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 random_wanderer
Registered: 01/04/11
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 Do you think it is right to self induce spiritual/birth/death experiences with the use of drugs? 
#13840957 - 01/24/11 09:56 AM (2 years, 3 months ago) |
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I'd love to do DMT, it sounds intense and in some ways helpful but something just tells me not to so i havnt.
I think my question is a particularly important one to be asking for those who take their spiritual journey seriously, but i do not mean it rhetorically, i just dont know.
What might the spiritual repercussions be? ...of forcing states of mind upon your experience that many mystics devote years of their lives to cultivate.
Any thoughts?
Is it right to self induce birth/death/spiritual experiences with the use of drugs?
I am not talking about whether or not it works, undoubtedly, from my own experiences, and all the accounts written on here, drugs can open us to a different sense of reality that might feel as though it facilitates our spiritual growth...but does it?...in the (multiple incarnations) long term?
I know that taking certain plant substances is part of the culture of many shamanic practices. But then, how can these substances have an effect on them if they are enlightened and in union with the Great Spirit? Ram Dass gives an anecdote of when he gave his guru a large dose of acid to see what would happen, and verily, it had no effect on him at all. Might this point that shamans perception is still influenced by drugs prove that they might not be as spiritually advanced as gurus such as the one Ram Dass mentions?
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 Olympus Mons
esprit de l'univers
Registered: 09/15/09
Posts: 5,770
Loc: ∞
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 Re: Do you think it is right to self induce spiritual/birth/death experiences with the use of drugs? [Re: random_wanderer]  1
#13840967 - 01/24/11 10:03 AM (2 years, 3 months ago) |
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why wouldnt it be right? shaman are some of the most spiritually rich beings in our world. I think that different keys open different doors, all of which are accessible through natural means. Drugs are a slippery slope, they give you a taste of the potential that you possess but can also lead you into a labyrinth of confusion. I dont think there's anything wrong with using them to get started, i know that without the use of weed i wouldnt have started on this journey as early if i ever started at all
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I close my eyes and seize it
I clench my fists and beat it
I light my torch and burn it
I am the beast I worship....
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Envix
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Re: Do you think it is right to self induce spiritual/birth/death experiences with the use of drugs? [Re: Olympus Mons] 1
#13841022 - 01/24/11 10:29 AM (2 years, 3 months ago) |
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whether you choose to do DMT or you choose not to, it will be the right choice
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Tony
Stranger
Registered: 09/25/09
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Re: Do you think it is right to self induce spiritual/birth/death experiences with the use of drugs? [Re: random_wanderer] 1
#13841086 - 01/24/11 10:49 AM (2 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
shaman are some of the most spiritually rich beings in our world.
In my experience shamans can also be egocentric and business oriented. That's not to say that they can't at the same time possess psychic abilities that normal people don't.
Personally I would take ayahuasca, mushrooms and cacti any time, if only because they bring the right kind of discomfort.
Edited by Tony (01/24/11 10:49 AM)
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bigmike7104
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Registered: 07/12/10
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Loc: USA 
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Re: Do you think it is right to self induce spiritual/birth/death experiences with the use of drugs? [Re: Tony] 1
#13841432 - 01/24/11 12:38 PM (2 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
he gave his guru a large dose of acid to see what would happen, and verily, it had no effect on him at all
maybe it was bunk acid or it wasn't true? i don't see why it wouldn't work unless chemicals can't affect his brain which is hard to believe.
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Over thinking, over analyzing separates the body from the mind
Withering my intuition, missing opportunities and I must
Feed my will to feel my moment drawing way outside the lines
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bugsonwheels2
tarzan
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Re: Do you think it is right to self induce spiritual/birth/death experiences with the use of drugs? [Re: random_wanderer] 1
#13841455 - 01/24/11 12:44 PM (2 years, 3 months ago) |
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if you allow them to teach, and almost silently observe then maybe? in love craft ways they can be used to ieinlighten communication, maybe? how often the user uses often depicts in retrospect the knowledge one can receive. the trick is maybe taking then this iformation, informatino and installing it as difference throughout the day.
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In order to form a more perfect union'
learn to trade.
raw foods. no smoke. vegan[gradient:#,#][/gradient]
"Why work on something I already know is happening?"
for some Mush Room, wiggle room free inside
Happiness and Peace come naturally to me.
Health and prosperity.
Be peace now
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Poid
deBunker
Registered: 02/04/08
Posts: 40,361
Loc: SF Bay Area
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Re: Do you think it is right to self induce spiritual/birth/death experiences with the use of drugs? [Re: Envix] 1
#13841471 - 01/24/11 12:48 PM (2 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Envix said:
whether you choose to do DMT or you choose not to, it will be the right choice
I disagree.
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Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. -- Bob Dylan   fireworks_god said:It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.
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Envix
x+x+x+x+x+
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Re: Do you think it is right to self induce spiritual/birth/death experiences with the use of drugs? [Re: Poid] 1
#13841566 - 01/24/11 01:20 PM (2 years, 3 months ago) |
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why have u had a bad experience w/ DMT?
that doesnt mean it was wrong that u did it. you may choose to do something that you'll regret later but it was still a good choice because now you know what you don't want
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Poid
deBunker
Registered: 02/04/08
Posts: 40,361
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Re: Do you think it is right to self induce spiritual/birth/death experiences with the use of drugs? [Re: Envix] 1
#13841718 - 01/24/11 01:56 PM (2 years, 3 months ago) |
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No, I had a great experience with it, I just think everyone should try it. 
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Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. -- Bob Dylanfireworks_god said:It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.
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squintsbasoon
yogi/tracker
Registered: 01/12/11
Posts: 26
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Re: Do you think it is right to self induce spiritual/birth/death experiences with the use of drugs? [Re: random_wanderer] 1
#13841769 - 01/24/11 02:04 PM (2 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
random_wanderer said:
I'd love to do DMT, it sounds intense and in some ways helpful but something just tells me not to so i havnt.
I think my question is a particularly important one to be asking for those who take their spiritual journey seriously, but i do not mean it rhetorically, i just dont know.
What might the spiritual repercussions be? ...of forcing states of mind upon your experience that many mystics devote years of their lives to cultivate.
Any thoughts?
Is it right to self induce birth/death/spiritual experiences with the use of drugs?
I am not talking about whether or not it works, undoubtedly, from my own experiences, and all the accounts written on here, drugs can open us to a different sense of reality that might feel as though it facilitates our spiritual growth...but does it?...in the (multiple incarnations) long term?
I know that taking certain plant substances is part of the culture of many shamanic practices. But then, how can these substances have an effect on them if they are enlightened and in union with the Great Spirit? Ram Dass gives an anecdote of when he gave his guru a large dose of acid to see what would happen, and verily, it had no effect on him at all. Might this point that shamans perception is still influenced by drugs prove that they might not be as spiritually advanced as gurus such as the one Ram Dass mentions?
evry time i ingest any substance i do my best to repect it and for the most part i get it back. dmt is very much like this. wether what you learn can be applied is up to you. ganesh baba says " once a psycadelic always a psycadelic" if youve already taken the red pill then there is no going back. if your already a psycadelic then for the most part, small dose trips are like a reminder. higher does are for deeper explorations of your own awareness, and thats hard to compare to omeone elses
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"To teach yourself can sometimes be the most frightening task of all, but whats more frightening is to think of a man without knowledge, or experience." -Don Juan Matus
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The Chronic
Registered: 05/08/04
Posts: 12,002
Loc:
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Re: Do you think it is right to self induce spiritual/birth/death experiences with the use of drugs? [Re: random_wanderer] 1
#13841893 - 01/24/11 02:38 PM (2 years, 3 months ago) |
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I definitely don't consider smoking DMT a usable tool, taking mushrooms & meditating i would but DMT is just too raw for that, it's more for people that want to see crazy shit & have their mind blown, i do consider it purifying but its way too chaotic to really be usable imo.
Imagine how chewing coca leaves could be quite pleasant, but then consider doing a fat line of cocaine, quite different.
These pure extracts are super potent & powerful.
To be honest i couldn't say if DMT has helped or hindered me, in the afterglow im 100% convinced that its purifying but i still can't say if its done me good or bad, especially as its such a pure extracted form of it so hardly 'natural' to smoke it IMO
The flashbacks with DMT are much more intense than mushroom flashbacks aswell, they can be full on & really mess with your sleeping cycles (DMT or one of its analogues is naturally released when we wake up/fall asleep so smoking it can mess with that quite noticebly in some people, this isn't a scientific fact but i'm certain of it from my own experience)
If you want something to induce a death experience then a heroic dose of mushrooms in pitch black darkness should do it 
5-MeO-DMT is supposed to be much more of a death experience compared to the more common nnDMT, i haven't taken a big dose of it yet but in my limited experience it feels more familiar & 'endogenous' than the sheer alieness of nnDMT at high doses
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bongobongo4
cj
Registered: 11/02/10
Posts: 30
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Re: Do you think it is right to self induce spiritual/birth/death experiences with the use of drugs? [Re: The Chronic] 1
#13841979 - 01/24/11 02:55 PM (2 years, 3 months ago) |
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i beleive if your learning something from these different journeys and encounters then its beneficial to you, if you can grasp onto the beauty of it then i dont thing there is anything wrong with it, now abusing it would not be good, thats just creating bad karma, i have had positive and negative psychedelic experiences, but ive learned from each, ive taken something with me
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The Chronic
Registered: 05/08/04
Posts: 12,002
Loc:
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Re: Do you think it is right to self induce spiritual/birth/death experiences with the use of drugs? [Re: bongobongo4] 1
#13841990 - 01/24/11 02:57 PM (2 years, 3 months ago) |
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If you choose to do it (and i do) then i think that's fine, but i would never recommend someone that asks me to smoke DMT
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Poid
deBunker
Registered: 02/04/08
Posts: 40,361
Loc: SF Bay Area
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Re: Do you think it is right to self induce spiritual/birth/death experiences with the use of drugs? [Re: The Chronic] 1
#13842020 - 01/24/11 03:03 PM (2 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
The Chronic said:
...i would never recommend someone that asks me to smoke DMT
Why not?
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Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. -- Bob Dylanfireworks_god said:It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.
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The Chronic
Registered: 05/08/04
Posts: 12,002
Loc:
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Re: Do you think it is right to self induce spiritual/birth/death experiences with the use of drugs? [Re: Poid] 1
#13842038 - 01/24/11 03:07 PM (2 years, 3 months ago) |
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Just because its so powerful & people generally don't know how to respect something so powerful, myself included
When it comes to psilocybin i would dose the entire globe if i could, i can't wait to take mushrooms again
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Poid
deBunker
Registered: 02/04/08
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Re: Do you think it is right to self induce spiritual/birth/death experiences with the use of drugs? [Re: The Chronic]
#13842873 - 01/24/11 05:47 PM (2 years, 3 months ago) |
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Mushrooms are scarier to me than DMT was. 
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Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. -- Bob Dylanfireworks_god said:It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.
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The Chronic
Registered: 05/08/04
Posts: 12,002
Loc:
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Re: Do you think it is right to self induce spiritual/birth/death experiences with the use of drugs? [Re: Poid] 2
#13842885 - 01/24/11 05:48 PM (2 years, 3 months ago) |
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'if you don't think that you took too much then you didn't take enough' 
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c0sm0nautt
Registered: 05/19/08
Posts: 10,027
Loc: NY
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Re: Do you think it is right to self induce spiritual/birth/death experiences with the use of drugs? [Re: Poid] 1
#13842959 - 01/24/11 06:02 PM (2 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Poid said:
Mushrooms are scarier to me than DMT was.
How so? Was DMT too quick to get scared over?
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The intuitive mind is a sacred gift, and the rational mind is a faithful servant. We have created a society that honors the servant, and has forgotten the gift. - Albert Einstein
    
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Envix
x+x+x+x+x+
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Re: Do you think it is right to self induce spiritual/birth/death experiences with the use of drugs? [Re: c0sm0nautt] 1
#13843008 - 01/24/11 06:11 PM (2 years, 3 months ago) |
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dmt @ peak of dxm is pretty scarry.. i did that in a dark room in silence w/ no light except a candle flame it seemed to last for eternity.. i could see my whole life up to that point layed out in front of me like a pandimensional film strip
dmt @ peakof mescaline is super snazzy you go to machine land and ride the roller coaster @ tjhe theme park they have there
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Poid
deBunker
Registered: 02/04/08
Posts: 40,361
Loc: SF Bay Area
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Re: Do you think it is right to self induce spiritual/birth/death experiences with the use of drugs? [Re: c0sm0nautt] 1
#13843043 - 01/24/11 06:18 PM (2 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
c0sm0nautt said:
Quote:
Poid said:
Mushrooms are scarier to me than DMT was.
How so? Was DMT too quick to get scared over?
I s'pose; also, mushrooms give me a really uncomfortable feeling during the come-up.
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Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. -- Bob Dylanfireworks_god said:It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.
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