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Offlinewiggles
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Running a 5k
    #10192608 - 04/18/09 10:34 PM (14 years, 11 months ago)

Let me preface this by saying I am not a runner. I never have been. I was the kid in high school who walked when they made us run a mile. I was the thrower who got kicked off the track and field team because I flipped a coach the bird when he tried to get me to run. I despised running. It makes me hurt. It makes my lungs burn, my legs ache, my head throb, and pretty much every damn thing else I can think of.

But god damn I've always wanted to run. How fucking weird is that? Wanting to be good at something you despise. Sour grapes maybe? Who knows.

So, I've started training for a 5k. Ultimate goal? A freaking marathon. I'm one week in, and I've got a long, long time to go. But the 5k is in september.

I'm starting with interval training, the couch to 5k program if anyone is familiar.

Any pointers would be helpful. I've got running shoes, a heart rate monitor, a running buddy, and good music. I've also got a running coach for once I'm done with the program to work on speed and endurance so I'm ready for the 5k, and to get started training for the 10k.


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Re: Running a 5k [Re: wiggles]
    #10193029 - 04/19/09 12:15 AM (14 years, 11 months ago)

Well its running, so its not rocket science obviously, but you should make sure you have decent (not expensive) shoes that fit you right and that you run on decent materials (trails or something rather than concrete or something).

Do you just want to do it or do it as well as you can or what?


If its just for fun then personally I'd just run long distances and push yourself to keep going.


Don't try to be tough or anything, cuz if you get really sore one day you'll hurt yourself and your progress.

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Offlinewiggles
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Re: Running a 5k [Re: johnm214]
    #10193063 - 04/19/09 12:23 AM (14 years, 11 months ago)

To be honest its mostly a drive to do something I've always been terrible at. Maybe just proving to myself that I can in fact run.

If you're a runner already, it may not make much sense (it didn't seem to register to 95% of the people I know who run)... people who run regularly seem to have trouble visualizing someone who can't run a quarter mile without feeling like death warmed over. Some people are naturally gifted at it, I am not one of those people. So... it kinda feels like I'm entering into some kinda alien world. That make sense?


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Re: Running a 5k [Re: wiggles]
    #10193415 - 04/19/09 01:56 AM (14 years, 11 months ago)

Well, im a new runner and heres my 2cents:

Just stick with it, and go to a running shop and have them tell you how your feet lay (supinated, pronated or neutral), and buy good quality shoes.

I found it beneficial to push myself on endurance (distance.), to go a bit furthur than is comfortable...

I try not to think about anything related to running/distance/being tired but either go into a blank state, or get lost in abstract thinking + i find that makes the time/distance go by much quicker.

I started running in November - there was a landmark id run to from my house, about 5k there and back. It seemed easy enough, but id be sore for days after + i ended up injuring my knee because i was wearing the wrong shoes...

Anyways, i bought good shoes, and eased back into it with a treadmill and now in April im running 5 miles easily, did 6.5 reasonably easy the other day + im running a 10k fun race next weekend...

Its rewarding, i've slimmed down and toned up.

I run 3 or 4 days a week - 3.5-5.5miles most of the time.

Sticking to the routine is the most important part - However, i am flexible on my ways, depending on how im feeling and how my school/work schedule is. I run when i feel like it.


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Re: Running a 5k [Re: wiggles]
    #10194050 - 04/19/09 08:17 AM (14 years, 11 months ago)

I was like you until I was 38!  I thought that it was only a certain type of people that could run.  But I can now jog 5 miles without a problem. 

Find a measurable landmark 1/2 mile from your house.  Walk at a good pace out to that landmark.  When you get to the landmark turn around and jog for as long as you can toward your house.  Maybe you can make it that first day, which is wonderful, but if you can't just run as far as you can, walk until you can run again, then continue running home. 

Once you can get the 1/2 mile consistently, go on to longer distances doing the same thing.  Once I could get a half mile (that included hills) I was able to just go on to 5 miles within a month.


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OfflineSeussA
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Re: Running a 5k [Re: wiggles]
    #10194469 - 04/19/09 10:55 AM (14 years, 11 months ago)

I'm training to run a marathon towards the end of this year.  Right now I am running between twenty to thirty miles a week, slowly increasing total distance.  If you have specific questions, please ask.

The most important thing you can do is to stick with it.  Set a schedule and follow the schedule, no matter what.  If you are too sore to run, then follow your schedule, but walk.  If you are too sore to walk, then follow your schedule, but stretch.  Once the running bug bites you, this isn't so important... but when you are working on getting off the couch, and your body is trying to make up excuses to keep you firmly placed on the couch, following a schedule is key.  You will eventually find yourself looking forward to your run rather than looking for a way to avoid it.  When that happens, you will be hooked and will start to understand why runners enjoy the sport so much (and have a hard time relating to people that do not run :grin:).

The second most important thing you can do is avoid injury.  Do not over train.  The eighth week to the fourteenth week are the most dangerous.  During this time, your muscles have strengthened, but your bones and ligaments have not.  (Bones and ligaments are slower to adapt to usage than muscles.) 

You also want to get a good pair of running shoes.  Don't go to a large retail chain to get these.  Instead, go to a store that specializes in running.  (Look for the stores that have local running events posted in the window.)  Go in the afternoon, during a weekday.  (Your feet are smaller in the morning, and you avoid the less experienced weekend staff.)  You usually want your running shoes to be slightly larger than your daily use shoes.  Keep a distance log so that you know when to change running shoes.  Get a new pair around 300 miles, even if the old pair look fine.  Shoes are usually good for 400 to 500 miles, but you want to be wearing in a new pair of shoes while you are wearing out the old pair.

Stretch a little bit before your run and a lot after your run.  Don't bounce your stretches, rather make them nice, long and slow (15 to 30 second holds).  Start out doing a few simple stretches and add a new one every few runs.  Always, always stretch after a run.  There are plenty of web sites that show various stretches.

Drink lots of water, both during the run and after the run.  Failure to do so will lead to heart problems.  Personally, I avoid the sugary sports drinks and stick with water or sugar free electrolyte packets designed for endurance athletes.  Unless you are going over ten miles, water is fine.  Sugar and electrolytes do not go well together.  Avoid the sugar.  On long runs, it has been shown that caffeine helps increase glycogen uptake, which is a good thing.  However, caffeine is also a diuretic, which is a bad thing.  If used, balance it with more water.

> I'm starting with interval training, the couch to 5k program if anyone is familiar.

I'm not familiar with that specific program, but most of them are much the same.  Start out walking for five minutes, then run for two minutes, then walk for five, then run for two... continue for a set distance, maybe a mile.  After a week or so, the walking distance decreases a bit and the running distance increases a bit.  After a month or two, the walking goes away, while the running distance continues to increase slowly.

The two important things are continue with the program and push yourself very slowly (do not over train!).  It gets really hard to hold yourself back, but you have to find the will to do so.  Better to train slowly than to sit with an injury and not train at all.

As you become more serious, I would highly recommend a heart rate monitor.  Find your recovery zone, your aerobic zone, and anaerobic zone (by measuring your resting and max heart rates, and doing a bit of math).  Once you know your zones, you can ensure that you are doing most of your training in your aerobic zone.  Training in your recovery zone does nothing for you... these are known as the easy useless miles.  Training in your anaerobic zone is good for increasing your lactose threshold and recovery rates and for increasing your max VO2, but is harder on your body, is more likely to result in injury, and doesn't help your endurance much.

As you get close to your 5K goal, and as your body starts to adapt to running, you will want to add in a long run (once a week or once every other week) along with a tempo run (where you run in your anaerobic zone) once a week.  You will also want to eventually add some speed work (fast interval runs).  Again, don't push yourself too hard too quickly.  These are things to worry about several months from now.

Don't underestimate the value of rest days.  Especially when you are first starting out.  Your body needs rest days to recover and build muscle.  For the first month of training, no fewer than three rest days per week.  Space them out.  After a few months of training, drop one of the rest days.  After you can easily run a 10K, it is safe to drop down to one rest day a week, if your body is happy.  Listen to your body.  Avoid injury.

Remember, it takes two weeks for improvement to show.  Don't get frustrated when it seems like nothing is happening.  You also don't want to push yourself super hard the week before a race for the same reason; it won't matter and you may injure yourself.

> Well its running, so its not rocket science obviously

Give somebody enough time and they can turn anything into rocket science, including running.  :smile:


In case I forgot to mention it... don't over train!  Especially during your first two to three months.

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Re: Running a 5k [Re: Seuss]
    #10194521 - 04/19/09 11:05 AM (14 years, 11 months ago)

Wow, great advice, thanks. 

I have always wanted to run a marathon too.

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Re: Running a 5k [Re: MOTH]
    #10195550 - 04/19/09 02:05 PM (14 years, 11 months ago)

It is a great idea for anyone to maintain a general level of fitness so that any event that they wish to participate in is doable now....or at least within reach of 2 to 4 weeks of preparation. I feel that I am up for any run up to 12 miles right now. I would be just a month out from participating in a power lift meet or running a marathon and placing well in wither event. A triathlon might take some work due to my lack of facilities to swim regularly. I don't really train for specific events, but lately I find that any physical endeavor that I pursue comes easily to me due to the high level of general physical preparedness that I maintain though kettlebells and joint mobility work (and periodic yoga). I surprise myself often with this.


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"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda

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Re: Running a 5k [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #10197300 - 04/19/09 06:53 PM (14 years, 11 months ago)

> I would be just a month out from ... running a marathon and placing well in [the] event

You might want to try and run 26 miles keeping a 5:30/mile pace before you make claims about placing well in a marathon.  Even then, although a 5:30/mile pace is very, very respectable, it is nowhere near what the elite runners can do, nor would it put you anywhere near the top of the pack.  The top runners are usually running a 4:45 minute to 5:00 minute mile for the entire 26.2 miles.  Absolutely insane and not something a fit person can achieve with just a month of extra training.  If you have never run a marathon, you should set your goal to finishing, not to placing.

A big reason why a marathon is so difficult is because you expend your entire glycogen store around the twenty mile mark.  At that point, the run becomes anaerobic and lactic acid is produced.  As lactic acid builds up in your muscles, they stop responding, and no amount of will power will make them move.  It takes a decent amount of time and training to raise your lactic acid threshold allowing you to get through this point of the race.  Carb loading will also help.  Because of the depletion of your glycogen stores around the twenty mile mark, the difference between a half-marathon and a full-marathon is night and day.


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InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
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Re: Running a 5k [Re: Seuss]
    #10197517 - 04/19/09 07:22 PM (14 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

You might want to try and run 26 miles keeping a 5:30/mile pace before you make claims about placing well in a marathon.




I mean I could finish it and I would not finish in the total rear. I in no intended to say that I would win or be a top finisher...I mean I would finish it respectably. I understand that most people train just to finish. I have spent the last year training my energy systems and I have conducted training specifically for lactic acid buffering to reduce the effects of fatigue. I think at this time I could be prepared for such an activity quickly. I consider my level of physical preparedness to be much much greater than when I was an infantry soldier 24 years ago. The fitness level I maintain is very stringent. Last October on a whim I ran a 7.5 mile trail run in very steep and rugged terrain with no preparation. I did it on a whim  at a moments notice. It did not seriously tap my reserves. I am not trying to brag (well maybe a little), but I am stating facts. My wife Sunflower has done the same training as I have with very similar results.

The important thing in achieving proper general physical preparedness is to practice activities that have a lot of carry over to other activities. A runner can run, but running is sport specific to running. Kettlebell training has much carry over to other sports....like running and weight lifting. It has given me a resting heart rate that varies from about 37bpm to 45bpm. This is awesome for a 44 year old man. My last measured blood pressure was 115 over 65.

Here is the program I am on right at this moment. It is seriously intense stuff. Don't let the hyped up ad copy fool you...it is bad ass. The 2008 Danish olympic wrestling team was conditioned this way, but it is not specific to wrestling...just general conditioning.
http://www.dragondoor.com/b39.html


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"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda

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Re: Running a 5k [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #10197753 - 04/19/09 08:05 PM (14 years, 11 months ago)

> I in no intended to say that I would win or be a top finisher...I mean I would finish it respectably.

Ah, my apologies.  I misread your original statement of placing well to mean placing in the top handful.  I still recommend going out and giving a long run (20+ mile) a try.  I was big on talk until I tried that one weekend.  It humbled me very quickly and I started to realize why just finishing is such a big deal for a first time runner.


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Offlinewiggles
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Re: Running a 5k [Re: Seuss]
    #10197959 - 04/19/09 08:38 PM (14 years, 11 months ago)

Thanks for all of the advice folks, its really appreciated! Seuss, how long has it taken you to build up to running a full marathon? Have you always been somewhat gifted as a runner, or did you start as your average chump on a couch? I'm curious :smile:

For now my goal is a simple 5k, and I'm actually looking at signing up for one well before I plan to finish my training program and just be a walker to see what its like. Thank you for the advice about waiting around week 10. The program ends at week 9 with little guidance about what to do at that point and it could really lead to injury if someone decided to push himself much farther.


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You can turn your back on a person, but never turn your back on a drug, especially when its waving a razor sharp hunting knife in your eye.
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Re: Running a 5k [Re: Seuss]
    #10197966 - 04/19/09 08:39 PM (14 years, 11 months ago)

My cardiovascular system is already equal to the task. I suspect that I would need sport specific training to make the specific adaptation to the leg's musculature. So, I would make progressively longer runs while waving the volume and intensity (speed and length) of the run backward and forward until I could top 18 miles with good time. I understand that it would be a serious chore involving much pain. Most people starting to train for a marathon are also struggling to make the cardiovascular adaptations to be equal the task. If your cardio condition is already top notch you just need to train the muscles of the legs to endure the distance. I have run out beyond 12 miles before so I have a concept of how difficult this would be.


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"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda

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Re: Running a 5k [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #10198762 - 04/19/09 11:27 PM (14 years, 11 months ago)

Just a note to the OP.

Once you get into a regimine, where you look forward to your running days, and you can run and recover quick and without pain...

It gets way easier.

By week 9 you should have a pretty good idea of what your capable of, you will intimately know the limitations of your mind and body.

Goodluck - keep us posted on your progress!


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Re: Running a 5k [Re: PDU]
    #10198798 - 04/19/09 11:36 PM (14 years, 11 months ago)

You sound more than set already.  A snug pair of running shoes and some clothing that doesn't hinder your movement is all you really need to run well.  Are you looking to lose weight too? An improved diet and sleeping pattern will definitely help.

I used to be pretty hardcore about running, I got my 10k time to 39 minutes.  One of the things that honestly helped was cross training.  If you run too much (like everyday), especially on certain surfaces, your joints and muscles will get extraordinarily tired.  If you have a place where you can do some intense biking, like even a gym, that will definitely help with cardio vascular shape.


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Re: Running a 5k [Re: wiggles]
    #10199875 - 04/20/09 06:08 AM (14 years, 11 months ago)

> Have you always been somewhat gifted as a runner, or did you start as your average chump on a couch?

I was never good at distance running.  I was always fast on sprints, but never had the endurance for distance.  I started out better than a complete chump on the couch, but not by much.  I started training last August and really didn't get serious about it until the start of this year.

> The program ends at week 9 with little guidance about what to do at that point

Assuming your 5K is on week 10, taper down your distance over week nine and take it very easy.  Make sure you have a rest day (if not two) before the race.  The morning of the race, before the race, take a very short and easy jog followed by a good stretch.  You tend to push yourself harder on a race and your body will thank you for warming it up before hand.

After you complete you 9 week program, plus the 5k race, find a beginner 10k program to follow, something like http://running.about.com/od/racetraining/a/10Kbeginner.htm is decent.  You don't have to start at week 1, and you don't have to increase as quickly as shown in the plan.


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Re: Running a 5k [Re: Seuss]
    #10202162 - 04/20/09 03:00 PM (14 years, 11 months ago)

I'm kinda in the same shoes as you, OP, except I set my goal to be a full triathlon! 2 months ago, I went from being a non-runner to all 3 in a day, no sweat. So far, I'm at 3 miles running, 1/2 mile swim and 13 mile ride consecutively, as regular training. All of the advice I've read here is definitely good, especially from Seuss.

The hardest part, honestly, is sticking to it. Rest days are important. Shoes are important. Hydration is important. Eating is important. My blood sugar is relatively high in the mornings, so I usually don't eat before I run. If I do, it will be something like half a piece of bread with jelly for some starches and sugars to burn for fuel. Water is definitely important too. Drink water all day, even if you're not thirsty.

If your knees start to hurt, pay more attention to your form while running. Google "runners knee" and it will instruct you on how to take care of your knees before and after your training. That's all I can think of at the moment, but I wish you good luck in your journey. I'm looking forward to your follow-up with your 5k time! :thumbup:

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