a lot in common with the Taliban [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #3903274 - 03/11/05 01:57 PM (19 years, 12 days ago)

What actions against women's rights have Republicans made?

Abortion rights?


Extreme anything is a silly stance to have, be it a Liberal or a Conservative viewpoint.


--------------------
Once, men turned their thinking over to machines in the hope that this would set them free.
But that only permitted other men with machines to enslave them.

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Invisibletrick

Registered: 10/22/04
Posts: 1,059
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Re: Republicans have a lot in common with the Taliban [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #3903282 - 03/11/05 02:00 PM (19 years, 12 days ago)

Wow, this article is complete bullshit. First off, it's not the "republicans" that are the problem, it's the neoconservatives when it comes to issues like this. Republicans are just blindfolded and told to follow the neocons. "Liberals" are certainly not very liberal and are just republicans with slick rhetoric. As far as the left being the thing for popular culture right now, that's certainly true. I think in part that it also distorts people from real leftist views and principles and turns liberalism into a joke. As far as Faux News goes, it's just like every other major news network. Which is why i choose independent media sources. As for me, i guess you could say i'm an anarchist. :smile:

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InvisibletrendalM
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Re: Republicans have a lot in common with the Taliban [Re: trick]
    #3903310 - 03/11/05 02:06 PM (19 years, 12 days ago)

I laughed my ass off last night when Jon Stewart actually came out and said that all the 24-hour news channels do is lie :lol:

Hey, at least someone on TV is saying it :smirk:


--------------------
Once, men turned their thinking over to machines in the hope that this would set them free.
But that only permitted other men with machines to enslave them.

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InvisiblePsychoactive1984
PositiveCynicist
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Re: Republicans have a lot in common with the Taliban [Re: trendal]
    #3903422 - 03/11/05 02:26 PM (19 years, 12 days ago)

Nice slant... (mind you very I'm liberal)... But I'm sure if you wanted to you can take some far examples of certain groups that are very "left" and talk about their detriment as well... This doesn't prove shit, other then its own bias.

grrr, I hate all this you're either right or left political bias.  :crazy:


--------------------
"Their is one overriding question that concerns us all: How can we get out of the fatal groove we are in, the one that is leading towards the brink?" Albert Szent-Gyorgyi
"We may not be capable of eradicating the corruption of reason, but we must nevertheless counter it at every instance and with every means." Dan Agin
"Politics is the best religion and politicians are the worst followers."
-It's ok to trip as long as you don't fall.
-Substance over Style.
-Common sense is uncommon.

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InvisibletrendalM
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Re: Republicans have a lot in common with the Taliban [Re: Psychoactive1984]
    #3903870 - 03/11/05 03:54 PM (19 years, 12 days ago)

No shit. It's just a way for people to find other groups of people to hate.

In reality, trying to say that all humans are "Left" or "Right" (aside from which hand you use) is completely pointless. Obviously humans populate the entire political spectrum - not simply two sides of a coin.


--------------------
Once, men turned their thinking over to machines in the hope that this would set them free.
But that only permitted other men with machines to enslave them.

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InvisibleRandalFlagg
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Re: Republicans have a lot in common with the Taliban [Re: trendal]
    #3903961 - 03/11/05 04:24 PM (19 years, 12 days ago)


What actions against women's rights have Republicans made?


Abortion rights?

It could be argued that they are attempting to protect an unborn life, and therefore a woman's convenience does not count as a "right".

Edited by RandalFlagg (03/11/05 04:25 PM)

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InvisibleRandalFlagg
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Re: Republicans have a lot in common with the Taliban [Re: trendal]
    #3903983 - 03/11/05 04:31 PM (19 years, 12 days ago)


No shit. It's just a way for people to find other groups of people to hate.

I don't like the "Left/Right" categorization game myself, but unfortunately it fits a lot of people. Stereotypes are sometimes there for a reason. I have met people hopelessly brainwashed by both the Left and the Right. If people are going to allow themselves to confined by ready-made ideas and blindly follow a particular ideology, I have every right to categorize them when I speak of them. They are the ones who have categorized themselves.

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OfflineCatalysis
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Re: Republicans have a lot in common with the Taliban [Re: OneMoreRobot3021]
    #3904115 - 03/11/05 05:07 PM (19 years, 12 days ago)

Quote:

Republicans, on the other hand, hate the terrorists because they're Muslim.




Do not forget that democrats are the ones with a KKK member in their ranks and they are responsible for the 83-day filibuster of the civil rights act in '77. Republicans are called racists because of their fiscal policies but if you look at history, the dems are always the ones on the wrong side. Even going back to lincoln, as a republican president he is the one who declared all slaves in the confederacy free.

This idea of the right being racists is probably one of the biggest misconceptions about conservatives. Just take Bush's cabinet as an example compared to past democratic cabinets.

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Invisibletrick

Registered: 10/22/04
Posts: 1,059
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Re: Republicans have a lot in common with the Taliban [Re: Catalysis]
    #3904137 - 03/11/05 05:12 PM (19 years, 12 days ago)

Quote:

Catalysis said:
Quote:

Republicans, on the other hand, hate the terrorists because they're Muslim.




Do not forget that democrats are the ones with a KKK member in their ranks and they are responsible for the 83-day filibuster of the civil rights act in '77. Republicans are called racists because of their fiscal policies but if you look at history, the dems are always the ones on the wrong side. Even going back to lincoln, as a republican president he is the one who declared all slaves in the confederacy free.

This idea of the right being racists is probably one of the biggest misconceptions about conservatives. Just take Bush's cabinet as an example compared to past democratic cabinets.




This is one of the points i like to bring up with dealing with misconceptions and peoples' preconceptions. I think that the majority of both parties are racist whether it's covert or overt. Real conservatives aren't even around in major politics today, it's just neoconservatives.

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InvisibleDirtMcgirt
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Re: Republicans have a lot in common with the Taliban [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #3904249 - 03/11/05 05:41 PM (19 years, 12 days ago)

Quote:

Everything else in the media (TV shows, movies, music, and popular culture) is anywhere from being slightly Left to extremely Left.





I love it whe you victim-culture righties say this. Ever since the world saw on TV what a douche Nixon was in person the republicans have been whining about how all forms of communication are liberal. Sure, artists have tendancy to be liberal but the media does not have a slant left to far left at all. Superficial sensationalism doesn not equate bias. Republicans just love to shine their victim badge. Liberals are just as disappointed with the MSM as conservatives.


Pop culture is just that-popular culture, or lowest common denomiator. So you must be asserting that the majority of the country is liberal.

TV shows? see above. How about every cop show, or family values sitcom? These make up half of the television schedule. For every will and grace there are 5 full houses. Are these pandering to an inherint left bias? I don't think so. I don't think I need to argue what slant the owners of these entities have. Don't they really have the final say as to what is aired/published etc?

you got me on music but the rest of your quote is pure brainwashed conservative bellyaching.


--------------------
"And we, inhabitants of the great coral of the Cosmos, believe the atom (which still we cannot see) to be full matter, whereas, it too, like everything else, is but an embroidery of voids in the Void, and we give the name of being, dense and even eternal, to that dance of inconsistencies, that infinite extension that is identified with absolute Nothingness and that spins from its own non-being the illusion of everything."

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Invisiblemantis
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Re: Republicans have a lot in common with the Taliban [Re: Catalysis]
    #3904268 - 03/11/05 05:49 PM (19 years, 12 days ago)

Quote:

Catalysis said:
Do not forget that democrats are the ones with a KKK member in their ranks and they are responsible for the 83-day filibuster of the civil rights act in '77.



You mean the Southern Dixiecrats who largely converted to the Republican Party or are Democrat only in name? Strom Thurmond comes to mind. The Civil Rights Act was still passed with a Democratically-controlled congress.

Better luck next round!


--------------------

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InvisibleRandalFlagg
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Re: Republicans have a lot in common with the Taliban [Re: DirtMcgirt]
    #3904440 - 03/11/05 06:37 PM (19 years, 12 days ago)


I love it whe you victim-culture righties say this.

the media does not have a slant left to far left at all.

There are two types of media. One is for information and the other is entertainment.

There are many factions with different biases in the information media (from cable news channels to newspapers). Don't you find it strange at all that Fox News is reviled for its conservative slant, yet CNN, PBS, and NPR don't take as much heat for their liberal slant?


Sure, artists have tendancy to be liberal


The entertainment media is made up of artists! And since you just admitted that they tend to be liberal, you just proved my point. Who do you think makes the music, movies, and TV shows that people watch?


Superficial sensationalism doesn not equate bias.

Superficial sensationalism DOES equate to bias. Using hyperbole to try to get people to think like you is bias.


Republicans just love to shine their victim badge.

Every ideological group loves to wear the victim badge.


Pop culture is just that-popular culture, or lowest common denomiator. So you must be asserting that the majority of the country is liberal.

No, I don't think the majority of the country is liberal. I think that the majority of the entertainment media which we are exposed to is liberal.


These make up half of the television schedule. For every will and grace there are 5 full houses. Are these pandering to an inherint left bias?

How many times in the mainstream entertainment media have you seen obviously Leftish politically correct viewpoints pushed forward? How many times have you seen the girl portrayed as "spunky, original, smart, and tough" and the co-starring boy portrayed as being stupid and infantile? How many times have you seen shows or movies that addressed racism in a very condescending, heavy-handed, and preachy fashion? How many times have you seen well-off characters portrayed in horrible ways and poor people portrayed in positive ways? This is classic underdog worshipping that is inherent with the Left. It is everywhere in mainstream culture.

Look at how "Bowling for Columbine" or "Fahrenheit 9/11" was received. Micheal Moore(who is a blatant Lefty) received accolades for both films. Could you imagine Right-wing versions of those documentaries making it in the mainstream? They would be mercilessly attacked in the entertainment and information media.

However, I will add that there are bastions of Right-Wing thinking in mainstream culture too. Look at Fox News. Look at some of the nutjobs on AM radio. Those are just as odious in my opinion as Left-slanted pop culture.

That said, I think most Americans are pretty much Centrists. They are not far-Left and they are not far-Right. The far Left and far Right either annoy or outright frighten most people. Unfortunately, the more extreme you are in this country, the more attention you get and the more other people are likely to associate these extremes with political groups. Because of this we get a skewed picture of what people are in this country and in the world.

Edited by RandalFlagg (03/11/05 06:45 PM)

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InvisibleDirtMcgirt
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Re: Republicans have a lot in common with the Taliban [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #3904924 - 03/11/05 09:06 PM (19 years, 12 days ago)

Quote:

There are two types of media. One is for information and the other is entertainment.

There are many factions with different biases in the information media (from cable news channels to newspapers). Don't you find it strange at all that Fox News is reviled for its conservative slant, yet CNN, PBS, and NPR don't take as much heat for their liberal slant?





CNN NPR and PBS don't because they have way higher standards of journalism in comparision to fox news. They do receive tons of flak for there liberal bias. If fox news didn't present their bias in such a shamless fashion the flak would be equal I feel. MSNBC doesn't receive any flak for its conservative bias. Not even as much as CBS does for its own bias.


Quote:

The entertainment media is made up of artists! And since you just admitted that they tend to be liberal, you just proved my point. Who do you think makes the music, movies, and TV shows that people watch?




Thats the thinking that feeds this myth. The entertainment media is like 10% artists and 90% businessmen. The business men decide what to expose the culture to and they think in numbers and money-not politics.


Quote:

Every ideological group loves to wear the victim badge.




very true. IMO the republicans pander to the American victim culture WAY more often than the Dems. Reps piss and moan about the NY times all the time but how often does a dem whine about the wall street journal? Its all propagated by the Reps and they have no need to stop because there constituancy believes it so much and it works to their advantage. Its a political manuever and thats it.



Quote:

How many times in the mainstream entertainment media have you seen obviously Leftish politically correct viewpoints pushed forward? How many times have you seen the girl portrayed as "spunky, original, smart, and tough" and the co-starring boy portrayed as being stupid and infantile? How many times have you seen shows or movies that addressed racism in a very condescending, heavy-handed, and preachy fashion? How many times have you seen well-off characters portrayed in horrible ways and poor people portrayed in positive ways?




Tons of times. I would argue the inverse to these examples is true as well. The football player with the dumb bitch cheerleader girlfriend and the stay-at-home-mom. The news media working up a frenzy whenever a pretty white girl is raped and murdered but never when some Native american gets it. And poor destitute people and neighborhoods being treated as a some foriegn wasteland filled with worthless souls in TV and Movies. The Army and war worship. Again action movies are always against some evil bogeymen foriegners(commie, Arabs). I need not even mention the Clinton's oral sex in the white house and the I did not inhale BS. Bush doesn't get this kind of daily flak from the news even now that his pot use has become public recently.

All this amounts to nothing though. BAd crappy writing is a staple in TV and infotainment. It does not constitute a political bias.


Quote:

This is classic underdog worshipping that is inherent with the Left. It is everywhere in mainstream culture.




Welcome to America. The underdog is what Americans have always rooted for. We still see ourselves as the underdog even as we sit on top on the world becasue so many people take pot shots at us. It all feed this. Again, this is not left-oriented but just is a testament to the lameness of MSM.


Quote:

Look at how "Bowling for Columbine" or "Fahrenheit 9/11" was received. Micheal Moore(who is a blatant Lefty) received accolades for both films. Could you imagine Right-wing versions of those documentaries making it in the mainstream? They would be mercilessly attacked in the entertainment and information media.




Micheal moore's film did make a large impact with people and got a lot of exposure. This was in part due to the right bitching about it. How about "Passion of the Christ?" That was received with tons of accolade and wasn't very original or good in the same scope as Moore isn't. It was just was a hack job of other movies and books about Jesus' crucifixtion but made tons of money and had tons of exposure. I will give you the film acadamy is leftist but like you said talk show hosts on the radio and cable news networks offset this.


Quote:

That said, I think most Americans are pretty much Centrists. They are not far-Left and they are not far-Right. The far Left and far Right either annoy or outright frighten most people. Unfortunately, the more extreme you are in this country, the more attention you get and the more other people are likely to associate these extremes with political groups. Because of this we get a skewed picture of what people are in this country and in the world.





I totally agree with this. But again a horribly bad and irritating pop culture does not constitute a bias. This comes from both right and left who both say the the MSM and pop culture are in bed with the other side. Its all whining about how bad and unbearable it is and the blame is placed on the favorite scapegoat ideology.


--------------------
"And we, inhabitants of the great coral of the Cosmos, believe the atom (which still we cannot see) to be full matter, whereas, it too, like everything else, is but an embroidery of voids in the Void, and we give the name of being, dense and even eternal, to that dance of inconsistencies, that infinite extension that is identified with absolute Nothingness and that spins from its own non-being the illusion of everything."

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Offlinebiglo
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Re: Republicans have a lot in common with the Taliban [Re: DirtMcgirt]
    #3905326 - 03/11/05 11:06 PM (19 years, 12 days ago)

Allright, let me settle this right wing/left wing bullshit (or at least try :wink: )

There is no "news" any more, it's just events that happen that people decide are newsworthy.  The worlds of Entertainment and News have become one.  Our news now is for entertainment.  Why?  Because people don't have the attention span for investigative journalism (unless it supports either a left or right bias), so we just like to hear highlights.  I hate Fox news because it barely has any credibility, but I can't resist watching every now and then because they make the news damn entertaining.  All the urgent sounds and headlines.  Even the local news sucks. 

It's all about "Heroin bust/death/is coming for YOU!", house fires, murders, robberies, weather, and is pretty much filler the rest of the broadcast.  It's all about getting the money shot of shit burning, or piles of dope and guns to get ratings.  Our media is just a whore for ratings, and whatever gets ratings get on TV.

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InvisiblePsychoactive1984
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Re: Republicans have a lot in common with the Taliban [Re: biglo]
    #3905351 - 03/11/05 11:18 PM (19 years, 12 days ago)

Quote:

biglo said:
Allright, let me settle this right wing/left wing bullshit (or at least try :wink: )

There is no "news" any more, it's just events that happen that people decide are newsworthy.  The worlds of Entertainment and News have become one.  Our news now is for entertainment.  Why?  Because people don't have the attention span for investigative journalism (unless it supports either a left or right bias), so we just like to hear highlights.  I hate Fox news because it barely has any credibility, but I can't resist watching every now and then because they make the news damn entertaining.  All the urgent sounds and headlines.  Even the local news sucks. 

It's all about "Heroin bust/death/is coming for YOU!", house fires, murders, robberies, weather, and is pretty much filler the rest of the broadcast.  It's all about getting the money shot of shit burning, or piles of dope and guns to get ratings.  Our media is just a whore for ratings, and whatever gets ratings get on TV.




:handth: :handth: :handth: :handth: :handth: :handth: :handth: :handth: :handth: :handth: :handth: :handth: :handth: :handth: :handth:


--------------------
"Their is one overriding question that concerns us all: How can we get out of the fatal groove we are in, the one that is leading towards the brink?" Albert Szent-Gyorgyi
"We may not be capable of eradicating the corruption of reason, but we must nevertheless counter it at every instance and with every means." Dan Agin
"Politics is the best religion and politicians are the worst followers."
-It's ok to trip as long as you don't fall.
-Substance over Style.
-Common sense is uncommon.

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