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pothead_bob
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Bill Gives FDA Control over Tobacco
#10487544 - 06/11/09 11:09 AM (14 years, 9 months ago) |
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Landmark tobacco legislation 10 years in the making is close to becoming law, giving the Food and Drug Administration clear jurisdiction over tobacco products. Tobacco is widely blamed for causing 443,000 deaths a year in the United States.
President Obama, who has a history of being an occasional smoker, has expressed support for the bill. Once he signs it, the FDA will be authorized to regulate tobacco advertising and marketing and limit flavorings. But it won't be able to ban tobacco or the most popular flavoring, menthol, outright.
The Struggle For Regulation
In the mid-1990s, then-FDA commissioner David Kessler tried to claim power over tobacco. But in 2000, the Supreme Court said it would take an act of Congress to give FDA regulatory authority. Since then, legislators have been trying to do just that, without success.
Kessler says the new bill allows the FDA to reduce the number of people who smoke and gives the agency broad new powers.
"The legislation gives very strong controls to the FDA to regulate access, to regulate the product and to regulate advertising," he says. "The legislation was crafted in such a way that it creates a separate center within FDA and gives FDA resources. The tobacco industry ends up paying fees that, in 10 years, can end up being $600 million a year."
The bill puts tobacco regulation into the hands of new commissioner Margaret Hamburg. At her Senate confirmation hearing earlier this year, Hamburg said her agency can handle it.
"It has the scientific expertise, the regulatory experience and the public health mission to do so, and I think that if done successfully, we can reduce smoking and we can help make cigarettes less harmful."
A Wide Range Of Input
It's a good bill, says Steven Grossman, who has followed the FDA as a consultant to food and drug companies and who has worked on Capitol Hill.
"A lot of people have had an opportunity to suggest changes to make it better," he says. "There's been a lot of thinking by a lot of very smart people on how it could be meaningful and how it could make a difference. There's nothing slapdash about this."
The nation's biggest cigarette manufacturer, Philip Morris USA, followed construction of the bill closely. Philip Morris spokesperson Bob Phelps says the company recognizes that cigarettes can kill, and welcomes the new legislation.
"We believe that FDA regulation could provide clear guidelines and oversight of products that could potentially reduce the harm caused by smoking," he says.
But other tobacco manufacturers are not so happy. At the time the bill won its first committee vote, the No. 2 manufacturer, Lorillard, issued a statement saying that the company does not believe the FDA can handle tobacco regulations.
"Congress should not be burdening the FDA with a new responsibility over a multibillion-dollar industry when it is failing presently to preserve its core mission," the statement said.
One of the shittiest agencies in Washington, the FDA, which has demonstrated it's incompetence on many occasions, will now have control over regulating tobacco. I predict that, considering the food and drug industry practically owns the FDA, the tobacco industry will get in bed with the FDA, get a nice "FDA Approved" sticker on their packs, cigarettes will lose some stigma, and smoking will eventually increase. After all, it would have to to make up for the $600 million a year in fees (what a fucking joke that is, btw).
-------------------- No knowledge can be certain, if it is not based upon mathematics or upon some other knowledge which is itself based upon the mathematical sciences. -Leonardo da Vinci (1425-1519) Speak well of your enemies. After all, you made them.
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Prisoner#1
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Re: Bill Gives FDA Control over Tobacco [Re: pothead_bob]
#10487850 - 06/11/09 12:17 PM (14 years, 9 months ago) |
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pothead_bob said:
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Tobacco is widely blamed for causing 443,000 deaths a year in the United States.
Kessler says the new bill allows the FDA to reduce the number of people who smoke and gives the agency broad new powers.
"It has the scientific expertise, the regulatory experience and the public health mission to do so, and I think that if done successfully, we can reduce smoking and we can help make cigarettes less harmful."
well, so far it appears that cigarettes kill a little over twice as many as doctors, they can legislate smokers out of existence and make cigarettes safe
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THC Titan
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Re: Bill Gives FDA Control over Tobacco [Re: pothead_bob]
#10488787 - 06/11/09 02:54 PM (14 years, 9 months ago) |
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One of the shittiest agencies in Washington, the FDA, which has demonstrated it's incompetence on many occasions, will now have control over regulating tobacco. I predict that, considering the food and drug industry practically owns the FDA, the tobacco industry will get in bed with the FDA, get a nice "FDA Approved" sticker on their packs, cigarettes will lose some stigma, and smoking will eventually increase. After all, it would have to to make up for the $600 million a year in fees (what a fucking joke that is, btw).
From another article:
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For the first time, the $89 billion tobacco industry would have to disclose the ingredients in its products. Under the new authority, the FDA could ban the most harmful of the estimated 6,000 chemicals used in cigarettes, cigars and other tobacco products. And it could reduce the amount of nicotine, perhaps to a point where tobacco is no longer addictive and smokers who want to quit can break free more easily. The legislation requires tobacco companies to expand the size of warning labels and include graphic images of the health effects of tobacco.
Advertising and promotion will also would be restricted. Tobacco manufacturers would be unable to use the terms "light," "mild" and "low" unless they can scientifically prove that the product so labeled is less harmful than standard tobacco. The bill would also create a tobacco center within the FDA funded by fees from the industry that are estimated to reach more than $500 million annually by 2013, according to the Congressional Budget Office.
This bill does not look like something that tobacco companies are going to support.
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Prisoner#1
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Re: Bill Gives FDA Control over Tobacco [Re: THC Titan]
#10489537 - 06/11/09 04:48 PM (14 years, 9 months ago) |
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the FDA has a history of corrupt practices
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pothead_bob
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Re: Bill Gives FDA Control over Tobacco [Re: THC Titan]
#10490040 - 06/11/09 06:14 PM (14 years, 9 months ago) |
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The nation's biggest cigarette manufacturer, Philip Morris USA, followed construction of the bill closely. Philip Morris spokesperson Bob Phelps says the company recognizes that cigarettes can kill, and welcomes the new legislation.
I'll believe all that other 'do-good' glitz when it happens. I have a feeling the FDA is getting a hard-on more so over that extra $500 million a year they'll be getting.
Besides, if they lower the nicotine, that doesn't necessarily mean people will quit. It may mean that they will just smoke more to get their fix, which would increase revenue for tobacco companies. Either that, or people will just start growing their own tobacco.
-------------------- No knowledge can be certain, if it is not based upon mathematics or upon some other knowledge which is itself based upon the mathematical sciences. -Leonardo da Vinci (1425-1519) Speak well of your enemies. After all, you made them.
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Cannabischarlie
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Re: Bill Gives FDA Control over Tobacco [Re: pothead_bob]
#10491402 - 06/11/09 10:16 PM (14 years, 9 months ago) |
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how about taking some of these fucking additives out of the things?
i know that they say that the brands with no additives (of which most roll your own has little to none, i hear) arent necessarily safer, but they would have to be.
i dont know why people continue to smoke with the asinine prices of cigarettes, yet people arent picking up the roll your own trend, even though its much easier now and theres a variety of ways to do it, without inconveniencing you that much time wise.
-------------------- This section of the signature line has been intentionally left blank. we could all use a little more sunshine. yeah, she's funny and somewhat interesting. not a beauty queen, but not bad lookin. i'd feel quite honored to fuck janine garofalo. -tiny_rabid_birds
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OverdoseLiving
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I dont care, maybe theyl make american ciggs in CA taste better.
I dont smoke them anymore.
I prefer my ciggarrettes made fom nioctiana rustica rom overseas
-------------------- Mi Vida Loco
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learningtofly
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Re: Bill Gives FDA Control over Tobacco [Re: Prisoner#1]
#10492273 - 06/12/09 01:19 AM (14 years, 9 months ago) |
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Prisoner#1 said: the FDA has a history of corrupt practices
tobacco is a lawltastic
funny how it was dropped from the US pharmacopeia IMMEDIATELY before drafting the Food, Drug, & Cosmetic Act ain't it?
Also how for some reason tobacco/nicotine are not considered drugs, yet they are not food or anything else either.
The best thing, this more related to tobacco though, is that the US govt needs tobacco companies to survive. The Master Settlement Agreement money from when tobacco had to pay like 200billion or whatever has already been spent by the states even though they havent received the money. basically the states need people to smoke in order for the companies to stay alive so they get the money they already spent
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badchad
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Re: Bill Gives FDA Control over Tobacco [Re: THC Titan]
#10493175 - 06/12/09 08:41 AM (14 years, 9 months ago) |
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THC Titan said:
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This bill does not look like something that tobacco companies are going to support.
This is certainly true. Anyone who has ever worked with the FDA know that the FDA is not your friend and they certainly aren't a rubber stamp for getting drugs approved.
-------------------- ...the whole experience is (and is as) a profound piece of knowledge. It is an indellible experience; it is forever known. I have known myself in a way I doubt I would have ever occurred except as it did. Smith, P. Bull. Menninger Clinic (1959) 23:20-27; p. 27. ...most subjects find the experience valuable, some find it frightening, and many say that is it uniquely lovely. Osmond, H. Annals, NY Acad Science (1957) 66:418-434; p.436
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Therian
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Re: Bill Gives FDA Control over Tobacco [Re: badchad]
#10493296 - 06/12/09 09:16 AM (14 years, 9 months ago) |
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I don't think there is a single adult smoker on this planet that doesn't realize smoking contributes to heart disease/cancer/early death. Yet they choose to smoke, this is their right to do so. Didn't many of the founding fathers of this country grow tobacco, and was it not often used for currency during early international trade.
Much of this country was established and grew in power due in large part to tobacco. I wonder what the authors of the constitution would say now. What about all the pollutants,herbicides,pesticides,toxic waste, heavy metals, etc. that the government allows in the air water and soil that people are exposed to, and unlike tobacco people can't make a conscious decision to limit their exposure. Unless of course you can go without eating, drinking, and breathing.
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learningtofly
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Re: Bill Gives FDA Control over Tobacco [Re: Therian]
#10495120 - 06/12/09 04:18 PM (14 years, 9 months ago) |
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Therian said: o. Didn't many of the founding fathers of this country grow tobacco, and was it not often used for currency during early international trade.
and? What does using tobacco as a currency have to do with regulation of it?
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Much of this country was established and grew in power due in large part to tobacco. I wonder what the authors of the constitution would say now.
So was slavery, but we don't use that anymore. And the founding fathers were fond of that as well.
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What about all the pollutants,herbicides,pesticides,toxic waste, heavy metals, etc. that the government allows in the air water and soil that people are exposed to, and unlike tobacco people can't make a conscious decision to limit their exposure. Unless of course you can go without eating, drinking, and breathing.
Are you saying that just because we pollute X we should pollute Y as well? two wrongs don't make a right my friend.
I don't necessarily disagree with your basic premise, which I assume is that people should be allowed to smoke, I just disagree with your reasoning.
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Therian
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Re: Bill Gives FDA Control over Tobacco [Re: learningtofly]
#10495442 - 06/12/09 05:28 PM (14 years, 9 months ago) |
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Therian said: o. Didn't many of the founding fathers of this country grow tobacco, and was it not often used for currency during early international trade.
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and? What does using tobacco as a currency have to do with regulation of it?
My whole point was I thought the constitution is supposed to be the "supreme law" of the united states, and the foundation of legal authority in the US, responsible for its very existence. AND the founding fathers grew it, smoked it, sold it, and bartered with it.
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Much of this country was established and grew in power due in large part to tobacco. I wonder what the authors of the constitution would say now.
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So was slavery, but we don't use that anymore. And the founding fathers were fond of that as well.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Slavery is not a constitutional right. If you choose to discount what the founders of this country stated (the constitution, declaration of independence, etc.) Then you discount the whole premise on which this country was based. Obviously not everything could be covered in the constitution and therefore judges look at the "intent" of the founding fathers. What I am saying is if the founding fathers engaged in these acts themselves, then would not restrictions fly in the face of the original intent?
The declaration of independence states that people should have right to life/LIBERTY/pursuit of happiness.
The definition of liberty being 1. Freedom of restriction or CONTROL (look at the title of thread) 2.The right to act, believe, or express ones self in a manner of ones own choosing.
I also feel not only smoking but distilling ones own alcohol should be made legal. During the colonial era most of the founding fathers themselves made their own alcohol, Thomas Jefferson even had the largest distillery in the colonies. If they by their own actions did this and state in the constitution each should be able act in a manner of their own choosing ( when not hurting others) then are not laws which impede ones own life/liberty unconstitutional?
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What about all the pollutants,herbicides,pesticides,toxic waste, heavy metals, etc. that the government allows in the air water and soil that people are exposed to, and unlike tobacco people can't make a conscious decision to limit their exposure. Unless of course you can go without eating, drinking, and breathing.
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Are you saying that just because we pollute X we should pollute Y as well? two wrongs don't make a right my friend.
No, I'm not saying just because we pollute A then it is OK to do so with B. Smoking is not polluting. People are now restricted as to where they can smoke thus negating effects of second hand smoke.
People can make the conscious decision as to whether or not they want to smoke, people can not stop the waters from being polluted with biologically persistent toxins, those effecting ALL people, involuntarily. Smokers are the proverbially low hanging fruit, easy to target and restrict.
Now the government wants to restrict soft drinks due to the fact they feel it makes people fat. I'm sick of all these over reaching intrusions into our basic everyday lives, thus negating my freedom from restriction,control, and right to act in a manner of my own choosing.
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pothead_bob
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Re: Bill Gives FDA Control over Tobacco [Re: badchad]
#10495684 - 06/12/09 06:39 PM (14 years, 9 months ago) |
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This is certainly true. Anyone who has ever worked with the FDA know that the FDA is not your friend and they certainly aren't a rubber stamp for getting drugs approved.
Well, they aren't our friends (as in the US citizens), but if they aren't buddies with the food industry, then I'd question their motives.
For example, food companies are allowed to have up to 0.5 grams of trans fat per serving of food and claim on the box that there are "0 grams trans fat per serving". Why would they allow such a thing? It's well known that trans fats are dangerous to peoples' health, so why do they even allow them in food? But even if they allow them in food, why would they allow the companies to deceive people into believing there are no trans-fats? And last time I checked, heart disease kills more people a year than cigarettes, so shouldn't they focus effort on that issue before tobacco?
-------------------- No knowledge can be certain, if it is not based upon mathematics or upon some other knowledge which is itself based upon the mathematical sciences. -Leonardo da Vinci (1425-1519) Speak well of your enemies. After all, you made them.
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cpw1971
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Re: Bill Gives FDA Control over Tobacco [Re: pothead_bob]
#10495778 - 06/12/09 07:04 PM (14 years, 9 months ago) |
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yeah man somethings not right here.
fuck them.... I got me some nice natural Tobacco planted.
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THC Titan
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Re: Bill Gives FDA Control over Tobacco [Re: cpw1971]
#10500491 - 06/13/09 04:50 PM (14 years, 9 months ago) |
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Ron Paul voted against this bill, of course.
Wouldn't want THE GOVERNMENT getting involved in the free market, telling us what ingredients are going into mass-marketed cigarettes that contribute to hundreds of thousands of deaths every year. Clearly if we just abolished the FDA, cigarette companies would be forced to reveal them to us by the invisible hand of the market.
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zouden
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Re: Bill Gives FDA Control over Tobacco [Re: THC Titan]
#10501050 - 06/13/09 07:05 PM (14 years, 9 months ago) |
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-------------------- I know... that just the smallest part of the world belongs to me You know... I'm not a blind man but truth is the hardest thing to see
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zouden
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Re: Bill Gives FDA Control over Tobacco [Re: pothead_bob]
#10501073 - 06/13/09 07:08 PM (14 years, 9 months ago) |
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pothead_bob said: And last time I checked, heart disease kills more people a year than cigarettes, so shouldn't they focus effort on that issue before tobacco?
Why not do both?
-------------------- I know... that just the smallest part of the world belongs to me You know... I'm not a blind man but truth is the hardest thing to see
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Prisoner#1
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Re: Bill Gives FDA Control over Tobacco [Re: THC Titan]
#10502093 - 06/13/09 10:51 PM (14 years, 9 months ago) |
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THC Titan said: Ron Paul voted against this bill, of course.
Wouldn't want THE GOVERNMENT getting involved in the free market, telling us what ingredients are going into mass-marketed cigarettes that contribute to hundreds of thousands of deaths every year. Clearly if we just abolished the FDA, cigarette companies would be forced to reveal them to us by the invisible hand of the market.
the information is already out there, people know there's a greater risk of lung cancer, they know it's unhealthy, they've been informed of this shit for the last 3 decades, do we really need to know more than 'hey dumbass, smoking this shit will probably kill you' especially when we're eating crap that's just as bad and FDA approved
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Prisoner#1
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Re: Bill Gives FDA Control over Tobacco [Re: zouden]
#10502106 - 06/13/09 10:52 PM (14 years, 9 months ago) |
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zouden said:
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pothead_bob said: And last time I checked, heart disease kills more people a year than cigarettes, so shouldn't they focus effort on that issue before tobacco?
Why not do both?
why not require labels on doctors since their negligence kills hundreds of thousands of people per year
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THC Titan
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Re: Bill Gives FDA Control over Tobacco [Re: Prisoner#1]
#10502175 - 06/13/09 11:07 PM (14 years, 9 months ago) |
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Prisoner#1 said:the information is already out there, people know there's a greater risk of lung cancer, they know it's unhealthy, they've been informed of this shit for the last 3 decades, do we really need to know more than 'hey dumbass, smoking this shit will probably kill you' especially when we're eating crap that's just as bad and FDA approved
Are you just trying to be contrary at this point?
This legislation could have been much stricter. It's a good thing, at the very least, that companies now have to disclose the additives in their products (besides toxic and radioactive particles that're already known about I suppose) and put their marketing claims through scientific scrutiny.
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