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 DuNeRaVeR
Sound conciousness
 
Registered: 01/30/06
Posts: 13,748
Loc: The land of Ports. 
Last seen: 2 hours, 6 minutes
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 Debunking Evolution 
#8309634 - 04/21/08 05:47 AM (5 years, 1 month ago) |
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Normally this would go in spirituality section or whatnot, but I would like to see disagreements and wrong proving.
visit Here And tell me what you think of the info provided.
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He who looks outside dreams, He who looks inside awakens.
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I make music with my computer, Click here for my Soundcloud Old project:www.myspace.com/psychoactivesynth
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Roker
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Re: Debunking Evolution [Re: DuNeRaVeR]
#8309655 - 04/21/08 06:26 AM (5 years, 1 month ago) |
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evolution may not be a perfect theory, but it certainly shits all over the idea of "god did it".
It's sad that a lot of people are just too fucken lazy to stretch the old brain muscle and try and understand this amazing planet and how the life on it came about, and just say if it ain't in the bible then it ain't true.
the world laughs at you americans and your stupid creationism (what sort of half assed word is that? as if tacking "ism" on the end makes it a science). I think the inventor of creationism is a world class wankologist.
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azurite
4got10horse
Registered: 03/18/07
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Re: Debunking Evolution [Re: Roker]
#8309658 - 04/21/08 06:37 AM (5 years, 1 month ago) |
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there are clearly all forms of evolution going on here. you can find examples of micro, macro, and even de-evolution. most people just can't accept truth unless it's easy to understand. it's pretty easy to just agree with the organized religions. most people also seem to be more interested in the economy, politics and sports than the natural systems.
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DuNeRaVeR
Sound conciousness
Registered: 01/30/06
Posts: 13,748
Loc: The land of Ports.
Last seen: 2 hours, 6 minutes
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Re: Debunking Evolution [Re: Roker]
#8309662 - 04/21/08 06:45 AM (5 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
Roker said:
evolution may not be a perfect theory, but it certainly shits all over the idea of "god did it".
It's sad that a lot of people are just too fucken lazy to stretch the old brain muscle and try and understand this amazing planet and how the life on it came about, and just say if it ain't in the bible then it ain't true.
the world laughs at you americans and your stupid creationism (what sort of half assed word is that? as if tacking "ism" on the end makes it a science). I think the inventor of creationism is a world class wankologist.
Creationism is found around the world. from people who take psychedelics to communicate with a "creator" or someone to uses prayer to talk to a "creator", or the use of meditation.
It is not just Americans.
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He who looks outside dreams, He who looks inside awakens.
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I make music with my computer, Click here for my Soundcloud Old project:www.myspace.com/psychoactivesynth
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azurite
4got10horse
Registered: 03/18/07
Posts: 173
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Re: Debunking Evolution [Re: azurite]
#8309673 - 04/21/08 07:02 AM (5 years, 1 month ago) |
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what i think the evolutionists haven't discovered yet is that the environment plays a larger role than we thought. the environment is really just a combination of fractals from the soil and bacteria to the plants,fungi,and animals to the clouds in the sky to the spirals in the galaxy to the whole universe. these fractals exchange information with each other and harmonize with each other. the auras around us all are electrical. this must be how evolution works instead of just random chance. if random chance was the truth, then there would be mutations of all kinds all the time. we rarely see mutations at all and it can be argued that when we do see them, the changes are made because of un-natural changes in their environments. these changes to their environments would never have happened without us. dumping chemicals into rivers will never have a positive effect on any species. these types of changes are almost all of what is going on on this planet right now. maybe it's not the best time to try and understand evolution now since we are losing another species every hour and a half. no shit and it's fucked.
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Toddo
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Re: Debunking Evolution [Re: azurite]
#8309675 - 04/21/08 07:05 AM (5 years, 1 month ago) |
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What amazes me most about this topic is the great ignorance BOTH sides posses. Most people say they believe in evolution as blindly as others believe in creationism.
That's just how things work. People do shit, and believe in shit based on a good amount of faith. Comparing evolution to creationism is a horrible waist of time...you just can't do it. It gets us no where.
Evolution is an extremely in-depth subject that requires quite a bit of research to really understand. I think after that research you really learn how much of it really isn't in stone...but it has some key concepts that fit very well with the current state of things on earth (and its past.) The key here is we have the most intelligent humans on earth working every day and refining the origins of all this shit (as they have been doing for most of recorded civilization.)
I think the argument of origins is so fucking immature. Let science work on their discoveries, let religion enlighten those it speaks to, and let the people pick and choose what they want from each. These subjects shouldn't be black and white (as they are now); They both have their own truths to offer.
In closing: Put a little effort the examine the things you believe in and more importantly, take the time to examine the other side. Who knows, you might find it more to your liking.
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azurite
4got10horse
Registered: 03/18/07
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Re: Debunking Evolution [Re: Toddo]
#8309684 - 04/21/08 07:15 AM (5 years, 1 month ago) |
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toddo, give me one bit of evidence that evolution isn't set in stone in the form of natural history. i know every bit of evidence can't be found in all circumstances. creationism is totally fake. to me, humans are creators. we create garbage out of the fractal reality draining all life and fractal energy out of it all. creationism is a landfill. you can quote me on that.
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Toddo
Stranger
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Re: Debunking Evolution [Re: azurite]
#8309707 - 04/21/08 07:46 AM (5 years, 1 month ago) |
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Take a look at an anthropology book from 10 years ago. Now look at one today. Discoveries and breakthroughs have been changing and shaping the sciences for as long as they existed. To say our current view of evolution is in stone would be foolish.
And my own view on creationism is that it really is irrelevant whether it is right or wrong. What it comes down to is creationism being compared to evolution is just plain wrong. They are completely different playing fields...One is based on a firm set of guidelines (the scientific method...ect) and the other is based of mythology. Both offer their own insights, but to try and put religion through the scientific method really defeats its whole purpose.
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 Ferris
PsychedelicJourneyman
Registered: 03/12/06
Posts: 11,529
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Re: Debunking Evolution [Re: Toddo]
#8309713 - 04/21/08 07:54 AM (5 years, 1 month ago) |
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I'm not even going to take the time to start nitpicking that article, except to say that most of its assertions are either oversimplified or wholly ignorant. Skimming through the article, I see nothing that can't be explained. Time would be better spent by skeptics coming up with alternative ideas to the argument, ie creationism, although perhaps a better alternative is in order, rather than shooting holes in a argument so complex that of course its going to have some issues.
Any logical person will support evolution because it has the most evidence to back it up, but that doesn't mean they have to accept it as fact, line by line.
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Discuss Politics
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azurite
4got10horse
Registered: 03/18/07
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Re: Debunking Evolution [Re: Ferris]
#8309737 - 04/21/08 08:25 AM (5 years, 1 month ago) |
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true, the scientific method could never work with mythology and the scientific method gets polluted easily anyway. i just think it's pretty simple to look at any species and trace it's know and possible anscestors back. as far as macro evolution never being observed, what do you call intimitely entwined mutualistic relationships like lichens which are themselves their own genuses and species being the fusion of fungi and algae and/or cyanobacteria. this shows that two kingdoms, the plants and fungi can combine to create something that many would argue deserves its own kingdom. as for now they lump lichens in with fungi, which they are. other fungi have photosynthetic partners too, called trees, and others get their energy from detritus. only the lichens are as one with their partner though. some jellyfish type creatures are doing a similar thing with algae.
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THEBats
FuturePsychopharmacologist
Registered: 03/18/05
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Re: Debunking Evolution [Re: azurite]
#8309760 - 04/21/08 08:47 AM (5 years, 1 month ago) |
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Throw this into the equation and we're really fucked.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/livescience/20080410/sc_livescience/shockfirstanimalonearthwassurprisinglycomplex
but seriously I'm for neither side. Both have holes too big for me to put faith in them completely.
I don't have time right at this moment but I would like to argue the devils advocate; ie creationism. Funny before I was arguing the opposite to my friend lol. I will be back.
Edited by THEBats (04/21/08 08:54 AM)
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Ego Death
Justadropofwaterinanendlesssea
Registered: 04/27/03
Posts: 10,447
Loc: The War Machine
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Re: Debunking Evolution [Re: DuNeRaVeR]
#8309811 - 04/21/08 09:23 AM (5 years, 1 month ago) |
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I got to the bit where he said "bacteria never turn into anything new" and gave up.
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Irdamage
Autobot
Registered: 11/19/05
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Loc: Canada
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Re: Debunking Evolution [Re: Ego Death]
#8309825 - 04/21/08 09:32 AM (5 years, 1 month ago) |
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Ok heres one for you then. Why do humans have Vestigial digits? Our appendix is no longer being used by humans for its original intended purpose...Ide say thats a big fucking sign of evolution. How about the domestication of species of animals over hundreds of years? ie: breeding of dogs.
BACTERIAL CHANGE!
FOSSILIZED REMAINS GOD DAMN IT!!!.
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Syle
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Re: Debunking Evolution [Re: Roker]
#8309874 - 04/21/08 10:23 AM (5 years, 1 month ago) |
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edit idiot.
Edited by trendal (04/21/08 10:43 AM)
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Seuss
Error: divide byzero
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Re: Debunking Evolution [Re: Irdamage]
#8309881 - 04/21/08 10:31 AM (5 years, 1 month ago) |
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> Our appendix is no longer being used by humans for its original intended purpose.
Actually, you might want to rethink that. Recent studies have indicated that the appendix does indeed play a roll in the digestive system of humans. It has been shown to be significant from three different perspectives: 1) by looking at people that have had it removed (they are sick more often), 2) by looking at the design of the organ (it is shaped to empty into the intestines while restricting anything entering it, and 3) by what they think it does (feeds good bacteria to the intestines whenever something kills off all the old ones).
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Just another spore in the wind.
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DimensionX
Quadratic Triangle.
Registered: 09/26/07
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Re: Debunking Evolution [Re: DuNeRaVeR]
#8309889 - 04/21/08 10:42 AM (5 years, 1 month ago) |
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I believe in evolutionary theory in general. I have a personal theory that there is some kind of intelligent force behind it. Possibly within the basic cells themselves. Evolution seems to put a lot of stock in chance occurrences which happen to be successful and survive. Random mutations, which coincidentally happen to work perfectly. To me, species seem so perfectly adapted that it points to some form of intelligence playing a role in their evolution. Probably not conscious intelligence like us, but not all intelligence is conscious, look at plants and computers for example. Maybe there is a certain logic programed into the cells which guide their development.
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Cannashroom
Smoke two Joints
Registered: 10/25/07
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Re: Debunking Evolution [Re: Seuss]
#8309890 - 04/21/08 10:42 AM (5 years, 1 month ago) |
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I am really sorry but i cannot believe any part of this shit. I stopped reading when they said mutations are imaginary. I have a biology final this afternoon and I can tell you, DNA has mutations, they happen and it can change the cell. You have many copies of the same gene so if one was mutated to make a new polypeptide, you would still have the old gene but also a new one that could be useful. Of course you don't see organisms changing DNA replication screws up 1 in 10^10 base pairs, it takes something like 100 000 years for an organism to change .1% or .01% of its genome. Evolution is not a theory anymore it widely accepted as scientific fact. I believe there is more to this world than we see and there may be a higher power, but all they did was create matter, life as we know it today came to be on its own accord.
This person has no idea wtf they are talking about. "Thus all the right mutations (and none of the destructive ones) must happen at the same time by pure chance." I'm sorry, NO! you need 1 mutation in a gamete and it will affect the entire organism that the zygote forms. Furthermore this person obviously has no idea how much genetic diversity our gametes have. For you guys, chances are every single one of the hundreds of millions of sperm are genetically different than one another! this gives rise to HUGE genetic diversity which allows for more change over time.
Although we cannot see evolution happen natural selection is easier to observe. Take as an example Moths in England. before the industrial revolution there were 90% white moths and 10% black because they would hide on white alder trees. After the industrial revolution trees were stained black and very quickly there were 90% black moths and 10% white. The change in the environment caused one phenotype from a mutation (black rather than white colour) to be much more desirable and quickly natural selection caused the white moths to die out as they no loner has their camouflage. This simple example shows how a certain mutation can cause natural selection to vastly change a certain phenotype of a population.
Please learn evolution before posting. This person does not understand evolution, not to say I do extremely in depth I just hate when people talk about evolution when they have no idea how it works.
Evolution is Fact, Read The Origin of the Species and get over it!
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"A human being is part of the whole, called by us 'Universe'; a part limited in time and space. He experiences himself, his thoughts and feelings as something separated from the rest -- a kind of optical delusion of his consciousness.
This delusion is a kind of prison for us, restricting us to our personal desires and affection for a few persons nearest us.
Our task must be to free ourselves from this prison by widening our circle of compassion to embrace all living creatures and the whole nature in its beauty.
Nobody is able to achieve this completely but striving for such achievement is, in itself, a part of the liberation and a foundation for inner security."
Albert Einstein
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b0red5tiff
NWO Disinformation Agent
Registered: 09/16/06
Posts: 18,446
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why are so many people obsessed with it?
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Atheist
Stranger
Registered: 01/24/06
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Loc: USA
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Re: Debunking Evolution [Re: b0red5tiff]
#8310056 - 04/21/08 12:17 PM (5 years, 1 month ago) |
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because many of us are majoringg in it, and he is completely right
evolution is a FACT.
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b0red5tiff
NWO Disinformation Agent
Registered: 09/16/06
Posts: 18,446
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Re: Debunking Evolution [Re: Atheist]
#8310069 - 04/21/08 12:23 PM (5 years, 1 month ago) |
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well if it's a fact then why does it need such ferocious defending?
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