|
 metalhead
GIT-R-DONE!
Registered: 04/05/08
Posts: 745
Loc: earth
Last seen: 24 days, 6 hours
|
 Re: morel cult thread  [Re: metalhead]
#10010329 - 03/20/09 10:43 PM (4 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
*Guarantee: We guarantee that, weather permitting; your morel spawn is capable of producing Morel mushrooms in a properly managed Morel Habitat. The total number of mushrooms you can expect to get in each habitat may vary from year to year, and will depend on the care of your Habitat and environmental conditions. We test each batch of spawn. If we find that any batch of spawn is unable to produce morel Mushrooms, we will send you new spawn free.
i was reading about the habitat from that guy who's on the patent and it says they test each batch of spawn. some how i don't think they test them outdoors and wait a year for results before sending that batch...it's indoodrs
--------------------
|
AcidHorse
No Name No Slogan
Registered: 05/12/06
Posts: 657
Last seen: 16 days, 5 hours
|
Re: morel cult thread [Re: metalhead]
#10011460 - 03/21/09 02:18 AM (4 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
metalhead said:
well about the decomp pine bark i have heard from several places about that i have also heard they use cooked oats.
They use cooked wheat berries in the PBS video and patent details
Quote:
the thing is they don;t say if it's mixed od layered(we now know it's layered)
Well it has to be a layered situation with a bottom layer that is nutrient rich (cooked oats) and the top layer that is nutrient poor (pine bark/soil)
Plus they do say its a layered situation in the patent, read the first section on producing sclerotia. 80% wheatberries 20% nutrient poor soil
or a 60:40 or 20:80 or something, they play around with the percentages.
Quote:
so let's begin with testing strait nute poor soil with decomp pine bark and see if there is a difference.
You must have the nutrient rich layer too.
Quote:
there has to be a relationship between the two or mabee the allowed them so it looked like an outdoor grow...
--------------------
If you wanna ride, don't ride the white horse, if you wanna ride, ride the white pony
Humidity Differential Calculator
|
metalhead
GIT-R-DONE!
Registered: 04/05/08
Posts: 745
Loc: earth
Last seen: 24 days, 6 hours
|
Re: morel cult thread [Re: AcidHorse]
#10013181 - 03/21/09 01:14 PM (4 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
"i was reading about the habitat from that guy who's on the patent and it says they test each batch of spawn. some how i don't think they test them outdoors and wait a year for results before sending that batch...it's indoors" what do you guys think abou this think it's true?
--------------------
|
Mycelio
Stranger
Registered: 06/24/08
Posts: 1,636
Loc: Berlin 
Last seen: 5 months, 7 days
|
Re: morel cult thread [Re: metalhead]
#10013863 - 03/21/09 03:19 PM (4 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
No way, reading this 'guarantee' made me laugh when finding it the other day. That is advertising, you better ignore it as well as articles written by journalists without mycological background.
About a month ago I planted sclerotia from two jars like this one
(description is here) into three small flower pots on stones, covered with stones and activated charcoal. In each jar, there was one large lump of connected sclerotia, so I had to break them to pieces to get them out. Now one is outside, one in the stairway and one in a cold room, but they don't show much action, only the indoor-ones have a little mycelium at the surface.
I decided to use a pure mineral casing layer first, as I have seen pictures of morels, emerging from between the bricks of a wall and between stones on gravel paths.
Yesterday I covered some jars, which had less sclerotia on top with a mixture of peat, coir, pine bark pieces and activated charcoal, all got soaked and boiled for a few minutes.
Carsten
|
CptnGarden
fuck this site
Registered: 05/13/04
Posts: 11,945
Last seen: 4 years, 1 month
|
Re: morel cult thread [Re: Mycelio]
#10013898 - 03/21/09 03:25 PM (4 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Looking good guys, I just stuck some stem-butts in a flower pot and its colonizing the soil. around it fairly well.
|
metalhead
GIT-R-DONE!
Registered: 04/05/08
Posts: 745
Loc: earth
Last seen: 24 days, 6 hours
|
|
nice to have your input cptngdn and mycelio. that's some dense sclerotia growth! i woulda broken the glass to get that mass. with one like that you will most likely have a hell of a lot better chance getting a fruiting bodie! keep us updated! i just did more or less the same technique a couple of days ago from some dried specimines i found last year and had myc in like 1 day. that's the petri pic i posted i'll post more pics when i get sclerotia.
--------------------
|
metalhead
GIT-R-DONE!
Registered: 04/05/08
Posts: 745
Loc: earth
Last seen: 24 days, 6 hours
|
Re: morel cult thread [Re: metalhead]
#10014202 - 03/21/09 04:04 PM (4 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
mycelio did you do agar or strait spore dust into the jars? and did you mix the seed and manure or do it in layers?
--------------------
|
Mycelio
Stranger
Registered: 06/24/08
Posts: 1,636
Loc: Berlin
Last seen: 5 months, 7 days
|
Re: morel cult thread [Re: metalhead]
#10014749 - 03/21/09 05:35 PM (4 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
metalhead said:
... i just did more or less the same technique a couple of days ago from some dried specimines i found last year and had myc in like 1 day. that's the petri pic i posted i'll post more pics when i get sclerotia.
Yes, that is so cool, spores from fruitbodies germinate after a few hours.
Carsten
|
Mycelio
Stranger
Registered: 06/24/08
Posts: 1,636
Loc: Berlin
Last seen: 5 months, 7 days
|
Re: morel cult thread [Re: metalhead]
#10014773 - 03/21/09 05:39 PM (4 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
metalhead said:
mycelio did you do agar or strait spore dust into the jars? and did you mix the seed and manure or do it in layers?
I already explained in the description I linked to, it is not much text to read.
Carsten
|
metalhead
GIT-R-DONE!
Registered: 04/05/08
Posts: 745
Loc: earth
Last seen: 24 days, 6 hours
|
Re: morel cult thread [Re: Mycelio]
#10014806 - 03/21/09 05:44 PM (4 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
oh is see, sorry. how are the jars doing today, the jars you posted were from a month ago right?
--------------------
|
Mycelio
Stranger
Registered: 06/24/08
Posts: 1,636
Loc: Berlin
Last seen: 5 months, 7 days
|
Re: morel cult thread [Re: metalhead]
#10014970 - 03/21/09 06:10 PM (4 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Two month ago. I waited one month for the sclerotia to turn darker, but that did not happen. After removing them I kept one jar in the dark and it grew a couple of pea sized sclerotia. The rest from the other one and some of the initial small jars were mixed into a bucket of soil and kitchen wastes. The remaining small straw/manure jars grew more and more mycelium in different shades of brown and went dormant without developing any more sclerotia.
Carsten
|
metalhead
GIT-R-DONE!
Registered: 04/05/08
Posts: 745
Loc: earth
Last seen: 24 days, 6 hours
|
Re: morel cult thread [Re: Mycelio]
#10015095 - 03/21/09 06:30 PM (4 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
so i was just talking to rr and he thinks that sclerotia formation is triggered more by drying of the substrate rather than running out of nutes. oh and i'm going to plant some spawn outside and harvest the sclerotia to see if they fruit easier and are bigger.what do yall think?
--------------------
|
Mycelio
Stranger
Registered: 06/24/08
Posts: 1,636
Loc: Berlin
Last seen: 5 months, 7 days
|
Re: morel cult thread [Re: metalhead]
#10016152 - 03/21/09 09:29 PM (4 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Are you sure he didn't mean primordia formation?
My jars has never been ventilated, got all my sclerotia under constant humidity. But there are reports of morels appearing after flooding, when the soil dries again. I think that was also mentioned by stamets.
Carsten
|
metalhead
GIT-R-DONE!
Registered: 04/05/08
Posts: 745
Loc: earth
Last seen: 24 days, 6 hours
|
Re: morel cult thread [Re: Mycelio]
#10016192 - 03/21/09 09:35 PM (4 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
yeah we were talking about sclerotia on agar and what not.
--------------------
|
metalhead
GIT-R-DONE!
Registered: 04/05/08
Posts: 745
Loc: earth
Last seen: 24 days, 6 hours
|
Re: morel cult thread [Re: metalhead]
#10016220 - 03/21/09 09:38 PM (4 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
"I've seen small sclerotia the size of BBs form on MEA agar. However, they're not going to be large enough to support a fruiting. If you'll put your culture in large spawn bags with rye berries or rye grass seed, you can get sclerotia the size of tennis balls. I don't think it's nutrients that need to run out as much as moisture. I always make the grains on the dry side, and that seems to trigger sclerotia formation.
RR"
--------------------
|
AcidHorse
No Name No Slogan
Registered: 05/12/06
Posts: 657
Last seen: 16 days, 5 hours
|
Re: morel cult thread [Re: Mycelio]
#10016524 - 03/21/09 10:36 PM (4 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Mycelio said:
No way, reading this 'guarantee' made me laugh when finding it the other day. That is advertising, you better ignore it as well as articles written by journalists without mycological background.
About a month ago I planted sclerotia from two jars like this one
(description is here) into three small flower pots on stones, covered with stones and activated charcoal. In each jar, there was one large lump of connected sclerotia, so I had to break them to pieces to get them out. Now one is outside, one in the stairway and one in a cold room, but they don't show much action, only the indoor-ones have a little mycelium at the surface.
I decided to use a pure mineral casing layer first, as I have seen pictures of morels, emerging from between the bricks of a wall and between stones on gravel paths.
Yesterday I covered some jars, which had less sclerotia on top with a mixture of peat, coir, pine bark pieces and activated charcoal, all got soaked and boiled for a few minutes.
Carsten
Yeah ignore the advertising but I don't know about their pictures.
The site owner is the third patent signer on Ronald Ower's patent.
--------------------
If you wanna ride, don't ride the white horse, if you wanna ride, ride the white pony
Humidity Differential Calculator
|
metalhead
GIT-R-DONE!
Registered: 04/05/08
Posts: 745
Loc: earth
Last seen: 24 days, 6 hours
|
Re: morel cult thread [Re: AcidHorse]
#10019407 - 03/22/09 02:04 PM (4 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
do you think they are all in on mills morel growery? except ower of course.
--------------------
|
AcidHorse
No Name No Slogan
Registered: 05/12/06
Posts: 657
Last seen: 16 days, 5 hours
|
Re: morel cult thread [Re: metalhead]
#10021920 - 03/22/09 08:46 PM (4 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
metalhead said:
do you think they are all in on mills morel growery? except ower of course.
I would think so. Otherwise why would James Malachowski be listed on the patent?
He's a colleague of Gary Mills at Michigan State so I'd say its a fact that he knows the method.
--------------------
If you wanna ride, don't ride the white horse, if you wanna ride, ride the white pony
Humidity Differential Calculator
|
AcidHorse
No Name No Slogan
Registered: 05/12/06
Posts: 657
Last seen: 16 days, 5 hours
|
Re: morel cult thread [Re: metalhead]
#10036819 - 03/25/09 03:19 AM (4 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
You all have viewed the patent and didn't even investigate the "cited references" in Ower's patent?!?!?
http://www.freepatentsonline.com/4594809.html
US Patent References:
3942969 Delayed release nutrients for mushroom culture March, 1976 Carroll et al. 47/11
4164405 Method of controlling the rate of damping-off of plant seedlings and improving the rate of tree growth with treated cotton gin waste August, 1979 Pinckard 71/3
4229442 Method for the treatment of trees or shrubs affected with decline symptoms with treated cotton gin waste October, 1980 Pinckard 71/3
http://www.freepatentsonline.com/3942969.html
http://www.freepatentsonline.com/4164405.html
http://www.freepatentsonline.com/4229442.html
Delayed release nutrients for mushroom culture
Document Type and Number:
United States Patent 3942969
Abstract:
Denatured protein is used as a nutrient supplement for the stimulation of the growth of mushroom mycelium. The denatured protein is admixed into the compost growing medium before or shortly after spawning. A synergistic effect is attained by admixing a vegetable oil, or fish oil with the denatured protein.
Method of controlling the rate of damping-off of plant seedlings and improving the rate of tree growth with treated cotton gin waste
Document Type and Number:
United States Patent 4164405
Abstract:
A biochemical process for the aerobic thermophyllic fermentation of cotton gin waste is disclosed which converts a presently useless pest ridden agricultural waste product into a useful medium for the culture of horticultural and agronomic plants as well as micoorganisms useful to man. By the aeration, water content and physical shape and size of the waste product, piles are so conditioned that by means of the resulting biodegradation processes plant pathogenic microorganisms, insects, viruses, spider mites and related pests are destroyed. Additionally, pesticidal residues, chemical plant growth regulators and certain harvest aid materials normally added to the growing cotton crop for production purposes are reduced to materials harmless to plant life. The resulting humus like material provides improved plant growth, nearly five times that of a good river loam soil, and contains a microbial population that prevents the spread of soil borne plant pathogenic microorganisms reintroduced into the medium. The aerobic thermophyllically fermented gin waste provides a medium for growing horticultural and other plants without sterilization with heat or the use of fungicides. It also provides a medium with a source of energy for the culture of microorganisms useful to man. The fermented gin waste may also be employed as a means for controlling the rate of damping-off of plant seedlings caused by plant parasitic fungi. Also, by placing the fermented gin waste about the locus of the roots of trees, growth may be promoted and decline controlled. The medium may further contain iron salts to provide added nutritional value.
...
Method for the treatment of trees or shrubs affected with decline symptoms with treated cotton gin waste
Document Type and Number:
United States Patent 4229442
Abstract:
A biochemical process for the aerobic thermophyllic fermentation of cotton gin waste is disclosed which converts a presently useless pest ridden agricultural waste product into a useful medium for the culture of horticultural and agronomic plants as well as microorganisms useful to man. By the aeration, water content and physical shape and size of the waste product, piles are so conditioned that by means of the resulting biodegradation processes plant pathogenic microorganisms, insects, viruses, spider mites and related pests are destroyed. Additionally, pesticidal residues, chemical plant growth regulators and certain harvest aid materials normally added to the growing cotton crop for production purposes are reduced to materials harmless to plant life. The resulting humus like material provides improved plant growth, nearly five times that of a good river loam soil, and contains a microbial population that prevents the spread of soil borne plant pathogenic microorganisms reintroduced into the medium. The aerobic thermophyllically fermented gin waste provides a medium for growing horticultural and other plants without sterilization with heat or the use of fungicides. It also provides a medium with a source of energy for the culture of microorganisms useful to man. The fermented gin waste may also be employed as a means for controlling the rate of damping-off of plant seedlings caused by plant parasitic fungi. Also, by placing the fermented gin waste about the locus of the roots of trees, growth may be promoted and decline controlled. The medium may further contain iron salts to provide added nutritional value.
The interior of the large piles will begin to heat and progress from the interior outward to the surface, decreasing as it approaches the surface. The distribution of heat in the pile and its duration at tempertures above 125°-130° F. is essential for providing a useful material. Thermometers are placed in the pile and record the temperatures in relation to time, after the pile is formed.
So now do you see a relation to that 15 foot pile of "Michigan soil" that Gary Mills has at his plant?
This one will floor you.
The resulting humus material provides a horticultural medium for improved plant growth, nearly five times that of a good river loam soil. Unexpectedly, the material was found to contain anti-biotic agents capable of preventing the spread of soil borne plant pathogenic microorganisms introduced into the medium artificially. All of the organisms present in the cotton gin waste are not known, but those commonly present are mesophylic forms of bacteria, fungi and actinomycetes commonly found in soil at temperatures up to about 105° F. As the temperature increases, the ordinary fungi are normally killed and the thermophyllic fungi, bacteria and actinomycetes take over and increase the temperature up to 140° to 150° F. under optimum conditions. The large piles of waste, e.g. windows at least 10 feet wide and at least 8 feet high but preferably 30 feet high and 75 feet wide provide insulation useful in completing the process.
Anyone remember when Stamets talked about creating compost piles for oysters to clean up oil spills?
FIG. 2 illustrates graphically the daily temperatures of fermenting gin waste at various positions within a pile of the preferred size and shape. A temperature of at least 125°-130° F. must be maintained for several hours, or else contained large pieces of material will not be pasteurized and weed seeds and pests may not be destroyed. The outer fringe of the pile, 10 to 12 inches deep, never reaches 125° F. and in frosty weather the outer 12 to 18 inches may never reach temperatures and times required of pasteurization.
And the same soil to fruit the morels is the same soil to produce the sclerotia.
"Methods in the trays parallels methods in the jars"
--------------------
If you wanna ride, don't ride the white horse, if you wanna ride, ride the white pony
Humidity Differential Calculator
Edited by AcidHorse (03/25/09 04:34 AM)
|
metalhead
GIT-R-DONE!
Registered: 04/05/08
Posts: 745
Loc: earth
Last seen: 24 days, 6 hours
|
Re: morel cult thread [Re: AcidHorse]
#10038346 - 03/25/09 01:40 PM (4 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
where did you find that info? how do we replicate all that? give me a lay out of the procedure that they are using all that up there is so jumbled up. how are they doing it? nice find AH!
--------------------
|
|
Images only 
Threaded
Previous
Index
Next
Shop for: 
Edit 
Reply 
