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 ALTERED.STATES
Biologist and NRG Tek head
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 Removing Trichoderma from Coco Coir? 
#16156197 - 04/29/12 06:39 PM (1 year, 23 days ago) |
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Hello,
I may not have access to pet stores that sell Coir bricks free of Trichoderma but I have seen a fair amount of Coco substrates bags but nearly all have added Trichoderma.
I would like to use a similar tek as Damion5050's Elementary Coir Tek.
Has anyone here run into similar problems or use coco substrates with trichoderma but do something like with a PC or pasteurizing it? I want to keep the coir's goodness but get rid of the trichoderma.
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shroomtastic89
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Keep your house and tools clean. I have never had a persistent problem with trich using that tek. Maybe a tub here or there...
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 EvilMushroom666
Heretic
Registered: 11/18/09
Posts: 10,096
Loc: Canada 
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If the coir has added trich for the purpose of growing plants your
best bet is to properly pasteurize your substrate prior to use:
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/15859454/fpart/1
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Doc_T
Random Dude
Registered: 03/06/09
Posts: 42,395
Loc: Colorado 
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Quote:
ALTERED.STATES said:
a fair amount of Coco substrates bags but nearly all have added Trichoderma.
Could you post a pic of where it says that on the bag?
I keep hearing about this but I've never seen it in real life, I want to know what to look for.
OTOH if you are just going off your tubs contaminating, be aware that early massive contamination = bad spawn.
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RPW
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Quote:
shroomtastic89 said:
Keep your house and tools clean. I have never had a persistent problem with trich using that tek. Maybe a tub here or there...
That won't do him any good. He's saying the coco he has access to has trichoderma added to it before it's packaged. Companies do this as a biocontrol agent.
Only one way to find out. Just get as small a bag as you can at first, and PC it. If it works on a small scale, it'll work on a larger scale.
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Chitwan And Treasure Coast, WBS to Coir in MSG - Updated 5/14
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/16139042
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Doc_T
Random Dude
Registered: 03/06/09
Posts: 42,395
Loc: Colorado
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 Re: Removing Trichoderma from Coco Coir? [Re: RPW]
#16156279 - 04/29/12 06:58 PM (1 year, 23 days ago) |
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Yeah, he's saying that. We're doubting it. 
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RPW
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Re: Removing Trichoderma from Coco Coir? [Re: Doc_T]
#16156302 - 04/29/12 07:03 PM (1 year, 23 days ago) |
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Quote:
Doc_T said:
Yeah, he's saying that. We're doubting it.
It wouldn't surprise me. I've seen trichoderma sold as a supplement for root disease control, so I don't see why they wouldn't sell it already mixed in with soil.
That's packaged trichoderma. My buddy has used it for one of his outdoor marijuana grows.
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Chitwan And Treasure Coast, WBS to Coir in MSG - Updated 5/14
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/16139042
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EvilMushroom666
Heretic
Registered: 11/18/09
Posts: 10,096
Loc: Canada
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Re: Removing Trichoderma from Coco Coir? [Re: Doc_T]
#16156307 - 04/29/12 07:04 PM (1 year, 23 days ago) |
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Doc_T
Random Dude
Registered: 03/06/09
Posts: 42,395
Loc: Colorado
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Re: Removing Trichoderma from Coco Coir? [Re: RPW]
#16156325 - 04/29/12 07:06 PM (1 year, 23 days ago) |
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I've simply never seen it. I've heard of it, never seen it.
I'd like OP to post a pic of what it says on the bag about it.
Because otherwise I'm going to conclude he's shooting LC and that's the contam vector.
...
Ok, EM posted a link to a website. Doesn't mean that's what's going on here.
And seriously, there's only one brand of coir available? Shop around a bit. Post pics first.
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You make it all possible. Doesn't it feel good?
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shroomtastic89
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Re: Removing Trichoderma from Coco Coir? [Re: Doc_T]
#16156369 - 04/29/12 07:16 PM (1 year, 23 days ago) |
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Lol i agree with doc... Even if it has trich added, and the sub is properly pasteurized then he should have no problems. But if it is such a big deal then why not just try a different brand?
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ALTERED.STATES
Biologist and NRG Tek head
Registered: 02/20/12
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Loc: Irish
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Re: Removing Trichoderma from Coco Coir? [Re: Doc_T]
#16156376 - 04/29/12 07:18 PM (1 year, 23 days ago) |
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Quote:
Doc_T said:
Yeah, he's saying that. We're doubting it.
I don't know why you are doubting it. Like others have said it is a bioagent. Seems some substrates contain trichoderma as a way to control other pathogens in the soil.
Plagron Cocos is a light 100% organic substrate enriched with Trichoderma
http://www.1st-hydroponics.co.uk/plagron-cocos-growing-medium/prod_3409.html
I saw it today. Just limited as to what I can get around here. 
Seems like Proper Pasteurization of Substrates is the way to go. I was just watching something like that on YouTube.
Edited by ALTERED.STATES (04/29/12 08:26 PM)
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LeopardMan
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Honestly I would buy some coir online. But if you can't, a proper pasteurization will solve your problems. You can even sterilize coir if you want to be 100% sure. IME pasteurizing is essential only when you are using manure (because you don't want to lose any beneficial microorganism in order to kill mold and bacteria). But I've found that coir works great even when sterilized in a PC
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ALTERED.STATES
Biologist and NRG Tek head
Registered: 02/20/12
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Re: Removing Trichoderma from Coco Coir? [Re: LeopardMan]
#16156424 - 04/29/12 07:26 PM (1 year, 23 days ago) |
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Quote:
LeopardMan said:
... But I've found that coir works great even when sterilized in a PC
That sounds good to me also
I would rather not be doing too many things online if I can. Only if I absolutely must but ty.
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LeopardMan
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Manure can be tricky but coir is child's play. Some people even use it right out of the package (they hydrate it and use it. no pasteurization, no sterilization). I never had a single coir tray contaminated with mold or bacteria. If you use a high spawn ratio, it's practically foolproof.
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Either you care, or you don't (Stanley Kubrick)
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ALTERED.STATES
Biologist and NRG Tek head
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Re: Removing Trichoderma from Coco Coir? [Re: LeopardMan]
#16156646 - 04/29/12 08:25 PM (1 year, 23 days ago) |
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Yeah it looks fairly simple. Just the fact that 'Trichoderma added' on the package was staring me in the face sort of made me want to ask more about it.
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cubes4cancer
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atleast you seen this "waning" before you got everything put together.let us know how things turn out with it.
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Doc_T
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Re: Removing Trichoderma from Coco Coir? [Re: cubes4cancer]
#16156782 - 04/29/12 09:01 PM (1 year, 23 days ago) |
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Super cool info in this thread. 
If the stuff is shredded and dry in the bag, I'd bake it.
Pasteurization would be ok if done right, but baking at 325F for an hour would be a sure thing.
Just my opinion, I certainly haven't tried it. Honestly if this was all I could find I'd consider other substrates such has manure and straw.
Please please please post back what you try and how it works out!
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36fuckin5
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Re: Removing Trichoderma from Coco Coir? [Re: Doc_T]
#16157357 - 04/29/12 10:57 PM (1 year, 23 days ago) |
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While proper pasteurization should take care of it, I still wouldn't chance starting with something that tells you that it includes a contaminant. If just a few spores survive, it can wreck the whole grow. Also, you're likely gonna have that bag of coir lying around (prolly won't use the whole thing in one go) so you'll have Trich spores floating around in your air.
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tripdawg420
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Re: Removing Trichoderma from Coco Coir? [Re: 36fuckin5]
#16157440 - 04/29/12 11:13 PM (1 year, 23 days ago) |
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RogerRabbit
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I'd suggest sterilizing the coir in the pressure cooker. That should take care of the trich with no doubts about a surviving spore, if there's even trich spores added. Actually, I suspect they use live mycelium, which can be dried and then return to life when moistened.
RR
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deucedbi9
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Quote:
ALTERED.STATES said:
Yeah it looks fairly simple. Just the fact that 'Trichoderma added' on the package was staring me in the face sort of made me want to ask more about it.
Though I've never read "Trichoderma added" on any pack I bought, there was one brand ,forget which one, that, as I sliced through the brick, had definite green penny sized powdery discs incorporated throughout the brick. Was this Trichoderma. I don't know.
As I had already used some of this in an earlier grow, using RR's pasteurise in a jar method,link without problem, I continued using it.
E-mailed the manufacturer 'Zoo med laboratories inc' today for confirmation.
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Cheap coir in the UK from £0.88p (inc p+p) per brick. Link
whether low pressure sucks or high pressure blows...
it's a bugger to cycle in
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ALTERED.STATES
Biologist and NRG Tek head
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Re: Removing Trichoderma from Coco Coir? [Re: RogerRabbit]
#16158573 - 04/30/12 04:35 AM (1 year, 23 days ago) |
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Quote:
RogerRabbit said:
Actually, I suspect they use live mycelium, which can be dried and then return to life when moistened.
RR
... or couldn't be arsed to pasteurize the substrate and are selling what is naturally occuring contamination as a good thing for plant lovers. 
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deucedbi9
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Re: Removing Trichoderma from Coco Coir? [Re: deucedbi9]
#16192766 - 05/07/12 12:49 AM (1 year, 16 days ago) |
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Quote:
deucedbi9 said:
Quote:
ALTERED.STATES said:
Yeah it looks fairly simple. Just the fact that 'Trichoderma added' on the package was staring me in the face sort of made me want to ask more about it.
Though I've never read "Trichoderma added" on any pack I bought, there was one brand ,forget which one, that, as I sliced through the brick, had definite green penny sized powdery discs incorporated throughout the brick. Was this Trichoderma. I don't know.
As I had already used some of this in an earlier grow, using RR's pasteurise in a jar method,link without problem, I continued using it.
E-mailed the manufacturer 'Zoo med laboratories inc' today for confirmation.
Bump.
Just discovered a reply (30/4)from the manufacturers of "eco earth" coir:
"We do not add anything outside of coconut husk to this product. I do not know what this green material could be."
They even offered to send me a replacement brick if I could send them a picture/sample of the 'green disc' described for their technicians to examine.
So, I guess it was another brand that I bought that was the "green disc" offender.
Before I forget. Found a cheap supplier in the UK. If you buy 20+ bricks £0.88p each, DELIVERY AND VAT INCLUDED.
Link
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Cheap coir in the UK from £0.88p (inc p+p) per brick. Link
whether low pressure sucks or high pressure blows...
it's a bugger to cycle in
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ALTERED.STATES
Biologist and NRG Tek head
Registered: 02/20/12
Posts: 356
Loc: Irish
Last seen: 1 month, 12 days
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Re: Removing Trichoderma from Coco Coir? [Re: deucedbi9]
#16193602 - 05/07/12 07:30 AM (1 year, 16 days ago) |
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Yes. I discovered a pet shop last week with them but will still do the bag one.
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Doc_T
Random Dude
Registered: 03/06/09
Posts: 42,395
Loc: Colorado
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Re: Removing Trichoderma from Coco Coir? [Re: deucedbi9]
#16193680 - 05/07/12 08:47 AM (1 year, 16 days ago) |
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Quote:
deucedbi9 said:
If you buy 20+ bricks £0.88p each, DELIVERY AND VAT INCLUDED.
Link
Dang!
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