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dr_gonz
Registered: 08/18/03
Posts: 44,654
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#10657441 - 07/11/09 10:59 AM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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sterbeklang
w/e
Registered: 03/03/09
Posts: 824
Loc: Filthy Rock
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Re: Messiahs [Re: dr_gonz]
#10657583 - 07/11/09 11:34 AM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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Oddly enough, none of those seem to describe this guy:
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Minstrel
Man of Science
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 1,974
Loc: Hogtown
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Quote:
sterbeklang said: Oddly enough, none of those seem to describe this guy:
I lol'd.
Lil'kimmy is a bit of a 2nd messiah to the DPRKers. There is a government supported myth that on the day he was born, every bird in Korea sang. The only thing that surpasses his mythology is that of his father, the eternal President, Kiimy Il Sung.
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deCypher
Registered: 02/10/08
Posts: 56,232
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Re: Messiahs [Re: dr_gonz]
#10658119 - 07/11/09 01:10 PM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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Do all these religions also prophesy the coming of an Antichrist or anti-Messiah figure?
-------------------- We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars.
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dr_gonz
Registered: 08/18/03
Posts: 44,654
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solstice
Hempowered
Registered: 02/14/09
Posts: 2,003
Loc: Silly Cunt Valley
Last seen: 10 years, 7 days
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Re: Messiahs [Re: dr_gonz]
#10660565 - 07/11/09 09:08 PM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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I personally take great interest in that kind of thing. Nowadays my view on this topic is that these spiritual icons might be projections of an ideal generated by the human mind which takes many forms in many places due to the multitudes of traditions forming mankind's cultural fabric.
I mean, why do these iconic figures always either lived in the past or are awaited in the " near " future? Why are they never found right now? Why is that the only mean to encounter such a perfect human being is through scripture and never in flesh and blood?
Another way to put it would be that there is no such thing as a perfect man. Everyone has their price, everyone is potentially corrupt but that never stopped us, as a species, to envision an ideal, hypothetical human being, someone who holds the highest moral ground and sticks to it through thick and thin. Someone to guide us, to show us the way. A great leader strong enough to right the wrongs we are too weak to work out. Someone to set things, and ourselves, straight once and for all.
So I ask the question again: If, as these religious traditions claim, such men are real, why do they always belong in the past of in the future?
Personally, I think that such a man never was but what our collective mind did was imagine such a concept and created some sort of egregore fed by all these people from all these cultures from all over the world which might sooner or later reach a sufficient energetic stage and emerge as the hypothetical messiah so many people await. So what I'm saying is that Buddha, Krishna, Muhammad, Moses, Jesus, Zarathustra and all the others never really existed, or, never were what their followers claimed them to be. Instead, these icons are our best aspirations written down in the form of scripture in an instinctive drive to inspire future generations of people and all the while, unconsciously feeding the egregore of human idealism so that eventually we might actually come face to face with the one and only, the first of it's kind, perfect man/woman. The collective egregore of perfection made flesh.
Thinking about messiahs from this angle gives the whole concept a very eschatological sense. What we might actually be doing, regardless of superficial cultural difference is collectively wishing into existence the very best of ourselves! Something no one ever managed to become yet, in all of mankind's recorded history.
Edited by solstice (07/11/09 09:15 PM)
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blewmeanie
Registered: 10/01/06
Posts: 28,984
Loc:
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Quote:
deCypher said: Do all these religions also prophesy the coming of an Antichrist or anti-Messiah figure?
Nah, not all of them.
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blewmeanie
Registered: 10/01/06
Posts: 28,984
Loc:
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Rev 5:6 - And I beheld, and, lo, in the midst of the throne and of the four beasts, and in the midst of the elders, stood a Lamb as it had been slain, having seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven Spirits of God sent forth into all the earth.
Who are these seven spirits?
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FreedomForAll
One Step Ahead
Registered: 11/30/08
Posts: 2,105
Last seen: 10 years, 9 months
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Quote:
deCypher said: Do all these religions also prophesy the coming of an Antichrist or anti-Messiah figure?
I know Islam does.
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Silversoul
Rhizome
Registered: 01/01/05
Posts: 23,576
Loc: The Barricades
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Quote:
sterbeklang said: Oddly enough, none of those seem to describe this guy:
Kim Jong-Il needs to get himself an island fortress inside a volcano with a shark tank and a miniature version of himself.
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blewmeanie
Registered: 10/01/06
Posts: 28,984
Loc:
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His actual residence is equally as crazy.
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blewmeanie
Registered: 10/01/06
Posts: 28,984
Loc:
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Those are some pretty pimp glasses too.
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c0sm0nautt
Registered: 05/19/08
Posts: 10,303
Loc: The Astral Realm
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There are a lot of people who think Obama is the anti-Christ. I haven't seen anything to support this though.
Could the anti-Christ be more of a symbol for the materialist nihilist hedonistic culture that is ravaging the planet?
Edited by c0sm0nautt (07/15/09 09:19 AM)
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Silversoul
Rhizome
Registered: 01/01/05
Posts: 23,576
Loc: The Barricades
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Quote:
c0sm0nautt said: There are a lot of people who think Obama is the anti-Christ. I haven't seen anything to support this though.
I think the argument is that the anti-Christ will first appear as a benign, charismatic figure who helps bring people together, before turning on them and branding them all with the "mark of the Beast." Also, Revelations describes the beast as coming from the sea, which could be interpreted to mean Hawaii(though most of the people who think he's the anti-Christ probably think he was born in Kenya). Tim LaHaye and Jerry Jenkins, authors of the Left Behind series, disavow any rumors of him being the anti-Christ, and for and interesting reason: He's not popular enough. Apparently a 60-70% approval rating isn't nearly enough for someone to be the anti-Christ. He has to sway nearly the whole of humanity. Also, they say the anti-Christ isn't going to be American. He's supposed to come from either Europe or the Middle East.
Quote:
Could the anti-Christ be more of a symbol for the materialist nihilistic culture that is ravaging the planet?
I tend to look for archetypes in mythology, so yeah. I like to think of the anti-Christ as a social influence in our society, rather than a specific person.
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Edited by Silversoul (07/15/09 10:03 AM)
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c0sm0nautt
Registered: 05/19/08
Posts: 10,303
Loc: The Astral Realm
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I was watching a show on the History Channel about the anti-Christ, and if I recall the mark on the beast is on the wrist or the head? When I heard this all I could think of is RFID chip. I believe humanity had averted this time line though.
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solstice
Hempowered
Registered: 02/14/09
Posts: 2,003
Loc: Silly Cunt Valley
Last seen: 10 years, 7 days
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Personally I see the anti-christ as the conservative mind, the tendency in humans to try and prevent change. When you think about it, any messiah or christ is supposed to bring on a " new age " or basically some kind of change in the world. He's all about turning things around so, looking at it this way, what would be his nemesis? Obviously anything conservative, trying to prevent change from occuring.
And I have a hard time believing in some " final showdown " of epic proportions between two actual figures representing good and evil, I prefer seeing this as the conservative force in humanity striving to halt it's counter-part, the progressive force, human beings being the actors in the drama, some fighting to keep things as they are and some fighting to make things change. So basically, the fight that's been going on for as long as evolution's been called history although things are getting much more epic in our time.
-------------------- Man woke up in a world he did not understand and that is why he tries to interpret it - Carl Jung
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MisterMuscaria
Registered: 05/13/08
Posts: 27,646
Loc:
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Re: Messiahs [Re: dr_gonz]
#10680806 - 07/15/09 10:01 AM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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Ive never told anyone this for fear of being persecuted, but since childhood Ive been suspicious of myself as the messiah.
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solstice
Hempowered
Registered: 02/14/09
Posts: 2,003
Loc: Silly Cunt Valley
Last seen: 10 years, 7 days
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Quote:
MisterMuscaria said: Ive never told anyone this for fear of being persecuted, but since childhood Ive been suspicious of myself as the messiah.
I pity the fool who has a superiority complex.
-------------------- Man woke up in a world he did not understand and that is why he tries to interpret it - Carl Jung
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holyconifer
Human
Registered: 07/14/09
Posts: 204
Loc: Forest
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Quote:
MisterMuscaria said: Ive never told anyone this for fear of being persecuted, but since childhood Ive been suspicious of myself as the messiah.
Me too.
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dr_gonz
Registered: 08/18/03
Posts: 44,654
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