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Invisiblethedudenj
Man of the Woods

Registered: 08/18/04
Posts: 14,684
iso tar Vs. HCl
    #10972251 - 08/31/09 11:55 AM (14 years, 6 months ago)

so really whats the difference in effects when properly extracted when it comes down to it you pull all the active stuff out. people have been claiming that the iso tar totally has way more flavor ( aka a better feel and more magical one) is there any validity to this claim. is so what are the alkaloids that arnt being extracted via the extract? its clear P torch and san pedro have more then just mescaline.

as far as peyote goes i can believe that that has way more of a feel then just just mescaline or a cactus crystalline extract.

now when extracting MG doing a acid base or non polar it clearly pulls out more the just LSA in the final crystal product. why wouldnt it be the same for extracting from cactus. its totally clear that if you have synth mescaline it shouldnt compare to cacti extracted any day dude to it being just straight mescaline.

so can people compare and contrast that have the experience. i can say that cactus tea and ISO extract dont feel any different at all.


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"You all are just  puppets... You have no heart...and cannot feel any pain...""
you may think thats pain you feel but you must have a heart to feel true pain and that pain wont be yours

Edited by thedudenj (08/31/09 12:01 PM)

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InvisibleReoSpeedwagon153
Male User Gallery

Registered: 02/04/06
Posts: 2,098
Loc: Chetumal, Mexico
Re: iso tar Vs. HCl [Re: thedudenj]
    #10972494 - 08/31/09 12:57 PM (14 years, 6 months ago)

Pedro has many more alks than just mescaline.

At least one contributes to the tired, nauseous, dreamy stage at the beginning of the trip.

An HCL extraction removes this and purifies the mescaline (as one has to wash the mesc. HCL in acetone to remove the excess acid, it removes the excess hydrochloride salts of non mescaline alkaloids in the extraction as well).

Same goes for the citrate tek on this site. There is a final cleaning step, in which the alkaloids are crystallized out of solution to remove the excess citric acid. The crystallized product is almost entirely pure mescaline citrate, as it is the most abundant chemical in the solution, and therefore would be first to fall out of solution.

There are many ways of purifying a cactus extract to 90-98%, so it's likely such an extract would be identical to synthetic mescaline.

I have also read that peruvian torch extracts are mostly pure mescaline, as it does not contain the same dreamy chemical that pedro and achuma have.


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“I thought naming myself ‘ReoSpeedwagon153’ on a forum was a funny idea in 2006.”

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Invisiblethedudenj
Man of the Woods

Registered: 08/18/04
Posts: 14,684
Re: iso tar Vs. HCl [Re: ReoSpeedwagon153]
    #10972567 - 08/31/09 01:17 PM (14 years, 6 months ago)

i totally havent had san pedro only P torch,Loph will, and loph diff diffusa being my favorite then will then p torch. p torch i have the most exp with tho. its really nice.


so when it comes down to it ISO extract P@wns or tea on crystal


--------------------

"You all are just  puppets... You have no heart...and cannot feel any pain...""
you may think thats pain you feel but you must have a heart to feel true pain and that pain wont be yours

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InvisibleTomandjerry58
Stranger
Registered: 01/27/03
Posts: 5,212
Re: iso tar Vs. HCl [Re: thedudenj]
    #10973036 - 08/31/09 02:50 PM (14 years, 6 months ago)

Ive only tried it twice. Once with 1ft of pedro tea and once with 300 mg mescaline hcl(extracted pedro acetone wash). The pedro tea wasn't all that potent. Stomach discomfort was experienced General euphoria came on later in the trip. But it just wasn't enough. 300mg hcl ...no stomach discomfort...full level three trip at least...come down was superb....no ill effects.. nor abnormal bathroom visits... mescaline = :inlove3:  Mescaline hcl is what we are all looking for. :slomo:

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InvisibleReoSpeedwagon153
Male User Gallery

Registered: 02/04/06
Posts: 2,098
Loc: Chetumal, Mexico
Re: iso tar Vs. HCl [Re: thedudenj]
    #10973060 - 08/31/09 02:56 PM (14 years, 6 months ago)

I like them both.

Never tried iso tar, but I'm guessing it's about the same as tea.

Pure mesc is quite different though. Not necessarily preferable, it depends on what you like about tripping.

You seem more like the 'plant spirit' kind of tripper. Some people prefer to use 'psychedelic drugs.'


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“I thought naming myself ‘ReoSpeedwagon153’ on a forum was a funny idea in 2006.”

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Offlinefatso
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Registered: 05/14/09
Posts: 3,088
Loc: LA Flag
Last seen: 11 years, 8 months
Re: iso tar Vs. HCl [Re: ReoSpeedwagon153]
    #10973171 - 08/31/09 03:15 PM (14 years, 6 months ago)

can i use 91 iso for the iso extract?  i cant seem to find 99% anywhere.


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My old Papaver Somniferums var. Gigantum and my Passion Flower...

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Invisiblethedudenj
Man of the Woods

Registered: 08/18/04
Posts: 14,684
Re: iso tar Vs. HCl [Re: ReoSpeedwagon153]
    #10973224 - 08/31/09 03:22 PM (14 years, 6 months ago)

well iso tar is like tea minus drinking snot. you just pop balls of tar in mouth swallow and then trip i dont get stomach problems at all. btw you pedro sounds weak the first time i had torch i had the BBB really weak torch i took alot will barely threshold. i later extracted a huge piece of it into tar which was still weak effects but stronger then eating the amount that i did for sure.

this other vendors dried torch P@WNs


--------------------

"You all are just  puppets... You have no heart...and cannot feel any pain...""
you may think thats pain you feel but you must have a heart to feel true pain and that pain wont be yours

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Offlinefatso
Male User Gallery


Registered: 05/14/09
Posts: 3,088
Loc: LA Flag
Last seen: 11 years, 8 months
Re: iso tar Vs. HCl [Re: thedudenj]
    #10973282 - 08/31/09 03:29 PM (14 years, 6 months ago)

dunno why mine is weeam cuz i havent used it and its homegrown not bbb.  will 91 work? i have that and my cactus is goonna pretty much finish drying today


--------------------
   
My old Papaver Somniferums var. Gigantum and my Passion Flower...

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OfflineShroomDoom
Friend of the Medicine
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Registered: 06/07/04
Posts: 4,435
Loc: A Psychedelic State Flag
Last seen: 1 year, 10 months
Re: iso tar Vs. HCl [Re: thedudenj]
    #10973308 - 08/31/09 03:32 PM (14 years, 6 months ago)

i found the mescaline acetate form of p. torch extract to be quite nice even in very low doses. here is the acetate tek
http://www.dmt-nexus.com/forum/default.aspx?g=posts&t=4002



my most powerful mescaline experience to date has been from a tea brewed in the arbuckle mountains. Ive had beautiful experiences from p. torch iso tar as well.

i have had bunk tea and bunk tar experiences though.
too much heat or impotent cactus might have been the culprit.


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Invisiblethedudenj
Man of the Woods

Registered: 08/18/04
Posts: 14,684
Re: iso tar Vs. HCl [Re: ShroomDoom]
    #10973451 - 08/31/09 03:45 PM (14 years, 6 months ago)

yeah i use low heat. when making tar i fan dry

yeah 91% or higher iso is choice.

when making tea i dont let it bubble


--------------------

"You all are just  puppets... You have no heart...and cannot feel any pain...""
you may think thats pain you feel but you must have a heart to feel true pain and that pain wont be yours

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Offlinefatso
Male User Gallery


Registered: 05/14/09
Posts: 3,088
Loc: LA Flag
Last seen: 11 years, 8 months
Re: iso tar Vs. HCl [Re: thedudenj]
    #10973552 - 08/31/09 03:56 PM (14 years, 6 months ago)

ok thanks. ive been fan drying and sun dryinying my flesh. gonna strat anextact today maybe.  just do like 3 pulls right?  how many days should i soak it?


ps random thought can you use fresh cactus for iso exteact?


--------------------
   
My old Papaver Somniferums var. Gigantum and my Passion Flower...

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Invisiblethedudenj
Man of the Woods

Registered: 08/18/04
Posts: 14,684
Re: iso tar Vs. HCl [Re: fatso]
    #10974004 - 08/31/09 05:03 PM (14 years, 6 months ago)

i only get 2 pulls when it comes down to it


--------------------

"You all are just  puppets... You have no heart...and cannot feel any pain...""
you may think thats pain you feel but you must have a heart to feel true pain and that pain wont be yours

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Offlinefatso
Male User Gallery


Registered: 05/14/09
Posts: 3,088
Loc: LA Flag
Last seen: 11 years, 8 months
Re: iso tar Vs. HCl [Re: thedudenj]
    #10975196 - 08/31/09 07:46 PM (14 years, 6 months ago)

k. should i add a lil bit of lemon?  its 10 inches of skinned cactus flesh.


--------------------
   
My old Papaver Somniferums var. Gigantum and my Passion Flower...

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InvisibleReoSpeedwagon153
Male User Gallery

Registered: 02/04/06
Posts: 2,098
Loc: Chetumal, Mexico
Re: iso tar Vs. HCl [Re: ShroomDoom]
    #10979911 - 09/01/09 02:07 PM (14 years, 6 months ago)

The acetate tek kicks any other preparation's ass.

Have you heard of the carbonate variety of the acetate tek, using seltzer water instead of vinegar to obtain solid crystals?

Arbuckle mountains, huh? I guess we are neighbors...


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“I thought naming myself ‘ReoSpeedwagon153’ on a forum was a funny idea in 2006.”

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Offlineredfishbluefish

Registered: 09/27/07
Posts: 132
Last seen: 7 years, 6 months
Re: iso tar Vs. HCl [Re: ReoSpeedwagon153]
    #10979986 - 09/01/09 02:20 PM (14 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

ReoSpeedwagon153 said:
The acetate tek kicks any other preparation's ass.





Explain please? I thought there was no significant difference between the end product of the preparations except weight? Hcl being the lightest? Does the acetate form work better or something?

I thought to obtain a certain form, just use a different acid. Citric acid -> mesc citrate. Muriatic acid -> mesc hcl.

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InvisibleReoSpeedwagon153
Male User Gallery

Registered: 02/04/06
Posts: 2,098
Loc: Chetumal, Mexico
Re: iso tar Vs. HCl [Re: redfishbluefish]
    #10980096 - 09/01/09 02:37 PM (14 years, 6 months ago)

Acetate forms a waxy solid that is not crystalline really at all.

It is because of this (and probably the higher solubility in water) that mescaline acetate seems to be slightly more potent than HCL.

200mg is a strong psychedelic experience that comes on much quicker than a higher dose of mescaline hcl.

The reason I praise the acetate tek so much is for an innovation earlier in the tek, before the salting phase. This tek calls for the use of D-limonene and food-grade calcium hydroxide in place of xylene and lye.

D-limonene is a natural terpene extracted from orange peels. It is non-toxic and smells amazing.

These innovations, along with the vinegar make the d-limonene acetate tek completely food safe. Also, word is that most who attempt it end up with much bigger yields than with other teks (1.5%-2.5%).

Would you rather your house smell like xylene, isopropyll alcohol, or d-limo?


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“I thought naming myself ‘ReoSpeedwagon153’ on a forum was a funny idea in 2006.”

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Offlinefatso
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Registered: 05/14/09
Posts: 3,088
Loc: LA Flag
Last seen: 11 years, 8 months
Re: iso tar Vs. HCl [Re: ReoSpeedwagon153]
    #10980164 - 09/01/09 02:48 PM (14 years, 6 months ago)

iso


--------------------
   
My old Papaver Somniferums var. Gigantum and my Passion Flower...

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Offlineredfishbluefish

Registered: 09/27/07
Posts: 132
Last seen: 7 years, 6 months
Re: iso tar Vs. HCl [Re: ReoSpeedwagon153]
    #10980165 - 09/01/09 02:48 PM (14 years, 6 months ago)

Fascinating. Hadn't heard of that. I must give it a try. Thanks for the heads up, REO.

Sorry for the hijack.

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InvisibleReoSpeedwagon153
Male User Gallery

Registered: 02/04/06
Posts: 2,098
Loc: Chetumal, Mexico
Re: iso tar Vs. HCl [Re: fatso]
    #10980458 - 09/01/09 03:40 PM (14 years, 6 months ago)

Maybe you haven't smelled limonene yet. It smells like you are living inside of an orange.


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“I thought naming myself ‘ReoSpeedwagon153’ on a forum was a funny idea in 2006.”

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InvisibleTomandjerry58
Stranger
Registered: 01/27/03
Posts: 5,212
Re: iso tar Vs. HCl [Re: ReoSpeedwagon153]
    #10980681 - 09/01/09 04:13 PM (14 years, 6 months ago)

I mean yeah...it seems safer and all... but i would seriously have to take the pepsi challenge before i would call it better.. and where the hell do you find d-limonene?

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