Home | Community | Message Board

Cannabis Seeds UK
This site includes paid links. Please support our sponsors.


Welcome to the Shroomery Message Board! You are experiencing a small sample of what the site has to offer. Please login or register to post messages and view our exclusive members-only content. You'll gain access to additional forums, file attachments, board customizations, encrypted private messages, and much more!

Shop: Bridgetown Botanicals Bridgetown Botanicals   Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order   Kraken Kratom Kratom Capsules for Sale   Original Sensible Seeds Autoflowering Cannabis Seeds

Jump to first unread post Pages: 1 | 2 | 3 | Next >  [ show all ]
Offlineviktor
psychotechnician
Male User Gallery


Registered: 11/03/10
Posts: 4,293
Loc: New Zealand Flag
Last seen: 1 year, 11 months
Does Cannabis Prohibition Cause Schizophrenia? * 3
    #24897818 - 01/08/18 02:40 AM (6 years, 2 months ago)

Something that many of us may have asked. Does the system that enforces cannabis prohibition actually cause the mental illnesses it claims to be trying to solve? Original here.

*

In The Politics of Experience, the great Scottish psychiatrist R. D. Laing presents his own understanding on the ultimate causes of schizophrenia. He concludes that schizophrenia is not mainly caused by either genetic or environmental factors but rather “the experience and behaviour that gets labelled schizophrenic is a special strategy that a person invents in order to live in an unlivable situation.”

This is a position that many schizophrenics could themselves agree with. Common to the schizophrenic experience is a sense of having been “skewered” by the world, in that one is doomed if one chooses a certain option but also doomed if one does not choose it. This kind of Catch-22 situation is regularly accompanied by a level of anxiety that is impossible to live with, followed by the mind starting to disintegrate as a way of relieving unendurable levels of stress.

It’s not a position that receives much sympathy from the psychiatric establishment, who are almost all hard-core worshippers of the cult of materialism. Most Western psychiatrists cannot conceive of mental health in any other terms than brain chemistry, and they cannot conceive of treatment in any other fashion than dishing out pills. That someone has been driven insane by society is an unpalatable possibility.

Cannabis use is believed by many to be the cause of schizophrenia, because the association between cannabis use and getting such a mental health diagnosis has long been noted. In the mainstream Western model, it is assumed that the causal relationship of these two variables goes in the direction of cannabis use causing people to develop psychosis and schizophrenia.

This has led to many psychiatrists telling their patients that not only are the patients themselves to blame for their own mental illness (which leads to terrible feelings of guilt and self-recrimination) but that only by avoiding cannabis can they hope to make a recovery.

The problem with this approach is, obviously, that cannabis is medicinal, and the vast majority of cannabis users know this, and so being told such things by a mental health “professional” is confusing, frustrating and enraging.

Getting lectured about what one needs to do to stay mentally healthy by a person who has never had schizophrenia, who has never had any experience with psychosis and who has almost certainly never used cannabis, much less a major psychedelic, is a difficult thing for any person to put up with, let alone an experienced psychonaut. When that person doing the lecturing is actually ignoring one’s own lived experiences with the medicinal qualities of the substance, it’s mind-boggling.

Because of cannabis prohibition, mental health care workers are extremely reluctant to tell the truth about the medicinal qualities of the substance (if they’re even aware of them). After all, if they recommend medicinal cannabis to a patient in a place where it’s illegal, they’re effectively recommending that the patient commit a crime, which comes with various ethical issues.

The problem is that the patient is frequently aware that the mental health care workers are lying by omission, which puts them in an impossible situation – exactly the kind of situation described by Laing as schizophrenogenic. If you have problems knowing what’s real and what isn’t, talking to someone who you know is lying to you while that person is also claiming to be helping you is just too much for the human mind to cope with.

If doctors and psychiatrists are there to help us, why don’t they tell us the truth about the medicine that does so much to relieve abominable suffering? The fact that they refuse to do so only feeds into the perception often held by paranoid schizophrenics – that they really are out to get you. It also makes people wonder if they’ve fallen into a time warp of some kind.

Prohibition of cannabis medicine is so absurd, so ludicrous, that it actually causes mental illness in the people whose lives are affected by it.


--------------------
"They consider me insane but I know that I am a hero living under the eyes of the gods."

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisibleredgreenvines
irregular verb
 User Gallery

Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 38,062
Re: Does Cannabis Prohibition Cause Schizophrenia? [Re: viktor] * 1
    #24898067 - 01/08/18 07:34 AM (6 years, 2 months ago)

It is unhealthy to be sure, as are all draconian authoritarian forces upon the objects of their pressure.

At the same time I do not blame the New York Times for running pictures of Sessions and Trump, which revolt me and take me to the brink of mental illness.

The effect is indirect, but the meddling of one group upon the private activities of another group without merit especially when the meddlers are clearly duplicitous about EVERYTHING, well that meddling, including prohibition, and raping the environment, etc. etc. are sickening both physically and mentally.


--------------------
:confused: _ :brainfart:🧠  _ :finger:

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleIcelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Male


Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
Re: Does Cannabis Prohibition Cause Schizophrenia? [Re: viktor] * 1
    #24898185 - 01/08/18 09:22 AM (6 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Common to the schizophrenic experience is a sense of having been “skewered” by the world, in that one is doomed if one chooses a certain option but also doomed if one does not choose it. This kind of Catch-22 situation is regularly accompanied by a level of anxiety that is impossible to live with, followed by the mind starting to disintegrate as a way of relieving unendurable levels of stress.




These sound like the healthy ones to me. They see our actual situation and are too sensitive to live like this.

Wasn't it Laing who said something like "Insanity is a sane reaction to an insane world"? And didn't Krishnamurti say something like "it's not a sign of mental health to be well adjusted to a mentally ill society"?


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisibleredgreenvines
irregular verb
 User Gallery

Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 38,062
Re: Does Cannabis Prohibition Cause Schizophrenia? [Re: Icelander] * 1
    #24898242 - 01/08/18 10:12 AM (6 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Icelander said:
...
Wasn't it Laing who said something like "Insanity is a sane reaction to an insane world"? And didn't Krishnamurti say something like "it's not a sign of mental health to be well adjusted to a mentally ill society"?



These were great geniuses.


--------------------
:confused: _ :brainfart:🧠  _ :finger:

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleIcelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Male


Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
Re: Does Cannabis Prohibition Cause Schizophrenia? [Re: redgreenvines] * 1
    #24898290 - 01/08/18 10:53 AM (6 years, 2 months ago)

I'm shocked you would think so.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisibleredgreenvines
irregular verb
 User Gallery

Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 38,062
Re: Does Cannabis Prohibition Cause Schizophrenia? [Re: Icelander] * 1
    #24898310 - 01/08/18 11:01 AM (6 years, 2 months ago)

it's OK, i did not say you were, you can relax


--------------------
:confused: _ :brainfart:🧠  _ :finger:

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleIcelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Male


Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
Re: Does Cannabis Prohibition Cause Schizophrenia? [Re: redgreenvines] * 2
    #24898321 - 01/08/18 11:08 AM (6 years, 2 months ago)

Never thought you did. But from your posting here I take the impression that  you don't want to face the insanity of society. That truth seems very threatening to you by the responses I've been seeing.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlineviktor
psychotechnician
Male User Gallery


Registered: 11/03/10
Posts: 4,293
Loc: New Zealand Flag
Last seen: 1 year, 11 months
Re: Does Cannabis Prohibition Cause Schizophrenia? [Re: redgreenvines] * 1
    #24898796 - 01/08/18 03:30 PM (6 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

redgreenvines said:
The effect is indirect, but the meddling of one group upon the private activities of another group without merit especially when the meddlers are clearly duplicitous about EVERYTHING, well that meddling, including prohibition, and raping the environment, etc. etc. are sickening both physically and mentally.




It's sickening, but what can we do? It seems like people will meddle in each other's affairs the moment they are granted the power to do so and get away with it.


--------------------
"They consider me insane but I know that I am a hero living under the eyes of the gods."

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisibleredgreenvines
irregular verb
 User Gallery

Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 38,062
Re: Does Cannabis Prohibition Cause Schizophrenia? [Re: viktor] * 1
    #24898860 - 01/08/18 03:56 PM (6 years, 2 months ago)

We can do what Oprah reminds us of which Gandhi spoke of, and that Obama echoed:
"be the change we want to see"

@Icelander, you have declared I have a fear of the insanity of society, this is not true, I just find depressing rants that blame the insanity of society unhelpful; mostly because they are unclear or poorly formulated politics. They are calls to action without enough motivation, understanding, or path.

The term you brought up about "pushing buttons" is about psychological play - I think for you this is more posturing and play than serious, but you pretend it is very serious meanwhile pushing buttons, and threatening to leave if we do not take you seriously enough. Taken to extreme you could become Kurtz in Apocalypse Now, or just another kid that wont share his toys.

What I do fear is getting a job in some flat earth racist part of USA, or Europe, and then appearing on the street to be an undesirable minority.

I also fear TRUMP remaining in power and finally finding that big button he seeks with his flat earth mentality.


--------------------
:confused: _ :brainfart:🧠  _ :finger:

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlineakira_akuma
Φύσις κρύπτεσθαι ὕψιστος φιλεῖ


Registered: 08/28/09
Posts: 82,455
Loc: Onypeirophóros
Last seen: 4 years, 2 months
Re: Does Cannabis Prohibition Cause Schizophrenia? [Re: redgreenvines] * 1
    #24898935 - 01/08/18 04:29 PM (6 years, 2 months ago)

Trump won't do any of that, unless people allow him to. he's a great mirror of society.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleIcelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Male


Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
Re: Does Cannabis Prohibition Cause Schizophrenia? [Re: redgreenvines] * 2
    #24898967 - 01/08/18 04:48 PM (6 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

redgreenvines said:
We can do what Oprah reminds us of which Gandhi spoke of, and that Obama echoed:
"be the change we want to see"

@Icelander, you have declared I have a fear of the insanity of society, this is not true, I just find depressing rants that blame the insanity of society unhelpful; mostly because they are unclear or poorly formulated politics. They are calls to action without enough motivation, understanding, or path.

The term you brought up about "pushing buttons" is about psychological play - I think for you this is more posturing and play than serious, but you pretend it is very serious meanwhile pushing buttons, and threatening to leave if we do not take you seriously enough. Taken to extreme you could become Kurtz in Apocalypse Now, or just another kid that wont share his toys.

What I do fear is getting a job in some flat earth racist part of USA, or Europe, and then appearing on the street to be an undesirable minority.

I also fear TRUMP remaining in power and finally finding that big button he seeks with his flat earth mentality.





Isn't Obama the guy that stripped away a lot of the personal freedoms we have left? Now I hear on NPR Oprah is going to run for president. :curbyourenthusiasm:

I could care less if you think I'm serious or not. You've already shown your true colors in the other thread and finally owned that  you are a "big baby".  You're the one who won't debate in good faith and the proof is all over the Antinatalism thread. Maybe it's you that lacks understanding of human behaviors but I backed my views with Becker's work and Terror Management Theory and Jordan Peterson. You've done nothing like that. What is apparent is if something pushes YOUR buttons you attack it without merit or argument, instead linking it to another idea that has NOTHING to do with the idea being discussed and attacking it that way. You really ought to be embarrassed IMO. You're hardly a kid and you know the rules of debate that Diploid posted as a sticky.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

Edited by Icelander (01/08/18 04:50 PM)

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlineakira_akuma
Φύσις κρύπτεσθαι ὕψιστος φιλεῖ


Registered: 08/28/09
Posts: 82,455
Loc: Onypeirophóros
Last seen: 4 years, 2 months
Re: Does Cannabis Prohibition Cause Schizophrenia? [Re: Icelander] * 1
    #24899011 - 01/08/18 05:07 PM (6 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Now I hear on NPR Oprah is going to run for president.




and now they are in hot water for it, and are backpeddling. LOL
http://archive.is/9QzHX (scroll down)

just sayin'...they can't help themselves, these days, and people will defend this.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleIcelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Male


Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
Re: Does Cannabis Prohibition Cause Schizophrenia? [Re: akira_akuma] * 2
    #24899079 - 01/08/18 05:35 PM (6 years, 2 months ago)

Wouldn't surprise me though. I actually heard this on NPR. We love celebs that are PC so the new left can go on destroying the environment in an ethical way with a clear conscience.  BTW I find NPR on par with Fox or CNN in that they are just status quo lite rather than really getting at the real core of world problems.

The world is dreaming all this together. That's why they say someone who sees beyond this big cultural lie is "awakened".  I think UG krishnamurti was a example of awakened.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

Edited by Icelander (01/08/18 06:47 PM)

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlineakira_akuma
Φύσις κρύπτεσθαι ὕψιστος φιλεῖ


Registered: 08/28/09
Posts: 82,455
Loc: Onypeirophóros
Last seen: 4 years, 2 months
Re: Does Cannabis Prohibition Cause Schizophrenia? [Re: Icelander] * 1
    #24899095 - 01/08/18 05:44 PM (6 years, 2 months ago)

the mind is a powerful thing, and they are all swayed and inculcated against the truth, by the powers that be. this isn't a conspiracy. and i hope to get to the bottom of this- even if it takes waking people up to their own minds.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleIcelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Male


Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
Re: Does Cannabis Prohibition Cause Schizophrenia? [Re: akira_akuma] * 2
    #24899100 - 01/08/18 05:47 PM (6 years, 2 months ago)

Good luck. You know conspiracy is not a dirty word. This is well worth a watch imo.
https://topdocumentaryfilms.com/conspiracy-theory/


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlineakira_akuma
Φύσις κρύπτεσθαι ὕψιστος φιλεῖ


Registered: 08/28/09
Posts: 82,455
Loc: Onypeirophóros
Last seen: 4 years, 2 months
Re: Does Cannabis Prohibition Cause Schizophrenia? [Re: Icelander] * 1
    #24899127 - 01/08/18 06:02 PM (6 years, 2 months ago)

i was thinking today would be a documentary day! lo and behold!

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineRJ Tubs 202
Male

Registered: 09/20/08
Posts: 6,123
Loc: USA Flag
Last seen: 16 days, 1 hour
Re: Does Cannabis Prohibition Cause Schizophrenia? [Re: Icelander] * 2
    #24899403 - 01/08/18 08:39 PM (6 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Icelander said:

And didn't Krishnamurti say something like "it's not a sign of mental health to be well adjusted to a mentally ill society"?




Mental health has nothing to do with what happens outside of our mind.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleIcelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Male


Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
Re: Does Cannabis Prohibition Cause Schizophrenia? [Re: RJ Tubs 202] * 2
    #24899433 - 01/08/18 08:51 PM (6 years, 2 months ago)

Yeah that's right. I'm glad  you recognize that. I don't think we really know what's going on outside of our mind.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

Edited by Icelander (01/08/18 08:52 PM)

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleJokeshopbeard
Humble Student

Registered: 11/30/11
Posts: 26,088
Loc: Deep in the system Flag
Re: Does Cannabis Prohibition Cause Schizophrenia? [Re: RJ Tubs 202] * 1
    #24899442 - 01/08/18 08:57 PM (6 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

RJ Tubs 202 said:
Mental health has nothing to do with what happens outside of our mind.



But it's influenced by it though right? Especially in early developmental stages..


--------------------
Let it be seen that you are nothing. And in knowing that you are nothing... there is nothing to lose, there is nothing to gain. What can happen to you? Something can happen to the body, but it will either heal or it won't. What's the big deal? Let life knock you to bits. Let life take you apart. Let life destroy you. It will only destroy what you are not.
--Jac O'keeffe

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlineakira_akuma
Φύσις κρύπτεσθαι ὕψιστος φιλεῖ


Registered: 08/28/09
Posts: 82,455
Loc: Onypeirophóros
Last seen: 4 years, 2 months
Re: Does Cannabis Prohibition Cause Schizophrenia? [Re: Jokeshopbeard] * 1
    #24899487 - 01/08/18 09:15 PM (6 years, 2 months ago)

i nearly died in a C-section, so...damn.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Jump to top Pages: 1 | 2 | 3 | Next >  [ show all ]

Shop: Bridgetown Botanicals Bridgetown Botanicals   Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order   Kraken Kratom Kratom Capsules for Sale   Original Sensible Seeds Autoflowering Cannabis Seeds


Similar ThreadsPosterViewsRepliesLast post
* Numerology and schitzophrenia
( 1 2 3 all )
reflectedlight 5,927 43 06/07/07 06:05 PM
by backfromthedead
* Schizophrenia from a spiritual perspective gettinjiggywithit 2,243 18 01/26/05 05:32 PM
by incubaby_421
* A different look at Schizophrenia
( 1 2 all )
gettinjiggywithit 3,907 32 02/08/14 03:22 AM
by FishOilTheKid
* intresting interview with a schizophrenic
( 1 2 3 4 all )
scattass 9,843 71 04/21/07 10:30 AM
by spiritualemerg
* Schizophrenia
( 1 2 3 all )
OrgoneConclusion 6,608 58 10/19/09 03:32 PM
by soldatheero
* jesus a schizophrenic?
( 1 2 3 4 all )
quantum reality 4,357 75 02/24/09 11:32 AM
by Mr. Mushrooms
* some thoughts on schizophrenia
( 1 2 all )
wordreality 3,523 20 10/06/03 10:28 AM
by fireworks_god
* Belief in God: A form of schizophrenia?!
( 1 2 3 all )
Northernsoul 6,589 47 08/26/09 12:01 PM
by OrgoneConclusion

Extra information
You cannot start new topics / You cannot reply to topics
HTML is disabled / BBCode is enabled
Moderator: Middleman, DividedQuantum
1,612 topic views. 2 members, 4 guests and 21 web crawlers are browsing this forum.
[ Show Images Only | Sort by Score | Print Topic ]
Search this thread:

Copyright 1997-2024 Mind Media. Some rights reserved.

Generated in 0.024 seconds spending 0.007 seconds on 16 queries.