Home | Community | Message Board


This site includes paid links. Please support our sponsors.


Welcome to the Shroomery Message Board! You are experiencing a small sample of what the site has to offer. Please login or register to post messages and view our exclusive members-only content. You'll gain access to additional forums, file attachments, board customizations, encrypted private messages, and much more!

Shop: PhytoExtractum Buy Bali Kratom Powder   Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

Jump to first unread post Pages: 1 | 2 | 3 | Next >  [ show all ]
Offlinelove2shpongleIRL
Opiophile
Male

Registered: 06/11/11
Posts: 4,784
Last seen: 11 years, 10 months
Faster than light particle found * 1
    #15117609 - 09/22/11 02:48 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/44629271/ns/technology_and_science-science/t/astounding-discovery-faster-than-light-particle/?gt1=43001




Font:





GENEVA — Scientists at the world's largest physics lab say they have clocked subatomic particles traveling faster than light, a feat that — if true — would break a fundamental pillar of science.

The readings have so astounded researchers that they are asking others to independently verify the measurements before claiming an actual discovery.

"This would be such a sensational discovery if it were true that one has to treat it extremely carefully," said John Ellis, a theoretical physicist at the European Organization for Nuclear Research, or CERN, who was not involved in the experiment.

Nothing is supposed to move faster than light, at least according to Albert Einstein's special theory of relativity: The famous E (equals) mc2 equation. That stands for energy equals mass times the speed of light squared.

But neutrinos — one of the strangest well-known particles in physics — have now been observed smashing past this cosmic speed barrier of 186,282 miles per second (299,792 kilometers).

More science news from MSNBC Tech & Science



K.U. Leuven Robots gear up for the farm
Future of Tech: For the past 10,000 years or so, farmers have been waking at the crack of dawn to tend their fields. Such a bleary-eyed chore could become a thing of the past thanks to robots geared-up for the farm.

Whales mingle as Northwest Passage ice melts
How DEET works: Study says it confuses insects
Before genocide, Bosnians suffered greatly
.
.
CERN says a neutrino beam fired from a particle accelerator near Geneva to a lab 454 miles (730 kilometers) away in Italy traveled 60 nanoseconds faster than the speed of light. Scientists calculated the margin of error at just 10 nanoseconds, making the difference statistically significant. But given the enormity of the find, they still spent months checking and rechecking their results to make sure there were no flaws in the experiment.

The CERN researchers are now looking to the United States and Japan to confirm the results.

A similar neutrino experiment at Fermilab near Chicago would be capable of running the tests, said Stavros Katsanevas, the deputy director of France's National Institute for Nuclear and Particle Physics Research.

Katsanevas, who participated in the CERN experiment, said help could also come from the T2K experiment in Japan, though that is currently on hold after the country's devastating earthquake and tsunami in March.

Scientists agree that if the results are confirmed, it would force a fundamental rethink of the laws of nature, starting with the special theory of relativity proposed by Einstein in 1905.

Special relativity, which helps explain everything from black holes to the Big Bang theory about the origins of the universe, underlies "pretty much everything in modern physics," Ellis said. "It has worked perfectly up until now."

He cautioned that the neutrino researchers also would have to explain why similar results weren't detected before, such as when an exploding star — or supernova — was observed in 1987.


--------------------
Only those who will risk going too far can possibly find out how far one can go.
T. S. Eliot

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisiblearago
Mr. Wind Up Bird
Male


Registered: 02/07/06
Posts: 828
Re: Faster than light particle found [Re: love2shpongleIRL]
    #15117659 - 09/22/11 02:58 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

Particle/wave theory is so cool.  The more they keep smashing, the smaller they get, and the faster they go.  Not a very rational response, I'm just the first to say this is cool.  Hope they can repeat the results.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflinePatlal
You ask too many questions
Male User Gallery


Registered: 10/09/10
Posts: 44,826
Loc: Ottawa Flag
Last seen: 10 hours, 36 minutes
Re: Faster than light particle found [Re: arago]
    #15117803 - 09/22/11 03:31 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

OMFG. I always wanted to see the speed of light broken in my lifetime. I really REaLLY hope this is true and not just a miscalculation


--------------------

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisiblepwnasaurus
Stranger
I'm a teapot User Gallery


Registered: 07/16/08
Posts: 12,317
Loc: Canada Flag
Re: Faster than light particle found [Re: Patlal]
    #15117809 - 09/22/11 03:32 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Patlal said:
OMFG. I always wanted to see the speed of light broken in my lifetime. I really REaLLY hope this is true and not just a miscalculation



If this is true it would nullify such a HUGE amount of our understanding of physics.  I hope it's NOT true, because then we as humans would feel pretty shitty about having all our knowledge erased, but at the same time I am kinda curious to see if it is...

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleMidnight_Toker
Gone Fishin'
Male User Gallery

Registered: 09/26/10
Posts: 11,589
Loc: Canada Flag
Re: Faster than light particle found [Re: love2shpongleIRL]
    #15117829 - 09/22/11 03:35 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

Wasn't it already common knowledge that relativity breaks down on a subatomic scale?

I mean it's cool to have it in writing, but I don't think it will change much.

What about entanglement?  That's instant transmission of information no matter the distance.  That's FTL travel in my books.

Relativity still has it's place, but quantum physics seems to be the way of the future.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisible4runner
 User Gallery

Registered: 07/16/10
Posts: 15,406
Loc: State of Jefferson
Re: Faster than light particle found [Re: Midnight_Toker]
    #15117839 - 09/22/11 03:37 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

Can't say i ever thought about it but yeah, seeing that speed record broken is something pretty damn special. That is if it holds up to scrutiny.

Strange, very strange.

Quote:

Midnight_Toker said:
Wasn't it already common knowledge that relativity breaks down on a subatomic scale?



Yeah, pretty much, but this is a first that could affect a lot more... I guess. (maybe I am wrong?)

Now that shit is weird.



:header:

Edited by 4runner (09/22/11 03:40 PM)

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleDieCommie

Registered: 12/11/03
Posts: 29,258
Re: Faster than light particle found [Re: Midnight_Toker]
    #15117847 - 09/22/11 03:38 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Midnight_Toker said:
Wasn't it already common knowledge that relativity breaks down on a subatomic scale?

I mean it's cool to have it in writing, but I don't think it will change much.

What about entanglement?  That's instant transmission of information no matter the distance.  That's FTL travel in my books.




No, relativity does not break down at a subatomic scale and entanglement is not the instantaneous transformation of information.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleMidnight_Toker
Gone Fishin'
Male User Gallery

Registered: 09/26/10
Posts: 11,589
Loc: Canada Flag
Re: Faster than light particle found [Re: DieCommie]
    #15117858 - 09/22/11 03:40 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

Care to elaborate for the non-particle-physicists here?

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleDieCommie

Registered: 12/11/03
Posts: 29,258
Re: Faster than light particle found [Re: Midnight_Toker]
    #15117877 - 09/22/11 03:43 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

Its a common misconception that the theory of relativity and quantum theory are somehow incompatible.  They are not.  In fact, quantum theory didn't work quite right until relativity was incorporated into it.  This happened back in the 1920s.

Also, there is no way to transmit information using entanglement.  No matter how you try to set it up, you cannot send any type of information at all instantaneously.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleMidnight_Toker
Gone Fishin'
Male User Gallery

Registered: 09/26/10
Posts: 11,589
Loc: Canada Flag
Re: Faster than light particle found [Re: DieCommie]
    #15118015 - 09/22/11 04:11 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

Well you are correct.  They have to be compatible in some way, even if it's only to let one theories forces take hold over the other's at a certain point, right?

I apologize.  Although it interests me, I only have an at-home education of these subjects.  Can you explain how quantum entanglement does not count as faster than light travel? 

Also, what was your reaction to this new possible discovery?

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineThe Ecstatic
Chilldog Extraordinaire


Registered: 11/11/09
Posts: 33,752
Loc: 'Merica Flag
Last seen: 7 hours, 14 minutes
Re: Faster than light particle found [Re: DieCommie]
    #15118052 - 09/22/11 04:18 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

:awecluster::awecluster::awecluster:
:awecluster::awecluster::awecluster:
:awecluster::awecluster::awecluster:

If these calculations are correct this is a HUGE day for science! :cheers:

:awehigh:


--------------------

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisiblefiddle
Male User Gallery


Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 04/10/08
Posts: 1,769
Loc: PNW
Re: Faster than light particle found [Re: Midnight_Toker]
    #15118055 - 09/22/11 04:18 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

I was under the impression that science already knew about particles traveling above the lightspeed and that moving above the speed of light wasn't an issue unless you were starting from sub-relativistic speeds. ie: a particle can travel above the speed of light, so long as it has always been travelling above the speed of light.

this is either my clairvoyance or :tard: acting up.


--------------------
Tickle my bassline.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineACTG
Stranger
 User Gallery


Registered: 02/08/10
Posts: 215
Last seen: 10 years, 3 months
Re: Faster than light particle found [Re: fiddle]
    #15118117 - 09/22/11 04:28 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

The biggest problem with detecting "faster than light particles" is...
if Einstein is correct... they would travel BACKWARDS THROUGH TIME,
meaning any "detector" would actually have to detect the particles
BEFORE you actually send them. And unless you can transmit a detectible
pattern, any "detection" would be indistinguishable from simple background noise.


--------------------
:bow2::bow2::bow2: :bow2::bow2::bow2:

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleDeadHearts


Registered: 07/17/09
Posts: 21,827
Loc: MICHIGAN
Re: Faster than light particle found [Re: pwnasaurus]
    #15118133 - 09/22/11 04:31 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

pwnasaurus said:
Quote:

Patlal said:
OMFG. I always wanted to see the speed of light broken in my lifetime. I really REaLLY hope this is true and not just a miscalculation



If this is true it would nullify such a HUGE amount of our understanding of physics.  I hope it's NOT true, because then we as humans would feel pretty shitty about having all our knowledge erased, but at the same time I am kinda curious to see if it is...





How would this be a surprise if true?? I just love how people cling to our
current understanding as the end all be all.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleDieCommie

Registered: 12/11/03
Posts: 29,258
Re: Faster than light particle found [Re: Midnight_Toker]
    #15118184 - 09/22/11 04:42 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

.

Edited by DieCommie (11/11/16 10:11 AM)

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineMuufokfok
aka BoxyBrown
Male User Gallery

Registered: 02/14/07
Posts: 2,119
Loc: america's wang Flag
Last seen: 1 year, 9 months
Re: Faster than light particle found [Re: DieCommie]
    #15118248 - 09/22/11 04:54 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

this is some serious business, one of the biggest scientific breakthroughs since :abomb: or :lsd: lol


--------------------
"I'm guessing the 'ancient lost drug' of india is psychedelic mushrooms. The correlation between sacred cows (in hinduism) and magic mushrooms growing on cow dung is too strong to ignore, if you ask me."

As the ocean waves, the universe "peoples"
~Alan Watts~

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleDeadHearts


Registered: 07/17/09
Posts: 21,827
Loc: MICHIGAN
Re: Faster than light particle found [Re: DieCommie]
    #15118273 - 09/22/11 04:58 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

DieCommie said:


:yawn: Its no big deal IMO.  These types of things pop up every year, people making claims and spreading the news before there has been reproduction and scrutiny.  Ill be impressed after its been reproduced and scrutinized.





I think CERN is a pretty reputable source. Who are you again?

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleDieCommie

Registered: 12/11/03
Posts: 29,258
Re: Faster than light particle found [Re: DeadHearts]
    #15118276 - 09/22/11 04:59 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

CERN is not a source, its a place....

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleDeadHearts


Registered: 07/17/09
Posts: 21,827
Loc: MICHIGAN
Re: Faster than light particle found [Re: DieCommie]
    #15118290 - 09/22/11 05:01 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

DieCommie said:
CERN is not a source, its a place....





:lolsy:

You know what I mean.
Are you aware of that big machine they have and who works there? This isnt coming from some fringe scientist.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineAnonymousRabbit
Comrade
 User Gallery

Registered: 01/10/08
Posts: 8,993
Last seen: 1 year, 6 months
. [Re: DeadHearts] * 3
    #15118296 - 09/22/11 05:03 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

.


--------------------
.

Edited by AnonymousRabbit (05/19/22 12:37 AM)

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Jump to top Pages: 1 | 2 | 3 | Next >  [ show all ]

Shop: PhytoExtractum Buy Bali Kratom Powder   Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order


Similar ThreadsPosterViewsRepliesLast post
* Mickey hart+Particle = Hydra!! LooksLikeRain 1,422 17 02/18/05 01:16 AM
by KristiMidocean
* Particle... Edge 1,093 8 07/30/04 03:12 PM
by Edge
* Mickey Hart+Particle=Hydra**Updated With Pics**
( 1 2 3 all )
blissedout 5,586 55 04/28/05 10:28 PM
by blissedout
* Particle
( 1 2 all )
Psilygirl 3,578 27 07/01/05 09:35 AM
by dnL
* Particle physics inqueries
( 1 2 all )
PreparationH 2,280 21 02/14/10 03:15 PM
by cortex
* Anyone heard the band Particle yet?? Adamist 1,937 16 04/25/04 10:13 PM
by Hooty
* Particle-board is what happens when... Konnrade 1,170 15 09/20/06 03:33 AM
by Prisoner#1
* Did any of you Particle fans know that their guitar player is not with them anymore? blissedout 875 9 01/16/06 04:00 PM
by blissedout

Extra information
You cannot start new topics / You cannot reply to topics
HTML is disabled / BBCode is enabled
Moderator: Entire Staff
3,144 topic views. 8 members, 24 guests and 89 web crawlers are browsing this forum.
[ Show Images Only | Sort by Score | Print Topic ]
Search this thread:

Copyright 1997-2024 Mind Media. Some rights reserved.

Generated in 0.03 seconds spending 0.008 seconds on 16 queries.