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 Sev
Astropath
Registered: 06/06/03
Posts: 1,426
Loc: NY
Last seen: 8 years, 9 months
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Both suck. There needs to be a new paradigm.
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"Do we want the stars? We can have them. Can we borrow cups of fire from the sun? We can and must and light the world." --"On the Shoulders of Giants", Ray Bradbury
All of my posts are full of fiction and blatant lies.
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atomikfunksoldier
T'was born oftrue in the yearof the cock!
Registered: 04/07/03
Posts: 1,500
Loc: a human-infested anthill
Last seen: 9 years, 7 months
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 Re: Capitalism or Communism? Which is better?  [Re: Sev]
#1654839 - 06/22/03 11:52 PM (9 years, 10 months ago) |
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until you can provide a new paradigm, choose one or the other.
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enjoy the entertaining indentity i have constructed for you while you can.
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lucid
Jack's AlteredConsciousness
Registered: 03/29/03
Posts: 6,296
Loc: up on the bidet
Last seen: 2 months, 8 days
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>until you can provide a new paradigm, choose one or the other.
Dictator ! 
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"no-mind un-thinks no-thought..."
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PDU
travel kid vs.amerika
Registered: 12/04/02
Posts: 9,517
Loc: beautiful BC
Last seen: 16 hours, 20 minutes
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Re: Capitalism or Communism? Which is better? [Re: lucid]
#1654887 - 06/23/03 12:25 AM (9 years, 10 months ago) |
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How about freedom?
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GO OUTSIDE.
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lucid
Jack's AlteredConsciousness
Registered: 03/29/03
Posts: 6,296
Loc: up on the bidet
Last seen: 2 months, 8 days
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Re: Capitalism or Communism? Which is better? [Re: PDU]
#1654892 - 06/23/03 12:28 AM (9 years, 10 months ago) |
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>How about freedom?
hmmm... there's a novel idea...but not for the
plebians tho... much to dangerous...
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"no-mind un-thinks no-thought..."
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 Sclorch
Clyster
Registered: 07/13/99
Posts: 4,805
Loc: On the Brink of Madness
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 Re: Capitalism or Communism? Which is better? [Re: lucid]
#1654911 - 06/23/03 12:40 AM (9 years, 10 months ago) |
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This is politics. Wrong forum guy. 
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Note: In desperate need of a cure...
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lateralus
member
Registered: 01/29/03
Posts: 126
Last seen: 6 years, 1 month
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Re: Capitalism or Communism? Which is better? [Re: Sclorch]
#1654937 - 06/23/03 12:51 AM (9 years, 10 months ago) |
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Anarchy is the one and only system that ensures complete freedom. Anything else is unacceptable to me. If you are a person who believes in pure freedom/wants pure freedom, you are an anarchist, you just may not know it. You cannot have pure freedom under any 'system'.
That being said Communism is definately the better of the two. It is tried and true and almost never failed throughout history. Capitalism has failed repeatedly. In fact, it has failed everytime it has been attempted. I gues that means; 'we're next'.
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HagbardCeline
Student-Teacher-Student-Teacher
Registered: 05/10/03
Posts: 9,018
Loc: Overjoyed, at the bottom ...
Last seen: 12 hours, 7 minutes
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Re: Capitalism or Communism? Which is better? [Re: Sclorch]
#1654940 - 06/23/03 12:54 AM (9 years, 10 months ago) |
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I think both of the two systems form distinctly different societies, with equally different philoshopical views.
What you think is best says alot about you.
Can't it stay in here. 
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Understanding is near, don't do anything stupid!
All be well!!!
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HagbardCeline
Student-Teacher-Student-Teacher
Registered: 05/10/03
Posts: 9,018
Loc: Overjoyed, at the bottom ...
Last seen: 12 hours, 7 minutes
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Re: Capitalism or Communism? Which is better? [Re: lateralus]
#1654944 - 06/23/03 12:57 AM (9 years, 10 months ago) |
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When has communism succeeded?
And capitalism failed?
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Understanding is near, don't do anything stupid!
All be well!!!
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lucid
Jack's AlteredConsciousness
Registered: 03/29/03
Posts: 6,296
Loc: up on the bidet
Last seen: 2 months, 8 days
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 Re: Capitalism or Communism? Which is better? [Re: HagbardCeline]
#1654949 - 06/23/03 12:59 AM (9 years, 10 months ago) |
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>And capitalism failed?
just read the (as yet unpublished)
"Rise and Fall of the American Empire... 
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"no-mind un-thinks no-thought..."
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atomikfunksoldier
T'was born oftrue in the yearof the cock!
Registered: 04/07/03
Posts: 1,500
Loc: a human-infested anthill
Last seen: 9 years, 7 months
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Re: Capitalism or Communism? Which is better? [Re: lucid]
#1654988 - 06/23/03 01:16 AM (9 years, 10 months ago) |
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communism has never failed....interesting. i guess ill just pick up my history book and...oh...USSR, China, North Korea!
when has capitalism failed, let me check...oh EVERYWHERE CIRCA 1929.
how is anarchy complete freedom? are you free to live in peace? not if someone comes and robs you. yes yes yes.
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enjoy the entertaining indentity i have constructed for you while you can.
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Xlea321
Stranger
Registered: 02/26/01
Posts: 9,134
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Re: Capitalism or Communism? Which is better? [Re: HagbardCeline]
#1655052 - 06/23/03 01:47 AM (9 years, 10 months ago) |
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It isn't really a matter of which is better. The fundamental premise of corporate free market(rigged for the rich) capitalism is that resources are infinite and there to be exploited for short-term profit. The environment, peoples welfare (ie all the things that make life worth living) are all of no importance compared to short-term profits.
Since we live on a planet that isn't infinite, capitalism will destroy the planet sooner rather than later. All we can hope is that there's enough left for life on earth to survive by the time capitalism collapses.
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Don't worry, B. Caapi
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HagbardCeline
Student-Teacher-Student-Teacher
Registered: 05/10/03
Posts: 9,018
Loc: Overjoyed, at the bottom ...
Last seen: 12 hours, 7 minutes
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Re: Capitalism or Communism? Which is better? [Re: lucid]
#1655060 - 06/23/03 01:50 AM (9 years, 10 months ago) |
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It hasn't fallen. And what we have isn't capitalism. At least not in its true form. Many aspects of today's society are pure socialism.
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Understanding is near, don't do anything stupid!
All be well!!!
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lateralus
member
Registered: 01/29/03
Posts: 126
Last seen: 6 years, 1 month
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I only said that communism has a better track record... 'Its tried and true and almost never failed throughout history'. I dont personally agree with either capitalism or communism.
And I pose that yes, capitalism has failed. Already. Look at our current global situation. If you don't see that its failed, my opinion is: you're blind.
How is anarchy complete freedom? You dont ever have to answer to anybody except yourself. That is the definition of freedom.
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Kenny Bus
The enlightend
Registered: 10/11/02
Posts: 321
Loc: ontario
Last seen: 4 years, 3 months
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Re: Capitalism or Communism? Which is better? [Re: lateralus]
#1655100 - 06/23/03 02:16 AM (9 years, 10 months ago) |
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ok i'm no history buff so dont make fun of me but
we must have started out in a state of anarchy right?
although i think anarchy would be kool, it would never last
people find streanth in numbers, we need the rest of the pack to survive
with that in mind, capitalism doesnt work, the rich get richer, but still need the poor to survive, if everyone had they're way in a capitalist society nobody would do shit and we would die. its a game for power, enslaving our own, wasting our resources, making survival harder each day. if communism was done right the world would be a better place, just mt 2 cents
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KB
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atomikfunksoldier
T'was born oftrue in the yearof the cock!
Registered: 04/07/03
Posts: 1,500
Loc: a human-infested anthill
Last seen: 9 years, 7 months
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Re: Capitalism or Communism? Which is better? [Re: Kenny Bus]
#1655140 - 06/23/03 02:36 AM (9 years, 10 months ago) |
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"It isn't really a matter of which is better. The fundamental premise of corporate free market(rigged for the rich) capitalism is that resources are infinite and there to be exploited for short-term profit. The environment, peoples welfare (ie all the things that make life worth living) are all of no importance compared to short-term profits."
that is plain incorrect, you are ignoring the consumer-corporate relationship. corporations are the slaves of consumers, what ever consumers want, corporations do. if consumers are intelligent, educated and care about the environment, so will corporations. look at all the new marketing trends popping up nowadays that are directed towards eco-conscious consumers. thusly, capitalism is plastic, it changes as social consciousness changes.
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enjoy the entertaining indentity i have constructed for you while you can.
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Malachi
stereotype
Registered: 06/19/02
Posts: 1,294
Loc: Around Minneapolis.
Last seen: 3 years, 11 months
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Re: Capitalism or Communism? Which is better? [Re: HagbardCeline]
#1655268 - 06/23/03 04:01 AM (9 years, 10 months ago) |
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the right answer is always in the middle.
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The ultimate meaning of our being can only be fulfilled in the paradoxical leap beyond the tragic-demonic frustration. It is a leap from our side, but it is the self-surrendering presence of the Ground of Being from the other side.
- Paul Tillich
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atomikfunksoldier
T'was born oftrue in the yearof the cock!
Registered: 04/07/03
Posts: 1,500
Loc: a human-infested anthill
Last seen: 9 years, 7 months
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Re: Capitalism or Communism? Which is better? [Re: Malachi]
#1655296 - 06/23/03 04:12 AM (9 years, 10 months ago) |
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plastic. plastic like pro-tool robots. being disected by a giant mechanism designed to construct plastic re-dertimination generators.
plast
-----ic.
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enjoy the entertaining indentity i have constructed for you while you can.
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Anonymous
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Re: Capitalism or Communism? Which is better? [Re: HagbardCeline]
#1655692 - 06/23/03 09:23 AM (9 years, 10 months ago) |
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capitalism is good if you want freedom, socialism is good if you want equality.
communism, in which people are free to do whatever they want with their labor, money, and property, and voluntarily choose to share it amongst the community, following an ethic of 'from each according to his ability, to each according to his necessity', would be the best arrangement i think. in such a system, the government follows the same hands-off approach as in libertarianism, but instead of keeping property, people share everything (voluntarily).
whether a society (or parts of it) is libertarian or communist is not something determined by the government; it does the same in both 'systems'. it is the people that organize differently. i think it's far more likely for most people to keep their property instead of voluntarily sharing everything, so i don't think communism has much of a chance of ever existing on a wide scale.
there could be small voluntary communist communities within a larger libertarian nation however.
i'd like to see communism, but any system which counts on everyone do do something which they aren't obliged by ethics to do, without forcing them to do it, doesn't sound like it has much of a chance of existing on a wide scale.
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Xlea321
Stranger
Registered: 02/26/01
Posts: 9,134
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what ever consumers want, corporations do.
Maybe in terms of if consumers want Nike shoes with one swoosh rather than two swooshes.
For everything else coporations will care about short-term profit. If they can make tremendous profits by destroying the amazon rain forest it will be destroyed. If it is cheaper to dump toxic pollutants in the sea, that is where they will be dumped.
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Don't worry, B. Caapi
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