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 Mrbook7
Stranger
Registered: 04/06/08
Posts: 24
Last seen: 1 year, 7 months
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 Riding the debt wave to the grave VS. getting out now 
#12924406 - 07/20/10 03:02 PM (2 years, 9 months ago) |
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So when I post on Shroomery I usually like to make it long and drawn out, just a heads up.
I've been lurking on these forums for a couple years posting every once in a while about my trips or spiritual thoughts. This is the first time I've browsed Money Matters although thanks to WS's links I've been a fan of Money As Debt videos and the like.
I want to ask those who are willing to listen a (complex) question about my future decisions concerning my finances. Personal Background: I'm 24 years old, graduated with a Bachelors in Mathematics last December, and I have $23,000 in student debt along with $9,300 in credit card debt (oh and $1,400 I owe my college). For 5 and a half years I worked cash jobs here and there while I lived off of my credit cards. I also foolishly made purchases of things like a new computer, new TV, new bass guitar (and now my friends don't even want to start a band anymore, can you believe them :P). My current work situation is a part-time mortgage broker where I lose a little more of myself and my scruples every day I go in. This is the only job I could find since I graduated because my school put a hold on my account preventing me from using my records as proof of graduation. I gross $800 a month from this job, and it costs $150 a month in gas to get there (it's far).
LUCKILY, my girlfriend and I were able to live in her mother's house these past 7 months rent free. Not because we moved back home but because this house is being foreclosed in 30 days. It wasn't worth $1,100 a month to stay here. We have some savings that we were going to try and buy a house with, but after a lot of frustration we have given up and decided that an apartment is perfectly fine, again.
So finally my question. Is it a good idea to do the following? I'm going to consolidate my credit card debt with my largest credit card and also my bank. Then I plan on using the open space on my cards to pay off what I owe the school. I also plan on just not paying off this credit card debt and hording my money at home until I can settle. Because this will ruin my only minimal credit score, I also plan on not paying the private student loan ($6,700) to the same bank with which I'm consolidating. Honestly it makes me laugh, does that make me a bad person? Then to top it all off I'm going to quit my job. I feel that associating myself with the people that work there makes me a worse person. I'll gladly go back to ditch digging for less money just because the work "let's me sleep at night", to turn a phrase.
So was all of that a good idea? I mean it's what I plan to do so it's already set in motion but I do value input. Then I collect and analyze all your data and make an educated decision.
[The idealistic me wants to just go on a buying spree before I stop paying, just to twist the knife a little deeper as I forever give up my "right" to have debt.]
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Journal entries cover my grow attempts.
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Greenvalley
PRS
Registered: 06/16/10
Posts: 2,005
Loc: Why not?
Last seen: 1 day, 21 hours
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Re: Riding the debt wave to the grave VS. getting out now [Re: Mrbook7]
#12924455 - 07/20/10 03:11 PM (2 years, 9 months ago) |
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Go for it
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I am looking for land. 5-20 acres for 10-20,000. Can you help? do you know of any land for sale? do you have some for sale? Would you like to help and or be part of this? I want to develop it into a permaculture food forest. Any help would be much appreciated. 
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Stonehenge
enthusiast
Registered: 06/20/04
Posts: 3,778
Loc: S.E.
Last seen: 1 hour, 33 minutes
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Re: Riding the debt wave to the grave VS. getting out now [Re: Greenvalley]
#12924561 - 07/20/10 03:30 PM (2 years, 9 months ago) |
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Student loans are never written off. They survive bankruptcy even. The govt will hound you to your grave over that according to what i've heard.
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“A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship.” (attributed to Alexis de Tocqueville political philosopher Circa 1835)
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Mrbook7
Stranger
Registered: 04/06/08
Posts: 24
Last seen: 1 year, 7 months
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Re: Riding the debt wave to the grave VS. getting out now [Re: Stonehenge]
#12924722 - 07/20/10 03:51 PM (2 years, 9 months ago) |
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Yeah I wasn't going to stop paying the federal student loans yet... I just applied for a reduction in my monthly payment to them so we'll see how that works out. Otherwise I can just go to school the rest of my life.
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Journal entries cover my grow attempts.
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 ArmFromTheAbyss
Old Hand
Registered: 10/09/02
Posts: 1,351
Loc: Down here in Babylon
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Re: Riding the debt wave to the grave VS. getting out now [Re: Mrbook7]
#12925875 - 07/20/10 07:06 PM (2 years, 9 months ago) |
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Let me get this straight:
Your plan is to pay off your student loans with credit cards and then stop making payments? You do realize that the lower your credit score, the higher your interest will go right? If you have a degree in math, you should probably try really hard to find a decent job and pay off all your debt. Cut up the cards.
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"The man who knows something knows that he knows nothing at all" -Badu
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Mrbook7
Stranger
Registered: 04/06/08
Posts: 24
Last seen: 1 year, 7 months
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Re: Riding the debt wave to the grave VS. getting out now [Re: ArmFromTheAbyss]
#12926091 - 07/20/10 07:45 PM (2 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
ArmFromTheAbyss said:
Let me get this straight:
Your plan is to pay off your student loans with credit cards and then stop making payments?
No no, I'm still paying the student loans. You can't pay student loans off with credit cards. I'm just paying the debt the college still says I owe them for their tuition hike. I could always just go back to school and hold off on paying the loans that way.
Quote:
ArmFromTheAbyss said:
If you have a degree in math, you should probably try really hard to find a decent job and pay off all your debt.
Why?
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Journal entries cover my grow attempts.
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Groovy Grant
Registered: 08/01/00
Posts: 6,599
Loc: TX 
Last seen: 3 months, 18 days
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Re: Riding the debt wave to the grave VS. getting out now [Re: Mrbook7]
#12926917 - 07/20/10 10:26 PM (2 years, 9 months ago) |
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This makes my head spin...
You have savings for a house but you can't pay back $1400 to your college?
You need to prioritize. Pay the college so they release your transcripts, which allow you to get a better job. Work to pay off the debt.
Everything else should go towards paying down the credit card with the highest interest rate. Keep paying the others at their minimum, making as large a payment possible on the highest rate card. Even if it means you eat spaghetti for breakfast lunch and dinner. Start shedding the debt.
From my calculations;
Gross $800 Month
net $600 /mo
Student loans $300~ /mo
Credit Card min $190~ /mo
Gas $150 /mo
Surplus (40.00)
You currently are insolvent.
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<3<3DowntroddenInDC <3<3
<3<3 Texas Jobs <3<3
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Terillius
Renaissance Man
Registered: 07/21/06
Posts: 1,190
Loc: UT
Last seen: 2 days, 23 hours
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Re: Riding the debt wave to the grave VS. getting out now [Re: Groovy Grant] 1
#12927140 - 07/20/10 11:10 PM (2 years, 9 months ago) |
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First of all, if you quit a job you ALREADY HAVE because you are DEPRESSED ABOUT MONEY you are a fool.
DON'T ABANDON INCOME!!!
You need another job. Go dig those ditches! Eat cheap basic food and sell all that expensive shit. You don't say what car you drive, but it had better be getting 32+ MPG.
You don't say anything about your savings, but a 24 year-old recent graduate shouldn't be thinking about buying a house. That's just American Dream BS indoctrination. Pay the college with cash so you can get your degree. Use the remaining savings as leverage during your credit consolidation. DON'T PAY OFF STUDENT LOANS!! Their interest rates should be the absolute lowest. That credit card is nasty, but the credit consolidation should help that.
Find a CHEAP crappy place to live. Think no rain and warm.
Finally, and I hate to betray the principals of the forum we post in, but if you are doing drugs or drinking I am going to come to your house and beat you with big rolls of hundred dollar bills.
Ok, end rant. All in positive spirit, man! 
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Mrbook7
Stranger
Registered: 04/06/08
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Last seen: 1 year, 7 months
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Re: Riding the debt wave to the grave VS. getting out now [Re: Terillius]
#12929409 - 07/21/10 12:40 PM (2 years, 9 months ago) |
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I have $1,050 in my checking/savings. This comes from the extra $80-100 a month I have left over from my job, along with $50/mo from my cash welding jobs / ditch digging for the past 7 months of rent free living.
I spend $100 a month on HOA/SRP. I spend $50 a month on internet/cable (honestly I could do without another second of TV in my life but the GF likes it so we pay for it). I spend $80 a month on weed and alcohol because it's cheaper than another other form of social entertainment. If I want, I can make an extra $100 a month from selling weed to a couple people, since money seems to be SO important, maybe I'll just start dealing again. I get $200 a month in food stamps so I'll eat fresh fruit over pasta.
I refuse to work 40 hours a week unless it is for myself or family (otherwise 2 days a week of free time to spend with family and friends isn't enough, the 40 hour work week is indoctrination). I refuse to work somewhere where I cannot be creative/independent on a daily basis. I refuse to eat ramen noodles for more than 2 meals a week, since that's all I lived on in college and I'm TOO GOOD FOR THAT. My car gets 21 MPG which was the minimum to not be able to trade it in for cash for clunkers. I put $40 into my car every month for the myriad of problems that arise from cars with 200,000+ miles.
I feel that I have paid my dues on the credit cards because I have paid so much interest over the last 4 years, not to mention that usury is a sin. I look at what I'm doing as being Robin Hood (this is the only correct moral choice, to NOT pay back this debt), besides they got enough insurance to cover any "loss" they say I cost them if I stop paying. What's credit good for anyway? more debt?
I love entitlement. Go Generation Y!
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Journal entries cover my grow attempts.
Edited by Mrbook7 (07/21/10 12:41 PM)
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Terillius
Renaissance Man
Registered: 07/21/06
Posts: 1,190
Loc: UT
Last seen: 2 days, 23 hours
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Re: Riding the debt wave to the grave VS. getting out now [Re: Mrbook7]
#12930332 - 07/21/10 03:36 PM (2 years, 9 months ago) |
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Bah. The first thing that comes to mind is you are the one who spent all that credit card money you didn't have. Robin Hood? C'mon! You're telling us you can't support yourself, let alone help anyone else. You know who is going to pay off your cards if you follow through with your plan? WE ARE!
TV should go and you should try and negotiate out of that HOA for a while. Alcohol and Weed are both depressants which you don't need right now. For God's sake don't sell drugs. How will you get the great job you have earned with all that college if you have a felony on your record?
All that "I refuse" and "I'm too good" stuff is just arrogance. You don't think that everyone feels the same way? Everyone wants to be a wealthy part-timer who smokes pot and finger paints all day on the beach and never gets told what to do. If everyone wants it you have to work hard to actually get it.
With all due respect, you have an attitude problem that will be fixed by a regular work week and sobriety. Try jogging, read some free Google books, grow tomatoes, learn to draw, go hiking or swimming...
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Mrbook7
Stranger
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Last seen: 1 year, 7 months
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Re: Riding the debt wave to the grave VS. getting out now [Re: Terillius]
#12930573 - 07/21/10 04:36 PM (2 years, 9 months ago) |
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I'm sorry that someone else has to foot the bill for me not paying the credit cards, but when you're this low in the pecking order you just don't seem to care anymore. I want to understand why I should pay the cards off but every reason I get doesn't seem to be a good one. These people foolishly lent me their money.
It's hard to stop drinking and smoking when the manager I car pool with brings beer and weed to work everyday. I can say no but it's a whole lot easier to get yelled at on the phone by clients when I'm high. I've stopped drinking and smoking at home. I even made an appointment with my state health care provider for substance abuse and behavior modification, though their first open time isn't for another 3 weeks.
The arrogance isn't as bad as I made it out to be, but I really don't see how working at a place I hate, for laughable pay is going to make me happy. Happiness isn't everything, but really it wouldn't cost that much to live on the beach and finger paint all day, hippies do it all the time.
I'm more worried about losing my idealism, soul, spirit, youthfulness, or whatever by getting a regular work week. I could be a shift/store manager like the rest of my friends who didn't even go to college. They all hate themselves and their jobs, but they love money.
I went back to the bank today to try and consolidate my debt; however, now I do not qualify except for an $800 PLoC. New plan, pay off my school with the remaining space on my cards plus a few hundred from savings. Then sign a 2 year lease at the cheapest apartment my girlfriend will live in. I'm still going to quit this job to be less depressed, and go back to offering services for general labor and math tutor on craigslist while I search for a "good job".
Thank you for your courteous input.
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Journal entries cover my grow attempts.
Edited by Mrbook7 (07/21/10 04:51 PM)
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Groovy Grant
Registered: 08/01/00
Posts: 6,599
Loc: TX
Last seen: 3 months, 18 days
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Re: Riding the debt wave to the grave VS. getting out now [Re: Mrbook7]
#12931716 - 07/21/10 08:27 PM (2 years, 9 months ago) |
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I am almost completely certain this guy is a puppet troll. These posts are too incredibly stupid to be real.
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<3<3DowntroddenInDC <3<3
<3<3 Texas Jobs <3<3
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zappaisgod
horrid asshole
Registered: 02/11/04
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Last seen: 2 hours, 13 minutes
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Re: Riding the debt wave to the grave VS. getting out now [Re: Groovy Grant]
#12931805 - 07/21/10 08:47 PM (2 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
Groovy Grant said:
I am almost completely certain this guy is a puppet troll. These posts are too incredibly stupid to be real.
Now that is something you and I can agree on without any reservations or qualifiers.
To the OP:
Let me make myself perfectly clear. The courts may legally forgive you for not repaying the money you borrowed but in my eyes you will be forever scum. You are deliberately defrauding people, borrowing money you have no intention of repaying. Please remove yourself from society. You are scum and a burden and of no use. Your happiness is undeserved and you should never have any. You are a common thief. And pitifully small time at that.
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Groovy Grant
Registered: 08/01/00
Posts: 6,599
Loc: TX
Last seen: 3 months, 18 days
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Re: Riding the debt wave to the grave VS. getting out now [Re: zappaisgod]
#12931837 - 07/21/10 08:52 PM (2 years, 9 months ago) |
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Zappa,
It's a waste. This guy isn't sincere. It is obvious that it's fake. Someone who is maxed out with credit cards, works 3 days a week (because they want time to 'chill') and collects $200 a month in food stamps, while making $800 a month (gross) isn't going to get a car loan to qualify for "Cash for Clunkers'.
This is bogus. The math doesn't work.
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<3<3DowntroddenInDC <3<3
<3<3 Texas Jobs <3<3
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Terillius
Renaissance Man
Registered: 07/21/06
Posts: 1,190
Loc: UT
Last seen: 2 days, 23 hours
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Re: Riding the debt wave to the grave VS. getting out now [Re: Mrbook7]
#12932499 - 07/21/10 10:39 PM (2 years, 9 months ago) |
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Easy with the negative vibes. I don't think having debt makes you "scum".
Quote:
Mrbook7 said:
I'm more worried about losing my idealism, soul, spirit, youthfulness, or whatever by getting a regular work week. I could be a shift/store manager like the rest of my friends who didn't even go to college. They all hate themselves and their jobs, but they love money.
I hear that. I decided that losing some of those things is part of growing up. Idealism isn't so bad to maintain, you just have to let your ideals mature and stabilize into realistic expectations.
I have been working on my "future" for so long, I wonder if I have just been wasting the present. I don't think so. I am comfortable with my love of money because money is freedom. Whatever WILL get me happiness, I can afford to support. Fast car, family, friends, art, music, food, drugs, experiences, travel, business, career...
In 24 hours, 8 are sleep, 8 are obligation, and 8 are yours. Rest, work, and play come in exactly even doses. You ever read the 7 Habits of Highly Effective People? I listened to it on my 30 minute commute a while back. Pretty good.
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Yrat
Hello
Registered: 11/08/07
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Re: Riding the debt wave to the grave VS. getting out now [Re: Terillius]
#12934593 - 07/22/10 11:28 AM (2 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
Terillius said:
Easy with the negative vibes. I don't think having debt makes you "scum".
that's not what he said, at all. zappa feels that he is scum for deliberately borrowing money with the intention of never paying it back. i happen to agree. please read a little more carefully. this is nothing more than theft. theft that every other customer of the company will eventually have to pay off through increased fees. just like how shops balance out shoplifting losses through slightly increased prices... that everyone else pays. thieving scum is quite an accurate description if you ask me.
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"There are a thousand hacking at the branches of evil
to one who is striking at the root."
-Henry David Thoreau
Strike The Root
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Mrbook7
Stranger
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Re: Riding the debt wave to the grave VS. getting out now [Re: Yrat]
#12934655 - 07/22/10 11:48 AM (2 years, 9 months ago) |
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Everyone makes their own assumptions. People ignore facts because they can't separate themselves from their beliefs. They project their weakness onto those they do not understand. I wouldn't call these people scum (because that's rude, really learn some respect) I'd say ignorant.
btw, i never said that i didn't intend to pay my credit cards when I started using them.
I'm going to try as hard as I can to destroy this economy.
If you want to spend the rest of your life as a cog in the machine, be my guest.
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Journal entries cover my grow attempts.
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Mrbook7
Stranger
Registered: 04/06/08
Posts: 24
Last seen: 1 year, 7 months
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Re: Riding the debt wave to the grave VS. getting out now [Re: Groovy Grant]
#12934666 - 07/22/10 11:52 AM (2 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
Groovy Grant said:
I am almost completely certain this guy is a puppet troll. These posts are too incredibly stupid to be real.
Please don't reply anymore
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Journal entries cover my grow attempts.
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Yrat
Hello
Registered: 11/08/07
Posts: 2,030
Last seen: 1 hour, 47 minutes
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Re: Riding the debt wave to the grave VS. getting out now [Re: Mrbook7]
#12934834 - 07/22/10 12:50 PM (2 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
Mrbook7 said:
Everyone makes their own assumptions. People ignore facts because they can't separate themselves from their beliefs. They project their weakness onto those they do not understand. I wouldn't call these people scum (because that's rude, really learn some respect) I'd say ignorant.
btw, i never said that i didn't intend to pay my credit cards when I started using them.
I'm going to try as hard as I can to destroy this economy.
If you want to spend the rest of your life as a cog in the machine, be my guest.
oh, trust me, i am much further ahead of you in removing myself from the system before the collapse. this still doesn't change the fact that you are openly admiting your plans to steal. no matter how you try to justify it you are still stealing. and not from the "machine," mind you, but rather from ordinary folks who choose to repay their borrowed money. in other words, folks doing the right thing.
walking away from an underwater mortgage is one thing (as you don't get to keep the house), but stealing yourself a new TV, computer, and guitar is entirely different. sell your shit and give back the money.
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"There are a thousand hacking at the branches of evil
to one who is striking at the root."
-Henry David Thoreau
Strike The Root
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Terillius
Renaissance Man
Registered: 07/21/06
Posts: 1,190
Loc: UT
Last seen: 2 days, 23 hours
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Re: Riding the debt wave to the grave VS. getting out now [Re: Yrat]
#12935932 - 07/22/10 04:48 PM (2 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
Yrat said:
Quote:
Terillius said:
Easy with the negative vibes. I don't think having debt makes you "scum".
that's not what he said, at all. zappa feels that he is scum for deliberately borrowing money with the intention of never paying it back. i happen to agree. please read a little more carefully.
Uh hu. So IF he does decide to steal the money (and he hasn't yet and didn't intend to when he started) he is stealing from people who call him scum and troll for doing a little bitching in a public forum. You are "stealing" from our conversation.
Edited by Terillius (07/22/10 04:50 PM)
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