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 Ped
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What specifically were you addicted to? What were you getting out of doing meditation?
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White Beard
Registered: 08/13/11
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 Re: Should I try meditation?  [Re: Ped]
#15444454 - 11/30/11 01:33 PM (1 year, 5 months ago) |
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I was addicted to the feeling that I'm going to somewhere, progressing through some spiritual path, and if I gave up meditation, then this wouldn't be true anymore. So, I got stuck in this addiction where meditation was no longer helping me out. In the past it did help for me to let go, but then I mistook the finger pointing at the moon for the moon. I equated meditation to happiness, and I couldn't find any value in anything I did unless it pertained to meditation, or spiritual development. So I felt shitty when I wasn't meditating, and then alright when meditating. I was like my fix.
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White Beard
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Re: Should I try meditation? [Re: Ped]
#15444507 - 11/30/11 01:46 PM (1 year, 5 months ago) |
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I think the problem is that it tries to make a big deal over nothing. When I was young I use to just sit in the bath for an hour or two and just let my thoughts wonder. I didn't have to make a job about it.
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White Beard
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Oh! I think I understand something. Okay, how can anyone possibly teach me to meditate and to be myself? That's like teaching a duck how to be a duck. And then you got the duck convinced it's a rabbit, and it has to figure out how to be a duck so it can go swimming in the beautiful lake. But from the start the duck was just a duck, it could be nothing other than just a duck.
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 LucyLove
On A Quest For Glory
Registered: 05/15/11
Posts: 5,115
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Ped, I'm sorry but I think I'm going to have to disagree with you. From what my relative has told me, those Buddhists monks were some of the most peaceful and happy human beings he has ever met.
I also forget to mention I suffer from ADHD, so maybe meditation could help me focus and possibility not have such a scattered mind. My relative described his first meditation OBE as bad and good spirits were flying through him, saying things he could not understand, almost as if they were mocking him. After that he sleep great and it seemed to cure all of his illness's and he came back to the temple and tried it again, but he told me that time it was much different, he could not describe it to me.
I must also point something out. My relative went to a seminar (about chakra, sense of well-being, and a lot of other points). A few thousand people were seated and the speaker began to say something along these lines: "I am going to send a wave of energy through the crowd, when you feel this energy, I would like you to raise your hand. I will not tell you when I release this energy, but you will definitely know." He started making movements with his hands and chanting quietly, all of the sudden the first row of the crowd (people were seated) raise there hand, and then the next row, until the energy had made its way to the top of the seats. That amazed EVERYONE at the seminar.
I find that so fascinating, my relative said he could feel these "energies" when he had meditated as well.
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"Either way my morning will be the same. It is just I don't want to ruin my brain"
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White Beard
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Re: Should I try meditation? [Re: LucyLove]
#15444556 - 11/30/11 01:55 PM (1 year, 5 months ago) |
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To the Op,
If you have to ask to meditate, then you shouldn't meditate. If your body needed meditate, it would just do it.
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Angel_Above
Nobody
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Lol white beard...
So if someone's body is being damaged severely due to excessive daily drinking, the body itself would shut off the mind's thoughts from controlling what the body does?
Doubt it. There's lot of drug addicts, mayne. The body won't just do what it needs to do. You're the fucking pilot of this weird ass machine we all share.
EDIT:
This forum should be about open-mindedness and not throwing out a method by which many people claim to be in peaceful states more often. This isn't meant to be a subforum of arguments, but that's all it's turning into.
Edited by Angel_Above (11/30/11 02:02 PM)
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Ped
Circumspect
Registered: 08/31/99
Posts: 2,357
Loc: Canada
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>> I was addicted to the feeling that I'm going to somewhere, progressing through some spiritual path, and if I gave up meditation, then this wouldn't be true anymore.
This can happen with such subtlety that it can carry on for years, or even whole lifetimes. There are stories about lifelong abbots who, on their deathbeds, confessed with wide eyes that they had squandered their entire lives on nothing more than a gigantic mental construct called "practice".
It is good that this was so pronounced for you that it was easy to identify. It's good that it was so solid as to be brittle and prone to fracture.
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LucyLove
On A Quest For Glory
Registered: 05/15/11
Posts: 5,115
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Quote:
White Beard said:
To the Op,
If you have to ask to meditate, then you shouldn't meditate. If your body needed meditate, it would just do it.
Well I ask because I know there are a lot of members on this forum who could give me some information as to whether meditation would help some of my problems. And after surfing the internet a bit, I can see that it COULD help.
My body does not need meditation, but it might want it. I think I am going to attempt to meditate tonight.
Quote:
Angel_Above said:
This forum should be about open-mindedness and not throwing out a method by which many people claim to be in peaceful states more often. This isn't meant to be a subforum of arguments, but that's all it's turning into.
I agree 
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"Either way my morning will be the same. It is just I don't want to ruin my brain"
Edited by LucyLove (11/30/11 02:07 PM)
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White Beard
Registered: 08/13/11
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No pilot.
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White Beard
Registered: 08/13/11
Posts: 5,173
Loc:
Last seen: 22 hours, 58 minutes
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Re: Should I try meditation? [Re: Ped]
#15444612 - 11/30/11 02:08 PM (1 year, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Ped said:
>> I was addicted to the feeling that I'm going to somewhere, progressing through some spiritual path, and if I gave up meditation, then this wouldn't be true anymore.
This can happen with such subtlety that it can carry on for years, or even whole lifetimes. There are stories about lifelong abbots who, on their deathbeds, confessed with wide eyes that they had squandered their entire lives on nothing more than a gigantic mental construct called "practice".
It is good that this was so pronounced for you that it was easy to identify. It's good that it was so solid as to be brittle and prone to fracture.
Hm. Yes.
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bigmike7104
Stranger
Registered: 07/12/10
Posts: 1,395
Loc: USA 
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Quote:
From what my relative has told me, those Buddhists monks were some of the most peaceful and happy human beings he has ever met.
i don't doubt at all they are. but, there goal in going to meditation isn't peace and happiness, rather it's just being with the present moment and all that entails which usually results in the side effect of peace and happiness.
the difference is important though, in that it's chasing happiness versus letting happiness come or go on it's own.
also i'd like to add many people look at meditation as something to help them relax when really it's practice for a way of living (living more in the moment and accepting what is).
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Over thinking, over analyzing separates the body from the mind
Withering my intuition, missing opportunities and I must
Feed my will to feel my moment drawing way outside the lines
Edited by bigmike7104 (11/30/11 02:15 PM)
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LucyLove
On A Quest For Glory
Registered: 05/15/11
Posts: 5,115
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I would say a partial pilot. The mind and body are already "programmed" to know what to do. Prepare for the best, worst, any scenario. But it's HOW the person perceives these scenarios is who we act on them.
I don't know if that sounds right... 
Quote:
bigmike7104 said:
Quote:
From what my relative has told me, those Buddhists monks were some of the most peaceful and happy human beings he has ever met.
i don't doubt at all they are. but, there goal in going to meditation isn't peace and happiness, rather it's just being with the present moment and all that entails which usually results in the side effect of peace and happiness.
the difference is important though, in that it's chasing happiness versus letting happiness come on it's own.
Yes! You pulled the words right out of my brain. 
But sometimes happiness can run away, so you must find it.
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"Either way my morning will be the same. It is just I don't want to ruin my brain"
Edited by LucyLove (11/30/11 02:11 PM)
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Angel_Above
Nobody
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What a wonderful, insightful post...
Your body does not move on it's own. It does not seek what is best for "it"
At least discuss this... You're one of the against meditation fanboys here, you're exactly who I wanted to discuss this with.
Are you saying the body is autonomous?
Because when i eat food I don't "think" to eat some pringles and my body overrides that and chooses to eat lettuce. it just don't work like that -.-
I think to eat the pringles, command my hand to the package, pop the top, and pour and gobble the fuckers.
This all being my doing. Not the doing of my autonomous body as I observe it.
Seriously though, what are you getting at?
EDIT: bigmike: are you saying the monks are the ones chasing the happiness or that their peace within the moment brings about peace within their expression?
Couldn't quite get that part.
Edited by Angel_Above (11/30/11 02:12 PM)
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White Beard
Registered: 08/13/11
Posts: 5,173
Loc:
Last seen: 22 hours, 58 minutes
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Quote:
bigmike7104 said:
Quote:
From what my relative has told me, those Buddhists monks were some of the most peaceful and happy human beings he has ever met.
i don't doubt at all they are. but, there goal in going to meditation isn't peace and happiness, rather it's just being with the present moment and all that entails which usually results in the side effect of peace and happiness.
the difference is important though, in that it's chasing happiness versus letting happiness come on it's own.
Thank you.
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Angel_Above
Nobody
Registered: 09/25/08
Posts: 4,820
Last seen: 5 days, 1 hour
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Quote:
White Beard said:
Quote:
bigmike7104 said:
Quote:
From what my relative has told me, those Buddhists monks were some of the most peaceful and happy human beings he has ever met.
i don't doubt at all they are. but, there goal in going to meditation isn't peace and happiness, rather it's just being with the present moment and all that entails which usually results in the side effect of peace and happiness.
the difference is important though, in that it's chasing happiness versus letting happiness come on it's own.
Thank you.
Are you just trying to get your post stats up?
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White Beard
Registered: 08/13/11
Posts: 5,173
Loc:
Last seen: 22 hours, 58 minutes
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Quote:
Angel_Above said:
What a wonderful, insightful post...
Your body does not move on it's own. It does not seek what is best for "it"
At least discuss this... You're one of the against meditation fanboys here, you're exactly who I wanted to discuss this with.
Are you saying the body is autonomous?
Because when i eat food I don't "think" to eat some pringles and my body overrides that and chooses to eat lettuce. it just don't work like that -.-
I think to eat the pringles, command my hand to the package, pop the top, and pour and gobble the fuckers.
This all being my doing. Not the doing of my autonomous body as I observe it.
Seriously though, what are you getting at?
EDIT: bigmike: are you saying the monks are the ones chasing the happiness or that their peace within the moment brings about peace within their expression?
Couldn't quite get that part.
Aren't the mind and the body connected? The body thinks, I need some food, then gets it. There's no 3rd entity. The body, YOU, and the mind, and you're like some runner boy between the two. How could that even be possible??? It's just silliness I tell you some of the silliness I believe in! Thank you for that.
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Ped
Circumspect
Registered: 08/31/99
Posts: 2,357
Loc: Canada
Last seen: 6 hours, 8 minutes
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>> This forum should be about open-mindedness and not throwing out a method by which many people claim to be in peaceful states more often. This isn't meant to be a subforum of arguments, but that's all it's turning into.
That's what happens when attachments form to spiritual practices or outlooks. It is probably a waste of energy to make a declaration about what this forum should or should not be about, though, as it will always be about what contributions people make to it. That's all it can ever be about. The best we can aspire toward is to continually make the best contributions we can, to trust that others are making the best contributions they can; to live our own truth with conviction, and to discover that truth by remaining steady as we witness of other's convictions. Or, in a headline: have faith and be faithful.
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bigmike7104
Stranger
Registered: 07/12/10
Posts: 1,395
Loc: USA
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Quote:
EDIT: bigmike: are you saying the monks are the ones chasing the happiness or that their peace within the moment brings about peace within their expression?
Couldn't quite get that part.
the second one
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Over thinking, over analyzing separates the body from the mind
Withering my intuition, missing opportunities and I must
Feed my will to feel my moment drawing way outside the lines
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Angel_Above
Nobody
Registered: 09/25/08
Posts: 4,820
Last seen: 5 days, 1 hour
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Yeah they're connected and what are you getting at with that "you" part?
I never claimed to be a me or a you or any of that.
You said the body will do what it wants. it doesn't. They work together (as you pointed out)
Or one overrides the other.
I see this going nowhere.
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