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OfflineSpacerific
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Another encounter with (alleged) ADHD and self esteem issues * 1
    #20620589 - 09/26/14 08:31 AM (9 years, 6 months ago)

First one was a few months back. Girl told me she had ADHD, I just met her and applied my own analysis to what she was doing. She was indeed a bit distracted, but when shown some skin contact and grip strength tricks, lo and behold her brain worked just fine. That supported my initial suspicion, that ADHD diagnoses, at least in some cases, act like a form of crutch, an identity to hide behind, a permission slip to continue having poor self-modulation skills and take chems to modulate. Rather than reign that attention in, oh I can't, I have ADHD, I need pills for this :rolleyes:

I was exploring this girl's head a bit, I asked when was the last time you felt alive and connected? (To have something to go back to, a state to use as baseline) and she said "Well actually ... right now, here with you!" :lol:

Anyway that went well, though couldn't continue my experiments on her as she had to go on her own way later that evening, and I had to go mine.
Now however, I have a proper test subject :hellfire:

I'm staying at this girl I met at a psy festival. She has the same ADHD diagnosis, was quite hyper most of the time, doing this compulsive dancing sort of thing, taking her Dextroamphetamine pills as prescribed, and smoking plenty of tobacco.

I took this as a challenge. I fancy myself somewhat of a wizard and a healer, a spreader of chill and good vibes, so I always challenge people's disempowering beliefs about themselves, with what the shrooms and Ayahuasca showed me. IMO the ADHD diagnosis is clearly a disempowering belief, as it tells one that they are incomplete, defective, and need some weird chems to regulate their states and brain frequencies. Which may be true, but I'll challenge it nonetheless, until I see it with my own eyes and hear it with my own ears to be true.

It's been 6 days. Here's my progress with the experiment so far:
- Added in A LOT of skin contact. Massage, sex, hugs, all manner of skin-related interactions. This is the advice I give to any nerdy indoor stayers on this forum, and so I practice it myself. Skin contact being important, it chills everybody involved. Lack of it breeds alienation and self-doubt. Of course anxiety transmits through it, so I have to be chill myself, in order to help others chill through skin contact. So far it worked awesomely.

- Offered pointers about noise. Mental noise. WHen and how specifically she's just mindlessly doing shit, as opposed to mindfully doing it. Throwing the dog's food in the bowl with a careless BANG!!!! is not the same as putting it in, in a mindful Zen way. The dog eats it differently, I will not be :rolleyes: at her and have my stuff interrupted, the cat will be less of a bitch because nobody disturbed her chill times. Same with banging doors, cabinets and so on. Sloooooooooooowly does it. Mindfully. After some days of this, taking care not to be a nazi and an a-hole about it, she's quickly started to pick it up. It's an area of life she just wasn't paying attention to, and now she does. It's something she'll bring up in music she puts on, movies we may watch, etc.

- Reduced tobacco smoking. By helping her be more mindful and less stressed, she needs to smoke less. By the fact that she knows I dislike the smell, although it's her house and can smoke where she pleases, she now mostly does it outside. Which is WAY less smokes per day, compared to chain smoking indoors whenever home.

- Reduced the Dextroamphetamine pills. Tapering down I believe they call it, but instead of 3-5 a day, she's now down quite a bit. 2 days I think in which she took none at all. She takes these guys if and when things start to feel weird, too weird for her to deal with. As there was way less need to do that, she took less of them, and things still feel chill. From this I noticed that her metabolism went back to normal. Her hands and body used to be always hot, as if running a fever most of the day. Now she's back to normal human temp. Sleeping a bit more, probably to compensate for all the Dex-amp. pills she's been on for months and years.

- Brought in way more greens to the fridge. This girl was eating crap instant noodles, filled with MSG, almost on a daily basis. Personally I'm VERY suspicious of MSG, perhaps without real basis, but I am, and at least some sources share my views, that it's not good for a brain to get this kind of diet. Especially if one already has a tendency (for whatever reason) to be more hyper and restless, MSG should probably not be added into the mix every day. I pointed this out, I pointed it out in her noodle sauce, soy sauce, chicken soup cubes etc. She learned to make her noodles with her own spices, as opposed to using the MSG crap in the box. As we cook together she's now getting stuff closer to my diet, lots of spinach and broccoli and olive oil, as I'm a firm believer in the importance of Omega 3. Showed her the TED Talk about it, she went out and bought herself some Omega 3 pills, and is taking them at the recommended dosage, 2 with each meal, 6 a day in total. For me it took 5-6 days to kick in properly, so we'll see how that plays out.

And this is my progress so far. Today we have a bit of an acid trip planned together, so will report on how that develops. I'm a firm believer in the power of the psychedelics, the insights they've revealed, and so that's why I do these in-the-field tests, to see if the observations and methods actually work, or are just nice ideas in my head. So far so good :biggrin:


--------------------
Blessed are your eyes because they see, and your ears because they hear.



For truly, I say to you, many prophets and righteous people longed to see what you see, and did not see it,
and to hear what you hear, and did not hear it.
- Matthew 13:16

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Invisibleazur
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Re: Another encounter with (alleged) ADHD and self esteem issues [Re: Spacerific]
    #20620614 - 09/26/14 08:40 AM (9 years, 6 months ago)

:takingnotes:


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FALL IN LOVE WITH LC
FOTTSE!!!
ALL NOOBS READ THIS!!!


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OfflineEverything
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Re: Another encounter with (alleged) ADHD and self esteem issues [Re: Spacerific]
    #20629098 - 09/28/14 02:52 AM (9 years, 5 months ago)

wow sounds like your straight up re-habilitizing this girl. hey, if she is down for the changes she is making it then it all works out. If she is just trying to impress you or something like that who knows maybe it won't work out. maybe shes quite into you and if you keep with her and give her love she'll keep trying to better herself, but if you don't stick around she'll probably fall back into bad habits.

we shall see, best of luck to your lady friend.

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OfflineSpacerific
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Re: Another encounter with (alleged) ADHD and self esteem issues [Re: Everything]
    #20629148 - 09/28/14 03:11 AM (9 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Everything said:
wow sounds like your straight up re-habilitizing this girl. hey, if she is down for the changes she is making it then it all works out. If she is just trying to impress you or something like that who knows maybe it won't work out. maybe shes quite into you and if you keep with her and give her love she'll keep trying to better herself, but if you don't stick around she'll probably fall back into bad habits.

we shall see, best of luck to your lady friend.



Thanks :hatsoff:

We're having some pretty good times actually, though I'm not interested in her as a gf or anything of the sort. Right now it's sex and friendship and I don't see much more than some nice company. I do like to be present, to take care of people if I can, and most of all I like practicing what the :mushroom2::mushroom2::mushroom2: and Ayahuasca and LSD trips have shown and told me about. I'm a firm believer in the positive results of these methods, because I've seen them work wonders for me. I also think the best way to show their benefits is to help people with actual problems, give them tools to modulate their nervous system without pills and chems and smoking compulsively.

I don't have a fixed period that I'm staying here (bohemian traveler, I tend to go with the flow :biggrin:) and so I'll stay as long as the vibes are good and useful and we both find fun and joy in it. So far so good.

In the meantime I've had an LSD trip with her, it was very nice (and I think very useful) but the thread about it has seen a lot of noisy replies :lol:

We'll see where the story goes from here.


--------------------
Blessed are your eyes because they see, and your ears because they hear.



For truly, I say to you, many prophets and righteous people longed to see what you see, and did not see it,
and to hear what you hear, and did not hear it.
- Matthew 13:16

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OfflineEverything
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Re: Another encounter with (alleged) ADHD and self esteem issues [Re: Spacerific]
    #20631427 - 09/28/14 04:00 PM (9 years, 5 months ago)

Awesome dude,  your awesome! I travelled New Zealand for a bit, only 3 months but I know it need to travel the US and other countries now. What is your means of transportation? Bike, motorbike, car, bus, hitchhike? Do you just meet people and stay with them or work for them or do you apply for jobs in towns/cities you stay in? I'm really curious because your doing exactly what I'd like to do so tell me more!

This girl reminds me of my ex girlfriend, I myself am trying to get my shit together. I quit smoking, taking a break from a plethora of different stimulants and psychedelics and dissociatives and alcohol etc....long list, this summers been a high one. It's probably been a week away from all these substances and I'm already feeling soooo much better and more in touch with humans. I bought a lot of RC stimulants for study and school but ordered them a month before classes start so I obviously did them in a more recreational way and now right before I start school I realize how unhelpful to my life they will actually be, it's funny how that works.

Anyways please let me know how you made it possible to start your journey.

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OfflineSpacerific
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Re: Another encounter with (alleged) ADHD and self esteem issues [Re: Everything]
    #20632026 - 09/28/14 06:04 PM (9 years, 5 months ago)

Update: after teh trip, my girl/volunteer is doing quite awesome. She went to work today, took 1 Dextroamphetamine pill (instead of the usual 5 she's been taking pretty much daily for the past 3-4 years). Got home in very good mood, had pizza (spinach, broccoli, as usual) and chilled in the hammock together.

Apparently her boss was really glad to see here socializing more than usual and mentioned that fact. Her body temp is now back to normal, which means she's getting cold hands and feet when tired (normal for a tall skinny girl like her) whereas usually she'd be "running hot" all the time from her stimulant pills. Like she had a fever constantly.

She ate pretty ravenously all day, and right now she fell asleep. Sleeping way more since she decreased her pill intake, and I suspect she's basically recovering and replenishing all sorts of nutrients and neurotransmitters and sleep debt, which is very much needed after years of pushing her body with stimulants.

We spent some very nice time chilling, talking at length about emotions, connecting and various episodes from both our pasts. All in all very easy to connect to, compared to the state I found her in (rushed, edgy, restless, short nervous eye contact most of the time).

Quote:

Everything said:
Awesome dude,  your awesome! I travelled New Zealand for a bit, only 3 months but I know it need to travel the US and other countries now. What is your means of transportation? Bike, motorbike, car, bus, hitchhike? Do you just meet people and stay with them or work for them or do you apply for jobs in towns/cities you stay in? I'm really curious because your doing exactly what I'd like to do so tell me more!

This girl reminds me of my ex girlfriend, I myself am trying to get my shit together. I quit smoking, taking a break from a plethora of different stimulants and psychedelics and dissociatives and alcohol etc....long list, this summers been a high one. It's probably been a week away from all these substances and I'm already feeling soooo much better and more in touch with humans. I bought a lot of RC stimulants for study and school but ordered them a month before classes start so I obviously did them in a more recreational way and now right before I start school I realize how unhelpful to my life they will actually be, it's funny how that works.

Anyways please let me know how you made it possible to start your journey.



Read/listen to Tim Ferriss' "Four Hour Work Week" dude, that's the fundamental work on such adventures.

As for me, short answer: Bashar - follow your highest enthusiasm. Always do that, it will lead you exactly where you need to end up, learning what you need to learn in the best possible way.

Longer answer - After several unfulfilling jobs, first psy trips, realizing I need to paint my visions, going to art school to learn painting, quitting art school, starting a small online business and having about 1,000 eur, I set out to chase my real enthusiasm, my main curiosity. What's Ayahuasca like?

Found it was here in the Netherlands. Like Tim Ferriss said, I relied on Couchsurfing to get the ball rolling. Was scared quite a bit as I had never traveled by myself before. But once I came here, the couchsurfers I happened to meet were awesome, one in particular liked my mission really well, as he knew about the powers of Ayahuasca. Hosted me for a bit, showed me around town (The Hague) and so I got comfy living in the Netherlands.

Then I found I have some friends living in some other NL city, they hosted me a bit. Then went back home and prepared for my first psy festival (Boom 2012) where my host and his friends told me to join them, as I'd surely love it. WHich indeed I did. At Boom, the same dude shared the first liquid acid trip ever. Magic beyond words.

Seeing what's possible at the festival, how people can live on this planet, I knew then and there my life was changed. I was to live in the city only during winter, and during summer trip and travel, voyage and experience the bohemian nomadic life.

I came to NL 5 more times since then, I believe this is my 5th or 6th time. Came here around X-mas :biggrin:

Since then I worked on a boat in Amsterdam (learned basic woodworking, had never even drilled a hole before :biggrin:), crashed for many weeks at two different Shroomery members, slept in a treehouse, a yurt, a tent in a hippie camp, all manner of adventures.

I started traveling via plane. Skyscanner site for cheap flights. Then I tested the bus. Somewhere along the way I restarted biking again (as last bike I had before was when I was 5 :lol:). Then I started going between cities and now this is my main mode of travel in NL. It seems one can also take bikes on certain international busses, so that's how I plan to get back home. If I ever return :lol:

I say if, because my plan was to return something like 3 months ago. I stopped in a city (Nijmegen) to visit a painter I've seen on youtube, ended up staying there about 2 months. Not at the painter mind you, with him I just chatted for an afternoon. Stayed at a few couchsurfers, 3-4 non-couchsurfing people I just randomly met there or girls I clicked with.

There's this thing dude, the magic. The flow. When you're aware and connected, following your true highest enthusiasm, the universe just sends people. I've seen it at Boom on the liquid acid. From then on I've started integrating and trusting this way of riding the possibilities the universe offers, the synchronicities, the in-the-moment fulfillment of needs and desires.

I needed a lot of money to get started with the travel the first time around, as I lacked confidence, but each subsequent trip showed me new tricks of the trade, how needs can be fulfilled, and though I've come to under $100 budget-wise many times, I've rarely lost hope or felt threatened in any way. I've learned to accept and work with the uncertainty, understanding that life is like driving at night. Unless you lock yourself into some fixed monotonous existence, you have to learn to live with the uncertainty. You can only see one headlights length ahead, and you have to rely that there's more road ahead, that you simply can't see yet. So you deal with it one host at a time, on episode at a time, one host at a time.

Present situation is as you see here, living with a girl I "randomly" met at Ozora 2013. I offered the best help with her issues that I was capable of, because this was/is my highest enthusiasm, in the moment. I didn't ask for anything, yet everything got done in its proper course and timing. Wu Wei. What Alan Watts and Lao Tzu were talking about.

I hope this puts you on the right track. If you need a more specific boost, I'd advise listening to Bashar, seeing how this kind of following your highest joy, your highest enthusiasm, helps people, solves problems and allows everybody to advance their process. Their main life story.

Work-wise I do barter these days more than money exchanges. I generally paint for people, or as seen in this thread, I don't even know what this is. Healing services? Massage sex and nutritional advice? :lol:

The Ayahuasca, shroom and acid trips have shown me some amazing things about the human nervous system. On one end it just helps me connect and get laid fairly well, but more importantly I can show people how to modulate their states well, which fixes (or at least helps with) things like anxiety, alleged ADHD, some types of depression. It's basically a completely different model of analyzing and optimizing states/behaviors/emotions, unrelated to regular Western medicine or psychology/psychiatry. Having been shown some of this, how could I not share and expand it? I'm pretty sure there's more where that came from, provided I work with and apply what I've been given already :biggrin:

In any case, as long as this girl and I have a few chapters together in our respective life story, I'm not worried at all. I know the universe is always lining up new adventures for me to go through, people to chill and learn with, trips to go on. Also, her current flatmate ran into some cash difficulties (hasn't paid her rent in a month or two). Synchronistically, she was bothered by some noisy sexy times we had, and chose to strike back by waking everybody up at 5 am. Two days in a row. When I pointed out that's rather rude (to wake up this girl that's paying her rent, on a work day) she said fuck this, I'm going to my mother. She's never been heard from since. Looks like this might be an opening for me to move in, stay 1-2 months in the Netherlands, paying half of a subsidized rent for a gorgeous place in the middle of a park, complete with awesome cat, cool dog and tall blonde girl who likes BDSM :lol:

These things and more can definitely happen, when following one's enthusiasm properly.

For money, when I actually need to get some money in the bank, I do transcription work online. Haven't done that in a few months though. Used to hire and run a whole team of transcribers from the Philippines (straight up Tim Ferriss model) but I got tired of that, as I'm a painter, not a text dude. I can do it and know how, it's just not my thing.

Hope this helps and clarifies. Follow your dream dude, it's there in your heart for a reason :biggrin:


--------------------
Blessed are your eyes because they see, and your ears because they hear.



For truly, I say to you, many prophets and righteous people longed to see what you see, and did not see it,
and to hear what you hear, and did not hear it.
- Matthew 13:16

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OfflineSpacerific
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Registered: 10/13/12
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Re: Another encounter with (alleged) ADHD and self esteem issues [Re: Spacerific]
    #20634369 - 09/29/14 08:58 AM (9 years, 5 months ago)

Super short update. Today my girl tells me she was dreaming. Second night in a row. This morning she was writing dreams in her journal. After not dreaming (or at least remembering) anything at all for 3+ years, since she went on the Dextroamphetamine, now it's back to dreaming mode :biggrin:


--------------------
Blessed are your eyes because they see, and your ears because they hear.



For truly, I say to you, many prophets and righteous people longed to see what you see, and did not see it,
and to hear what you hear, and did not hear it.
- Matthew 13:16

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OfflineMescalean
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Re: Another encounter with (alleged) ADHD and self esteem issues [Re: Spacerific]
    #20634633 - 09/29/14 10:34 AM (9 years, 5 months ago)

Thats good dude but do you believe all cases off ADD and ADHD are poppycock or just some?


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FREE BURKE

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OfflineEverything
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Re: Another encounter with (alleged) ADHD and self esteem issues [Re: Mescalean]
    #20634799 - 09/29/14 11:26 AM (9 years, 5 months ago)

Regardless of whether add/adhd is real, they don't need amphetamines.

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OfflineMescalean
Burke is love, burke is life.


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Re: Another encounter with (alleged) ADHD and self esteem issues [Re: Everything]
    #20634821 - 09/29/14 11:32 AM (9 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Everything said:
Regardless of whether add/adhd is real, they don't need amphetamines.



Oh I know, I am proof they don't need them. Especially at age 10 like me... I am very sensitive to stims in general I think and too much will make me vomit all day. Adderal was a contant gagging. Only thing I've found that works is school is not really my niche' and im okay with that, I'm attending classes for nutrition and physical training. The one thing ive always been able to focus on.


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FREE BURKE

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OfflineSpacerific
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Re: Another encounter with (alleged) ADHD and self esteem issues [Re: Mescalean]
    #20636007 - 09/29/14 03:46 PM (9 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Mescalean said:
Thats good dude but do you believe all cases off ADD and ADHD are poppycock or just some?



Well there's a bit of a longer explanation to deal with this question.

One thing is that even though some people may have a different type of attention (tendency for shorter bursts of attention, more attention shifting, a certain kind of restlessness) calling it ADHD is IMO a very poor label to use for this situation, as it's very disempowering. Like "Social Anxiety Disorder" is equally bullshit IMO. Sure there's a reluctance to deal with crowds, other people, low self esteem and restlessness/anxiety at the very thought of these things (I know because I've behaved like this for most of my life until a few years ago) but the label itself is poorly thought through. It doesn't at all help its carrier deal better with the situation. On the contrary, it solidifies a dysfunctional state of events into a whole identity, a very real problem (when IMO it's completely transient, if one knows what it really consists of, how it arises and how it goes away).

So from this perspective I wouldn't agree with this specific label (ADHD) for ANYBODY. Call it shock-induced restlessness. Call it lack-of-skin-contact-hugs-and-real-affection-disorder. Call it lack-of-proper-blowjobs-in-a-while-disorder (for dudes :biggrin:) too-much-inflammatory-omega6-in-the-diet-disorder, or anything like that. This will show that most (if not all) of these things are pretty easily fixable with things like a lot of what I did above in my OP. Massage/hugs/sex/intimacy, foods rich in Omega 3, cutting down on stimulants and other noise-makers (cigarettes for instance) and practicing proper cycles. By proper cycles I mean not endlessly fidgeting in a nervous state, neither here nor there, but alternating full effort (physically) with full disconnect. In practice, do something that takes full attention (sprint, fuck, lift, trip, whatever) until exhausted properly, then crash and sleep at length. That's one cycle. Full connect, full disconnect.

You will notice that TV, alcohol, cigarettes, stimulants like the meds prescribed for ADHD, they both allow and push one to function at never full on, never full off. Instead of clear cycles, you get somewhat-on but never fully truly alive kind of attention or action, and after that you get a somewhat-off, but never fully truly resting and at peace kind of state.

If you think of it as a sine wave, it decreases the amplitude, to always under 100% engagement and above 0% activity when trying to rest. If you think of a heart, if a heart would function like this, it would be never fully closed and drawing blood, nor fully open and pushing, but always with valves ALMOST closed/open, never completing it motion properly.

The way to clear this is to force full cycles, educate presence and force full grip strength in the limbs. WHen one hesitates, one loses grip strength. When one is on one's head, some or all limbs will not be fully engaged with what they're doing. You feel this. When someone hugs you and htey're in their head, you will feel like it's a half-assed hug, because their presence is not on you, but on something else. To educated this and get back to normal functioning, ALL that is required is practicing full, present hugs. Full, mindful, present sex. Or skill practice. Juggling, balancing on a wire, ANYTHING that will give proper feedback when one is mindless (balls dropped to floor, losing balance and falling off wire).

Now if anybody here is, or knows about ANY alleged ADHD person that does these things (eats right, acts in full cycles) and still has ADHD, by all means tell me about it. I have yet to see it or hear about it.

- - -

Anyway, update: This place has pretty much turned into a zen monastery :lol:

We spent today chilling, cleaning (slowly, in silence or very nice comfy conversation, delectable) and doing some stuff outside. Evening spent mostly in the hammock. Lights off, lots of candles lit, with this here running:



We then walked the dog and at one point she slowed me down, pointed out I was walking/talking too fast. I agreed, I was. The point being that she's now VERY mindful of these things, not in a nervous bitchy way or anything, simply noticing them, being aware, whereas before she wasn't. This is PRECISELY what I was trying to get at. This is IMO 100% what's happening with alleged ADHD people. Sustained, reinforced and permitted mindlessness about these simple aspects. Rate of speech. Position and rate of movement of limbs, allowing them to wonder, fidget, be uncoordinated all the time. THe actual source is likely nervousness with very real sources (boring school not matching their interests, careless parenting, lack of friends and partners with real intimacy and healthy skin contact habits).

This is my analysis so far, about ADHD as misidentified and mistreated by Western medicine, by medicating with stimulants.

Let me be perfectly clear: there is NO AMOUNT of stimulants that you can give an unaware undisciplined person filled with bad movement/attention habits, to make them fix their habits, become disciplined and aware. It is NOT a lack-of-stimulants problem. It is a habits problem. They have the energy, they just waste it in constant trickle, as opposed to allowing it to build (while chilling) and then expending it fully (while acting).

FInal mention, IMO very very important. She said this, when walking the dog: "It was very good that you made me not talk for a day after the trip. It helped me see and understand how most of my thoughts don't need to be spoken." This approach has turned in about 9-10 days, a place of chain smoking, noise, chatter, stress, loneliness and restless constant despair, into a very chill zen setting, with the above music running and candles. Disagreements may arise between us, but at no point was there screaming, passive aggressiveness or anything of the sort.

We took time today to draw in the hammock. Quite large project, will post tomorrow. Minimal restlessness on either of us. Chill times and focused action for way above an hour. To my knowledge quite rare among alleged ADHD people.

So this is the stuff folks, if anything in this thread sparks your interest, please explore it. It can be done. Peace of mind IS available to all :thumbup:


--------------------
Blessed are your eyes because they see, and your ears because they hear.



For truly, I say to you, many prophets and righteous people longed to see what you see, and did not see it,
and to hear what you hear, and did not hear it.
- Matthew 13:16

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OfflineIcyus
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Re: Another encounter with (alleged) ADHD and self esteem issues [Re: Spacerific]
    #20649182 - 10/02/14 03:07 PM (9 years, 5 months ago)

Sadly..

M


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And thus begins the  reverse-fusing of our one-dimentional understanding, and adds ever-expanding perspectives, in depth and number; splitting our perception, and in so doing, seemingly irrationally, creates yet more one-ness, with all that ever was, is and will ever be, streching across the infinite, inunderstood concept of everything, percievable and not.

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OfflineSpacerific
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Re: Another encounter with (alleged) ADHD and self esteem issues [Re: Spacerific]
    #20654439 - 10/03/14 05:51 PM (9 years, 5 months ago)

Brief update: had a shroom trip together, that didn't go that stellar. Still recovering from that as it took a toll on both of us. However that showed me this might be a bit of a longer project than initially planned or expected. Not that there ever was a "plan" per se, as I just live in the present moment :shrug:

She did find a lot of things about herself and human nervous systems and habits in general. She's now noticing the same kind of mental noise in the people who have it, generally speed abusers. Stuff that was always there, but because she was so used to it, she'd just not notice it (neither in herself nor others).

Seeing the progress of the whole thing we're doing here, she ordered some Salvia, DMT and African Dream Root, to have in our psychedelic bag of tricks. The DMT I'm psyched about. I don't know how she'll handle it, but for me it's always a source of strength and wisdom, so :thumbup::thumbup::thumbup:

The African Dream Root she was curious about, after she just restarted dreaming again.

Tobacco smokes are still way down (3-5 a day) and same for dextroamphetamine pills. More smooth and present body movement, easier smoother deeper breath.

Breath control is moving along and progressing, though there's A LOT of stuff to work through, sometimes I just see her drop back to typical depressed/disconnected person breathing, zero muscle tone, staring blankly into space.

Sometimes I just get caught off guard by incredibly short attention span issues, sometimes I find myself taking on her restlessness and I have to stop, go out, spend time in nature to chill out, come back calm and fresh. Some things of that nature I haven't felt in years, like the level of tension/tremors in the arms, arising seemingly out of nothing, breath cutting off mid-inhale, all kinds of things. Anyway as I'm figuring out her patterns I see them starting to dissolve, and we're working together at finding more functional ones.

Today we spent the day out at the beach and evening talking about some of her childhood, early life, relationship to family. She started off very disempowered, that low broken voice of a depressed person, but I found that giving her one of my juggling balls, to focus and occupy her arms with a definite rhythm as she was talking, made it possible to get a flow, a good empowered voice, connecting to more useful, flowing and positive emotional states. Once she got that stuff off her chest she was way more able to breathe fully, hula hoop, etc.

She mentioned that she's seen how she's been doing incomplete shallow breathing the whole day, trying and failing to breathe fully (as she's been able to sometimes) and the best time from that point of view was at the beach, right after I showed her how to do Breath of Fire Pranayama. Not during (as she's just learning it so she couldn't do it that well yet), but right after it, she was able to breathe fully, in a relaxed way. Guess we'll do that pranayam a bit more regularly then :biggrin:


--------------------
Blessed are your eyes because they see, and your ears because they hear.



For truly, I say to you, many prophets and righteous people longed to see what you see, and did not see it,
and to hear what you hear, and did not hear it.
- Matthew 13:16

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Re: Another encounter with (alleged) ADHD and self esteem issues [Re: Spacerific] * 2
    #20655597 - 10/03/14 10:51 PM (9 years, 5 months ago)

why do you feel like you need to fix this woman?


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Re: Another encounter with (alleged) ADHD and self esteem issues [Re: yogabunny]
    #20655637 - 10/03/14 11:03 PM (9 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

pika* said:
why do you feel like you need to fix this woman?



Touche


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Re: Another encounter with (alleged) ADHD and self esteem issues [Re: Spacerific]
    #20655691 - 10/03/14 11:22 PM (9 years, 5 months ago)

(Hope it's OK to update this thread by myself even with no replies, it's basically the only way I can think of to get organized in these ideas).

Update: I think I made a bit of a breakthrough / found some insight in what is going on here.

Here's what happened:

I was in bed next to our girl of the hour here, and being 4-5 am or whatever, I sort of woke up. The dog was at my feet, on the bed (normally not its place, he has a place on the floor which he stays in, when he wants to be in the room). I then realized she wasn't quite breathing. That is, I'd be taking 3-5 breaths, before she'd bother to take one. This was NOT the regular rhythm of slower breath, which is normal for people sleeping. It was MUCH slower than that.

I realized I've seen the same rhythm when she was basically doing the "waiting for approval" thing. That is, she'd do something, and then instead of rolling along at some steady pace, she'd stop, seek eye contact (waiting for approval) and basically hold her breath waiting for it. This is something kids do, or people when they're in unfamiliar situations and there's something they hope has answers. An expert, a teacher, a parent. However if it's done constantly, every minute of every hour of every day, it becomes tiring for anyone present, as basically here's a being which requires constant, compulsive, incessant confirmations that yes, what you're doing is OK. Yes, what you're doing is OK.

As I was noticing these unhealthy, excessively long pauses in her breath, I realized what the dog was doing on the bed. He was there in order to hear her breathe, which is IMO what dogs do, one of the ways they can take a read of their masters' state of mind. If the breath is chill, the dog can be chill. If the masters' breath is anxious, un-even or in any way disturbed, the dog knows it needs to be on alert, because something is obviously troubling the master. Whether it's internal or external the dog has no idea, but certainly there's some reason for concern there. If it's external trouble, the dog can be ready to protect. Eyes and senses sharp, to give early warning of any invaders of the territory and threats to the master. If it's internal trouble the master suffers from, perhaps they just are battling the thoughts in their head, getting into unhealthy thought patterns, and the dog knows (from experience) that master can be cheered up, if the dog shows up to play, and thus interrupt the pesky troubling thoughts.

So that's how dogs figure some things out (based on breath) and IMO it is a way that we could learn a lot from.

But what to do when the master's breath can't be heard? Well you have to get closer.

So far so good. This far I have noticed and decoded during the mushroom trip we had in that room. I've also seen the dog get anxious/nervous and actually pondering attack (attacking me) as he was not sure if I'm causing this girl some trouble, whether I'm friend or foe. I explained to her that she has to breathe, breathe chill, or that dog (which relies on her breath for guidance as to how things are going) will get restless. He had a bone there to gnaw and chew on. Whenever her breath stopped completely (which is something that depressed people do, when caught in the thoughts in their heads) the dog would start getting more nervous, and the bites on the bone would get, for lack of a better word, more murderous. The dog would stop its breath to be able to hear better how she's doing, and this stopping of its breath would put it on edge. Then I'd tell the girl to breathe, she'd breathe, the dog would hear, he'd start breathing and chill out and move on.

All well and good.

Now what happened next (earlier this morning, not during the trip) is that as I was hearing her basically fail to breathe, waiting, hanging on confirmation in a way, I noticed myself starting to get angry. This is a process I've seen before. I've put A LOT of massage in this girl, some loverboy tickling, awesome skin contact, very good vibes and most of them worked very well. They sent the message that I like her, that she's in fact likable as a person, which is IMO what she needed. And most of that effort has been well rewarded.

But some was not.

Some of my signals have been rewarded and returned (with hugs and kisses and caresses and what have you, the things that lovers do normally when in each other's company) while others have been dissipated in mindless behaviors, completely out of context and lacking all sense of timing. If you can imagine something like you're having sex, working your way up to and orgasm, everybody's engaged into it and rooting for the same goal, everybody's on the same team, and then one of the lovers stops, takes out their phone and starts playing Farmville :lol: Not that this is what happened, but many instances of similar behaviors, when energy that is being worked for together, gets simply dropped. Disconnected from. Taa-dee-dah, I wonder how grandma is doing. In the middle of a conversation, or a hug, or whatever is going on at the time. It's like a lover relying on you to provide orgasms, satisfaction and good vibes in a relationship, without pulling their own weight.

For these reasons and more, I've noticed myself get angry. Some minutes of this and I figured, well this is no way to proceed, at this rate I'll just build resentment, ruin the good vibes in this house and the whole show will fall apart in a mindless spectacle of anger and mediocrity. That is 100% not who I am, I am Space, I am the rolling festival of awesome, wizard and healer and bringer of good vibes to the people I interact with, and no amount of depression, alleged ADHD nor any other crap will detract me from that.

So I got up, got out of the bedroom to be able to move and think (can't do quality thinking in a body filled with bad vibes, limb tremors and shallow breath, have to move it and find a dancing rhythm again before you can think right) and explored. I explored rhythms and patterns, movements and steps and got my good vibes again. And as I was exploring the significance of this, I reached the insight.

The insight is something like, there is a game between you and the universe. The game is, are you awake or are you mindless? If awake, play with these things that I (the universe) have provided in your life. What is the most fun you can create with them? This much? Awesome. Have something else. Try this and this and this. Enjoy and chill and thrive to your heart's content.

But every once in a while, there's a sour apple thrown in. That's the actual meat of the game. The questions here are as follows:
- Do you know a sour apple when you see/hear/taste/smell/feel one? (if yes you're awake, if no you're asleep and mindless. Good luck playing the game while absent-minded :lol:)
- IF you've seen and felt that the apple is sour, how long will you stick around, before throwing it away or going away looking for new apples? New situations, people, breathing patterns, hobbies, foods, whatever?

That is the name of the game. How long is that delay? That is the precise measure of your mindfulness, awakening and engagement level in the game. For mindless drones stuck in their ways, it may be years and decades. Trying the same shit with the same approach with the same people and same molecules, for ever and fucking ever. See smoking. See alcoholics. See meth and porn and prostitution and whatever you can think of in those directions. See negative self-talk, being rough with oneself. How deep do you get into muddy waters before you start smelling the mud and changing course?

For this girl (and many like her, and I was like that for many many years) it takes years. Hell probably would have taken most of her life if I didn't happen to show up and start pointing certain things out.

How long will you keep taking the Ritalin, Xanax, Zoloft, opiates and booze, smoking the tobacco, masturbating to porn, going to an unsatisfying job to buy shit you don't really like, before you start looking for new patterns that actually deliver and satisfy? How long can you fall for the same trick of advertising, buying the propaganda, falling for the camouflage of the predators lurking in the grass?

How long will you breathe, move and think like that, before noticing it's not doing the job for you?

These are very deep questions to consider I think, and questions who especially in the West, IMO especially in the US, will reveal some pretty shameful answers. Pill popping instead of breath control, diet control and skin contact exploration. What pill or supplement can I take so that I don't have to be bothered to mind my own lungs, my own mindlessness and just get back to chugging down beers and fries? What therapist can I talk to, in order to avoid having to get out, take in the plentiful sunlight, hear the birds and trees and all the things that would calm and balance my nervous system, if I only showed up there? What, oh great internets, can I do to improve my life, without having to get my ass off this comfy couch? Can I get it in a really short sentence that doesn't require me to Google? :rofl:

So yeah. My anger is gone. I'm not angry at her. This girl is a juggling ball. A mystery box, a present to be unraveled and played with for great vibes. I am exploring patterns and solutions that are not rushed nor coarse nor angry, but fascinating, playful, engaging and fascinating. If the juggling balls don't work, I'll try the hula hoops. If those don't work I'll get back to the massage oils and healthy foods. The sands of the beach. The comedy movies and hugs and bike rides and swans on the lake, and all the other awesome things that the blue planet has available, for me to work my magic and clear this nervous system, of this girl who's just picked up some bullshit in her past. I know that's what the shamans are doing in those jungles. That they've taken the same things I have and have been shown the way. That if you take these 2-3 things and just simply rattle them for long enough in the right rhythm, fun will emerge. From the string of a bow being pinched for music, to anything that makes sound being used as a first-time drum, meaningful pattern, rhythm and great joy can be found in anything, irrespective of context. The only way it can't be found is by being inactive and lacking the thirst and curiosity for it.

These are great times and great adventures. I will follow the rabbit hole wherever it leads, and know very well in my heart of hearts that it leads from one awesome place to another. All one needs is to move and explore sincerely :biggrin:


--------------------
Blessed are your eyes because they see, and your ears because they hear.



For truly, I say to you, many prophets and righteous people longed to see what you see, and did not see it,
and to hear what you hear, and did not hear it.
- Matthew 13:16

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Re: Another encounter with (alleged) ADHD and self esteem issues [Re: azur]
    #20655726 - 10/03/14 11:40 PM (9 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

azur said:
Quote:

pika* said:
why do you feel like you need to fix this woman?



Touche



I don't need anything you simpletons, I enjoy it and thrive on it :lol:

I fix nervous systems because that's what I take the greatest pleasure in right now. I do this in the same exact way that a bird sings. Perhaps it's compulsive, in the sense that it is my nature, just like a birds' song, but if she kicks me out tomorrow and decides to get back to smoking a pack a day and popping 5 pills of dexamphetamine to fuel more mindlessness, I will be on my bike and happily pedaling on. I have plenty of adventures waiting for me, just like I found this one. I don't cling to this one girl in particular. I'm not sure if you've noticed, but broken nervous systems and people fucking themselves up in all ways imaginable, that is something there's definitely NOT a shortage of on this planet. I can go ANYWHERE and find myself 50 volunteers who are cluelessly crawling through life with strain, struggle and difficulty, looking for someone who has even the faintest clue how to live it joyfully, which I do.

What I have to prove, if anything, is to myself and myself alone. I do this to sharpen my skills and senses and my understanding of the universe. I do this because I was called here, faced with a challenging fascinating problem and endowed and equipped with the skills to fix it.

I do this as a glorious :lol: in the face of every unimaginative "doctor" that thinks the solution to Westerners' isolation, lonelines and alienation can be found in pills or talking to therapists on a couch with no skin contact nor dietary change.

I do this to show how awesome the healing process can be, and that I have massage, fun, juggling, hula hooping, singing, dancing, romance, BDSM, psychedelic trips and glorious adventures, where my poorer and less imaginative practitioners of "medicine" have boring ineffective approaches that only spread around their lame flaccid brand of mediocrity. I explore these things because they give me great pleasure. Having for the most part fixed my nervous system to the point where life is joyful most of the time, I like to show up some place, do a certain something and see good vibes spread to people that haven't seen good vibes in years. I like taking things that people can't make sense of, and making progress where others have given up and written a crap prescription, or started smoking and drinking in despair.

Choice of words gentlemen, choice of words. The question is why do I LIKE doing this, and I like it for all the reasons above. Be well and thrive and prosper in all your ways :heart:


--------------------
Blessed are your eyes because they see, and your ears because they hear.



For truly, I say to you, many prophets and righteous people longed to see what you see, and did not see it,
and to hear what you hear, and did not hear it.
- Matthew 13:16

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Re: Another encounter with (alleged) ADHD and self esteem issues [Re: Spacerific] * 8
    #20656272 - 10/04/14 06:29 AM (9 years, 5 months ago)

It's one thing if you are a healer of some sort with a healing practice where people come to you to solicit your guidance and expertise. It's another thing to purposely select human beings as test subjects and manipulate them into healing themselves. This is not you helping and healing some poor soul, this is your ego trying to demonstrate how powerful you are to yourself.. 

"Now however, I have a proper test subject :hellfire:"

Yikes, man!

If you have achieved some level of knowledge and experience around mind/body/spirt health, your path should be to live it and guide by your example; not to select test subjects to enter into relationships with and "fix".

You seem determined though, so my advice to you is that while you are on this mission to fix this woman, don't forget to take care of yourself otherwise you may end up energetically drained and taking on a lot of her emotions and negativity.

I think allowing yourself to be led by this purpose will inevitably blow up in your face at some point, though. Keep focusing on your own healing practice and you will naturally influence people around, and then if you want to help others than find some way to teach - yoga, nutrition, energy work, body work, etc in an official setting.

:bunnypeace:


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Re: Another encounter with (alleged) ADHD and self esteem issues [Re: yogabunny]
    #20656318 - 10/04/14 06:52 AM (9 years, 5 months ago)

Thank you for your input. Most of my stuff here happens by example. Anyway since this is the first of my patients/test subjects/victims, I'm learning as I go. Takes a while to master any skill or art.

Quote:


You seem determined though, so my advice to you is that while you are on this mission to fix this woman, don't forget to take care of yourself otherwise you may end up energetically drained and taking on a lot of her emotions and negativity.



Well aware. Putting my oxygen mask on first. Seems to be handle-able though. There have been some challenges, I've had to recover from some shocks to my system but seems to go AOK so far.

Quote:


I think allowing yourself to be led by this purpose will inevitably blow up in your face at some point, though.



I must say I dislike the negative attitude. Also think it's misplaced/misguided. Of course you're well entitled to your opinion and feelings, just saying I think it rather not constructive to share them here in this way. Even if it blows up in my face it will have been a valuable learning experience and I will take it as such. Rome wasn't built in a day.

Random update: Her incredibly noisy roommate just came home. I feel my gut clutching and heart increasing a few bpm's. 2-3 minutes and so far doors have been slammed, several thing restlessly fidgeted with, sounded like she's in an extreme state of panic, but apparently that's her normal every day behavior. I've well enjoyed the 2-3 weeks she's been here, bothering her mother.

This is a 35 kg anorexic btw, that fancies hereself a mindfulness hippie btw, has no sex and sees great value in waking up at 5 AM to do noisy things to attract attention on how spiritual she is. I wonder if she's here to stay or just pick up a few things.

If she stays, her frigid head is likely to :header: at the normal displays of affection that I have with my girl. Last time she felt the need to storm out of the house after about two days :lol:

Will update as things develop.


--------------------
Blessed are your eyes because they see, and your ears because they hear.



For truly, I say to you, many prophets and righteous people longed to see what you see, and did not see it,
and to hear what you hear, and did not hear it.
- Matthew 13:16

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Re: Another encounter with (alleged) ADHD and self esteem issues [Re: Spacerific]
    #20656873 - 10/04/14 10:01 AM (9 years, 5 months ago)

I just think relationships should be about finding someone you love & who's on the same level with you, not about finding someone to turn into a project in order to demonstrate your own grasp of spiritual practice and nutrition and stuff.

I think you have good intentions and you feel you have wisdom to share which is beautiful, but a relationship should be about accepting someone faults & all and not conditional upon whether the person changes to adopt your lifestyle. 

I can't help but think about this video clip I watched of this couple in Miami. They're both 70 something but the woman looks not a day older than 40 because she's been on a completely raw diet of food she grows herself since her 30's. The guy kept eating the same way he always did and looks his age, but they're still totally in love and happy together.

I wish you both the best though.


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