Welcome to the Shroomery Message Board! You are experiencing a small sample of what the site has to offer. Please login or register to post messages and view our exclusive members-only content. You'll gain access to additional forums, file attachments, board customizations, encrypted private messages, and much more!
|
 dao727
Stranger
Registered: 08/18/07
Posts: 1
Last seen: 5 years, 9 months
|
 Re: suicide selfish??  [Re: xxjokerxx1]
#7308767 - 08/18/07 11:06 PM (5 years, 9 months ago) |
|
|
Just my two cents... I have had suicidal ideation since the age of 16, and I am now 43. I have major clinical depression. My fear of going to hell, and the destruction and hurt I would cause to my family forces me to go on despite my pain.
Some loved ones can deal with my pain, and others just think I am faking it. The "tough love" approach in some cases hurts so much. I have had a lover tell me I will go to hell anyway because of my depression and suicidal thoughts. I have been told I am faking it.
On the other hand , I have many sisters who have told me that they wished I believed in myself as they believe in me. (The lover alternately says the same.) .
I am sad in general because I suffer daily from a lot of anxiety, OCD symptoms, need to be alone, some degree of agoraphobia (I think that it the right spelling). Plus I never reached my main goal in life, which was to give life to a child. Luckily I have many nieces and nephews, whose bright happy faces give me hope.
Please, please, don't say to a depressed person " I don't believe you." Don't say, " You are evil for feeling the want to die', Please don't say, "I hate you".
Please don't take away your love or support, however distant to a person that is obviously crying out for help. Many people who think about suicide don't want to die. They want their inner pain to end. This can only happen by true, unconditional love.
I have been lucky to have enough of that to sustain me, I am still alive. I have a long way to go.
Tell the person in your life, how much they are loved, and how much they will be missed. Do not make it personal, make them know they are important , and have had a positive impact on people's lives.
It is easy to judge those who fail, but depression is so devasting, as is any mental illness. Although I personally believe God considers this while finally judging us, the pain that the act may cause people in your life, from your Parents to the innocent children in your lives, is selfish in that sense. I am a person who has often wished to die. The tears of my Mother, and those that my sisters, and their children would shed , is what keeps me alive.
Pray for those who suffer, do not condemn them for their thoughts.
It may not be a choice to be depressed. It is hard to seek help, until you reach the bottom, and know that you must to go on.
I am there. I can do it for my family, someday I will want to do it for me, because I love me, as they love me.
Please don't judge. God loves us all.
|
xxjokerxx1
Stranger
Registered: 03/17/07
Posts: 110
Last seen: 3 years, 4 months
|
Re: suicide selfish?? [Re: dao727]
#7315371 - 08/20/07 09:43 PM (5 years, 8 months ago) |
|
|
people also want to commit suicide because they have physical illnes that is crippling them, that is my only reason if i had my health i would be fine
|
 Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 79,899
Loc: underbelly
|
|
Quote:
KristiMidocean said:
I dont know what is wrong with me.... I just recently had a friend kill herself leaving behind hunderds of frineds, 3 childern a husband good home and job, and tons and tons of loving family....
Her lately (its been about a month) I can't help but feel that she is the most selfish person I know! I have other friends right now that want to kill themselfs and I know I should be there for them ut I can...... I cant help but feel really mad at them for being soo stupid and selfish... Think about it..... They think their "issues" are sooo bad ad the only way to fix it is end their life...... well shit what about the people you are leaving behind.... YOUR NOT THINKNG ABOUT HOW IT WILL EFFECT OTHER PEOPLE........ STOP THINKING ABOUT YOU AND YOURSELF.......... sooo many people will suffer from your lose........ YOu know time can only heel "issues" but there is not enough time in the world to feel the hole in peoples lives when you kill yourself......
AM I WROng? Should I be more compassionate??? NO BECAUSE WHEN THAT PERSON TOOK THEIR LIFE THEY WERENT BEING COMPASSIONATE JUST SELFISH
right??
DELETED: I replied to this two years ago.
--------------------
"Hang on tightly, let go lightly" -anonymous
“under the present brutal and primitive conditions on this planet, every person you meet should be regarded as one of the walking wounded. we have never seen a man or woman not slightly deranged by either anxiety or grief. we have never seen a totally sane human being.”
― Robert Anton Wilson
Edited by Icelander (08/23/07 08:01 PM)
|
catastrophic_17
Stranger
Registered: 06/12/08
Posts: 3
Last seen: 4 years, 11 months
|
|
its not about you
they were obviously in pain
and they have the right to their body
suicide isn't a crime
its a choice. and its a choice anyone can make
you can't be punished for that
suicidals go to hell? that's bullshit
they obviously had a good reason.
|
Mark_W
Stranger
Registered: 05/19/07
Posts: 347
Loc: NC
Last seen: 1 year, 1 month
|
|
I've always thought it very strange when people consider suicide selfish.
I just don't get the argument...When someone commits suicide I'd imagine it is because one some level they feel like they are doing more harm than good (to the world, to their loved ones, etc), and that their death will help overall.
Even if they're wrong, I don't see how it could be selfish.
But as already mentioned, their is something selfish about thinking others owe their life to you, and that you have a right to get angry at that person when they commit suicide.
Do you think that person is going to a place of eternal bliss now, or is their life just over? [question for anyone as the OP is from 3 years ago]. Is this world a painful obligation to suffer through, or is it a beautiful chance to increase love in ourselves and others? It seems the only way someone could consider suicide selfish is if they didn't value life and considered death a gateway to heaven.
--------------------
Let the State Disintegrate
-Leary
Edited by Mark_W (06/13/08 08:49 PM)
|
sunflower
We're here....
Registered: 08/19/06
Posts: 551
Last seen: 9 months, 19 days
|
|
Quote:
KristiMidocean said:
I dont know what is wrong with me.... I just recently had a friend kill herself leaving behind hunderds of frineds, 3 childern a husband good home and job, and tons and tons of loving family....
Her lately (its been about a month) I can't help but feel that she is the most selfish person I know! I have other friends right now that want to kill themselfs and I know I should be there for them ut I can...... I cant help but feel really mad at them for being soo stupid and selfish... Think about it..... They think their "issues" are sooo bad ad the only way to fix it is end their life...... well shit what about the people you are leaving behind.... YOUR NOT THINKNG ABOUT HOW IT WILL EFFECT OTHER PEOPLE........ STOP THINKING ABOUT YOU AND YOURSELF.......... sooo many people will suffer from your lose........ YOu know time can only heel "issues" but there is not enough time in the world to feel the hole in peoples lives when you kill yourself......
AM I WROng? Should I be more compassionate??? NO BECAUSE WHEN THAT PERSON TOOK THEIR LIFE THEY WERENT BEING COMPASSIONATE JUST SELFISH
right??
I don't feel this way anymore, since my rebirth day.
--------------------
Edited by sunflower (08/18/08 06:31 PM)
|
myshoesarered
Mushabelly Snoozem
Registered: 12/12/07
Posts: 377
Loc: The Mitt
Last seen: 4 years, 10 months
|
|
Of course it's selfish, imagine that you're a 10 year old kid getting home from school. You walk into your parent's room and find your mom with a gun in her mouth. Tell me that's not gonna fuck a kid up for a good long time.
--------------------
"What a beautiful face I have found in this place that is circling all round the sun,
and when we meet on a cloud
I'll be laughing out loud,
I'll be laughing at everyone I see,
Can't believe, how strange it is to be anything at all..."
"...nobody has yet died of amazement & you always come back to planet Earth..."
|
Mark_W
Stranger
Registered: 05/19/07
Posts: 347
Loc: NC
Last seen: 1 year, 1 month
|
|
Quote:
myshoesarered said:
Of course it's selfish, imagine that you're a 10 year old kid getting home from school. You walk into your parent's room and find your mom with a gun in her mouth. Tell me that's not gonna fuck a kid up for a good long time.
Being a depressed parent will also have a negative effect on children. Is being depressed then selfish? If so, that's just another thing for the depressed person to feel bad about and spiral down into further depression, and thus have an even more negative effect on his or her children.
I still don't get the logic behind the claiming this person is being selfish.
--------------------
Let the State Disintegrate
-Leary
|
myshoesarered
Mushabelly Snoozem
Registered: 12/12/07
Posts: 377
Loc: The Mitt
Last seen: 4 years, 10 months
|
Re: suicide selfish?? [Re: Mark_W]
#8523025 - 06/14/08 12:30 PM (4 years, 11 months ago) |
|
|
One of my parents has been depressed my entire life, and while it has made things hard for me growing up, I couldn't even imagine coming home as a child and finding my mom dead by her own hand. People have little to no control over depression, putting a gun in your mouth is a choice. If you have children then their well-being is your responsibility.
--------------------
"What a beautiful face I have found in this place that is circling all round the sun,
and when we meet on a cloud
I'll be laughing out loud,
I'll be laughing at everyone I see,
Can't believe, how strange it is to be anything at all..."
"...nobody has yet died of amazement & you always come back to planet Earth..."
|
Mark_W
Stranger
Registered: 05/19/07
Posts: 347
Loc: NC
Last seen: 1 year, 1 month
|
|
Quote:
myshoesarered said:
People have little to no control over depression, putting a gun in your mouth is a choice. If you have children then their well-being is your responsibility.
I agree, but what if someone commits suicide because they feel like their life and depression is making things harder on their family than their death would? I'd imagine this is the mindset of many suicidal people. We can claim they're wrong, but selfish?
When someone does something selfish, its assumed that they benefit in some way at the expense of others, right? What is the benefit of killing oneself? Since nobody knows what, if anything, awaits us after death, how can we make the assessment that this person has selfishly gained something at the expense of others? All we know is that they did lose life, and if we value our lives shouldn't we pity them?
Edited by Mark_W (06/14/08 01:21 PM)
|
Ballarat_Bandit
Techno-Drugs
Registered: 03/28/08
Posts: 51
Last seen: 4 years, 4 months
|
Re: suicide selfish?? [Re: Mark_W]
#8523221 - 06/14/08 01:42 PM (4 years, 11 months ago) |
|
|
Existence itself is selfish in nature, death is the ultimate good in the world. Trying sitting down to eat everyday thinking of who is going to starve to death, going to a swimming pool as ~2 billion people cannot find fresh water to drink. The reason is what matters when it comes to dying. If you kill yourself out of anguish, that is the most misguided and selfish thing I could imagine. There's only one way to make sure things will never get any better...
|
myshoesarered
Mushabelly Snoozem
Registered: 12/12/07
Posts: 377
Loc: The Mitt
Last seen: 4 years, 10 months
|
|
Quote:
Mark_W said:
Quote:
myshoesarered said:
People have little to no control over depression, putting a gun in your mouth is a choice. If you have children then their well-being is your responsibility.
I agree, but what if someone commits suicide because they feel like their life and depression is making things harder on their family than their death would? I'd imagine this is the mindset of many suicidal people. We can claim they're wrong, but selfish?
When someone does something selfish, its assumed that they benefit in some way at the expense of others, right? What is the benefit of killing oneself? Since nobody knows what, if anything, awaits us after death, how can we make the assessment that this person has selfishly gained something at the expense of others? All we know is that they did lose life, and if we value our lives shouldn't we pity them?
I understand your point, it's impossible to rightfully judge someone that's going through things that I couldn't imagine. I can't relinquish my view that it is something that damages the ones that the person loves however.
My mom dealt with depression throughout her entire life, and it has impacted me. However, a friend of mine's father had dealt with depression throughout his entire life as well. He didn't tell anyone. My friend found him in his hunting shack with a gun in his mouth. His father kept it a secret out of fear of judgment and now that decision has hurt many of the people he loved. This is an instance that I view as selfish. I agree with you now though that for the most part it shouldn't be considered "selfish".
--------------------
"What a beautiful face I have found in this place that is circling all round the sun,
and when we meet on a cloud
I'll be laughing out loud,
I'll be laughing at everyone I see,
Can't believe, how strange it is to be anything at all..."
"...nobody has yet died of amazement & you always come back to planet Earth..."
|
Mark_W
Stranger
Registered: 05/19/07
Posts: 347
Loc: NC
Last seen: 1 year, 1 month
|
|
Quote:
Ballarat_Bandit said:
Existence itself is selfish in nature, death is the ultimate good in the world... The reason is what matters when it comes to dying. If you kill yourself out of anguish, that is the most misguided and selfish thing I could imagine. There's only one way to make sure things will never get any better...
I'm having a hard time making sense of your last post. Existence is selfish, but death is good? According to your logic, if death is the ultimate good then it stands to reason that it is selfish, and existence is seperation from that ultimate good and is therefore unselfish, right?
I'd agree that existence is selfish, but I wouldn't agree that suicide or ceasing to exist is selfish. How could both be selfish?
And I'm in agreement with you that we could call suicide misguided, but shouldn't we pity someone who is misguided? And if we pity them because they are misguided, how can we call them selfish at the same time? Either they are misguided, or they are selfish, but how can they be both?
--------------------
Let the State Disintegrate
-Leary
Edited by Mark_W (06/14/08 02:39 PM)
|
MNshroomDR18
Stranger
Registered: 08/13/08
Posts: 4
Loc: Stillwater MN
Last seen: 4 years, 8 months
|
Re: suicide selfish?? [Re: dao727]
#8772677 - 08/14/08 12:50 PM (4 years, 9 months ago) |
|
|
People, especially parents need to realize that life is hard for some ppl, its hard for everyone its a struggle, modern society makes us feel like we're not part of the animal kingdom, but we still have to work like animals work to barely live. sometime ppl feel so bad they want to kill themselves, or die unintionally. they feel alone, and even when they're not they do, it is selfish, but its also selfish to say you have to live when you weren't given a choice to be born. Life especially modern is not the best. In my opinion humans are cruel, abnormally sick and yes, selfish. Suicide, is not a joke, if your friend wants to kill him/her self, they might not say it and do it. They might mention it jokingly, take it seriously, they might mention it frantically and pleadingly, they feel sufficated, you need to listen to thier whole story or when you leave or hangup, even if you think they sound better, they could be tying a rope. remember just to listen.
--------------------
Turn on tune in and dropout.
|
Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 79,899
Loc: underbelly
|
Re: suicide selfish?? [Re: nitroguy]
#8774983 - 08/14/08 11:05 PM (4 years, 9 months ago) |
|
|
I say have some compassion for a desparate person and learn to forgive. My nonsensical 2cents
You are way ahead of the curve brother. Most people are so selfish that they need to blame people for doing whatever they feel they have to.
--------------------
"Hang on tightly, let go lightly" -anonymous
“under the present brutal and primitive conditions on this planet, every person you meet should be regarded as one of the walking wounded. we have never seen a man or woman not slightly deranged by either anxiety or grief. we have never seen a totally sane human being.”
― Robert Anton Wilson
|
MrBump
Third prize is you're fired
Registered: 10/01/02
Posts: 4,254
Loc: Where Art Meets Crime
Last seen: 4 months, 29 days
|
Re: suicide selfish?? [Re: dao727]
#8780783 - 08/16/08 04:30 AM (4 years, 9 months ago) |
|
|
one of my best friend's and roommate for 6 yrs hung himself in our attic 2 yrs ago. to this day I feel that he was being extremely selfish in his actions. I have to go on living with the memories of cutting him down. he had many many friends who miss him to this day. he deprived his friends and family of everything that is good about him. he is my friend, but a complete asshole.
depression is treatable. its universal imo, who doesnt get depressed? you OWE it to those who love you, and to those that you love, to work out your problems.
Life Is Hard, Get A Helmet!
--------------------
If it weren't for the bloody corpses, I wouldn't have any corpses at all.
There are two ways to get to the top of an oak tree: start climbing or sit on an acorn.
Are you a carrot, an egg, or a coffee bean?
|
Dystopia
unit - [s2dope] - v1.0.13
Registered: 03/24/00
Posts: 15,253
Loc: Danger Zone
|
Re: suicide selfish?? [Re: MrBump]
#8781044 - 08/16/08 07:43 AM (4 years, 9 months ago) |
|
|
We are all autonomous moral agents. We make our own choices. How selfish are any of you for judging other peoples' decisions?
The world revolves around YOUR pain and YOUR tears. Who's selfish now?
|
Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 79,899
Loc: underbelly
|
Re: suicide selfish?? [Re: MrBump]
#8781801 - 08/16/08 01:16 PM (4 years, 9 months ago) |
|
|
you OWE it to those who love you, and to those that you love, to work out your problems.
This is the crap I can't stand. It's the same as the government telling you, you have to be patriotic.
Each human owes nothing to another that is not given freely. Otherwise we are in bondage to each other. Most people only feel comfortable in bondage.
--------------------
"Hang on tightly, let go lightly" -anonymous
“under the present brutal and primitive conditions on this planet, every person you meet should be regarded as one of the walking wounded. we have never seen a man or woman not slightly deranged by either anxiety or grief. we have never seen a totally sane human being.”
― Robert Anton Wilson
|
LeftyBurnz
Mr. I Eat Butthole
Registered: 06/21/05
Posts: 23,590
Loc: The Wang
|
Re: suicide selfish?? [Re: Icelander]
#8790967 - 08/18/08 03:08 PM (4 years, 9 months ago) |
|
|
you dont owe anyone anything.
when it comes down to it, your life is in your hands. if you get to the point where you dont want to be here anymore, noone has the right to tell you that you cant leave. your life, your choice. i dont owe it to anyone to stay here.
--------------------
The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in Government."
~Thomas Jefferson
A free people ought not only to be armed and disciplined but they should have sufficient arms and ammunition to maintain a status of independence from any who might attempt to abuse them, which would include their own government.
~George Washington
|
numonkei
Back! From thedigestive tractof dave theiguana!
Registered: 04/12/06
Posts: 2,473
Loc: A Tree
Last seen: 8 days, 16 hours
|
Re: suicide selfish?? [Re: LeftyBurnz]
#8791154 - 08/18/08 03:57 PM (4 years, 9 months ago) |
|
|
When you foster a relationship of love, then commit suicide, whether or not it is selfish comes down solely to the intent of the deceased in the process of the suicide.
If someone is mentally ill, clinically depressed, then they are likely not responsible for the mental craving for their death, end of suffering, etc. That wouldn't be so selfish, even if it does hurt others, because it is an illness.
Otherwise sane folks DO kill themselves for selfish reasons. My best friend killed himself when I was sixteen, and did so simply because he didn't want to have to get a job/house/2.5kids American deal. No mental illness, simply cowardice and laziness. I think THAT was selfish, especially because it was immediately after making obligations to friends/family that would never be paid back.
Another good example. Killing yourself for fear of a 1-2 year term in the clink or a small (relatively), monetary debt; THAT'S usually going to be selfish. Especially with many close relations/children/ect. A year or two of your life in a bad situation is worth more than the mental wellbeing of all your children, friends, relations for likely the rest of THEIR lives?
It's situational. And since they've killed themselves, we likely can never REALLY know to the full extent the mindset during the suicide.
Note - I think the motivations for my friend's suicide were cowardice, but he was not cowardice. Was one of most courageous, off-the-wall, crazy sunuvabitch I've ever met. He killed himself by lighting himself on fire and breathing the fire into his lungs, dieing painfully five hours later. Compared to a gunshot blast or an intentional narcotic overdose, that's some pretty serious shit.
~Monk
| |
|
|
 |
|
I've decided to committ suicide
(  1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 all ) |
 Anonymous |
4,449 |
163 |
05/21/12 10:48 PM
by YouNeedMT | |
|
A Couple of Misunderstandings About Suicide.
( 1 2 all ) |
 Flop Johnson |
3,888 |
21 |
07/29/09 08:49 PM
by LayYouIn | |
|
How to respond to a suicidal person
( 1 2 3 4 5 all ) |
 tomk |
30,196 |
92 |
03/08/13 02:50 AM
by Grizzlysnizzly | |
 |
Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions?
( 1 2 3 4 5 all ) |
 Phishgrrl |
2,914 |
90 |
02/15/10 08:25 PM
by MagicHombre | |
 |
Best (Most painless) way to Commit Suicide?
( 1 2 3 4 ... 117 118 ) |
 MXNR |
2,644,649 |
2,344 |
05/22/13 12:56 PM
by Esekon Kelly | |
|
benzo + alcohol suicide guarantee
( 1 2 3 4 all ) |
 Mosis |
3,366 |
77 |
06/20/11 04:00 AM
by vandago | |
|
suicide is selfish but it's also selfish of other people for them to not want you to die... |
Anonymous |
2,196 |
19 |
01/27/11 03:26 PM
by mr.711 | |
 |
suicide
( 1 2 3 4 all ) |
Anonymous |
4,123 |
74 |
01/08/12 07:34 AM
by xFrockx |
|
|
You cannot start new topics / You cannot reply to topics
HTML is disabled / BBCode is enabled
Moderator: CherryBom, eris, boO, Gumby, ZippoZ, Newbie
12,759 topic views. 2 members, 19 guests and 0 web crawlers are browsing this forum.
[ Toggle Favorite | Print Topic ]
| | |
|
|
|
Images only 
Threaded
Previous
Index
Next
Edit 
Reply 
