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 kaliman
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Registered: 02/12/08
Posts: 47
Last seen: 4 months, 24 days
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 Help! Grain on drinking glass? (Inspired by Anno´s video) 
#10282072 - 05/04/09 03:00 AM (14 years, 11 months ago) |
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I notice that almost nobody report using drinking glasses for PF tek these days, but it was been used and is feasible and wonderfully featured in the Anno website video.
I wonder if it is possible to use the drinking glass to grow mycelium on grain, without the vermiculite filter?
I was especulating to make a simple tek using a ripped plastic bag (autoclavable, from the grocery store), attach it with a rubber band and a glued tyvek filter or micropore 3M). PC it and inoculated with a syringe through micropore tape or equivalent. Maybe in a glovebox. I fear that alum foil will not be a barrier to bacteria or spores.
I want to produce a cake like form. It can be done in a used glass container bottle but some myc, i.e. Trametes, may not break easily even if buffered with lime or gypsum, so we may need to break the bottle or use a Kerr jar. I do not want to use, and I cannot get now a Kerr. Also I would like to avoid plastic bags, I have been used it for 3 years, and want to use now something reusable not polutant like glass.
I feel autoclavable plastic containers are a good option, but I have a lot of strong, unused good drinking glasses and would like to see if I can use them for cultivation, besides PK tek.
Any experience in this? Any ideas?
Thanks in advance!
Edited by kaliman (05/04/09 05:24 PM)
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 ohmatic
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Registered: 02/28/04
Posts: 6,742
Loc: europe
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Re: Help! Grain on drinking glass? (Inspired by Anno video) [Re: kaliman]
#10284208 - 05/04/09 02:57 PM (14 years, 11 months ago) |
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my first grows used grain in glass drinking glasses just covered by 2 layers of tinfoil like in his videos and i was sucessfull.
if it worked for me, it can work for anybody, just be REALLY clean.
--------------------
 MONOTUB tek  HEATBOMB tek
RIP #cultivation! ....can't associate? well FUCK U !
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kaliman
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Registered: 02/12/08
Posts: 47
Last seen: 4 months, 24 days
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Re: Help! Grain on drinking glass? (Inspired by Anno video) [Re: ohmatic]
#10285149 - 05/04/09 05:23 PM (14 years, 11 months ago) |
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Thank you man.
And did you inoculated with a syringe?
Covered the holes with tape of left as they are?
Which percent of success rate you got?
I believe that will be no problem with aggressive myc like pleurotus, and some polypores as I have made them grow in almost neglected plastic bags, half open!
But we all know that sometimes some species or some strains that we badly want goes wrong and we want to do our best...
Cheers
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ohmatic
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Loc: europe
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Re: Help! Grain on drinking glass? (Inspired by Anno video) [Re: kaliman]
#10289211 - 05/05/09 09:23 AM (14 years, 11 months ago) |
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see, he shows to use a 2nd layer of tinfoil as a "cap" on it, thats how i did it,
you didnt see tape anywhere in there so you are NOT going to use it, stick to what it says/you see and youll suceed.
sucess rate 100%
--------------------
MONOTUB tek HEATBOMB tek
RIP #cultivation! ....can't associate? well FUCK U !
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mockeylock
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Registered: 02/07/04
Posts: 1,046
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Re: Help! Grain on drinking glass? (Inspired by Anno video) [Re: ohmatic]
#10292250 - 05/05/09 06:19 PM (14 years, 11 months ago) |
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Yes, there is exactly one way to skin a cat...
and you are NOT to deviate from it.
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ohmatic
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Registered: 02/28/04
Posts: 6,742
Loc: europe
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Re: Help! Grain on drinking glass? (Inspired by Anno video) [Re: mockeylock]
#10295653 - 05/06/09 07:34 AM (14 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
mockeylock said:
Yes, there is exactly one way to skin a cat...
and you are NOT to deviate from it.
well in this case, if he doesnt, success is very likely !
stick to what u read when u begin then start to apply own thoughts.
btw wrong forum no way advanced.
--------------------
MONOTUB tek HEATBOMB tek
RIP #cultivation! ....can't associate? well FUCK U !
Edited by ohmatic (05/06/09 07:35 AM)
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kaliman
Researcher
Registered: 02/12/08
Posts: 47
Last seen: 4 months, 24 days
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Re: Help! Grain on drinking glass? (Inspired by Anno video) [Re: ohmatic]
#10297346 - 05/06/09 03:03 PM (14 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
ohmatic said:
see, he shows to use a 2nd layer of tinfoil as a "cap" on it, thats how i did it, you didn't see tape anywhere in there so you are NOT going to use it, stick to what it says/you see and you ll succeed.
success rate 100%
Great! I think you got that success rate because of being very careful and because relevant experience. I do not believe this is a robust tek in itself regarding sterility and would not recommended it for beginners.
It questions somehow the need of a filter for incubating, at least in some cincunstances. Also it is not yet a documented tek. But I think many people here privately may have tried it to see if it works.
Anno did not recommended this tek, nor anyone, as far as I have seen. It is similar to the PF tek, to the Anno´s version, and to the one shown in "Growing mushrooms made easy" but without the vermiculite filter or any filter besides the foil barrier. Also grains are not the primary substrate for our mushrooms therefore its a clearly artificial environment for most edible mushrooms. Therefore we have here more likely an experiment than a growing tek.
That is why I thought its better to ask in the advanced forum because some people here could have used this tek, that seems undocumented, and now uses better methods. Reason of my posting was collecting the results of experiments, limits of mushroom adptablity, rather than learning how to grow on grain. But if the moderators think belongs to other forum, I am OK with that.
I would think that you had good results because your overall good methods as result of your experience rather than from the strength of the tek itself.
Thanks for your answer.
Cheers
Edited by kaliman (05/06/09 08:58 PM)
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ohmatic
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Registered: 02/28/04
Posts: 6,742
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Re: Help! Grain on drinking glass? (Inspired by Anno video) [Re: kaliman]
#10300493 - 05/07/09 01:12 AM (14 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
kaliman said:
Great! I think you got that success rate because of being very careful and because relevant experience. I do not believe this is a robust tek in itself regarding sterility and would not recommended it for beginners.
no
i used it for my VERY FIRST GROW EVER without any experience beforehand, i was very careful however.
this was my first grow, with homemade spore syringes, directly using rye grains and eventually casing them.
all worked perfectly and it IS recommended for beginners !
and whats that talk about an experiment and it not being a tek ? ofcoz its a tek ! and i continued to use this exact way
for a year or so and rarely ever got any contams before i ever started
to use pickle jars with polyfill filters on them.
--------------------
MONOTUB tek HEATBOMB tek
RIP #cultivation! ....can't associate? well FUCK U !
Edited by ohmatic (05/07/09 01:14 AM)
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fastfred
Old Hand
Registered: 05/17/04
Posts: 6,899
Loc: Dark side of the moon
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Re: Help! Grain on drinking glass? (Inspired by Anno video) [Re: ohmatic]
#10306083 - 05/08/09 01:27 AM (14 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
and i continued to use this exact way for a year or so and rarely ever got any contams before i ever started to use pickle jars with polyfill filters on them.
I kind of wonder why people even bother with all the filter setups they use.
Seems kind of silly to me.
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kaliman
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Registered: 02/12/08
Posts: 47
Last seen: 4 months, 24 days
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Re: Help! Grain on drinking glass? (Inspired by Anno video) [Re: fastfred]
#10308736 - 05/08/09 03:34 PM (14 years, 11 months ago) |
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Ohmatic:
Thanks for your answer. I made this question because I thought some of you tried something similar. But even if its old and tried, I do not find it is a documented tek. If I am wrong please share the link to the official teks where it is documented.
I think it actually may not be not recommended for beginners just because many of them may have not developed yet enough sterile skills to take care of all details involved. I think that if a person takes good care of the sterile environment and has enough experience may do it well with just alum foil, provided its inoculated with pure mycelium and not with loads of contams because of a careless handling.
The reason why I started the thread, was to gather info on the experience of others regarding this option, rather than developing a "new" tek for myself, because for sure many already tried it, even if it is not in the "official teks". At least not here, in this forum (http://www.shroomery.org/16/Basic-Cultivation-Guides).
I believe that is possible to do it the way you advice and I find it useful information.
Fastfred:
Thank you for your answer. I really think that many of the theories about mushroom growing are still in a development stage. I find hard to believe that mushrooms are totally weak living beings that must be totally isolated from the nature or else will be defeated by contaminants. I believe that most contaminants or problems we find is because we take the mushrooms OUT of their ecological niche, and because we do not yet fully know about their ecology and requirements. In my experience I often find interesting things such as: Bags of cardboard inoculated with Pleurotus, Ganoderma, Trametes growing perfectly after I forgot to close them. They performed perfectly, better than the bags that were closed and provided with a filter. Also since I started growing mushrooms I found that the bags with the best looking mycelium were sometimes the ones showing also "best looking" contaminants. That lead me to think that the contaminants may be, in nature, part of the system that makes the species survive. Its like the Zebras and the lions, the mice and snakes, etc. I believe that mushroom species are very strong survivors and that can grow the best if we identify their needs and proved them with an environment the closest to their needs.
I am a believer that not using filters is possible and I have tried it many times, not with grain, but with cardboard bags. Also I think that growers like Roger Rabbit and Anno, among others, have grounds to use filters in some circumstances, for some people. I think they have lots of practical experience and that was been working. I would prefer a more natural, simple, cheap procedure as I conduct sometimes workshops to produce edible mushrooms for very poor communities that face problems to get some things like filters, agar, etc.
kaliman
Edited by kaliman (05/08/09 03:35 PM)
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fastfred
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Registered: 05/17/04
Posts: 6,899
Loc: Dark side of the moon
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Re: Help! Grain on drinking glass? (Inspired by Anno video) [Re: kaliman]
#10308992 - 05/08/09 04:22 PM (14 years, 11 months ago) |
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Some of the PF tek writeups involve using drinking glasses. They've been around a long time and there are at least a dozen posts on the topic.
It's common knowledge in lab culture that you just throw some tinfoil over your beaker and it will remain sterile. Some people use foam plugs sometimes, but that's usually just for special experiments.
"Teks" are just for the beginners here. Once you have a bit of experience or have been around here awhile you won't bother trying to follow something step-by-step.
-FF
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