Welcome to the Shroomery Message Board! You are experiencing a small sample of what the site has to offer. Please login or register to post messages and view our exclusive members-only content. You'll gain access to additional forums, file attachments, board customizations, encrypted private messages, and much more!
|
 Lightningfractal
Nutcase
Registered: 06/24/03
Posts: 14,899
Loc: Heaven and Hell
Last seen: 3 months, 3 days
|
 Re: Vocal racism should be removed from OTD..  [Re: fireworks_god]
#6581612 - 02/18/07 03:55 PM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
So you've become janitors. Lovely.
--------------------
Hi how's it going, wanna kick Heroin basically painlessly on your own, in your own house, without any government "help" ,or the "help" of a crazy condescending, judgmental medical doctor? Read this:
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php?Cat=0&Board=42&Number=7342616&page=0&fpart=all
|
 demiu5
broccolilocks
Registered: 08/19/05
Posts: 38,158
Loc: the popcorn stadium
|
Re: Vocal racism should be removed from OTD.. [Re: Lightningfractal]
#6581614 - 02/18/07 03:55 PM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
just let us suffocate in our own pool of filth and vomit
if a person doesn't take a shit, they're vital functions cease to continue due to toxic buildup
|
Lightningfractal
Nutcase
Registered: 06/24/03
Posts: 14,899
Loc: Heaven and Hell
Last seen: 3 months, 3 days
|
Re: Vocal racism should be removed from OTD.. [Re: demiu5]
#6581622 - 02/18/07 03:57 PM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
just let us suffocate in our own pool of filth and vomit
Now that does have a measure of validity. But I like the fun OTD, the way it was before the scat invasion. I'd like to see it again.
--------------------
Hi how's it going, wanna kick Heroin basically painlessly on your own, in your own house, without any government "help" ,or the "help" of a crazy condescending, judgmental medical doctor? Read this:
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php?Cat=0&Board=42&Number=7342616&page=0&fpart=all
|
Redstorm
Prince of Bugs
Registered: 10/08/02
Posts: 44,162
Loc: [life]now[/life]
Last seen: 1 year, 6 months
|
Re: Vocal racism should be removed from OTD.. [Re: Lightningfractal]
#6581688 - 02/18/07 04:12 PM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Lightningfractal said:
Quote:
just let us suffocate in our own pool of filth and vomit
Now that does have a measure of validity. But I like the fun OTD, the way it was before the scat invasion. I'd like to see it again.
You weren't even here before scat was big in OTD.
|
ThreePieceSuit
disastrophe
Registered: 04/26/06
Posts: 5,003
Loc: East Coast of Canada
Last seen: 1 year, 3 months
|
Re: Vocal racism should be removed from OTD.. [Re: Redstorm]
#6581747 - 02/18/07 04:23 PM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Will someone PM me the history of the OTD?
I'm interested to know what the forum was like before the inclusion of poo.
Um, also, I don't really have anything to add to this conversation. I apologize.
--------------------
I'm so lucrative, even my birthday suit is in three pieces.
|
demiu5
broccolilocks
Registered: 08/19/05
Posts: 38,158
Loc: the popcorn stadium
|
Re: Vocal racism should be removed from OTD.. [Re: Lightningfractal]
#6581752 - 02/18/07 04:24 PM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
I don't really care for a lot of the nonsense in otd, as you should know, but why do you let it bother you?
It may be hard to ignore at times, but just do your best.
|
Wiccan_Seeker
gold foil hat admin
Registered: 02/06/02
Posts: 33,513
Loc: Virgo Supercluster (or b...
Last seen: 6 hours, 49 minutes
|
Re: Vocal racism should be removed from OTD.. [Re: Lightningfractal]
#6581948 - 02/18/07 05:18 PM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Why do you only put a sign out front, when you can just clean up the mess??
I think that's just laziness.
It is not lazyness, and certainly it is not moderator lazyness.
It may be hard to fathom the notion, but the admins of this website explicitly want racism to be a part of the Shroomery. Racism is here because they want it here, and that is a deliberate choice.
They want it here. They keep it here.
They explicitly name racism as being OK in the OTD disclaimer:
Quote:
This forum contains content that many will find extremely offensive. Such material includes grotesque imagery, vocal racism, and generally disrespectful behavior.
They actively put racism and homophobia in the smiley panel:
Quote:
  
They allow racist usernames.
They allow racist avatars.
Specific mention of condemnation of racism, sexism etc, which is present in just about every website's rule list by default, is completely absent in the Administrative Rules & Guidelines despite recurrent requests.
Repeated requests to act on these matters are denied with great clarity.
If you look at this list it is pretty clear that the administrators condone and by their actions facilitate racist expression on the shroomery. They want it here. They keep it here.
Any mod or admin who feels unpleasantly judged by these words should look for the source of that condemnation in their own conscience. I am not morally condemning racism here, I am merely stating the fact that allowing (and to some degree encouraging) racism on the Shroomery is policy, deliberate policy decided and agreed upon by the admins.
All of these things can readily be observed by any member, and the conclusions drawn from them, albeit unflattering, is a deep but straight-line cut with Occam's Razor.
I will not defend this policy, because I'm against it, but any staff member is hereby invited to step forward to do so.
|
Redstorm
Prince of Bugs
Registered: 10/08/02
Posts: 44,162
Loc: [life]now[/life]
Last seen: 1 year, 6 months
|
Re: Vocal racism should be removed from OTD.. [Re: Wiccan_Seeker]
#6581966 - 02/18/07 05:23 PM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
You think that post might be more appropriately discussed behind closed doors?
|
Lightningfractal
Nutcase
Registered: 06/24/03
Posts: 14,899
Loc: Heaven and Hell
Last seen: 3 months, 3 days
|
Re: Vocal racism should be removed from OTD.. [Re: Wiccan_Seeker]
#6581975 - 02/18/07 05:25 PM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Wiccan_Seeker said:
Quote:
Why do you only put a sign out front, when you can just clean up the mess??
I think that's just laziness.
It is not lazyness, and certainly it is not moderator lazyness.
It may be hard to fathom the notion, but the admins of this website explicitly want racism to be a part of the Shroomery. Racism is here because they want it here, and that is a deliberate choice.
They want it here. They keep it here.
They explicitly name racism as being OK in the OTD disclaimer:
Quote:
This forum contains content that many will find extremely offensive. Such material includes grotesque imagery, vocal racism, and generally disrespectful behavior.
They actively put racism and homophobia in the smiley panel:
Quote:
They allow racist usernames.
They allow racist avatars.
Specific mention of condemnation of racism, sexism etc, which is present in just about every website's rule list by default, is completely absent in the Administrative Rules & Guidelines despite recurrent requests.
Repeated requests to act on these matters are denied with great clarity.
If you look at this list it is pretty clear that the administrators condone and by their actions facilitate racist expression on the shroomery. They want it here. They keep it here.
Any mod or admin who feels unpleasantly judged by these words should look for the source of that condemnation in their own conscience. I am not morally condemning racism here, I am merely stating the fact that allowing (and to some degree encouraging) racism on the Shroomery is policy, deliberate policy decided and agreed upon by the admins.
All of these things can readily be observed by any member, and the conclusions drawn from them, albeit unflattering, is a deep but straight-line cut with Occam's Razor.
I will not defend this policy, because I'm against it, but any staff member is hereby invited to step forward to do so.
I agree. That seems to be the situation.
--------------------
Hi how's it going, wanna kick Heroin basically painlessly on your own, in your own house, without any government "help" ,or the "help" of a crazy condescending, judgmental medical doctor? Read this:
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php?Cat=0&Board=42&Number=7342616&page=0&fpart=all
|
Lightningfractal
Nutcase
Registered: 06/24/03
Posts: 14,899
Loc: Heaven and Hell
Last seen: 3 months, 3 days
|
Re: Vocal racism should be removed from OTD.. [Re: Redstorm]
#6581979 - 02/18/07 05:26 PM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Redstorm said:
You think that post might be more appropriately discussed behind closed doors?
he should be able to express his views in public if he wants to.
--------------------
Hi how's it going, wanna kick Heroin basically painlessly on your own, in your own house, without any government "help" ,or the "help" of a crazy condescending, judgmental medical doctor? Read this:
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php?Cat=0&Board=42&Number=7342616&page=0&fpart=all
|
adrug
Registered: 02/04/03
Posts: 15,800
|
Re: Vocal racism should be removed from OTD.. [Re: Wiccan_Seeker]
#6581994 - 02/18/07 05:31 PM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Wiccan_Seeker said:
Quote:
Why do you only put a sign out front, when you can just clean up the mess??
I think that's just laziness.
It is not lazyness, and certainly it is not moderator lazyness.
It may be hard to fathom the notion, but the admins of this website explicitly want racism to be a part of the Shroomery. Racism is here because they want it here, and that is a deliberate choice.
They want it here. They keep it here.
Are you accusing the shroomery administration of being racist, even SUPPORTING racism among users? Because I find that a bit ridiculous. The fact is, racism exists in this world, and trying to ban people's opinions doesn't work. Trying to hide it doesn't make it go away. Maybe the administration believes that people should be allowed to say whatever they want? I would support them 100% in that position.
Haven't we tried to clean up OTD before? And it didn't work? Yeah, that's what I thought. You can't have the good without the bad...
|
Wiccan_Seeker
gold foil hat admin
Registered: 02/06/02
Posts: 33,513
Loc: Virgo Supercluster (or b...
Last seen: 6 hours, 49 minutes
|
Re: Vocal racism should be removed from OTD.. [Re: Redstorm]
#6582011 - 02/18/07 05:35 PM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
You think that post might be more appropriately discussed behind closed doors?
I've thought about it before dropping the post, but no, I don't think it should be discussed behind closed doors.
It uses points of evidence every member can observe, and the conclusion drawn by no means needs a stretch of the imagination.
I think it's unjust, I think it's embarrassing as fuck, but it does seem te be the situation, a conclusion any member can arrive at by themselves.
But yeah, that's one inflammatory post.
I like to add that I do not consider any of the moderators or administrators a racist. I do not think things are like they are out of maliciousness.
I'm against closed doors on this. Let it be known, and if that what is said about Freedom of Speech is sincere, then my former post will not put a noose around my neck.
If it does, hey, at least let me finish my damn prayer before dropping me
|
fireworks_god
SexyButt McDanger
Registered: 03/12/02
Posts: 24,188
Loc: Red Panda Village
Last seen: 13 hours, 12 minutes
|
Re: Vocal racism should be removed from OTD.. [Re: Wiccan_Seeker]
#6582073 - 02/18/07 05:59 PM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
I personally do not see those emoticons as being racist, although I realize that some individuals might use them in a racist context or that others would interpret them as being used in such a manner. I have a gay friend that would probably think that emoticon was hilarious. 
I also am not certain that the disclaimer constitutes the administration as encouraging racism, but simply ensuring that material that may be offensive or may be interpreted or used in such a context can be posted in that forum without creating an undesireable situation when someone who objects views it. I don't necessarily think that they condone racism, although they certainly, up to this point, have allowed objectionable content that may be viewed as such to be posted in one forum with the disclaimer that offensive material lies ahead.
Like I was saying earlier, the word "nigger" is likely more offensive than it is racist. I think this community as a whole is open-minded and many individuals who post in OTD view such content as being tounge-in-cheek, satirical, or simply to troll those they do not personally care for, to insult and to have fun doing so. 
I personally am not too attached to the opportunity to express myself in such a manner as I do not typically feel the need to do so; however, I do not think that this is something that is "broken" and in need of repairs. Almost everyone understands what OTD is and feels that the disclaimer is effective in ensuring that some members who feel compelled to post in such a manner have a place to do it without upsetting other members and scaring off new members.
As a moderator, I feel that having OTD in its present form assists my ability to ensure that P&S stays constructive and focused upon discussing philosophical and spiritual ideas, as anyone who wishes to troll and post about matters irrelevant to the forum can be referred to the OTD forum. If they want to bash me, I can send them there and they can rant on and on about me.
--------------------
  
 
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you
  
 
|
Hanky
wiffle bat.
Registered: 08/30/03
Posts: 56,993
Loc: Great Southern Land.
|
Re: Vocal racism should be removed from OTD.. [Re: fireworks_god]
#6582253 - 02/18/07 07:02 PM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
This rationale behind this nonsense is that LF hopes by trolling up trouble in context of the OTD forum that the 40 odd people from OTD will take him off ignore and start listening to his rubbish again. To an extent this works, ie: One person (me) takes him off ignore just to read this particular thread. But he forgets or doesn't realize that he goes straight back on ignore when I'm finished.
He's been ostracized by the very forum which he so deeply wants to be accepted by but It's never going to happen. We got sick of reading his rubbish and have acted accordingly.
LF will never again be a welcome part of OTD and it's time that he accepted that and moved on.
LF, you're as transparent as a brand new wind shield.
In regards to REAL racism in OTD, one just has to look back at the way we treated the neo nazi "Looner3".
--------------------
Coaster is an idiot...
[quote]Coaster said:
but i thnk everything thats pure is white?
[/quote]
|
Thor
Anti-Theist OVERLORD
Registered: 08/12/98
Posts: 9,868
Loc: Calgary, Canada
|
Re: Vocal racism should be removed from OTD.. [Re: adrug]
#6582264 - 02/18/07 07:04 PM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
adrug said:
Quote:
Wiccan_Seeker said:
Quote:
Why do you only put a sign out front, when you can just clean up the mess??
I think that's just laziness.
It is not lazyness, and certainly it is not moderator lazyness.
It may be hard to fathom the notion, but the admins of this website explicitly want racism to be a part of the Shroomery. Racism is here because they want it here, and that is a deliberate choice.
They want it here. They keep it here.
Are you accusing the shroomery administration of being racist, even SUPPORTING racism among users? Because I find that a bit ridiculous. The fact is, racism exists in this world, and trying to ban people's opinions doesn't work. Trying to hide it doesn't make it go away. Maybe the administration believes that people should be allowed to say whatever they want? I would support them 100% in that position.
Haven't we tried to clean up OTD before? And it didn't work? Yeah, that's what I thought. You can't have the good without the bad...
Free speech has its good and bad; I'd personally rather have people allowed the opportunity to speak how they see fit and debates like these are better than us just using a blanket policy forcing users to refrain from certain words in the english language.
Free speech isn't easy or at times even pretty.
|
Wiccan_Seeker
gold foil hat admin
Registered: 02/06/02
Posts: 33,513
Loc: Virgo Supercluster (or b...
Last seen: 6 hours, 49 minutes
|
Re: Vocal racism should be removed from OTD.. [Re: adrug]
#6582399 - 02/18/07 07:47 PM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Are you accusing the shroomery administration of being racist, even SUPPORTING racism among users? Because I find that a bit ridiculous
I'm not saying the admins are racists. I am however saying that policy does nothing to stop racism and that it in several ways encourages members to engage in racist activities. I've outlined the examples.
Quote:
The fact is, racism exists in this world, and trying to ban people's opinions doesn't work. Trying to hide it doesn't make it go away.
OK, but that is not at all the norm on the internet and in offline media, where racist and arguably racist material in the overwhelming majority of cases is being suppressed and sanctioned. The policy here is differerent. Contrary to most of the internet and most of the o0ffline media, racism is allowed to be (very) vocal here.
What kind of a bar allows you to be vocally racist, and what kind of customers does such a bar tend to attract - and repel?
In This poll I made in OTD, of the 65 people who answered the poll so far 6 people so far said they're somewhat racist in real life, 4 people plainly said they're racist and 8 people said they're very racist in real life.
Of the 65 people polled so far, 18 or more than one in four answered affirmative on the question:
are you a real racist?
So OTD isn't a lala land where people just joke about racism, all for fun - over one in four calls himself a real racist, and today the Shroomery server was used to distribute neonazi white power music by the fascist band Skr*wdriver, and in fact you can still download these songs in OTD, and such will we be spidered by Google. When you google the name of the neonazi band, soon and automatically the Shroomery will come up and we will offer song titles such as "white power" for download.
"when you build it, they will come"
If you unlike the overwhelming majority of webcommunities allow racist talk on your boards, you are comparatively encouraging racism, and will tend to attract people denied this privilege on the rest of the web.
So don't act like it is outlandish for a website administration act against racism, while it in fact is internationally outlandish to allow it.
Quote:
Thor said:
Free speech has its good and bad; I'd personally rather have people allowed the opportunity to speak how they see fit and debates like these are better than us just using a blanket policy forcing users to refrain from certain words in the english language.
Free speech isn't easy or at times even pretty.
As demonstrated as well by my use of free speech just now.
If "free speech" were just a hollow phrase, my post would've been an act of sepukku, as it would be on many websites. Again: if I thought policy was based on maliciousness, I wouldn't even be a moderator, or a member.
But, summarizing Thor's words, it is in fact policy to allow racism to take its course on the boards. Thank you for affirming that.
|
Redstorm
Prince of Bugs
Registered: 10/08/02
Posts: 44,162
Loc: [life]now[/life]
Last seen: 1 year, 6 months
|
Re: Vocal racism should be removed from OTD.. [Re: Wiccan_Seeker]
#6582447 - 02/18/07 08:02 PM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
You failed to take into account many things about your poll. The first is that it is OTD. People fill in nonsense in polls in OTD all the time, just for the fun of it. On top of that, many members in OTD view you as a downer or a "wet blanket" so would vote racist just to antagonize you.
Even if all those people are actually racist, so what? They have a right to state their opinion, no matter how un-mainstream it is.
|
Psilocybeingzz
Registered: 12/15/02
Posts: 14,463
Loc: International waters
Last seen: 6 months, 7 days
|
Re: Vocal racism should be removed from OTD.. [Re: TheHateCamel]
#6582486 - 02/18/07 08:12 PM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
TheHateCamel said:
The problem here is that LF is saying that the language in OTD is HATE SPEECH.
Hate speech is a term for speech intended to degrade, intimidate, or incite violence or prejudicial action.
What is being said in OTD is tongue-in-cheek, or at the very worst it is trolling for a reaction.
If someone came into OTD spouting REAL hate speech they would be berated like any other moron.
|
Psilocybeingzz
Registered: 12/15/02
Posts: 14,463
Loc: International waters
Last seen: 6 months, 7 days
|
Re: Vocal racism should be removed from OTD.. [Re: Psilocybeingzz]
#6582490 - 02/18/07 08:14 PM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
|
demiu5
broccolilocks
Registered: 08/19/05
Posts: 38,158
Loc: the popcorn stadium 
|
Re: Vocal racism should be removed from OTD.. [Re: Redstorm]
#6582501 - 02/18/07 08:16 PM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
I voted truthfully 
| |
|
|
You cannot start new topics / You cannot reply to topics
HTML is disabled / BBCode is enabled
Moderator: Ythan, eris, Thor, Seuss, geokills, Sell Your Soul
3,243 topic views. 1 members, 1 guests and 0 web crawlers are browsing this forum.
[ Toggle Favorite | Print Topic ]
| | |
|
|
|
Images only 
Threaded
Previous
Index
Next
Edit 
Reply 
