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 ozzyozzyozzy
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 Straight coco coir - inferior substrate? 
#8041574 - 02/19/08 06:19 AM (5 years, 3 months ago) |
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I spawned some WBS to coco coir 8 days ago and have seen [apart from cobweb mold on one spawn-bag used] horrible growth. The mycelium, where it has grown, is very stringy, slow and looks like snowflake particles. I.e the mycelium doesn't consolidate its growth, it merely sends out more spikey strands.
Am I right in thinking this is a sign of poor nutriment in the coir substrate? It would appear to be wet enough, and even in the tubs with micropore-tape filter patches, growth is unsatisfactory. Time is not an issue - at this rate, the mycelium will grow old and die before it has colonized even a third of the small tubs.
For reference, this is my first time using coir. It's possible I may not have hydrated it fully, however there is condensation on the inside of most of the tubs, so I doubt this is the case.
Edited by ozzyozzyozzy (02/19/08 06:20 AM)
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ozzyozzyozzy
Australian
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Re: Straight coco coir - inferior substrate? [Re: ozzyozzyozzy]
#8041586 - 02/19/08 06:25 AM (5 years, 3 months ago) |
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Before I get ripped into, yes I understand straight coco coir isn't the best substrate. However, I was getting to a point where I either just needed to do SOMETHING or throw away all my spawnbags. I know you need used coffee grounds for nitrogen and other additions to balance out the ph. But I would have thought that straight coco coir on its own was nutritious enough to be used, as people have, in the past. What am I doing wrong with my spawning?
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ozzyozzyozzy
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Re: Straight coco coir - inferior substrate? [Re: ozzyozzyozzy]
#8041754 - 02/19/08 08:51 AM (5 years, 3 months ago) |
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Added a [poor quality] photo to illustrate the myc growth.
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 shroober
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Re: Straight coco coir - inferior substrate? [Re: ozzyozzyozzy]
#8041786 - 02/19/08 09:14 AM (5 years, 3 months ago) |
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what was your spawn to substrate ratio?
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Demetri
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Re: Straight coco coir - inferior substrate? [Re: ozzyozzyozzy]
#8041793 - 02/19/08 09:18 AM (5 years, 3 months ago) |
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I just used coir for the first time with nothing added and I've never seen any other sub. colonize so quick and evenly. Its got to be something else. Wish I could be of more help but just saying its fine using it straight. The strain could be the problem. B+ is crazy aggressive.
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Yrat
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Re: Straight coco coir - inferior substrate? [Re: Demetri]
#8041815 - 02/19/08 09:33 AM (5 years, 3 months ago) |
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straight coir
don't know what to tell you
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hazey
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Re: Straight coco coir - inferior substrate? [Re: ozzyozzyozzy]
#8041817 - 02/19/08 09:34 AM (5 years, 3 months ago) |
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your coir looks too wet, its hard to tell though...
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Slimz
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Re: Straight coco coir - inferior substrate? [Re: hazey]
#8041935 - 02/19/08 10:43 AM (5 years, 3 months ago) |
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its great.. that "Snowflake" is a good sign.. it is reaching and growing fast and will fill in in no time.. when it shoots those stringers out, its doing just fine..
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Bungalow Bill
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Re: Straight coco coir - inferior substrate? [Re: Slimz]
#8042084 - 02/19/08 11:53 AM (5 years, 3 months ago) |
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Straight coir rocks, but you might want to fluff it up with 40-50% verm next time.
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simplemachine
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Re: Straight coco coir - inferior substrate? [Re: ozzyozzyozzy]
#8042128 - 02/19/08 12:03 PM (5 years, 3 months ago) |
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I get consistently good results from straight coir.
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ozzyozzyozzy
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Re: Straight coco coir - inferior substrate? [Re: Yrat]
#8043683 - 02/19/08 07:15 PM (5 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Yrat said:
straight coir
don't know what to tell you
That's cased with verm isn't it?
Still, would lend credence to the idea that I've done something wrong. The strain is orissa india.
The spawn ratio was very small, however I had enough for the mycelium to take hold. Even given the increased colonization times, I can observe the initial spawn points and the growth is along strings and it hasn't consolidated any of its growth so far [i.e becoming thicker and completely white]. Wouldn't this be an indication of too little moisture? I don't have GE on any of these since they're so small, I suspect that may be an issue but I don't want to open them up for possible contamination unless I have to.
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Boomers420
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Re: Straight coco coir - inferior substrate? [Re: ozzyozzyozzy]
#8044099 - 02/19/08 08:43 PM (5 years, 3 months ago) |
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Probably too wet of coir.
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ozzyozzyozzy
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Re: Straight coco coir - inferior substrate? [Re: Boomers420]
#8046009 - 02/20/08 03:52 AM (5 years, 3 months ago) |
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Hmm... I'll add some GE strips [hopefully it won't contam] and see if it helps a little. Or just open it up, fan the hell out of it, and run. Not sure how to dehydrate a substrate..
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Slimz
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Re: Straight coco coir - inferior substrate? [Re: ozzyozzyozzy]
#8046130 - 02/20/08 06:58 AM (5 years, 3 months ago) |
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OMG its fine.. stop worrying about it..
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This series will blow your mind and confirm what you already know to be true.
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ozzyozzyozzy
Australian
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Re: Straight coco coir - inferior substrate? [Re: Slimz]
#8046193 - 02/20/08 08:08 AM (5 years, 2 months ago) |
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Are you sure? I've only ever used WBS as a substrate but the mycelium colonized a lot differently to that - faster, stronger, and it consolidated growth without ever sending out branches.
I won't touch it unless somebody really convincing comes up with a master solution, but if it shows the same growth rate 20 days down the track [making it a month] then I'm going to know I've done something hugely wrong.
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MuShQuEsT
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Re: Straight coco coir - inferior substrate? [Re: ozzyozzyozzy]
#8046368 - 02/20/08 10:35 AM (5 years, 2 months ago) |
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ya, I'd watch it for bit longer before worrying that much
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preschooler
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Re: Straight coco coir - inferior substrate? [Re: MuShQuEsT]
#8046383 - 02/20/08 10:41 AM (5 years, 2 months ago) |
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what happen to poo and straw as a substrate? its cheap and you can buy like a 50lb bag for 5 dollars and normally the straw is free if you can find it layin around a straw trailer...
poo is ur friend
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HybridprX
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Re: Straight coco coir - inferior substrate? [Re: preschooler]
#8046396 - 02/20/08 10:48 AM (5 years, 2 months ago) |
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coir alone does not give off terribly high yields, mix in some coffee grounds with it and it's just as good as straw/hpoo
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FooMan
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Re: Straight coco coir - inferior substrate? [Re: ozzyozzyozzy]
#8046425 - 02/20/08 11:08 AM (5 years, 2 months ago) |
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It might be too wet OR dry. I'm not sure how anyone can tell the moisture content simply by looking at that pic. That stringy type of mycelium is a GOOD thing. That means the myc is growing rhyzomorphic (aggressive). 8 days is a long time after spawning to see such a small amount of growth with rhyzos like that though, so it is likely a moisture problem and/or you need more gas exchange. I would take a bit of uncolonized coir out and squeeze it to see if you get any water dripping out of it. If not, give the whole thing a good misting. If you squeeze and it's dripping like crazy, put the cover on loosely and create more gas exchange holes to let some of that moisture out.
Good luck.
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Re: Straight coco coir - inferior substrate? [Re: HybridprX]
#8047025 - 02/20/08 02:10 PM (5 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
HybridprX said:
coir alone does not give off terribly high yields, mix in some coffee grounds with it and it's just as good as straw/hpoo
Straw/poo is the hands down winner for monster shrooms, it can't be beat.
I don't know when coir became a substrate, because it contains only minute nutrients, being high in Sodium and Potassium, it is very low in Nitrogen. It is Coconut husks, the outer shell of the coconut seed that is shredded, it has very little nutrient values as compared to Poo/Straw. Using it as a substrate isn't really a good idea IMO & IME. Using it as a substrate your adding water not nutrients-Coir holds about 10 times its size/weight in water-just like verm. Why do you think people add it to their substrate of straw, poo, or grains? To add moisture not nutrients.
Coir dust is very similar to peat in appearance. It is light to dark brown in color and consists primarily of particles in the size range 0.2-2.0 mm (75-90%). Unlike sphagnum peat, there are no sticks or other extraneous matter.
Independent analyses of coir dust were performed in May and June 1991 at Auburn University, University of Arkansas, and A&L Analytical Laboratories (Memphis, TN).
G. C. Cresswell (1992) looked at coir dust in comparison to sedge and sphagnum peat products and concluded that it has superior structural stability, water absorption ability and drainage, and cation exchange capacity compared to either sphagnum peat or sedge peat.
Coir dust tends to be high in both sodium and potassium, compared to the other peats, but Na is leached readily from the material under irrigation. The high levels of potassium present in coir dust are interesting, and may actually prove more a benefit than any detriment to plant growth. Coir dust from sources other than Sri Lanka have also reportedly contained chlorides at levels toxic to many plants, thus it is very important that salinity in the raw material be monitored before processing into a horticultural amendment. It is evident, that chemical properties of this material can vary widely from source to source.
The higher pH of coir dust may allow less lime to be added to a coir dust-based medium, though adding dolomite to container soils is more important for Ca and Mg nutrition than for elevating pH. Cresswell did find that a small amount of nitrogen drawdown (N kept from availability to plants during decomposition of organic amendments low in nitrogen) occurred with coir dust, but typical production fertilization practices would likely compensate for the small amount of resulting N loss. At present, it is unclear how else fertilization regimes may need to be adjusted, if at all, in media composed chiefly of coir dust.
I use it for casing material only (and I get huge yields, check some of my posts) unless I add it the substrate to add moisture, but, that's just how I do it, some will argue differently
Doc
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